Jason Alexanders essay was very moving to me. I don't own guns myself being a non-hunter and not having anything I would kill to protect, but I've always come down on the side of in a free society you have to set the bar pretty high to outlaw something.

But he made some good points, particularly about the sorts of semi-automatic weapons out there, that really have no purpose other than killing many many people.

Bryant

Guns that fire one bullet each time you pull the trigger are enough for one's protection. Sub machine guns are what you need to get to the next level in your video game....

On a side note regarding the "but think of the sportsmen!" argument, REAL sportsman hunt with sporting weapons, like my father in law, who hunts with a bow and rarely a rifle.

Anything beyond that requires a special Federal license, police background/sign off, FBI background, and money.
Very few people have automatic weapons. This is why the conversation is a trainwreck, the entire class is one bullet per pull. There is functionally nothing else to restrict except banning/reclassifying all semi-automatic weapons as destructive devices like a mortar, a 50 cal. full automatic, grenades, etc, which is going to be considered absurd. We are discussing standard equipment for nearly a hundred years. The assault weapons ban (other than clip capacity) banned purely cosmetic features. A post ban weapon shot the same (one bullet per pull) and the same ammo and the same as grandpa's wood stock semi-automatic.

No automatic fire, no burst, no fire select. One pull one bullet, so what is the endgame?

Walk into a local gun store if you can find an AR-15 with 3 round burst I will buy you a car

I'll take a Chevy Volt

and the 3-round burst option.

Is that his police issued rifle that no civilian can own?
Or did he jump through the ATF hoops and purchase one that was converted prior to 1984?
The exact deal is that you have to walk into a local gun store and find an "AR-15" for sale that has 3 round burst

Every indication is burst fire is considered class 3 and covered under the 1986 restrictions.

I can't find nary a one gun with burst fire made after 1986 pre-ban, ban, or post ban.

The only hits I can find are blogs and video games. I'm interesting in seeing what you're talking about though I was pretty sure you are off base, I figured I'd try and look into it before I shot off my big mouth but I'm not seeing any burst fire available for sale without the Federal permit that would allow you to purchase legacy full autos.

Assault means unwelcome aggressive contact. Perhaps you were just flamed. I have been subjected to a lot of that and name-calling by the anti-gun zealots the past few days. If you think its excessive, perhaps you should use the alert button and email the admins.

HADOUKENS!

I don't think we'll get gun control, and I don't advocate for it, because I consider it settled. There are winnable battles out there.

But I'd like gun advocates to act like less of a cult, and admit that not everyone should own a gun. I'm not talking about felons. I'm talking about people not buying guns just because that's what their side advocates. People who aren't willing to take classes, and learn what they're doing, or people who don't actually need a gun in the first place. We don't need government regulation. We need common sense. Why do they have such a fetish about this?

I don't own a gun. This is not political for me. I just don't feel like I should have one. I really don't think an attacker will allow me the time to get to my gun, unlock it, and load it so I can shoot him. The alternative would be to keep it unlocked and loaded at all times. It's hard to imagine a scenario that makes that work.

I saw a cartoon on facebook that made the point that "if gun ownership is so dangerous, why don't we hear of any shootings at firing ranges, where everyone has a gun?" Out of curiosity, I googled it, and found five separate instances of people being shot and killed at firing ranges. Those were all on the first page of search results.

Common sense. That's all I'm hoping for.

Even seven or eight years ago, did you ever think it possible that 6 states plus several municipalities would legalize same-sex marriage (with more to come) or that Don't Ask Don't Tell would be rescinded? States were passing constitutional bans all over the place, but that tide has definitely turned.

All it takes is us speaking up on the reasonable issues: renew the assault weapons ban, require background checks, perhaps even require that gun owners purchase liability insurance (like when you buy a car, you know), etc. These things are entirely possible, if people only make their opinions heard.

But gay rights didn't come because the law forced them on people. They came because gays came out of the closet, and we saw that they were people we liked and admired. Again, common sense won in the end.

Gun laws may come, but not by force. They'll come when people see the logic of them.

it will come. It's a question of not being bullied and hiding in the closet anymore.

...you simply declare a list of things to be reasonable, and then invite debate on it with the implication that only a nut would argue that they aren't reasonable.

Experience argues that what you think current gun laws are bear only a passing relationship to what the gun laws actually are, and that your information comes through the MSM and the talking-head commentators that are frequently mistaken for journalists.

Of course, I could be wrong, but I find that often people who advocate for more gun laws don't fully know current laws because the talking-points and rhetoric gets hammered into their skulls far deep than boring legal analysis.

I share some of the outrage at the idea that there are no practical regulations available that would infringe on the rights of well intentioned gun owners. But, I agree that the matter is settled and that our best strategy is to promote thorough safety measures as well as some that demand personal responsibility.

with any responsible sane person owning a gun, but we have got to have better control laws that will make it harder for the loonies to have assault weapons!

Last edited Tue Jul 24, 2012, 04:37 PM - Edit history (1)

Funny how the same experience can have such disparate results. I now feel ready to exercise my unfettered 2nd Amendment Rights as an NRA Card Carrying Red State American.

Is this OP the end of it or is going to start you off on some crusade?

Will this thread be the end or is there more on the horizon for ya!

believe you!

pushed me from a pro gun person to one in favor of gun control. Their solution for everything is if there were just more guns there wouldn't be any murders is just asinine.

as a woman who owns firearms and who has been here for years and is extremely liberal, I have watched gun owners called all sorts of names since the terrible event. We have been accused of having blood on our hands and I seen tons of posts by people who have no idea what certain kinds of firearms are by definition, advocating bans on same. When someone tries to educate them on the particulars of the weapons they would ban and how they are typically used they don't want to hear any of it. This place has been like family to me and a refuge politically and I support it monthly but I was almost in tears this weekend at the vitriol spewed against firearm owners. I seriously considered leaving. That is how bad it has been for me anyway.

and I have not been flamed, insulted, ridiculed, etc by anyone BUT the anti-gun control types. NOT ONCE.

The anti-gun control types were the only ones flinging insults at me.

People do have the right to fight back, and insult in kind.

Funny how tough a lot of these CC folks are, stamping their feet and demanding they have the right to "fight back" in public - but when they attack others on a message board, they seem to think that others don't have the same right to "fight back."

I find that extremely interesting

But now it'd be joyous to see their smug smiles taken away when more gun control is passed.

That's for sure.

You all need to just stop it and learn how to have civil conversations with each other. If you can't do that, let me suggest you all start to ignore each other so the rest of DU doesn't have to wade through pages of bickering.

Better Gun Control Laws!

I was never pro-gun though. I just didn't think we needed more regulation. It is very sad to me that 12000+ people are killed in a year and that isn't enough to make people think we need to take a step back and reevaluate gun regulations.

jeeezus...

I'm just caught in the middle.

before this being swarmed and assaulted event occurred.

Either you just didn't realize it, or it was for 'common sense' measures that you thought no 'reasonable' person (gun owner or not), could object to.