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Miles Archer

(18,837 posts) Fri Apr 13, 2018, 06:05 PM Apr 2018

Manhattan federal judge grants Trumps request to intervene in the Cohen court hearing

Chris Geidner
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@chrisgeidner

"President Trump" was, officially, granted intervention in the Cohen case.

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23 replies

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Manhattan federal judge grants Trumps request to intervene in the Cohen court hearing (Original Post) Miles Archer Apr 2018 OP

What does that mean? MrsCoffee Apr 2018 #1

That he has standing to get in on the case because of his argument that his atty-client privilege oberliner Apr 2018 #2

This entire article is worth reading: Miles Archer Apr 2018 #4

Thank you. MrsCoffee Apr 2018 #6

This happens anyway matt819 Apr 2018 #14

I think they should choose the "taint team" from members of Congress. kentuck Apr 2018 #18

She was Bill Clinton's original pick for AG--but she had nanny issues. nt tblue37 Apr 2018 #16

What does this mean II? nt awesomerwb1 Apr 2018 #3

Trump can take part in the case to try and protect his attorney-client privilege oberliner Apr 2018 #5

Thank you. awesomerwb1 Apr 2018 #7

Don't think it will make much of a difference, to be honest oberliner Apr 2018 #9

They should not be able to discuss the case with each other, in my opinion. kentuck Apr 2018 #19

Trump wants his representative or a third party to triage the evidence TubbersUK Apr 2018 #10

Uh, no jberryhill Apr 2018 #15

Michael Cohen raid and attorney-client privilege: What is a 'taint team'? TubbersUK Apr 2018 #20

You seem to be missing a point jberryhill Apr 2018 #22

Step 1 seemed to be the focus of the Trump/Cohen push today TubbersUK Apr 2018 #23

This guy is a reporter for Courthouse news (Adam Klasfield): Leghorn21 Apr 2018 #8

That's the issue, "merit to his claims," because he always claims he didn't do it, no matter what. Miles Archer Apr 2018 #11

Hey thanks, Miles - hmmm, *Trump will have to earn it*? Leghorn21 Apr 2018 #13

Kimba Wood--Democrat; Clinton's friend; Bill's first choice for Attorney General. tblue37 Apr 2018 #17

Sounds like it should be. NCTraveler Apr 2018 #12

There's good legal reason to permit Trump intervention gratuitous Apr 2018 #21

MrsCoffee

(5,801 posts)

1. What does that mean?

Reply to Miles Archer (Original post)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 06:05 PM

Apr 2018

oberliner

(58,724 posts)

2. That he has standing to get in on the case because of his argument that his atty-client privilege

Reply to MrsCoffee (Reply #1)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 06:07 PM

Apr 2018

Miles Archer

(18,837 posts)

4. This entire article is worth reading:

Reply to MrsCoffee (Reply #1)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 06:07 PM

Apr 2018

Mr. Cohen wants his lawyers to be able to review the files and withhold privileged material before prosecutors can see them. As an alternative, he asked that an independent lawyer be allowed to review the files first, which prosecutors said would delay the investigation. Prosecutors argued in their court filing that the request by Mr. Cohen’s lawyer “belies the true intent of his motion: To delay the case” and “deprive” prosecutors of evidence. Judge Kimba M. Wood of United States District Court postponed any decision until a follow-up hearing Monday.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/13/us/politics/lawyers-for-trumps-personal-attorney-set-for-friday-court-appearance.html

MrsCoffee

(5,801 posts)

6. Thank you.

Reply to Miles Archer (Reply #4)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 06:09 PM

Apr 2018

matt819

(10,749 posts)

14. This happens anyway

Reply to Miles Archer (Reply #4)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 06:24 PM

Apr 2018

From what I understand. The federal prosecutors office creates a taint team to ensure that material unrelated to the search warrant is not passed.

I guess that the criminal lawyer Cohen wants to be in on this as well as ensure that seized material is within the scope of the warrant.

