General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsAll hell is about to break loose...
The Republicans in the US Senate and the Republicans in various Intelligence agencies have gone around Donald Trump. The Senate passed a bill today that requires a two/thirds vote in the Senate before we can leave NATO. It was a direct reaction to Donald Trump's recent trip to Britain and the EU. They finally see the danger that is sitting in the White House.
Also, it appears that the NSA Director, the FBI Director, the DNI, the Director of Homeland Security, the National Security Advisor, all came out for a news conference today to try and reassure the people that they are aware of the attacks that are in progress against our election system, and they did it without the approval of Donald Trump, their President.
It appears that Trump has lost all credibility with much of his own Party. Just when he is in full-out assault against his Attorney General, his Justice Department, and the Special Counsel. He has gone completely off the rails in the last few days.
What next??
Crutchez_CuiBono
(7,725 posts)Someone has to fall on their sword for 340 million people.
NotASurfer
(2,151 posts)First thought was, in a canoe in the back woods trying to escape from a group of insane deplorables who might even have voted for him
Hm...memo to Hell's Department of Ironic Punishment...
jalan48
(13,870 posts)JHB
(37,161 posts)chillfactor
(7,576 posts)loved listening to it again.....
Johnyawl
(3,205 posts)FailureToCommunicate
(14,014 posts)RainCaster
(10,884 posts)Or on 45s privates
lastlib
(23,250 posts)appalachiablue
(41,146 posts)Glorfindel
(9,730 posts)"Paddle faster! I hear banjo music!"
displacedtexan
(15,696 posts)I guess you have to be of a certain age to appreciate it, though.
maddiemom
(5,106 posts)Cryptoad
(8,254 posts)wont be him on a sword,,,,,,,
Metro135
(359 posts)Iggo
(47,558 posts)handmade34
(22,756 posts)well, impeachment proceedings would be nice...
Meadowoak
(5,551 posts)Meadowoak
(5,551 posts)mgardener
(1,817 posts)I was working in JC Penney's that evening when it was announced.
A cheer went up when the word got around.
Different Drummer
(7,621 posts)we will still have Trump to kick around.
FakeNoose
(32,645 posts)... I predict that Cheeto will beat a hasty retreat. He'll resign and Pence will be a lame duck for 2 years, unless he gets impeached himself. Any self-serving pardons Trump makes between now and then should be nullified. I'm not sure how that can be done, but we need to make sure there are no secret deals between Trump and Pence like Nixon made with Gerald Ford.
JayhawkSD
(3,163 posts)Why would not the Republicans start screaming that the Russians meddled with the election, and that all of the Democrats who won were tools of the Russians who got them elected?
In fact, that game is already afoot as, the "NSA Director, the FBI Director, the DNI, the Director of Homeland Security, the National Security Advisor, all came out for a news conference today to try and reassure the people that they are aware of the attacks that are in progress against our election system."
Except that I would not say that they were trying to "assure" anyone. They used very dramatic language to stress the very high level and quantity of the attacks.
I would say, actually, that if the Russian goal is to "destabilize democracy" and to "cast doubt on the validity of our elections," then our own Intelligence Community is doing a far better job of that the the Russian could ever have hoped to do.
kentuck
(111,104 posts)Would the Intelligence agencies be doing a better job if they were getting leadership from the top?
Do you think they are just spreading paranoia?
Or do you think it a pretty serious breach of security that they are looking at?
CrispyQ
(36,478 posts)Why isn't this being shouted over the rooftops of all our cities & towns? It is not a fool-proof process either, but we are fools to have electronic voting screens & tabulators counting our votes, knowing how compromised 2016 was.
flibbitygiblets
(7,220 posts)At the very least, all-mail voting such as we have in Oregon. YES I know they are fed into machines, but we can all keep copies of our votes. It also encourages more people to vote in the first place since it's so much easier, no lines, no machines mysteriously down at he polls, no voter intimidation tactics or ID required.
LisaM
(27,813 posts)It also didn't increase turnout (we had some very, very low turnout primaries), BUT, this time, at least in King County, the ballots arrived with the postage prepaid, a step in the right direction.
I really, really miss voting in person.
flibbitygiblets
(7,220 posts)But then, I'm an introvert, and directionally challenged, so finding the polling place in the first place was always a challenge, back when I lived in CA where most people vote in person. And what if you don't have a car? Now you have to take a bus or fine a ride, all on a day when you're almost certainly at work. No thank you!
PLUS, when you vote by mail, you have a chance to research the initiatives and candidates, especially the down-ballot people you don't hear about in the news. When I voted in person, I never research in advance, just showed up and punched whatever sounded good. No
LisaM
(27,813 posts)We still got the voter's guide, and I'd often take it with me into the voting booth.
When I was growing up in Michigan, I often worked at the polls. It was educational and fun, and a nice day's pay for a college student or senior.
calimary
(81,322 posts)workinclasszero
(28,270 posts)is going to stop the MASSIVE pressure to IMPEACH and CONVICT that evil traitor bastard in the White House!
