We must stop this BEFORE it happens.

Basta è basta!

I too hope she sues the store owners, and maybe the NYPD too. But she shouldn't HAVE to. These days it is lucky the cop didn't have an itchy trigger finger. Lots of African Americans have been shot and killed by gun-happy cops for a lot less.

Basta é basta, indeed!

So sick of this shit!!!!!!!

They claim that this is all the customers' fault. That's a stupid response every time even if true, which I doubt.

And why did the police cuff the women before they even knew if a crime had taken place?

I'm sick of this racist shit.

"You know how black people always steal stuff"

behavior" Please!

How about looking at the tapes BEFORE you call the Police?

I hope this lawyer sues them and puts them out of business. Enough is enough.

after the mother and daughter were prove to be innocent!

I said much of the same as you in my post below..

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=10608342

It said the woman and her daughter were handcuffed when the police arrived.. who handcuffed them?

The opening clause of the sentence should have either been written as "Once the police arrived..." or it should have been moved to the predicate, perhaps right after "handcuffed together."

Better yet, the author could have used the active verb "handcuffed" instead of the passive "were": When police arrived they handcuffed the mother and child together...

Just my two cents.

poorly written for people like me who took it literally the way it was written.

I imagined the mother and daughter handcuffed together when the police got there.

It's bad enough they handcuffed them.. with only the say so of the worker who was paranoid of women shopping while Black.. evidently!

And I'm sorry, but I honestly think the perp who called the cops should be doxxed. Until there's some kind of formal penalty in place for that sort of behavior, there needs to be some kind of deterrent in place.

I wonder if people are starting to do this as a copycat crime.

The person who called the cops is pathetic.

I'm not a fan of doxing. Start a boycott and run her out of business. Hit them where it hurts.

There is. It's called "filing a false police report." I don't know about doxxing, but she certainly should have been cited once the cops realized she called them with a false claim.

is not a good look. Just sayin’. And for the clerk to be unsure if something was taken, but called the police anyway? She should have relied on the surveillance tape rather than chance this clusterfuck.

Did they miss the part where she’s an attorney?

And even if there were some back-and-forth between the sales-person and the customers, the customer is right.

I will echo a comment about doxxing to put some level of blame on the employee. That's the only way a person can start to understand the effects of their action. Being fired from this establishment is not a big deal. Having a history following you around for years is.

And are snarky about their response being posted on the husband/gfather's FB -- liek wtf??? He is an attorney, end a letter of apology to him office, not post a fucked up statement calling his wife and daughter liars, and the aggressors in this.

lets turn this over to Jury of Peers.

What a fucked up statement.

What obvious lies by them and their employee.

I hope they go out of business NOW.

Our store employee was "shocked" that when they accused someone of stealing, that the accused didn't take it well.

Crisis communications 101 - don't blame the victims, don't prolong the crisis. Say you're sorry and what you will do to make sure it doesn't happen again.

They accused them of stealing and they got angry, so they called the police. People do get angry when you accuse them of things they haven't done, and I can imagine the level of rudeness behind that accusation too.

Because of store was claiming a theft in progress. So the lawyer and the owners are completely full of shit.

They called the two patrons "uncooperative" and "furtive," suggested that they were lying, accused them of "threatening" their employee's safety, and then of "humiliating," "berating" her. The employee, on the other hand, is described as professional, patient, and simply doing what anyone would have.

THEN they ask for a meeting to try to "resolve this."

How fucking pretentious of them. I, too, hope this is "resolved" in court.

Who could delete the store statement beside the store.

There is also a huge difference between that statement and the other statements by the store so which version are we supposed to believe.

Why didn't the cops look at the store video? Plenty of mistakes made by both the store and the cops.

They were saying that they posted to his page and he deleted it.

us@amarcordvintagefashion.com.

Poor woman. I bet that was humiliating and traumatic. The clerk should have reviewed the video before calling the police, since she had the identities of the shoppers, I assume. She should not have called the cops unless she was sure, though.

I wonder what she thought she saw. All the stores, esp small ones, keep an eagle eye on inventory because there's a lot of theft. I count, or clerk counts or notes, # of items I take to try on, then I return everything in most stores, counting the ones I'm buying. Everything is right there, accounted for.

But some stores are more loosey goosey on that, when you leave items in the dressing rooms & just take the ones to buy to the register.

In discount stores, you get a number on a tag to indicate the # of items you are trying on. Then you have to return them all to the clerk, along w/the tag #, so they can see that all items are accounted for.

