General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsHoly Crap! USA Woman's Tennis Championship.
If you didn't watch.. Get to Espn..Amazing .
Serena lost a point ... Code Violation .. She went absolutely nuts.. Game point was given to her opponent and her opponent (Japanese Player) won next point which gave her the Championship..
Naiomi Osaka .. Chris Everette... Stating never saw anything like it
Complicated situation.... Wow!
stopbush
(24,396 posts)That brought the warning. The warning became a code violation when Serena then smashed and broke her racket. That lost her a point. Then on the changeover, she called the umpire a thief for awarding the point to Osaka. That brought the awarded loss of a game for verbal abuse.
The whole time, Serena was yelling at the umpire that he needed to apologize to her.
I think the ump could have maybe given her a verbal warning to calm down, but that would have been showing favoritism to an American superstar player, which in itself would be an abuse of the rules.
Hind sight being 20/20, I believe Serena could have called for the tournament referee after the warning was given. Definitely after the point was awarded, rather than taking it into her own hands.
DURHAM D
(32,611 posts)Was not watching live.
stopbush
(24,396 posts)busterbrown
(8,515 posts)I don't watch that much Tennis... so thanks for the clarification.
ecstatic
(32,731 posts)The so called "coaching from the stands" happens all the time, especially in men's tennis.
Second, if her eyes were constantly glued to the stands to track her coach's hand movements, she wouldn't be the greatest player in the world.
Complete BS, IMO.
stopbush
(24,396 posts)The violation is rarely called, but it is called. Anyone who follows tennis knows this because its always a big deal when it is called.
USALiberal
(10,877 posts)busterbrown
(8,515 posts)But Serena is known for her comebacks... after difficult circumstances ..Remember she was Serving for advantage on pt 5 for deuce all of a sudden she's at break point.. She might of come back
USALiberal
(10,877 posts)Scurrilous
(38,687 posts)<snip>
"Serena Williams came to blows with the umpire in the US Open's Women's final as she accused him of 'stealing a point from her'.
Umpire Carlos Ramos issued a game penalty to the US star during her game against Japan's Naomi Osaka because the umpire accused her of getting coaching from the side lines.
The 23-time Grand Slam winner screamed at Ramos: 'Every time I play here, I have problems. I did not have coaching, I don't cheat. You need to make an announcement. I have a daughter and I stand for what's right. You owe me an apology.'
'For you to attack my character is wrong. You owe me an apology. You will never be on a court with me as long as you live. You are the liar. You owe me an apology. Say it. Say you're sorry.
'How dare you insinuate that I was cheating? You stole a point from me. You're a thief too. '
Moments later Williams crashed out of the final with Osaka winning 6-2, 6-4."
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/ushome/index.html
janterry
(4,429 posts)It might be an unusual penalty, but she was wrong. Her coach was coaching
from the side lines.
She owes him an apology.
It looks like coaching from the sidelines is done all the time.
Why it's even a rule to ban it is beyond me!
However, Serena was VERY badly behaved.
So it's a wash for me, and I just don't care.
MiniMe
(21,718 posts)What hurt was giving her a game that put Osaka up 5-3. Osaka definitely deserved the win.
busterbrown
(8,515 posts)Serena made a career on comebacks.. She definitely was not out of the match.
MiniMe
(21,718 posts)even if it had gone to a 3rd set. Love Serena, but Osaka is definitely the future, and Serena needs to get a few more matches under her belt. Be willing to bet that Serena will win the next match between the 2 of them.
stopbush
(24,396 posts)getting to 5-3 all on her own. She was serving for 5-3 after all.
MiniMe
(21,718 posts)I think he would have probably won the game, if it was played. Osaka was playing really well. Osaka deserved the win, it was just a shame with all the confusion and controversy.
Colorado Liberal
(145 posts)... than the umpire/referee becoming the center of attention. <sarcasm>
Osaka deserved the match and the championship, and she also deserved for the umpire to stay out of the way.
stopbush
(24,396 posts)Coaching from the stands? Sure, everyone does it and usually, nothing happens. Just like people running red lights - no big deal until it is.
