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DetlefK

(16,423 posts)
Sun Sep 16, 2018, 10:52 AM Sep 2018

Fox panel freaks out when economist touts successful example of universal basic income: Alaska.

https://www.mediamatters.org/video/2018/09/12/watch-fox-panel-become-speechless-after-guest-defends-universal-basic-income/221286

SALMON: The cost was the reason, but the work incentive actually played out. You wind up working more, and being healthier, and having healthier kids who go to school more, those findings, especially -- is stronger in places like sub-Saharan Africa, where you can see the differences happen much more rapidly. But there's a good case to be made that it happens in all countries. It happens in Alaska, Alaska is a Republican state, and they give everyone an unconditional check every year.

MACDONALD: That's a dividend out of the oil supplies.

VARNEY: That's from the dividend from the oil, it's got nothing to do with universal basic income for heaven's sake.

SALMON: It's universal income.

VARNEY: Are you a socialist?

SALMON: No.

...

VARNEY: Our viewers are not going to be very happy about this.

SALMON: They should be because it's free money. Who doesn't like free money?

MACDONALD: Taxpayers don't, they have to pay for it.

VARNEY: The people handing it out. People like me.

SALMON: Well, you have too much.

VARNEY: Oh. You've done it now. You've really done it now. I gotta move away to something else. Get off my set.
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democratisphere

(17,235 posts)
1. Varney is a GIANT a-hole.
Sun Sep 16, 2018, 10:59 AM
Sep 2018

redumbliCONS go crazy over healthcare for ALL. Universal Basic Income will have THEM jumping off rooftops.

badhair77

(4,218 posts)
7. A-hole and adulterer. Giant sleazeball.
Sun Sep 16, 2018, 11:13 AM
Sep 2018

His wife filed for divorce after she learned of a 9 yr affair he had. He said he didn’t love the woman but had the affair because “he could do it,” according to the divorce complaint. Don’t know if the divorce was ever finalized. He has 6 kids with the wife. No wonder he loves trump so much, so many things in common.

GulfCoast66

(11,949 posts)
14. Seems like most of them are Adulterous as well.
Sun Sep 16, 2018, 07:54 PM
Sep 2018

Not that adultery is a partisan trait. Many of us are. But only republicans build their entire career on faith to god and family only to repeatedly piss on the idea. But their rubes keep asking for more.

Eliot Rosewater

(31,112 posts)
2. UBI has never been tried, not even in Finland. What they did there was not UBI
Sun Sep 16, 2018, 11:01 AM
Sep 2018

And they admit they didnt do it long enough or with enough funding, it was restricted to certain people and was NOT enough to live on.

UBI will work in America if we have the GUTS to make the rich and corps pay for it.

It is that simple.


https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/apr/23/finland-to-end-basic-income-trial-after-two-years

DetlefK

(16,423 posts)
4. When the robots take our jobs, governments will have no choice but to go for UBI:
Sun Sep 16, 2018, 11:11 AM
Sep 2018

An economy only works if people buy. Robots aren't workers. They are unpaid slaves. Robots don't spend a wage by buying products. If nobody buys products, the company collapses.

The only way to keep the economy going despite robot-induced mass-unemployment is UBI.

And this mass-unemployment will come. Just imagine that the 10% of all low-skill jobs go to robots. Permanently. That means 10% of all low-skill workers will NEVER AGAIN find a job.
10% is not bad? What happens when robots replace 50% of all low-skill workers? Will that be bad?

Eliot Rosewater

(31,112 posts)
6. And it needs to start now. Common sense. But people are convinced
Sun Sep 16, 2018, 11:13 AM
Sep 2018

that capitalism, unbridled capitalism, is the way to go.

They are wrong.

It is a mix, and we need more socialism in our mix. But as you say UBI has to happen or people will die or live in the streets. Sooner or later.

Merlot

(9,696 posts)
8. I'm definatly not convinced that capatalism works
Sun Sep 16, 2018, 11:59 AM
Sep 2018

and am convinced it will eat it's host alive. Socialism is a good place to start, by that I mean free quality education, child daycare, universal health care, social security.

My concern with UBI is that if that were ever implemented it would be used as an excuse to remove all other financial protections. "Now that you have your UBI, you can pay out of pocket for health care and cover your own social security" would be the end result...and no UBI will ever be enough to cover health care.

Given the choice, I'd choose health care over UBI. As for no body being able to afford to by the things that the robots make, well, if no one buys, the price will go down. Fewer usless things will be made.

former9thward

(32,013 posts)
11. People have been predicting mass unemployment due to automation since the early 1800s.
Sun Sep 16, 2018, 05:17 PM
Sep 2018

They were called Luddites then. When is mass unemployment going to come? Companies have been putting in robots all over the place for decades now. Unemployment is 3.9%. When is this dire world going to happen?

GulfCoast66

(11,949 posts)
15. Excellent post. But you are pissing in the wind.
Sun Sep 16, 2018, 08:00 PM
Sep 2018

Many will never be convinced because profit is evil. Or something like that.

These are the same folks bitching about overpopulation while trying hard to ignore that every nation that has embraced liberal democracy and regulated capitalism has reduced their population growth to below repopulation levels. Including the US. Without immigrants we would have a declining population. As would all of Western Europe.

SharonClark

(10,014 posts)
5. That was one of the stupidest economic exchanges I've ever read.
Sun Sep 16, 2018, 11:11 AM
Sep 2018

Varney and MacDonald are partisan hacks and Salmon sounds like an idiot.

$2000 per person per year, provided by a glut of oil revenue, will not provide enough for universal basic income and most states are not swimming in money as Alaska has been.

UBI may be a good idea and worth investing in but Salmon doesn't help the cause.

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