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MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
Sat Jan 13, 2018, 04:06 PM Jan 2018

The Real Question: How Did That Hawaiian False Attack Alarm Happen? UPDATED!

So far, I haven't seen any report on that. How it happened is far more important that the fact that it happened. That was cleared up fairly quickly. If it wasn't just a bonehead mistake by someone, then it may have come from outside, and that's a very, very serious matter, indeed.

Update: Apparently, it was a mistake on the part of someone in Hawaii, according to the Governor of HI. That's a relief.

47 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
The Real Question: How Did That Hawaiian False Attack Alarm Happen? UPDATED! (Original Post) MineralMan Jan 2018 OP
Yeah, was it hacked somehow ... if so, extremely dangerous. n/t RKP5637 Jan 2018 #1
What concerns me is that we haven't heard a simple explanation MineralMan Jan 2018 #7
hmmmm, it seems they are fishing for an explanation. ... been wondering/thinking the same. n/t RKP5637 Jan 2018 #11
Perhaps some Un has the answer True Dough Jan 2018 #2
I certainly hope not. MineralMan Jan 2018 #5
Or, if you care to indulge in conspiracy theories... True Dough Jan 2018 #25
Exactly! peggysue2 Jan 2018 #3
There are mess ups and bpositive Jan 2018 #4
Apparently, during shift change, john657 Jan 2018 #6
Thanks for that! MineralMan Jan 2018 #8
And a complete review of shift change procedures, john657 Jan 2018 #9
jesus christ, pushed a wrong button, seems like that procedure is shit. sunonmars Jan 2018 #10
Yeah. john657 Jan 2018 #12
I suspect changes will be made in the procedure. MineralMan Jan 2018 #13
Yep, definitely. Next will be oops, I hit the nuclear launch button. I thought it said Lunch! n/t RKP5637 Jan 2018 #14
I believe that was the central plot device... Dave Starsky Jan 2018 #45
I wan't to see secure area access records checked against shift change schedules. LuvLoogie Jan 2018 #17
So this was a civilian initiated alert and not a military initiated alert? LuvLoogie Jan 2018 #26
Correct. john657 Jan 2018 #32
Smells like team... GeorgeGist Jan 2018 #27
They're just saying that to cover up dumbcat Jan 2018 #28
Any proof of your claim? john657 Jan 2018 #33
Proof? How about observation and experience dumbcat Jan 2018 #42
So, I'll ask you again, john657 Jan 2018 #43
What would you consider "proof"? dumbcat Jan 2018 #44
Proof would be something that's irrefutable, john657 Jan 2018 #46
If you believe that cilla4progress Jan 2018 #15
You might want to adjust your tinfoil hat. bearsfootball516 Jan 2018 #18
it just seems to easy, wrong button, if that happened, all of them need fired for that setup sunonmars Jan 2018 #19
Any proof of that? john657 Jan 2018 #24
President S***head was probably looking for a diversion.. Stellar Jan 2018 #16
Why are there no failsafe procedures to be sure "mistakes" like that The Velveteen Ocelot Jan 2018 #20
That's an excellent question, indeed. MineralMan Jan 2018 #21
its pure Homer Simpson script, isnt it? sunonmars Jan 2018 #22
More like Dr. Strangelove. The Velveteen Ocelot Jan 2018 #23
First thing I thought of was War Games. nt Ferrets are Cool Jan 2018 #36
Worse... why wasn't it immediately rescinded !!! C_U_L8R Jan 2018 #29
Yes. It was a screw-up of the first order. MineralMan Jan 2018 #31
If it is headed for Hawaii, all the folks on Oahu can chill FarCenter Jan 2018 #30
4/17: Hack of Dallas Sirens Not the First or Last on Emergency Systems, Experts Warn FreepFryer Jan 2018 #34
No doubt that's true. MineralMan Jan 2018 #35
The thing that doesn't sit with me is the latency. imho 38 mins is too long 4 human error alone. n/t FreepFryer Jan 2018 #37
I definitely agree. MineralMan Jan 2018 #41
Our steel and gun powder military is obsolete . pwb Jan 2018 #38
It could be a simple mistake. Turbineguy Jan 2018 #39
When you're on a hair trigger, like when your pResident is making insane threats against N. Korea LastLiberal in PalmSprings Jan 2018 #40
Processes and procedures... HipChick Jan 2018 #47

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
7. What concerns me is that we haven't heard a simple explanation
Sat Jan 13, 2018, 04:11 PM
Jan 2018

so far. If it was a stupid error on the part of someone, we should already know that. Otherwise, this is very worrisome.

