After what they did to him, maybe he decided it might be best to 'run' from them

He's fought for less, with less... and came out victorious.

(more rationalizations please-- currently yours are the same tired excuses lacking any evidence that have been circulating for a month now)

Why do you always repeat your title line?

Was curious about that myself... so annoying!

that he would not get good committee assignments, that other senators would not work with him etc. that would leave him no choice but to leave. I am sure he cares enough about WI to have a senator that can get things done. That is what likely happened - all senators who signed to this debacle signaled their unwillingness to work with him.

scenes so in essence it's time to move on.

MN

What I suggested are the ways that senators can exercise their power over other senators, in generic terms. How could Franken continue to work with all the senators who told him to resign? Would they likely back off if he did not resign? If so, media would always want to know from those senators what they thought of Franken staying on.

above

Let me tell you a fable about an old man, a child and their donkey.

One day, an old man and his grandson needed to go into town to get some stuff at the market.

When they started off, the old man put his grandson on the donkey's back because he thought it would be fun for the child to have that view of things.

They started down the road and in about a mile, they met a woman driving a waggon. She said, "Tsk, tsk. You should be ashamed, little boy, making your grandfather walk while you ride!"

So, the boy got down and the grandfather mounted the donkey. In about half a mile, they met a farmer. He said, "I can't believe you are weighing down that donkey by riding him. He can't carry that much, and that's being mean to him!"

So, the grandfather got down, but the boy did not get back up. Instead, they led the donkey. A mile down the road, they met another traveler, who laughed and said, "Boy, you guys are stupid! One of you should be riding that donkey!"

The moral of the story is, of course, that whatever someone does, they cannot please everyone. You say we should blame Franken, and you are the very first I've heard say that he turned tail and ran.

I say he was railroaded out of the Senate without due process, and this country will be the worse without his voice of sanity and decency.

hearing from him again...so sad.

Do you think we at DU are actually running this country with our voices or something? I mean, why bother to vote if it's no biggy that Al got railroaded. Just talky talking with your voice is enough!

guy is not dead and he will still have a lot to offer...this is not the end of the line for Al....I'm also trying to be positive.

sentiment here.

...especially when they are your supposed friends.

You are free to gloss it over if you like.

it to a Lynch Mob. That is all.

it's not the other way around...just trust me on that one.

It was a lynch mob....first they tarred and feathered AL then they hung em....he's lucky to still be breathing...it was a lynch mob. shouting, cursing, carrying torches, threatening death.....I will offend and you can take that to the bank...trust me

Maybe it is not politically correct to call it that....

but maybe you would prefer other phrases....like..... "throwing Franken under the bus"....or "destroying Franken's career"....or...."doing the Republicans' dirty laundry for them".....or....."major cop out"......or "cowardice on parade"......you might call it a "witch hunt" but Franken is a male and a female calling a male a witch might not be effective?

IT WAS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Of course.

If you missed act 1, it is here:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=10039478

He stuck up for himself in no way and told his colleagues he was going to draw it out for a long time. There is only one political reality in that situation. It was as weak as politician could be. Watch me be all warm and fuzzy as a scandal erupts around me. Yeah. That will do it.

Now we will watch certain people claim it was other Democrats who stabbed him in that back. Every bit as weak and simply passes the blame from its rightful owner.

first time I was like oh noes...I know Al wanted to do the right thing etc etc..but you have to throw in a deny if you WANT TO SURVIVE.

And you are right..this 'due process' which would of proved nothing either way would of been in the headlines perhaps kicking around during the midterms.

We are talking the Senate and it's just about as cut-throat as politics gets. Putting weakness and uncertainty in the public sphere on purpose is the kiss of death. It made no sense given what was known.

future. And yes hello it's politics!!!!!!

Including Independents, Bernie Sanders & Keith Ellison.

Not one of them is more or less to blame than the others.

My opinion.
He throughs out blanket labels & blames as Sanders, the one time Dem did.

I'm not fan.
Just saying

IS the Democratic Party in Minnesota. Al Franken is also a member. So is the governor, Keith Ellison, etc.


Apparently you are unaware.
Just sayin'

He didn't have to.

If not, you’re very fortunate, because it’s horrible and unbearable. In fact, it’s actually healthy to walk away from such a situation.