That actually seems reasonable. I just hope Cohen Cohen et al are allowed to do this under the watchful eye of the prosecution.

kentuck

(111,098 posts)

18. I think they should choose the "taint team" from members of Congress.

Reply to matt819 (Reply #14)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 06:54 PM

Apr 2018

I could think of a few I would choose for the "taint team".

tblue37

(65,377 posts)

16. She was Bill Clinton's original pick for AG--but she had nanny issues. nt

Reply to Miles Archer (Reply #4)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 06:45 PM

Apr 2018

awesomerwb1

(4,268 posts)

3. What does this mean II? nt

Reply to Miles Archer (Original post)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 06:07 PM

Apr 2018

oberliner

(58,724 posts)

5. Trump can take part in the case to try and protect his attorney-client privilege

Reply to awesomerwb1 (Reply #3)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 06:07 PM

Apr 2018

awesomerwb1

(4,268 posts)

7. Thank you.

Reply to oberliner (Reply #5)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 06:09 PM

Apr 2018

That's not good for the planet is it?

oberliner

(58,724 posts)

9. Don't think it will make much of a difference, to be honest

Reply to awesomerwb1 (Reply #7)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 06:13 PM

Apr 2018

It just means he is officially a party to the case also. Could slow things down a little, maybe.

kentuck

(111,098 posts)

19. They should not be able to discuss the case with each other, in my opinion.

Reply to oberliner (Reply #5)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 06:56 PM

Apr 2018

They are known conspirators.

TubbersUK

(1,439 posts)

10. Trump wants his representative or a third party to triage the evidence

Reply to awesomerwb1 (Reply #3)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 06:14 PM

Apr 2018

before it's given to the investigation, so as to protect anything which is extraneous to the case in hand (privileged).

Normally that role is performed by an FBI 'taint team' of officers or lawyers who are ring-fenced.

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)

15. Uh, no

Reply to TubbersUK (Reply #10)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 06:41 PM

Apr 2018

In the first instance, yes, there is a triage team.

But any other material provided to investigators is subject to a claim of privilege.

No, the FBI doesn't get to decide on everyone else's behalf what is or is not properly the subject of attorney client privilege.

Would you want that?

TubbersUK

(1,439 posts)

20. Michael Cohen raid and attorney-client privilege: What is a 'taint team'?

Reply to jberryhill (Reply #15)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 07:17 PM

Apr 2018

A taint team made up of lawyers who are not involved in the underlying investigation will almost certainly be put in place to review the materials obtained in the raid before those materials are handed over to the prosecutorial team.
The US Attorneys' manual says a "privilege team" exists "to protect the attorney-client privilege and to ensure that the investigation is not compromised by exposure to privileged material."

In other words, a taint team is intended to act as a protective buffer between an individual subject to a seizure and prosecutors when material is seized that may be privileged.

"The taint team lawyers review the documents and remove anything that is covered by the attorney client privilege," CNN chief legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin wrote in an email. "They pass the non-attorney client material to the investigators, who are not 'tainted' by contact with the privileged material."
.

Christie went on to say the team would "examine this, they're going to separate it into stuff that's privileged and stuff that isn't. And then of the stuff that's privileged, is there any evidence of a crime or fraud?"

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/04/10/politics/cohen-raid-trump-attorney-client-privilege/index.html

Which I thought was pretty much what I said.

Given that, where there's evidence of 'crime-fraud', privilege is moot.

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)

22. You seem to be missing a point

Reply to TubbersUK (Reply #20)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 07:30 PM

Apr 2018

Given that, where's there's evidence of 'crime-fraud', privilege is moot.

No, that's not how it works.

Step 1 - everything you've described

Step 2 - believe it or not, we have a legal system in which neither the FBI nor a prosecutors office is in charge of deciding things like guilt or whether or not a piece of evidence is or is not going to be admissible in a proceeding. The court decides that. And, another odd thing about how the legal system works is that the defense, or an affected party, has the right to challenge the admissibility of that evidence.

If the court decides that a given piece of correspondence qualifies for the crime-fraud exception, then it comes in, but to say:

"where's there's evidence of 'crime-fraud', privilege is moot"

No, where there's 'evidence' there's an argument about whether or not it is privileged. But we do not have a system in which law enforcement and the prosecutor have the last word on that.

TubbersUK

(1,439 posts)

23. Step 1 seemed to be the focus of the Trump/Cohen push today

Reply to jberryhill (Reply #22)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 07:56 PM

Apr 2018

hence my post referred to Step 1.