If someone had stopped me, I would have said I don't have any other items than what I paid for...and I would have opened my purse for them to see, to satisfy them. I would have been angry about it, but I wouldn't have just left, I think.

I'm sure racial profiling goes on, whether intentionally or unintentionally. I've had attempted break-ins by youngish men before (one white, one black). Because of that, I would be more leery of a youngish male approaching my door than someone else. I suppose that's a sort of profiling? But it's based on my personal experiences, so I can't really help it.

Upthread, you see the release from the store where they're essentially saying it's all made up:

They're strongly conflicting, facts not yet available.

And of course, belief based not on fact but on assigning guilt by color is intrinsically intensely biased. That shouldn't have to be said. Nor should anyone have to point out, yet again, that tendencies to both racist bad behavior and other obnoxious acting-out behaviors are human characteristics common to people of all colors and backgrounds.

I'm arguing that two lawyers who know exactly what the penalties would be if they were lying about this, it was proven, and a business won a civil suit against them, are the people I'm more likely to believe than the people who are sitting on evidence that could completely exculpate them, if their side is true.

I do want to hear more.

I also do see some similarities in both accounts.

----

Mom tries on four items, asks the price, leaves them on the ottoman, starts to leave having not made a purchase.

Approached while leaving, asked about a fifth item, points to the four she tried on, says no fifth. Exits and is followed out, told to come back in.

"No, how could I help you?' after she's already accounted for items.

"You stole from us'.

"No, I haven't stolen anything from you. Cause I’m black you think I’m stealing?”

"The surveillance cameras will prove any theft!"

“Great,” “You should go watch it.” Starts walking away, is being followed.

Cops arrive, handcuff two women instead of just asking to see their bags, etc.

-----

Now, beyond that, we don't know if both parties were yelling or just one. If Nancy actually does have a picture of the woman trying to touch her, that could suggest that the store employee went beyond "Shopkeeper's Privilege" by attempting to use physical force to detain her there. And the reasonableness factor -- if they did in fact review surveillance before following her -- may also go against the business.

But I really think most people know better than to lie to get their 20 minutes of fame. Especially educated people.

So yes, I believe Nancy.

for years, Moriah, would never (omg! ) automatically consider anyone more ethical, honest, reliable, or afraid of engaging the legal sysem because he or she is an attorney. All competent attorney's know how manipulate facts, words and processes to use our legal systems as both defense and weapon.

And unless you have the power to match him or her, taking on one who is threatening you legally is as begging for trouble in its way as challenging a bad police officer. I've been threatened twice as an independent subcontractor in my field and backed off twice though I was completely in the right and both were in the wrong. They both knew it, but they both also knew that legal costs would be very expensive for me and very low for them, and that they could drag it out punishingly. The same tactics Trump and Cohen used routinely.

As for the rest, I still feel not the slightest need to form an opinion now and will wait and see.

Did you read the story?

A racist caller struck again against innocent POCs.

Sure, that nothing was found when the police searched seems to speak very loudly. And not that these customers are guilty of "looking evasive" while being black. That sounds damning, but shouldn't we have the story before sentencing?

The reason I spoke up is the leaping to fact-free assumptions by most on this thread. God forbid anyone behaving that way were on a jury for me, or anyone. To that note, btw, I suspect a recital of behavior on this thread -- followed by a proud statement of intention to repeat it any time one feels like it -- should help anyone get excused from service.

If so, lay odds on that tape getting erased or not showing up. Oopsie!

Very different accounts. Maybe the security cameras will show which version is right.

I throw out the last version for several reasons. It's not believable.

but beause of he who shall not be named , " i have been emboldend by you know who," is now propelled out into the fore front , along with cable news and 24 7 news alltogether

Until they correct the statement to say "an employee falsely accused two shoppers of theft," I don't believe a word they say.

on but were wrong about
Fuck them

business model.

It really isn't that hard to do/say the right thing after a screw up.

digging in blaming the victims.

#VintageShoppingWhileBlack: New York Lawyer and Daughter Handcuffed After Being Accused of Stealing

snip//

The owners of Amarcord, Patti Bordoni and Marco Liotta, claim the event went down differently, but that their employees did nothing wrong.

“Basically, there was some furtive behavior on the part of the patrons, an employee asked about an item of clothing and that question alone prompted the patron to pull the race card,” Daniel Kron, the attorney for the store owners, told the Daily News.

Ummm...what race card? Probably not the best tactic for a lawyer who’s trying to prove that a gentrified rags store didn’t pull some race-related stereotyping, but we will continue.

