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Robb (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 09:41 AM Original message |
Wait, wait, wait... |
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NV Whino (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 09:45 AM Response to Original message |
1. That don't explain |
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Robb (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 09:47 AM Response to Reply #1 |
2. It doesn't explain a lot of things. But it speaks to "solitary confinement," which surprised me. |
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PBS Poll-435 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 10:56 AM Response to Reply #1 |
5. ShakeWeight! nt |
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jaxx (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 10:42 AM Response to Original message |
3. It takes away the victim aspect. |
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Bandit (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 10:55 AM Response to Reply #3 |
4. Except he has never even been charged with a crime. |
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Robb (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 11:06 AM Response to Reply #4 |
6. He was charged in July, when he was moved to Quantico. |
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jaxx (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 11:18 AM Response to Reply #4 |
7. The article cites two charges. |
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paparush (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 11:41 AM Response to Reply #4 |
8. Manning HAS been charged |
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EFerrari (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 03:21 PM Response to Reply #4 |
13. The point is, he has not been convicted of a crime and he is being punished. |
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BzaDem (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 03:42 PM Response to Reply #13 |
17. Are you saying pre-trial detention is now illegal? n/t |
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Hawkeye-X (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 07:53 PM Response to Reply #17 |
38. Yes, it's called cruel and unusual punishment |
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Robb (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 08:33 PM Response to Reply #38 |
39. Let's be clear, because the goalposts are getting shoved around: |
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Statistical (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 03:54 PM Response to Reply #13 |
21. So every single person in the history of the US who is held in pre-trial confiment has |
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EFerrari (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 04:00 PM Response to Reply #21 |
23. I don't get the sloppy generalizations around here. |
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Statistical (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 04:05 PM Response to Reply #23 |
27. He isn't being punished. He is being held in pre-trial confinment. |
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EFerrari (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 04:08 PM Response to Reply #27 |
28. That certainly is the Pentagon's position. n/t |
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Canuckistanian (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Dec-29-10 02:01 AM Response to Reply #27 |
58. "pre-trial" is the operative word here. No court date has been set. |
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Robb (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Dec-29-10 08:00 AM Response to Reply #58 |
62. UCMJ Article 10 is actually more strict and explicit than the 6th Amendment. |
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H2O Man (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 05:19 PM Response to Reply #21 |
29. Actually, |
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DeadEyeDyck (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 09:51 PM Response to Reply #21 |
48. No, there is a thing called article 32 |
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Robb (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 03:14 PM Response to Original message |
9. Non-Vick kick. |
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Ysabel (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Dec-29-10 02:59 AM Response to Reply #9 |
59. lol (nt) |
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one_voice (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 03:19 PM Response to Original message |
10. K&R |
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EFerrari (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 03:21 PM Response to Original message |
11. "We don't call it solitary confinement, so move along". |
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Robb (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 03:21 PM Response to Reply #11 |
12. Call it what you will, but you can't call it unique to Manning. nt |
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EFerrari (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 03:22 PM Response to Reply #12 |
14. So, if it happens to other people, too, there is no problem? |
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Robb (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 03:23 PM Response to Reply #14 |
15. So everyone who has ever been held at Quantico has been "tortured" by definition? |
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EFerrari (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 03:32 PM Response to Reply #15 |
16. Holding someone in pre-trial detention in solitary for months? |
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BzaDem (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 03:52 PM Response to Reply #16 |
20. Because you don't know his conditions, it is therefore torture (because you don't know)? |
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Robb (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 05:49 PM Response to Reply #16 |
31. But you don't think it's relevant that everyone has their own cell at Quantico? |
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EFerrari (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 05:56 PM Response to Reply #31 |
32. That soldiers sit in solitary for months before their trial |
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Robb (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 06:03 PM Response to Reply #32 |
33. Goalposts. Did Greenwald et al mention a single other soldier in US history? |
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EFerrari (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 08:37 PM Response to Reply #33 |
41. No. As I said 'way up thread, that this is happening to more people |
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TorchTheWitch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 10:15 PM Response to Reply #41 |
53. we always knew |
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TexasObserver (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Dec-29-10 12:13 AM Response to Reply #16 |
57. In the past 10 years, the US has become a major human rights violator. |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 03:44 PM Response to Reply #15 |
19. If they are subject to the same conditions and treatment that Manning is undergoing, then yes. |
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H2O Man (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 05:21 PM Response to Reply #19 |
30. Right. |
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Ignis (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 07:43 PM Response to Reply #30 |
37. +1. Incredibly troubling, indeed. |
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EFerrari (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 08:39 PM Response to Reply #30 |
42. It really is. |
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Sheepshank (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 09:48 PM Response to Reply #14 |
45. your argument is making no sense. |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 03:42 PM Response to Reply #12 |
18. Are the other prisoners isolated from each other 24/7? Do they have to answer "Yes" every 5 minutes? |
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Statistical (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 03:56 PM Response to Reply #18 |
22. Nobody wakes him up in the middle of the night. |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 04:00 PM Response to Reply #22 |
24. They wake him if they cannot see him clearly. He has been psychologically assessed |
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BzaDem (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 04:01 PM Response to Reply #24 |
25. So if he can be seen clearly, he won't be woken up. n/t |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 04:03 PM Response to Reply #25 |
26. You are right, he should sleep uncovered on the floor rather than in the bolted to the wall bed |
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BlackHoleSon (89 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 09:38 PM Response to Reply #25 |
43. Sleep deprivation is torture |
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Sheepshank (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 09:55 PM Response to Reply #43 |
49. good god..back to make believe manufactured torture...sleep deprivation? |
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Capitalocracy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 06:09 PM Response to Reply #18 |
34. Yes? |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 06:13 PM Response to Reply #34 |
35. During his waking hours, from 5:00 AM to 8:00 PM his jailors are tasked with calling out to him |
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Capitalocracy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 07:18 PM Response to Reply #35 |
36. What's the question? |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 08:35 PM Response to Reply #36 |
40. I believe is is "roll call" so I assume it is his name. And thank you for the rest of your post. |
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Sheepshank (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 09:56 PM Response to Reply #35 |
50. seems to nullify the argument of solitary confinment just a bit n/t |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 10:05 PM Response to Reply #50 |
52. Solitary confienment is confinement in isolation from OTHER PRISONERS. |
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Sheepshank (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 10:32 PM Response to Reply #52 |
55. it's clear you have no idea what solitary confinement really means n/t |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 11:18 PM Response to Reply #55 |
56. It is clear that you are trying to normalize solitary confinement and conflate it with sensory |
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Sheepshank (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 09:45 PM Response to Reply #12 |
44. On another thread we were arguing "not customary" |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 09:51 PM Response to Reply #44 |
47. So you are on the side of those who think that if all prisoners are treated similarly, that is... |
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Sheepshank (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 10:00 PM Response to Reply #47 |
51. bull |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 10:26 PM Response to Reply #51 |
54. Certainly, international human rights orgs have issued report after report revealing |
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DeadEyeDyck (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-28-10 09:49 PM Response to Original message |
46. They will NEVER get in |
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Dystopian (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Dec-29-10 03:41 AM Response to Original message |
60. Odd...or not. |
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Robb (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Dec-29-10 07:49 AM Response to Reply #60 |
61. No conspiracy. 1st Lt. Brian Scott Villiard, USMC. |
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Dystopian (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Dec-29-10 01:31 PM Response to Reply #61 |
63. Thanks for the clarification & fact check.... |
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