General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsGoing beyond "No". How Democrats can profit from a lengthy shutdown.
Trump is pressuring and pressuring, because he knows that he can portray any ever-so-slight compromise by the Democrats as a win.
So...
Why don't Democrats do the same? Get out your wishlist and demand EVERYTHING ON THAT LIST in exchange for the wall.
Trump and Republicans arent going to support these things. Setting it up this way, however, does a couple things. Most importantly, youre not just saying No. Its clear what youre fighting for because youre asking for it. Secondly, it puts the onus back on Trump and Republicans. You want a deal? What are you willing to compromise on? Of course the answer is nothing. That needs to be the headline: Republicans say No to deal.
This is a standard-tactic. Negotiation 101: Be the one to define the center, the average, the median, the baseline of demands around which the negotiation fluctuates.
Demand the COMPLETE democratic wishlist on immigration and offer Trump his $5.6 billion in exchange.
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2019/1/6/1823224/-Trump-s-shutdown-bet-and-how-to-defeat-it#read-more
ProudMNDemocrat
(16,786 posts)Asking for something in return IS NOT in Donald Trump's DNA.
Democrats have to play hardball with him and stick to their principles by reminding Americans who Trump PROMISED would pay for the Wall in the first place.
DetlefK
(16,423 posts)Keep on saying No and the Democrats will eventually look like obstructionists.
Trump wants his wall? Fine. Let's see how much he is politically willing to pay for it.
empedocles
(15,751 posts)dalton99a
(81,569 posts)backscatter712
(26,355 posts)Zero funding for the wall, clean spending bills to end the shutdown, or nothing.
We give nothing to Trump, we do not negotiate with hostage-takers, and we make absolutely fucking sure Trump comes out of this mess completely humiliated.
Charlotte Little
(658 posts)Don't negotiate with a bully. They don't make honest deals and they'll just use the same bully tactics the next time.
No money for the wall, period.
YessirAtsaFact
(2,064 posts)If 50 republicans in the House will vote with the Democrats, they can simply override Trumps veto.
bluestarone
(17,025 posts)They will not do it!!!
YessirAtsaFact
(2,064 posts)Response to DetlefK (Original post)
elocs This message was self-deleted by its author.
ooky
(8,928 posts)His hostage taking tactics cannot be tolerated or entertained in any way. Period. Hostages are unacceptable.
Once the government is open, I'm fine with discussing more "border security" money (NOT "wall" if we get equal concessions, like permanent status for DACA recipients. But I think such concessions will not happen because Coulter and Limbaugh don't like them. They won't be happy with anything but throwing the Dreamers out. I don't think we can fix immigration issues until we control both legislative chambers and the executive branch.
Hostages are unacceptable...
mr_lebowski
(33,643 posts)about keeping the government running, not having govt workers lose their homes, not having our air travel system become unsafe, not having people unable to use their food stamps, etc.
And Trump doesn't GAF about ANYthing except 'winning'. He'll let everyone suffer to 'get his way', and the more gov't workers that quit their jobs cause they have to put food on the table, the better in his mind. Mostly Democrats anyway, and many in Unions. And he'll LOVE to hear about regular citizens suffering at his hands even more, because he's a narcissistic sociopath.
And he'll just keep trotting out endless lies about how much 'danger' we all are in from the invading foreign hordes (nevermind that illegal crossings are already at historic lows), and his knuckle-dragging cult members will swallow it all, whole hog, and the media will continue to play their 'both sides' and 'it's all political' bullshit game (outside of the handful of honest folks on our side, like Hayes and Maddow).