More..
https://www.theroot.com/vintageshoppingwhileblack-new-york-lawyer-and-daughte-1825979700

Just begging to be protested.. Unbelievable!

I'm confused..the way this was written.

either way.. when I worked in retail you didn't get to go after someone once they left the store. You had to confront them on the spot. AND you sure as hell better be absolutely sure you saw them do it. I hope they clean bankrupt that store with lawsuits.

I'm sure that's why that guy was transferred..wow. Next he should be fired.

I'm about out of words as to this crap that keeps happening

She was getting medically examined and treated after use of force over nothing.

A smart officer would have handed over the IDs immediately, even if they did decide to go to the hospital as well, to avoid the perception of detention. A dirty cop knowing he used excessive force and trying to intimidate witnesses would hold it.

He picked the wrong woman to do that too and he deserves everything coming at him.

A smart officer would have let her go 2 minutes after arriving at the scene and seeing their was no evidence. Then lectured the woman who made the call.

Or purposely in the passive voice for the benefit of the cop.

Seems like it should read: "When police arrived, they handcuffed the mother and child handcuffed together and and looked through one of their shopping bags"

reading.. like they were already handcuffed when the police Arrived.. obviously.

Thank you, mcar.. for straightening that out for me.

Your version was quite clear.

I can't help but edit things.

cool. I love it when news stories are written so I can understand them.

My head hurt on that part

having handcuffs handy.

As I've subsequently found out.. "it was poorly written.. "

So you and I weren't the only ones confused by that wording.

. . . after the suit is decided, she'll own the place.

but I hear that's not ok to say

Thank you. I get berated for saying it.

I don't have to be followed around a store by "fearful" whites and/or their "security" who think I am going to steal something. As it is, the big box stores here require I have my receipt out to show to employees at the exit to verify the purchases in my bag/cart before leaving the store.

You get sick of it.

It's a "societal" thing and it will take some time to fix.

... detained ?!

Black people aren't allowed to get angry in the US without consequences, like having the police called and being handcuffed and detained. The folks at the shop were unsure at that point that anything was stolen, but the mom and daughter still got handcuffed and detained because they were angry. And why wouldn't they have been angry.

We've all seen the frequency escalate in recent days .....

Know what you are dealing with... the aims of Confederate mentality, driven by the Administrations Confederate Agena with its Antebellum Aspirations.

That might stop this crap.

I have read about several such cases.

so we're all thieves because we studied hard and achieved.
Fuck this shit!

...sell her a bag that she saw in Rome. They told her she

couldn't afford it. How did they know?

There were a few folks here saying that she shouldn't have been buying such expensive stuff.

Just search "Oprah purse" and they will pop up from 2013 (these were about her Swiss incident).

And from the looks of it, the shop workers continued to disrespect her way after the fact by calling her a liar, etc.

To each his/her own, but the moment I'm disrespected--I don't care if it's a Subway Diner or a car dealership--my wallet closes, all items in the shopping cart are abandoned, and I exit the store. I get that others prefer to make a point by giving racist assholes money, but not me. F that! We have to stop supporting businesses with racist/deplorable business practices!

No one who treats me like shit is getting my money

And immediately think, this lady has money. Hate to profile, but the teeth, earings, dress, hair style, all provide clues that she is likely well to do.

Lots of poor people don't steal

Here in Germany, one of my wife's friends was shopping in a sleep shop. She was shopping for some new sheets and covers. Her husband is the retired head of a huge successful firm and worth a fortune. She is a retired teacher from a working class Ruhr Valley town. She talks like it and dresses like it, and sees no reason to show off her husband's money. So she dresses in simple shirts and jeans. She went into a sleep shop and after looking around,told the saleswoman she wanted to take a close look at one certain set of bedclothes. The saleswoman told her, "oh, those are too expensive for you." Now, she could have bought the whole store if she had wanted to, but just told the saleswoman to let her be the judge of what she could afford and what she couldn't.

For that matter, I was in a "Reform Haus" shop (bio foods etc.) in my town a few years ago, and had nothing smaller than a 100 euro bill, so I tried to pay for my purchase with that. The elderly woman at the cashier started screaming at me that she knew a fake bill when she saw one, and that "she didn't know from what country (i.e. you dirty foreigner) I got my paper money from," but she knew there was no such signature of the euro bills. I looked. The signature on the bill was that of Jean-Claude Trichet, who had been head of the European Central bank for about a year and a half. Bills with the signature of the first chairman, Wim Duisenberg, were still circulating, and after a year and a half this idiot woman hadn't noticed the new ones--and she was working as a cashier!! I was so furious that I walked down to the local police station and swore out complaint that I had been falsely accused for being a foreigner trying to circulate fake money. The cop on duty looked at the bill in question and asked what the cashier had found wrong with it. I said she was cursing me out (and she was really yelling) because the signature of Jean-Claude Trichet didn't exist. The cop rolled his eyes, and asked if it would be enough for me that he send someone to have a talk with the cashier. I said that would be fine, and I found out later that not only had the police had stern words with her, but the head of the chain had sent a reprimand as well. They apologized to me and said they certainly didn't condone such behavior.

