General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsNight and Fog--another NAZI tactic...
It was a program to make 'undesirable' people disappear, with no recourse for relatives or survivors to find out any information on what happened to them. This operation to grab children and make them disappear has that kind of a feel to it. Pure family terrorism.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nacht_und_Nebel
Even before the Holocaust gained momentum, the Nazis had begun rounding up political prisoners from both Germany and occupied Europe. Most of the early prisoners were of two sorts: they were either prisoners of personal conviction (belief), political prisoners whom the Nazis deemed in need of "re-education" to Nazi ideals, or resistance leaders in occupied western Europe.[1]
Up until the time of the Nacht und Nebel decree, prisoners from Western Europe were handled by German soldiers in approximately the same way as other countries: according to international agreements and procedures such as the Geneva Convention.[2] Hitler and his upper level staff, however, made a critical decision not to conform to what they considered unnecessary rules and in the process abandoned "all chivalry towards the opponent" and removed "every traditional restraint on warfare."[3]
On 7 December 1941, Reichsführer-SS Heinrich Himmler issued the following instructions to the Gestapo:
After lengthy consideration, it is the will of the Führer that the measures taken against those who are guilty of offenses against the Reich or against the occupation forces in occupied areas should be altered. The Führer is of the opinion that in such cases penal servitude or even a hard labor sentence for life will be regarded as a sign of weakness. An effective and lasting deterrent can be achieved only by the death penalty or by taking measures which will leave the family and the population uncertain as to the fate of the offender. Deportation to Germany serves this purpose.[4]
Emphasis mine.
ck4829
(35,084 posts)With the 'disappearing' of dissidents.
Wounded Bear
(58,698 posts)That is true. Now, they are openly using them against the home front.
Volaris
(10,274 posts)I know in some circles they've fallen out of favor around here, and I'm not inclined to much argue the finer points of why, as their detractors have their reasons and on balance I think those are valid points that require consideration.
But don't say they wernt right...
Crutchez_CuiBono
(7,725 posts)Very interesting tid-bit of knowledge there. TY.
Wounded Bear
(58,698 posts)in all high schools.
A pretty definitive study that focuses mostly on the politics and not so much on the war.
Crutchez_CuiBono
(7,725 posts)As I recall its some very dry reading at the beginning and the pages are just so jammed w info it was hard to digest. Mine has a red cover. And it's thick.
TY for that. I DID get through 'Rise of the 4th Reich' by Marrs, however.
Wounded Bear
(58,698 posts)William Lawrence Shirer was an American journalist and war correspondent. He wrote The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich, a history of Nazi Germany that has been read by many and cited in scholarly works for more than 50 years. Wikipedia
He was a journalist, and his stuff can read a bit like a newspaper, not like the overdramatized stuff we're used to these days.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_L._Shirer
Crutchez_CuiBono
(7,725 posts)Ty for taking the time to post those. I salute you Navy. (or is that Marines?) Still Navy but, it get's touchy eh?
Wounded Bear
(58,698 posts)Marines are part of the Department of the Navy, but we don't really consider ourselves part of the Navy. Was thinking about this a couple of days ago. When you're in your early twenties, I guess distinctions like that can lead to bar fights, and sometimes did. Now, at my age, it's more of an inside joke of sorts, with more cheerful ribbing than caustic commentary.
It's all good.
thbobby
(1,474 posts)I have read it several times in my life and each time learned more. It is excellent. The old quote "Those who ignore history are condemned to repeat it" is very relevant today - probably always relevant.
Anon-C
(3,430 posts)Wounded Bear
(58,698 posts)as was posted above, it has been used at other times, by dictators around the world, some of whom were taught it by our CIA, of course.
Wednesdays
(17,402 posts)it was the high-water mark of the German Reich. In other words, the deepest the Nazis had driven into the Soviet Union.
Maybe there was a premonition that at that point they should get their dirty work done in as wide an area as possible, while they had the chance.
Wounded Bear
(58,698 posts)If he hadn't, it might have been many months before the US would have turned it's attention to Europe. The American public was not fond of another European war that soon after WWI, which many felt was a waste of effort. They were fine with attacking the Japanese, of course. That had the added benefit of a racial overtone as well. The fight in Europe had less visceral support than the Pacific. That could have delayed DDay significantly.
Oh, and the actual 'high water mark' of the invasion was a year later, at Stalingrad. In Dec of '41, the Germans were at the gates of Moscow, but were about to be driven back a hundred miles or more by the Russian winter offensive. The Germans rebuilt and attacked in the South the next summer.
Ferrets are Cool
(21,109 posts)IronLionZion
(45,514 posts)DUers will be so very shocked and won't believe it is happening.
Stuart G
(38,439 posts)32 minutes...The film was named after that German Decree.
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0048434/
Read the reviews by people who have seen it at IMDB....Please read the first 5 or 6 reviews by readers. It is 32 minutes of real horror. Some captured German films, and some films when the Allies opened the concentration camps. If you watch it someday, you will never forget it. I didn't know the film was named after that German Decree discussed above.
Here is the review I wrote on this film, it appears at IMBD (one of the first 5 or 6 user reviews.) The director was Alain Resnais , the grandson of the well known artist. At the time, Resnais was considered one of the most outstanding French directors. This film was made in 1956.
The Most Powerful Film Ever Made
stuartpiles16 November 2004
If you want to describe or give your audience a feeling for the holocaust, or "Man's Inhumanity To Man", then this is the vehicle to use..Show it..be warned, it is so powerful, that you will never forget what you see, neither will any of your viewers..It is impossible to describe, intermixing l955 footage of Auchwitz Concentration Camp, with captured Nazi footage which the allies found at the end of the war, and the scenes of American and British troops liberating the camps...In French, with English subtitles.. and scenes that are unforgettable and horrific. Even the sad music of death from this film plays in my ears, and I have not seen it in 15 years. Once you hear it, you will know.
This is the one to show if you want people to understand the truth of what happened and the reason for its reaction in today's current events....It is shocking in a special way. I showed it to my classes. Students were warned, and told what was coming, they said it would be "nothing" By the end some were crying and moaning in horror...
rickyhall
(4,889 posts)Our side gets a warning while their side gets ideas.