Whats sad is that it was Serenas coach who set this off, not the ump. The ump saw a clear violation (watch the video) and called it. Should he have ignored it? That would be favoritism. Serena wasnt asking for coaching, yet she paid the price for her coach violating the rules. The escalation of the situation was on Serena, though.
DURHAM D
(32,611 posts)You don't make that call in the finals simply because IT IS IGNORED ALL THE OTHER TIMES.
Ramos should never be in the chair again.
I never fault any player for escalating a situation caused by an umpire. It is not a game to the players, it is their life and livelihood.
stopbush
(24,396 posts)The situation was caused by her coach, not the umpire. And I dont even think the coach was really trying to coach her. He was just engaging in flagrant behavior/gestures that coaches use all the time, almost involuntarily. BUT, the rules are clear, and there are lots of rules that get ignored until they are not ignored.
I would not be surprised if we learn that warnings had been issued to players and coaches over the length of the tournament that the coaching was getting out of hand, and that warnings for coaching would be given. The escalation of the situation was on Serena for losing her cool.
DURHAM D
(32,611 posts)jftr - The whole sports world has been talking about Serena's new serve and volley game. Why would she need a coach to remind her to go to the net?
Answer: She doesn't.
stopbush
(24,396 posts)There are plenty of examples of the rule being enforced, if infrequently.
USALiberal
(10,877 posts)Argue balls and strikes, get thrown out. Happens all the time.
Serena was frustrated with her play and lost her cool.
Colorado Liberal
(145 posts)The first warning for coaching and the point penalty for breaking the racket, okay. The game penalty is the deal-breaker for me - at that point in the match, let her blow off some steam and get the match back in play. Making that call completely changes the competitive situation in the 2nd set, and with that, the match. He made himself the center of attention when he did that. Too many officials with too much ego, in my opinion (see Joe West, baseball umpire).
stopbush
(24,396 posts)continually demanding he apologize to her for the warning on the coaching violation. In fact, Ramos gave her two extended opportunities to blow off steam. He called the code violation on her only after her third go at him, when the demand for an apology escalated into her calling him a thief to his face.
Le Gaucher
(1,547 posts)He could have handled it better ( as could have Serena)
I am an Avid Tennis fan .. I has no clue about the 3 strikes and game rule... Good chance Serena was caught unawares too
stopbush
(24,396 posts)Le Gaucher
(1,547 posts)Sugarcoated
(7,728 posts)I've seen it enforced over the years.
stopbush
(24,396 posts)And the rule isnt new. Nadal was penalized in 2010 for coaching during a match. Coaching isnt allowed in Grand Slam events. What IS new this year is that coaching is being allowed between sets in non-slam events on an experimental basis. Thats something even casual fans know.
Le Gaucher
(1,547 posts)spooky3
(34,481 posts)EleanorR
(2,395 posts)The umpire got in the way. My heart broke for Osaka, she played so well and was so composed and strong and focussed, especially for a 20 year old. And Serena deserved to be treated as most players are, ignore the coaching. Give a warning if you're thinking about issuing a third strike in a final.
sunonmars
(8,656 posts)MuseRider
(34,120 posts)Serena can be her own worst enemy.
The American crowd was largely embarrassing booing and making this less than what it should be for Osaka. Most of her happy, joyous time was spent in sad tears. They are all trying to make up for it now thankfully. She deserved the win, I think she was going to win anyway considering how she was playing and how Serena was playing.
EDIT to add, Serena did a wonderful thing however, she asked the crowd to stop booing and cheer for Naomi who deserved the win. I never thought I would see that from Serena, she usually carrys her mad for a long while.
LisaM
(27,832 posts)Trying to undo damage you've created yourself doesn't much warrant a pat on the back (though I do think she realized how difficult it was making things for Osaka). I have spent years trying to like Serena better, and I'd actually gotten there, seeing her pal around with other players and with her baby, but she pretty much undid that all today.
MuseRider
(34,120 posts)I have not cared for her since she threatened that line judge in the US Open all those years ago, I try but it just does not come. I used to like her a lot and was always happy for her to win. I love Venus, always have but her attitude is more inline with my own so that is likely why.
I was trying to give something back to Serena because she did realize what had happened and all of a sudden she changed her attitude and I really appreciated that. I know all of it had to be hard for her.
