...I don't think so.

At least, it wasn't set up as one. Maybe they're stringing us along at this point to minimize the garbage we're going to find. But I bet Romney doesn't want them out in the open either way. If only so the 99% doesn't see how the 1% REALLY lives.

he up to now???

Mitt is fucked.

#666 to my Devil car insurance co.

Maybe 2 hours ago!

I wonder how many car insurance checks #666 went out today?

Not to mention the trust, or in this case, lack thereof. Why risk it, when the damage is worse than any benefit you'd gain from such a ruse?

Duh.

He can't say "50% pay no taxes!", full well knowing they do (sales tax, payroll tax, property tax, etc) then turn around and say he DOES pay taxes if all he pays are the very same taxes the people he criticizes pay. That would be totally hypocritical.....oh, wait........!

on tax dodge accounts overseas. If he had nothing to hide he wouldn't be hiding it.

Just think of the Dan-Rather incident.

He/she said that they could leak a bad tax return, have it broadcast everywhere, then prove it was false...
I wish i knew who posted it, it made a lot of sense to this cynic.

Like the "hidden camera" he found that he claimed his opponent planted. He plays more than dirty.

This does seem likely.



http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021054343

But it wouldn't surprise me a bit if this scenario were playing out again.

because he flip/flops about his taxes. He says he is going to release some, then he doesn't release even a full year yet, he says he isn't sure what he paid, then he is sure he paid lots and lots of taxes. He then via his wife states that "you people" have gotten all they are going to give. If he is playing some political game, he releases them, there is nothing wrong with them then people will wonder why he didn't just do it in the first place. He will have diverted the public discussion for both sides away from important issues about jobs and the economy. Serious discussions. That is something the Democrats will be able to use against him.

Rafalca the Olympic horse is a jointly owned horse business. Some day she will have to make a profit for them or be declared a hobby.

Ann's personal riding horses are her "therapy" and they aren't official riding therapy horses or any kind of deduction.

Some are more run of the mill dressage horses that she uses for her personal riding and then they also have high quality Olympic competitors which are somehow also businesses that lose enough money for a partial owner to write off $77K in one year?


Are there other dressage horses somewhere in the center of that range or have they eliminated that middle class already?

The vast majority of horses never make it past the lower levels. The basic levels of training prepare them for any other "job" they are suited to, however. Western reining horses, hunters, jumpers, and backyard trail horses all benefit from the basics.

Other horses make it up to medium levels, but can't do the highest levels of collection. It requires tremendous athletic ability and an interest in it.

Some horses make it all the way through to the highest levels of training (with Grand Prix being the highest) but are not competitive at the national or international levels. They do well in local competitions.

Ann's personal horses are competitive locally and possibly nationally, but not international quality.

Only a very few are International caliber and their prices tend to be extremely high, even at a young age. They can be spotted by a combination of bloodlines (certain lines have produced numerous international caliber horses), conformation, gaits, temperament and their early rideability/trainability. Even then, it is a gamble. Anything and everything can go wrong.

The middle class is priced out of International level dressage competition, except the few professional trainers to the 1% or the few who find sponsors. This is, btw, true of many of the Olympic sports. Most figure skaters, for example, are financed by sponsors. (The infamous Tanya Harding had a sponsor at age 8 or so, but lost her sponsor because her mother was beating her in the bathrooms when she lost. I think it's terribly sad that the sponsor abandoned her like that and partly explains how she ended up the way she did. Family matters.)

A woman I worked with for a year many years ago found a sponsor who literally gave her a blank check to travel the world and pick out her dream dressage horse. With that woman's and possibly other sponsorship, she ultimately made the US team for the World Cup.

Another US husband and wife team, Debbie MacDonald and her husband, are trainers to a 1%er in Idaho, who owns all the horses and pays them to train and compete them. Debbie went on to lead the US team in the Olympics she competed in.

...and then there are the 99% dressage horses!

what he has. I bet he'd be an open book for the right price.

besides there must have been some nondisclosure agreement.

Suspicion is damaging, day by day.

Exoneration doesn't come close to matching the damage of the preceding suspicion.

Hence the famous phrase, upon acquittal, "Where do I g to get my reputation back?"

If he has nothing to hide, there is nothing he gains by waiting.

I predict the McCain/Palin/Cheney/Romney divide to get even deeper.

if we think this is about criminality, or even about him paying absolutely zero taxes, then it could backfire.

I think Romney himself is close to the mark when he says what he fears, and Limbaugh said it today. If he releases them, it's going to prove how outrageous the tax system is, a giant ripoff and Romney is the symbol of it.

It could turn out to be the Barack Obama's birth certificate of the election, including a few people who refuse to believe the returns he releases are actually copies of what he filed.

With good lawyers and accountants (and a bit of financial skulduggery) that minimum could easily be zero.

There are about 30% +/- Americans who will vote for him regardless of what he does. These are the same ones that protested Terri Schiavo, bomb abortion clinics, want to see Obama's birth certificate, eat at Chick Fil A, supported Bush, still believe that there are WMD's, and support every irrational piece of legislation that the republicans float.
These are the knuckle draggers that listen to Rush, Faux, and the assorted vocal hate machines that exist.
THEY already could care less about Mittwit. They only care that it is not Obama.

The rest of the THINKING public will say, "Why the hell did they let this go on for so long for" and resent being strung along.

but certainly you're not saying that 30% of the population is willing to bomb an abortion clinic, are you?

30% would bomb an abortion clinic OR support those that do. Better?

is simply to take the pov that for decades most candidates in presidential campaigns have usually released a lot of tax records -- but since romney hasn't, it's natural to wonder if he's hiding something: maybe he hasn't been paying much? maybe he took advantage of some amnesty? dunno, but it's only natural to wonder

He is now saying that he paid a "lot of taxes".