The two senators demanding release of names of taxpayer payoffs for Senate harrassment. They probably know who is on the list, and know it’s not Franken.

who also recently had his own brush with false sexual harassment allegations shortly after the Tweeden story broke (and IIRC, was also attorney general for his state before becoming a Senator). He's also not on the ethics committee, so he was free to respond if he so chose.

Wow, the guy who was falsely accused of sexual harassment and assault DOESN'T demand the immediate resignation of one of his coworkers facing charges of sexual harassment that have yet to be investigated or independently vetted? Gosh, I wonder why? Is it because there but for the ineptitude of my fake accusers go I?

What's Blumenthal gonna say "Franken's an idiot for resigning"?

He didn't join in in the public pressure before he resigned, which was I was saying. I take issue with the 'Resign Mob' beforehand, because it put pressure on him to resign before a proper investigation happened (thus denying the people of Minnesota their vote without even bothering to vet the claims, an anonymous claim on a media blog shouldn't be all it takes to thwart democracy; I'm sure Smith will be swell, but NOBODY VOTED FOR HER; ), not people agreeing with it after Franken decided to go.

I may not agree with them, but that is not my issue in this situation. My issue is with the shitshow process beforehand. Unvetted claims, no matter how many, cannot be the basis for removing a duly elected official. It just can't, we can't run a democracy like that.

The Senators would have also NEVER asked for his resignation if Minnesota had a Republican governor, so their concern wasn't about doing the right thing, it was only about Doing The Right Thing So Long As We Lose Nothing. They weren't concerned about the victims, they were concerned about looking like they're concerned about the victims. What's gonna happen when a Dem Senator with a Republican governor starts getting sexual harassment complaints? Are they going to demand that Senator must resign without anyone vetting the half-anonymous complaints? Dems will either look like shitty ass hypocrites (and lose seats in elections), or they'll lose seats by handing them to Republicans. It will be spun to damage the Dems.

“Sexual harassment and groping are never OK, they’re never funny. And Senator Franken will have to address the allegations.”

There also was this:

A spokeswoman for Sen. Richard Blumenthal, who also received contributions from Franken’s PAC, said the senator would donate the money to the Connecticut Alliance to End Sexual Violence.

That was in November - and then the day before Franken resigned he said this:

“I’ve been listening to the courageous women across the nation who have come forward about sexual harassment and assault, as well as my Senate colleagues,” Blumenthal said in a written statement Wednesday afternoon. “I understand that Senator Franken will make an announcement tomorrow. I’ll comment after he speaks.”

It does seem like he was putting some public pressure on Franken before he resigned with those comments.

Saying Franken will need to address the accusations is EXACTLY what Franken wanted. It's not a call for resignation.

Donating the PAC money is making a point, maybe even to shame Franken (which is fine, he should be ashamed of that picture), but it's not a call for resignation.

Saying he's been listening to women who come forward with allegations along with his colleagues is not publicly calling for resignation.

Blumenthal may have privately agreed that Franken needed to resign, but he did not publicly call for it before Franken actually resigned.

But the statements he made and actions he took could have contributed to the pressure that Franken felt to resign.

It's not like Blumenthal said: "I absolutely do not think Senator Franken should resign." or anything along those lines like Joe Manchin said, for example.

There were multiple responses by Gillibrand in regards to the Trump tape; responses which questioned his character, his ability to lead, and his status as a family man.

I'm not surprised at all you were able to locate only one... your bias seems to wholly depend on it, and on your consistent failure to provide any objective evidence at all for your allegations.

I was specifically looking at her immediate response when the tape came out. This was her response:

"This sort of sickening dialogue from @realDonaldTrump has no place in our society and certainly no place in the presidential race"

Notice how there is no mention about his admission of sexual assault. She only talks about his language. Even Republicans had stronger responses.

and folks who are laying ground and kicking off congressional and local campaigns.

Senator Franken was always a ticking time bomb. His bravado is his greatest strength, but also his biggest weakness. The more important he became, the bigger the target was on his back.

His intentions may have been play-full and never darkly sexual, but perhaps, even Franken has decided, just being "play-full", although appropriate for comedy, isn't appropriate in the work place of government. A Democrat is still taking his seat and given Trump, its unlikely to flip.

Plus, we don't know what his long term intentions are. He may very well decided he wanted out of this "gig" awhile ago. He's been very boisterous recently, in a position that calls for patience. Usually when a politician starts doing that, they have already planned their exit.