True Dough

(17,305 posts)
25. Or, if you care to indulge in conspiracy theories...
Sat Jan 13, 2018, 04:29 PM
Jan 2018

There was lots of speculation that Trump was itching for war with North Korea over the past several months, which would be be catastrophic, of course. But it would also have taken the focus off of Dolt 45's various other issues and agenda failures.

However, things took a turn for the better recently with reduced North Korean missile tests and diplomatic talks with South Korea.

The impetus for war has been greatly diminished. BUT, if the Pentagon created this nuclear missile false alarm on the president's order and then that is blamed on North Korean hacking. Hmm.

I generally eschew the conspiracy theorists but I wouldn't put that one past desperate Donald.

peggysue2

(10,832 posts)
3. Exactly!
Sat Jan 13, 2018, 04:10 PM
Jan 2018

Which was the first thing I thought of: please make this a dumb human error story and not the alternative.

bpositive

(423 posts)
4. There are mess ups and
Sat Jan 13, 2018, 04:10 PM
Jan 2018

Then there are total f&$k ups. Someone needs to be fired- no one should be in this position of power who can’t handle it.

In light of all the issues with the 🍊 one and North Korea there is no acceptable margin of error.

 

john657

(1,058 posts)
6. Apparently, during shift change,
Sat Jan 13, 2018, 04:11 PM
Jan 2018

someone pushed the wrong button.




CNN: Missile Alert went out after the "wrong" button was pushed during shift change


"It was a mistake made during a standard procedure at the change over of a shift and an employee pushed the wrong button," Governor of Hawaii David Ige tells CNN.
“The warning went out to cell phones, Television and radio got the emergency alert,” he says.


MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
8. Thanks for that!
Sat Jan 13, 2018, 04:12 PM
Jan 2018

Sounds like they need a serious look at some sort of interlock for that button, eh?

LuvLoogie

(7,011 posts)
17. I wan't to see secure area access records checked against shift change schedules.
Sat Jan 13, 2018, 04:21 PM
Jan 2018

I want to see the person who made the mistake named in a report.

Will that be the excuse given when we launch WMD? "We pushed the wrong button?"

What rank sends that alert? Who gives the order to send that alert?

I have more questions...

dumbcat

(2,120 posts)
28. They're just saying that to cover up
Sat Jan 13, 2018, 04:39 PM
Jan 2018

the fact that their system was hacked. They would rather have you believe it was a simple mistake rather than people realize their shyster is vulnerable to hackers.

cilla4progress

(24,736 posts)
15. If you believe that
Sat Jan 13, 2018, 04:21 PM
Jan 2018

I've got some beachfront in AZ to sell you.

Crap - MS Word asks me if I really want to delete that file before it initiates! We're supposed to believe there's no failsafe?

It's Russia. I'm sure of it.

 

john657

(1,058 posts)
24. Any proof of that?
Sat Jan 13, 2018, 04:24 PM
Jan 2018
It's Russia. I'm sure of it.


Absent of any other proof, I'll go with what the Democrat Governor of Hawaii said.

Stellar

(5,644 posts)
16. President S***head was probably looking for a diversion..
Sat Jan 13, 2018, 04:21 PM
Jan 2018

Perhaps he thinks that his"Shithead" controversy has gone on far to long.