However, if he is forced to now make his returns public, he can say that he paid a lot more than zero, even if he only 5%-10%. And that the Democrats lied about his taxes... It is possible that they planted the story for Reid?

mittens into a vp slot.....then we can hear "lyin johnny" tell us more about his heroics when he was in the military...

And Mitt doubles down every time.

I think the pressure is getting to him and he would have released them if he had them.

This time keeps him from being able to focus on the economy as much as they would like.

It's hard to believe that Romney is this bad of a candidate and that the Republicans are this inept.

Romney twisting in the wind like this is too good to be true. Right?

I don't know about you but I feel I've earned this. I had to live through 8 years of Bush. I've had to endure the divestiture of the middle class, and all of the crap these "conservatives" have thrown at Obama and Bill Clinton. I've earned the right to watch a totally inane and inept Republican doing a slow burn.

I'm going to enjoy every minute of it too, and there's nothing you can do about that.

And he pays the taxes on all the stuff he buys like cars, TVs, etc.

So yeah. I'm sure he's paid taxes.

they would never let this go with all the bad publicity it is getting. October, nothing to see here . nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, won't make up for the hit they are taking now.

Nope not a trap.

A joke yes, a trap, no.

Because even they're finding it hard to keep defending such actions.

even repubs are turning against him and I helped convert one!!

He did not even say 'income taxes' he said 'taxes' and he said 'a lot' rather than 'millions' or 'hundreds of thousands'. And he most certainly did not say he paid his fair share. What he said was basically nothing. The man owns real property, thus he pays taxes. It is expensive property, so the taxes are of course a lot. But does that man pay a dime in income tax? That remains fully unaddressed.

Folks at the DNC have some very damaging info about mittens. They're content to bleed him to death slowly. And the RNC knows exactly what the DNC knows, but they don't even care to attempt to save him. The only "trap" is that the republicans want to supplant Romney with a true conservative.

In all the time he doesn't release the returns, and speculation is put out there it hurts Mitt. Keep swinging. Put him on the defensive and chip chip away.

By the time he comes clean with his return, nobody will care. Opinions have been formed.

Even if he releases his tax returns, and there's no smorking gun, the best he can say is "Democrats are mean and they're lying about me", which is pretty much his campaign message today.

And, don't expect him to get into property taxes; that opens a whole other can of worms (how many houses, which was his REAL residence, and when...)

He's got nothing good to show, that's why he's stonewalling, and even if they are perfectly legal, by this point he's done because they will get so much scrutiny because he has stonewalled this long that it will overshadow his campaign.

Not that I think he CAN release them. He has screwed over too many people in his life, and his tax returns will just bring that to light even more harshly than his run already has done so.

Last edited Fri Aug 3, 2012, 07:11 PM - Edit history (1)

to start frothing at the mouth over Romney's tax returns. So far Obama has not bit. Every noticed how the hullaballou about Romney's tax returns is always started by some Republican 'releasing' some information? Every time.

How can you look at Palin in 2008 and Romney in 2012 and NOT come away with enough proof to show that the GOP is falling to pieces?

I think some of you have post-traumatic stress syndrome if you are still worried about some super-duper master plan.

NO ONE IS IN RUNNING THE GOP! IT'S EMPTY!

"Romney stonewalls on his taxes until late October, releases them and they turn out to be fine."

....Romney is just tricking everyone into believing he's incompetent and inept in the way he handled the situation?

He's creating the impression that he has something to hide, stating that releasing his returns would be "damaging," and then at the last minute, after most Americans are convinced he's either a liar and/or a tax cheat, he's going to say "gotcha"?

Romney campaign "is hoping the waters will recede, and looking for a safe mountaintop"
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021066830

And it must be a bad one. Or several.

The longer he stalls the more we can beat him up over it. By December it won't matter if he paid every dime he had in taxes, the narrative will have done its work.

He needs to be pounded relentlessly, endlessly, incessantly and mercilessly on everything right down to the zits on his ass.

I normally don't watch much news because I figure why listen to an echo chamber? But she has some sort of story breaking tonight. I think it will have something to do with these returns. Did she find a copy somewhere, perhaps?

He was born into money. All he's ever done did is take his inheritance and invest it. Easy enough if you rich. Now throw into the mix the fact you're bored with wealth and want power so you can have more fun with putting your boot on underlings necks.

But, now no way. Not in this or any universe. This has been very damaging if it was a trap it would have been sprung before the damage was done. As of right now, very little talk on the economy. Why? Simple the Republicans don't want to talk about the economy and Mitts tax returns in the same breath because Mitt is a big reason the economy is the way it is and his returns will prove it.

The Repubs have a candidate with something to hide.

Hell no it is not a trap for democratic party but neat little pratfall for cons.
Give them hell Harry and never give in. Just like I did last night at a restaurant.
But that was religious debate against their false gods, money, power and oppression, the holy trinity of republicans.

I wish we would tread more lightly here.

allow the conversation and the headlines to be just about tax returns. There are plenty of other flaws to talk about as well. That way, the potential trap is avoided and the OVERALL case against Romney (a huge, easy case to make) is so diverse and multi-faceted that it can't be swept under the rug with some minor disappointment about his tax returns.

Keep his tax returns in the conversation...but while talking about his trickle down philosophy that is geared toward concentration of wealth in the hands of fewer and fewer people. Talk about how he and his wife 'don't feel rich'. etc etc... Talk about how Romney and the Kochs and his contributors exemplify the need to look at the tax code, at inequality, and almost unlimited power to sway elections...REGARDLESS of what Romney's returns show.

It's not smart to ASSUME Romney has a major tax return problem and state for sure that there's no trap.

He was not living in MA when he vote in the election for Scott Brown.

would be pressing this unless he had reliable information.