Assuming he was planning to leave, what a better way than call your detractors bluff, paint them as hypocrites and help them to lose a seat that should have been theirs?

is one of the most diligent Senators we have - and loved his job.

I believe he loosened up a little (his book, etc) because he had earned a reputation that had put his comedy career in the background. He showed he was smart, dedicated, capable and very serious about his job, and once others saw him in that light, he felt freer.

nt

going to post my anger at you for calling Kirsten a fraud.

This is so insane.

I'd like that answer, for starters.

But I dont want ANY sitting democratic politician being called a "fraud" on this site.

at least considering the little we have to judge on.
But terms like "fraud" is similar to blanket labels we saw in 2015/16.


I'd feel better if we had an honest reason given by those who asked Franken to step dpwn.
Perhaps a sincere statement from each would help close the divide.
The silence & finality is already becoming a tool for division, whether that tool is sincere or intentionally opportunistic.

Constituents were owed more of an explanation, IMO.

But insisting we get some detailed reasoning makes no sense.

GOP hatchetmen, and we've seen their method of character assassination before.

I believe the bitter pill we're expected to swallow would have been easier had they acknowledged the influence of the GOP hitmen.

Something like that to validate what we all know it was.

I would like Franken to go after Roger Stone & all his accusers, to publicly clear his name, and come back to run for President in 2020.

That would be my perfect scenario.

Let's see how she does.

I wish her well in her beautuful State.

divisive. Which may be the point. Yes, I've become very suspicious when I see these regurgitated posts, expressing anger and angst over something that is . . . over.

I was personally disappointed/angered in what happened to Franken and how his colleagues handled the matter. But what's done is done. There's nothing constructive in beating a dead horse and there's certainly nothing to be gained in damning other Democratic Senators, over and over and over again. Gillibrand and her colleagues, IMHO, made a mistake and were swept up in the moment. We all make mistakes. Yes, there may have been something else going on behind the scenes that we're not privy to. What? I have no idea.

What I do know is the only thing that matters at the moment are the upcoming elections, succeeding in taking back the House and maybe the Senate. We need to be united for that and to be charged up as the Democratic electorate was for Virginia and Alabama.

This is doable and absolutely imperative. Self-flaggelation may be good for the soul but it will not win elections. We need to make that Blue Tsunami a reality and keep our eye on the prize. Anything less is self-defeating. Let's do it for Al Franken and everyone who loves the country. Let's just do it!

Who do you want to run for Franken's seat?

I can't say that about any other Democrat at this point.

it always looked like Senator Franken was always by himself......it looked like no one ever talked to him while they were all waiting for votes to be counted. Even Amy was always busy talking with a lot of her male colleagues and not to Al......I think lotsa Senators might not have been able to get past his previous line of work, being a comedian and comedy writer. JMHO.

At all those ‘establishments Democrats’.

Why not blame Franken. After all he is the one who:

Took a photo grabbing a sleeping woman’s breast.

Is just very ‘huggy’ or however he admitted to be.

Respond so clumsily when he had to know there were issues out there.

I could go on.

But I find 2 things ironic.

When trump grabs them by the pussy, it is horrible. When our guys grab them by the boobs on film, well, you know, he is a comedian and she is a righty. It is HER fault.

And how so many posters have used this situation to keep stirring up shit amongst the Democratic Party when we need to be concentrated on the house this fall.

Just saying.

You must know of course that no sexual assaulter would grope a woman in front of witnesses, and it has also been insinuated that Tweeden was no actually asleep and was in on the gag.

Putting out inaccurate, debunked info is also divisive of the party.

has her sights set on 2020.

Last edited Wed Jan 3, 2018, 01:09 PM - Edit history (2)

And she's still not going after trump.

I keep hearing how much she is a champion against sexual assault, and yet her response was mild at best when Trump's bragging came out. We weren't even taking about anonymous accusations or questionable accusers. This was his own words, on tape, bragging about sexually assaulting women. Her complete lack of a strong response, not calling him out for his actions (not just his language), is why I consider her a fraud.

Seriously, we have a full 11 months left to fully flesh out our circular firing squad. I belive we can do much better than this before November 6 to break the party into infighting fractions.

Focus people, some of us are still working on unseating Republicans, this cannot be tolerated in an election year!