The difference is that here in Germany, words are exchanged. In Trump's America, the cops would have probably arrested me, put me in custody for a day or two, and then, after finding that my currency was genuine, confiscated it to finance their next barbecue.

Black people are routinely followed in stores by store security and suspect on entering stores..period

There's nothing like that here.

the mother and daughter were treated unfairly even though they were proven innocent.

What I can't understand is how did they got handcuffed before the police arrived?

This is horrible.. why didn't the store worker look at the tape instead of calling the police in the first place?

that they are not only evil to their core, but also clearly not enough of responsible adults to properly handle having someone like Trump as POTUS.

Every SINGLE HUMAN in this country SHOULD all be completely turned against that assf**kpigfacesh*thead by now, but these white supremacist entitled snowflake motherf***ers are so brainwashed and living in a hate-filled and propaganda-filled fantasy world that they simply cannot process WHAT COMPLETELY F***ED UP N*ZI's ... they are acting like.

I am ashamed of my race, of my gender, and I'm almost ashamed of being Murkan ... I would be, if it weren't for the rest of you here on DU.

F*** these people.

History will judge ALL OF YOU Dump Supporters ... very harshly. Just as they judged Japan and N*zi Germany for DECADES, until they showed the world they'd by and large become populated by decent people, and gotten rid of their SH*TBAG population ... i.e. the ones who were the equivalent of all you Dump Supporters.

Very likely no Trump supporters involved.

Whether the employees are Trumpers or not, Cheeto appreciates you sticking up for him... again.

Thus, the vast majority voted for Hillary and not Trump.

of Brooklynites voted for Trump. Nevermind that it's quite possible that these workers hail from a different part of the metro area.

Trump appreciates you sticking up for him. Keep going.

They also say: "Amarcord loves and embraces all cultures, ethnicities, races, and genders."

Important to remember that systematic racism is systematic, it's not just a "Trump-supporter" thing.

for years. I guess they were since they said so.

Trump told reporters a few months ago, "“I am the least racist person you have ever interviewed, that I can tell you.” Clearly that's true because he said so.

Which makes the situation quite problematic in other ways.

Could make them publicly shamed on FB.

Phone doesn’t show tweets.

How does one politely accuse a someone of stealing? What a load of bullshit.

Spinning!

Funny that.

Or is it just getting reported more? Or a combination of both? I have no problem believing police have often been used as a weapon against PoC, and that in the Age of Trump racists are emboldened. I also think (and this is probably good) that since the Starbucks incident we are talking more about these issues.

so IMHO, it is just getting "reported" more. The frequency may actually be "less" in certain places due to more enlightened people but may be "more" in other places due to people stoked by the current occupant of the WH.

And note that most of these reports ARE being done on social media initially and the only way they make the "news" is if they "go viral". I.e., simply reporting these incidents directly to the local news outlets would get the report eventually placed in the "circular file" unless the incident was egregious (like a death by cop) or involved a celebrity.

And yes, police are the private security of many whites, despite POC paying taxes for those same police. It is up to PDs to encode and enforce policies that will determine if the call was "unfounded" and to de-escalate any dispute, and finally to LEAVE.

There is a tendency for LEO to stand quietly while whites "mouth off" and vent at them (allowing them to "blow off steam&quot when confronted, but POC must remain silent and docile in the same situation or they will be beaten and brutalized before being arrested, or even killed on the spot, and then dragged away dead to be thrown in the back of a police cruiser or left on the street for hours before the coroner arrives.

Be happy to boycott, but never heard of the place.

So I don't think a boycott from Colorado would be particularly effective.

I'm a little slow sometimes.

If that is the route one wants to go.

Was watching ABC News last night and they had two stories on police abuse during the newscast. One on the young man being roughed up at the Waffle House and the other of the lady being yanked from her car in Atlanta. Interesting that they both immediately asked for the Supervisor to be brought in. (Police Supervisor)

As a white male, that is something I would never have considered, a bit of white privilege, we don't have to ask to move up the chain of command because we don't get yanked from cars during a traffic stop.