RKP5637
(67,111 posts)He needs a straight jacket.
elleng
(130,974 posts)IF this were true, we'd be in much better shape than we are.
erronis
(15,303 posts)Maybe MSM and other DU posters just haven't caught up yet.
But, "if this were true" in all aspects then it sounds like much of the intel establishment would not be supportive of a purely executive action. My question is the military and particularly the National Guard.
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)Will refuse to carryout an illegal order from Trump. I just have no certainty inside that they won't do what he tells them to do, even if that is attack fellow Americans.
Hekate
(90,714 posts)All I know is that anyone refusing to carry out an order from a superior better be VERY sure the repercussions will be worth it.
Cheviteau
(383 posts)...will not involve itself in unlawful orders. I would bet my bottom dollar that the military has a plan if things start rolling downhill. Generals understand that the military is sworn to uphold the Constitution. Whatever action they take (if any) will be in the best interest of the people and to preserve our Republic. I have no fear of the military going rogue.
LuvLoogie
(7,012 posts)unless they also move to suspend the fall elections.
They though trump would solidify their power. They have been trying to kill the human spirit. It is backfiring on them
kentuck
(111,104 posts)...Little will happen until after the election, imo. But, there must have been some collaboration between the Senate leaders and the Intelligence chiefs. If there was a real threat to our country, which they seemed to believe there is, they could not follow Trump over the cliff or wherever he was taking them.
C_U_L8R
(45,003 posts)They are doing nothing to stop Russian election hacking. In fact, the opposite. They are the beneficiaries... the co-conspirators... the cheerleaders... and probably the funders...
flibbitygiblets
(7,220 posts)couldn't resist, it's such a classic.
central scrutinizer
(11,652 posts)Probably a sternly worded, non-binding letter of concern.
Initech
(100,081 posts)Mister Ed
(5,940 posts)"How's that drainy-swampy thing working out fer ya?"
Leith
(7,809 posts)treated tRump like they treat Democratic presidents. They weren't scared to voice their opposition, like trying to make an excellent president a one-termer, refusing to even interview his nominations, investigation after investigation, and general rudeness.
Who knew they could act like such wimpy-wimps?
Bernardo de La Paz
(49,011 posts)Uncle Joe
(58,366 posts)Thanks for the thread kentuck
bucolic_frolic
(43,191 posts)Factions came and went in the year preceding the Russian Revolution. The Kerensky government, the White Russians, and eventually the Bolsheviks were not really communicating with one another. Once the situation with the war deteriorated and the workers organizations (Soviets) and the military support softened support for the moderates, the Bolsheviks seized power. I'm not suggesting or implying that could happen here, but it is an example of legitimacy melting away.
I really don't think our judicial system is in danger of siding exclusively with Trump. Donnie's out on a very long limb. If federal institutions, cabinet secretaries, Congressional committees could reassert their sense of patriotism and balance, and/or Democrats could grab the House in a solid election, Trump will be left tweeting to himself in a bird cage.
Bernardo de La Paz
(49,011 posts)bucolic_frolic
(43,191 posts)Nixon's downfall was an orderly removal. Today, some levers of federal power may work, some not, and the political spectrum in the country runs to both extremes but is poorly populated in the middle. The biggest risk - nothing might happen?
empedocles
(15,751 posts)makes this more interesting
bucolic_frolic
(43,191 posts)English Revolutions, French and Napoleon, Italy and Garibaldi ... it's been so long since I studied history I have to go YouTube to jog my memory!
WheelWalker
(8,955 posts)Blue_true
(31,261 posts)Still In Wisconsin
(4,450 posts)Longer term I expect him to become increasingly unhinged in his tweets, to start firing people left and right (Rosenstein and Sessions for starters) and for a small, insular cell of loyalists to encircle him and try to protect him from the inevitable storm. A "Trump bunker" as it were. After the midterms it's anyone's guess. He could resign. He could try to void the elections. He could try to start a war. Who really knows with Donald Trump?
bucolic_frolic
(43,191 posts)yes, it's totally in his playbook - RIGGED!! Crooked elections!!! They were no good!! I don't see how he could refuse to seat Congress, or dissolve Congress ... but with this idiot, WHO KNOWS ANYTHING???
BigmanPigman
(51,611 posts)I wish I had my own bunker from the shit that is coming down the pike. He will do anything since he is so insane and angry.
mikeysnot
(4,757 posts)Breaks Loose..
certainot
(9,090 posts)he risked drawing attention to his most important and invisible ally but considering media didn't seem to notice......
rurallib
(62,424 posts)everybody slinks back and make strongly worded statements.
Hell it would never pass the House anyway.
If it did and he vetoed could they get 2/3rds to override in both houses?
Equinox Moon
(6,344 posts)and I can't find a news report on it. It was extraordinary that the intelligence heads came forward to make statements.