The Velveteen Ocelot

(115,734 posts)
20. Why are there no failsafe procedures to be sure "mistakes" like that
Sat Jan 13, 2018, 04:23 PM
Jan 2018

can't happen? It's a good thing Orange Foolius was out golfing instead of fondling his Big Button...

C_U_L8R

(45,003 posts)
29. Worse... why wasn't it immediately rescinded !!!
Sat Jan 13, 2018, 04:39 PM
Jan 2018

Our Hawaiian friends spent 38 minutes in terror.
And it only takes 20 minutes for a missile to fly from North Korea.

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
31. Yes. It was a screw-up of the first order.
Sat Jan 13, 2018, 04:42 PM
Jan 2018

Someone will be on the unemployment line, I'm certain.

This kind of thing happening is really bush league. It is an illustration of how poor emergency planning really is. Whoever designed the alert system has very poor knowledge of implementing safeguards against false alarms.

It would be unbelievable, except stuff like this happens all the time. Poor planning.

 

FarCenter

(19,429 posts)
30. If it is headed for Hawaii, all the folks on Oahu can chill
Sat Jan 13, 2018, 04:40 PM
Jan 2018

Hawaiian Islands are pretty spread out.

FreepFryer

(7,077 posts)
34. 4/17: Hack of Dallas Sirens Not the First or Last on Emergency Systems, Experts Warn
Sat Jan 13, 2018, 04:44 PM
Jan 2018
Typically, a city will have just one, central computer workstation that is used to manage a city-wide deployment of civil defense horns. Hacking into that system either from the network its connected to, or by gaining physical or logical access to the actual terminal is all that’s needed to carry out the kind of attack seen in Dallas over the weekend [Steve Jung, a security researcher and penetration tester who has helped assess the security of such systems] said.

It wouldn’t be the first time. In 2013, for example software and equipment by the firm Monroe that is used to managed emergency alert systems was the target of a hack during which EAS equipment operated by broadcasters in Montana, Michigan and other states was compromised and used to issue an alert claiming that the “dead are rising from their graves,” and advising residents not to attempt to apprehend them. Researcher Mike Davis of the firm IOActive discovered those flaws and, later, in the digital alerting systems – DASDEC – application servers, which receive and authenticate EAS messages. A scan of the public Internet at the time by IOActive found 412 systems running vulnerable Monroe Electronics software. A subsequent patch by Monroe to address some security issues in its products failed to address serious security issues.

The software that controls civil defense and alerting systems like the Dallas sirens is often vulnerable to both network and application-focused attacks, experts say. “I would venture to guess that this is a relatively new frontier for that kind of software – even to think about an application focused attack,” Jung said. “In 20 years in (information security) I’ve never seen static code analysis of one of those boxes,” he said, referring to the siren systems.


https://securityledger.com/2017/04/hack-of-dallas-sirens-not-the-first-or-last-on-emergency-systems-experts-warn/

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
35. No doubt that's true.
Sat Jan 13, 2018, 04:48 PM
Jan 2018

It shouldn't be, but it certainly is.

You know those digital road signs on trailers that get put out to warn drivers of hazards? They're incredibly easy to hack. All you need is the portable programming device used to program them. While the sign can be password protected, typically they are not, which means that anyone can change the message on them if they have one of those programmer devices. And those are available for separate purchase.

pwb

(11,276 posts)
38. Our steel and gun powder military is obsolete .
Sat Jan 13, 2018, 05:05 PM
Jan 2018

Russia and North Korea are beating us with cyber attacks. I think they even made our navy ships collided. Not to mention our elections. But we will keep building ships and planes that will be made useless from cyber technologies . My two cents.

Turbineguy

(37,343 posts)
39. It could be a simple mistake.
Sat Jan 13, 2018, 07:09 PM
Jan 2018

The first design assumption is that nobody would push that button by mistake. The second assumption is that you would want easy access to that button to avoid any delays in case of a missile attack.



40. When you're on a hair trigger, like when your pResident is making insane threats against N. Korea
Sat Jan 13, 2018, 07:18 PM
Jan 2018

then you've got to doubly careful what you say and what buttons you push;



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