Awsi Dooger
(14,565 posts)She was disgusting against Clijsters in 2009, first threatening the female line judge and then blatantly lying about it.
Frankly it is the reason I am always surprised at the pro-Serena threads here. Once she demonstrated those low class bully tendencies in a match against such a classy player as Clijsters I started rooting against Serena all the time. And Serena also was low class in post match interviews after losses to the other prominent Belgian..Justine Henin.
Here is the clip of that 2009 match. I always thought it was great that the tiny Asian lines woman stuck up for herself and told the chair umpire exactly what Serena said. Then when Serena says she didn't threaten to kill the woman, you can hear a female voice from the stands in that area yell out, "Yes you did."
ecstatic
(32,731 posts)power-hungry umpire hurt both players with his antics. How convenient for him.
oasis
(49,408 posts)USALiberal
(10,877 posts)MuseRider
(34,120 posts)She was losing and most likely would have lost anyway. Out played and out classed today.
She will be back.
Sugarcoated
(7,728 posts)Her drama and inappropriate behavior takes attention away from the winner, spoiling what should be the wonderful moment, Osaka winning her first slam. I've seen her do it before: She knows she's playing badly and/or the other player is playing better so she takes a big dump on the day.
Trust Buster
(7,299 posts)USALiberal
(10,877 posts)Trust Buster
(7,299 posts)yuiyoshida
(41,861 posts)彼らにビデオテープがあることを願っています。 それを見たい。 I would love to have watched it.
jalan48
(13,886 posts)Sugarcoated
(7,728 posts)Poor verbally abusive baby. What a jerk she is.
jalan48
(13,886 posts)resorted to that age-old ploy of crying to get her way, which didn't work any better.
Sugarcoated
(7,728 posts)GD Williams...can't wait till she's gone from tennis.
jalan48
(13,886 posts)better player today and it was sad to see her moment of glory stolen by Serena and her boorish supporters.
Sugarcoated
(7,728 posts)I don't like bullies. It's why I'm a Democrat, actually...one of the reasons.
jalan48
(13,886 posts)yell at umpires or referees. It shows a lack of class.
healthnut7
(249 posts)For Osaka, she wins the match and the fans are booing. She is 20 years old and was crying. That's when Serena put her arm around her and comforted her and asked the fans to stop booing. It wasn't Osaka's fault that any of this happened. She was crying because she felt she shouldn't have won the match. It was her time to be so happy and I felt so bad for her.
IMO Serena should have accepted the warning about her coach and moved on. She couldn't let it go and then Osaka breaks her and she smashes her racket and from the time he gives her the first warning she was on him every time she sat down. A player in any game has to show respect to the Ref/Ump even though you are totally against his decision. He does not ever owe her an apology. She was yelling at him and then calls him a thief. I guess he had heard enough. She said she has had him as a Ref before and no problem. Chris Evert was one of the commentators and she said Serena's coach was coaching. He was motioning her to come forward and I know Serena said she never saw it but she did come forward a few times after that and did win points and Chris did comment on that as well.
Persondem
(1,936 posts)MuseRider
(34,120 posts)Sugarcoated
(7,728 posts)Composure and a class act in spite of the big tantrum.
spooky3
(34,481 posts)The statistics showed she outplayed Williams.
We dont know all the emotions and thoughts she was feeling, but she said she felt bad because she knew the fans wanted Serena to win, that she had idolized Serena, etc.
Awsi Dooger
(14,565 posts)It doesn't get any better than that, except when Serena also makes a fool of herself in the process
Sugarcoated
(7,728 posts)I don't mean to be a spelling nazi but it's spelled Evert.
healthnut7
(249 posts)I corrected it.
Tipperary
(6,930 posts)What did her husband have to do with anything?
Sugarcoated
(7,728 posts)the guy in the stands who was doing the hand signals. I thought he was also her husband.
Tipperary
(6,930 posts)I will refrain from the comment I would like to make lol.
Her husband is an American named Alexis Ohanian. Her coach is French, named Patrick Mototoglou. ( Imay have spelled that wrong.) They are both white, but look nothing alike.
Sugarcoated
(7,728 posts)I don't care enough about her personal life to know what her husband even looks like.