Does anyone have a link to the press conference?
Update: I found it:
kentuck
(111,104 posts)A lady named Farkus was responding to someone who asked if the Intelligence people would do something like that without the knowledge of Donald Trump. She smiled and commented to him about how Washington works, paraphrasing.
With the Senate's action on passing a bill to protect NATO and the very unusual meeting by the Intelligence agencies, we can only assume what is going down?
But whatever it is, it doesn't look good for Donald Trump, in my opinion.
zentrum
(9,865 posts)Pence.
And the push for a stealth Christian Theocratic state combined with an oligarchy.
Will be just as cruel, racist and toxic.
bucolic_frolic
(43,191 posts)has resurfaced on talk shows today, that at worst he will be an unnamed, unindicted co-conspirator. Also that Mueller does not have a particularly strong hand in interviewing Trump, that he will not indict Trump, that a report to Congress is best, that Mueller cannot subpoena Trump particularly well because unlike the case of Nixon who had his tapes targeted, Mueller does not yet have specific material to be sought from Trump.
Almost sounds like a soft landing is ahead, perhaps, that either pushes Trump out the door with sympathy, or allows elections to cleanse the wounds from this debacle. It is tempting to think something big is up, as the OP opined.The investigation cannot be curtailed, not with so many large and important lines of inquiry unelucidated.
Just wish they'd get a move on!
benld74
(9,904 posts)None of them
Theyve done nothing up till now
While using tRump to get what they want
Hell with them
heaven05
(18,124 posts)fucking cowards getting some spine, maybe.
DallasNE
(7,403 posts)The open cued with none other than the Koch brothers. Trump just won't put up with competition - much like a hippopotamus in the wild.
Demonaut
(8,919 posts)sobenji
(316 posts)Why cant someone hack the -Rs for us?
Maybe then they will care.
Im tired of going high when they go low.
F*** that.
SWBTATTReg
(22,143 posts)It is what they do w/ the information that they hacked that's important...if it's a liquor list for a bunch of fat old white guys, then we're out of luck...remember, its the R, we're not looking for intelligence here...
regnaD kciN
(26,044 posts)...doesnt it require Trump's signature? If so, it's all just for show.
kentuck
(111,104 posts)You don't think it could get enough votes to over-ride his veto??
louis c
(8,652 posts)If they're requiring two thirds, they must have two thirds.
and, because it's a treaty, they don't need the House at all.
lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)sellitman
(11,607 posts)If the Rethugs were coming around they would have this cretin Impeached by now.
The are 100% complicit.
bjvom
(51 posts)was a stunt. Nobody in his administration does anything against the wishes of the OMOO (Orange Menace Occupying the Oval Office. Apologies to Melville.) Now they can refer to it and say, "SEE! We're going to take this Russia thing SERIOUSLY!"
Texin
(2,596 posts)So, I'm skeptical that they can do anything more than just talk about the problem. Dan Coates drew Shitler's ire last week when he was visibly surprised and dismayed about not being told tRump had agreed to a summit with Putin in Washington. I read Shitler was apoplectic about that and I expected Coates to be sacked as a result. Now this. I bet not a single one of the people (except SHS) who was on that dais yesterday is left in his administration shortly.
kentuck
(111,104 posts)But, I don't think it was Trump's idea. I think they colluded to provide information about national security without the pre-approval of their President.
I would not have thought that if the Senate had not earlier made a strong statement with their vote to preserve NATO. That was probably much to the chagrin of Trump and Putin?
DallasNE
(7,403 posts)This had the blessing from someone inside the Whitehouse.
Ilsa
(61,695 posts)The security briefing is a stunt if they do nothing to fix our election vulnerabilities.
colorado_ufo
(5,734 posts)so they can get some actual work accomplished.
CrispyQ
(36,478 posts)Um, no, not really.
AllaN01Bear
(18,262 posts)i think the attacks on our election system has been going on for a very long time , before kerry/edwars and the attack on prez carters election.
bucolic_frolic
(43,191 posts)nothing is happening, in my view. Stocks can't decide up or down. No upside, no downside, yet everything's too expensive. Wages stagnant. It's like everyone is waiting for something.
PassingFair
(22,434 posts)Buckle up!
jaysunb
(11,856 posts)workinclasszero
(28,270 posts)a wag the dog war with Iran before the midterms is my guess.
Skidmore
(37,364 posts)I can find no articles that indicate that it is more than proposed.
Jack-o-Lantern
(967 posts)I urge you to go to Ronny Coxs (guitar player in Deliverance) face-book page.
He is a very intelligent progressive and his posts are very good.
apkhgp
(1,068 posts)Ever since 45 declared his candidacy this nation has been suffering setbacks. The Repukelican primaries leading up to their convention proved to be a clown act. His election to the White House was a deep blow to this nation only to be exceeded by all of the policies his administration has enacted. Thank you very much 45, for screwing this country up like you did.