In court, the Manhattan attorney and long-time fixer for Donald Trump was represented by a trio of lawyers — one who had only joined the case on Friday afternoon. They were there to argue that they should get to review the documents seized from Cohen’s office, apartment and hotel room this week before federal prosecutors do so. According to reports, the search warrants related to payouts Cohen coordinated for women who have claimed to have had affairs with Trump, as well as to a taxi business Cohen is involved with.

In the courtroom Friday afternoon, the prosecution argued that Cohen’s team is trying to use attorney-client privilege to both keep the government from reviewing the information they have searched and to protect their client from having to turn over additional information pertinent to the case.

Assistant US Attorney Tom McKay said the law was very clear that the privilege “can’t be used as both a sword and a shield.”

Cohen’s team deserved no extension to try to prove their “wildly overbroad claims of privilege” for material that was lawfully obtained through search warrants, McKay insisted.

Though Wood ultimately granted Cohen’s team additional time, she referred to the prosecution’s concerns as “well-taken.”

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/muckraker/cohen-lawyers-judge-spar-over-attorney-client-privilege

Leghorn21

(13,524 posts)

8. This guy is a reporter for Courthouse news (Adam Klasfield):

Reply to Miles Archer (Original post)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 06:12 PM

Apr 2018

Jargon explanation: Trump is not a party to Michael Cohen's lawsuit against the U.S. government, but he claims that he has an interest in the litigation through attorney-client privilege.

That's why he made a motion to become an "intervenor," which was granted here.
4:19 PM · Apr 13, 2018
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Adam Klasfeld
Adam Klasfeld
@KlasfeldReports
·
26m
Replying to @KlasfeldReports
A new minute entry on the docket: "Counsel for intervenor President Donald J. Trump shall file a letter on or before Sunday, April 15, 2018 by 9:00pm." (cont'd)
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Adam Klasfeld
Adam Klasfeld
@KlasfeldReports
·
26m
"Counsel for movant Michael D. Cohen shall file a letter substantiating factual claims in support of his position on unsealing by 10:00am on Monday, April 16, 2018."

Also notes arguments schedule same day.

No attached document.
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🌬Mizz Allie
🌬Mizz Allie
@mizz_allie
·
42m
Replying to @KlasfeldReports
So Trump is treated above the law. So much for the judges initial comments about equal treatment 🙄

I am so sick of that ignoramus.
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Jordan McRae
Jordan McRae
@jordan_mcrae_
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30m
He's not being treated above the law. This is a pretty routine thing. Judge hasn't decided if Trump has merit to his claims, just that he gets to formally present his claims to the court as an intervenor.
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🌬Mizz Allie
🌬Mizz Allie
@mizz_allie
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26m
I appreciate your explanation. However, he continues to interfere and obstruct. It’s hard to believe it’s anything different.

Miles Archer

(18,837 posts)

11. That's the issue, "merit to his claims," because he always claims he didn't do it, no matter what.

Reply to Leghorn21 (Reply #8)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 06:21 PM

Apr 2018

This one's a little different...he's not "defending" himself against "allegations," these are files from his attorney.

And it's already stated that the "attorney / client privilege" doesn't hold water if the documents in question show proof of ongoing wrongdoing.

It's not a free pass. Trump will have to earn it. Unless, of course, the court just rolls over so he can scratch their belly.

Leghorn21

(13,524 posts)

13. Hey thanks, Miles - hmmm, *Trump will have to earn it*?

Reply to Miles Archer (Reply #11)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 06:24 PM

Apr 2018

Well, THAT WOULD BE A FIRST, amirite??!

tblue37

(65,377 posts)

17. Kimba Wood--Democrat; Clinton's friend; Bill's first choice for Attorney General.

Reply to Miles Archer (Reply #11)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 06:49 PM

Apr 2018

She won't just "roll over" for Trump.

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)

12. Sounds like it should be.

Reply to Miles Archer (Original post)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 06:23 PM

Apr 2018

It seems to me it’s going to give Trump representation in a matter he is uniquely involved in legally.

Will Trumps lawyer have to go past an argument about attorney client privilege? Will they have to argue in instance after instance why the probable cause clause doesn’t apply. That might get interesting.

gratuitous

(82,849 posts)

21. There's good legal reason to permit Trump intervention

Reply to Miles Archer (Original post)

Fri Apr 13, 2018, 07:20 PM

Apr 2018

But I'd like to think it's because Judge Wood wants to kick his ass directly, not just through his consigliere.

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