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orangecrush

(19,546 posts)
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 07:58 AM Jan 2019

Trump Shutdown Isn't About a Wall...


It is about him punishing America for repudiating him by electing a Democratic House to check his authoritarian agenda.

I believe it is also a psychological ploy - creating a crisis out of thin air as the new Democratic House is seated, an attempt to attach a negative aura to electing Democrats and punishment for challenging his authority.

And this is something straight out of Putin's think tank.
53 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Trump Shutdown Isn't About a Wall... (Original Post) orangecrush Jan 2019 OP
This is also Lindsay Jan 2019 #1
This is exactly what it is. GoCubsGo Jan 2019 #3
And don't forget, watoos Jan 2019 #6
Imagine the materials (steel and/or concrete) MyOwnPeace Jan 2019 #36
Also a tactic of business consulting firms! It Laura PourMeADrink Jan 2019 #12
I believe mechanics and doctors do this too. panader0 Jan 2019 #13
In politics it's known as demagoguery Major Nikon Jan 2019 #19
+1000 byronius Jan 2019 #25
Great point. orangecrush Jan 2019 #44
Yes, but our laws and Constitution will hold the President and anyone who takes action The Wielding Truth Jan 2019 #51
"...straight out of Putin's think tank." Achilleaze Jan 2019 #2
"National emergency" coming up. orangecrush Jan 2019 #45
Yes - mob rule, literally. debsy Jan 2019 #4
Alpha Male Posturing modrepub Jan 2019 #5
I agree duforsure Jan 2019 #7
Interesting. That hadn't occurred to me, but it sounds like Trump logic. Vinca Jan 2019 #8
Probably part of it, I think it's even more nefarious. Amimnoch Jan 2019 #9
This isn't latest breaking news but, watoos Jan 2019 #22
Exactly, well said! And tRump's directive from Putin IMO is to overthrow America. n/t RKP5637 Jan 2019 #10
TPM's Editorial Blog Entry: Where This May Be Going TheBlackAdder Jan 2019 #11
If he gets his "national emergency" orangecrush Jan 2019 #46
Exactly Danascot Jan 2019 #14
It's all Trump has left, watoos Jan 2019 #23
I think it's about Trump's inability to admit that he lost Poiuyt Jan 2019 #15
It's about destroying Government tenderfoot Jan 2019 #16
Bingo! watoos Jan 2019 #24
OR destroying the government TrishaJ Jan 2019 #37
18 Investigations Completely Ignored By The Media PaulX2 Jan 2019 #17
Jesus, the WSJ took a year and a half, watoos Jan 2019 #29
The only solution to 'this disaster is impeach trump. Lean on repubs. notdarkyet Jan 2019 #18
If he really wanted money for the wall... Tribalceltic Jan 2019 #20
Trump is a lousy deal maker... dubyadiprecession Jan 2019 #34
Didn't you hear Midnightwalk Jan 2019 #40
And where are the Republicans in Congress? Lonestarblue Jan 2019 #21
Snowflake republicans are shit scared to go against the Fuhrer. Amimnoch Jan 2019 #28
Republicans have power they refuse to take. Lonestarblue Jan 2019 #33
Congress needs to take back their power and put a bill on his desk scarytomcat Jan 2019 #26
Speaker Pelosi has this; watoos Jan 2019 #30
still the Senate needs to stand up scarytomcat Jan 2019 #32
It's also about his desire to be an absolute dictator. PoindexterOglethorpe Jan 2019 #27
Yup. orangecrush Jan 2019 #47
He's just following his masters orders. lark Jan 2019 #31
This is a bold step orangecrush Jan 2019 #48
K/R BadgerMom Jan 2019 #35
Trump wants a $5Billion slush fund to skim off of. C_U_L8R Jan 2019 #38
It's PUTIN'S troll game. nt Baltimike Jan 2019 #39
The Shock Doctrine is all about the elite exploiting crises to fuck over the poor. ProfessorPlum Jan 2019 #41
The only real crisis is with Trump's ego Ohioboy Jan 2019 #42
I believe it is more than that orangecrush Jan 2019 #49
I think this is dead on! NutmegYankee Jan 2019 #43
Thanks.... orangecrush Jan 2019 #50
The press has forgotten the "I" word RainCaster Jan 2019 #52
Totally agree karin_sj Jan 2019 #53
 

watoos

(7,142 posts)
6. And don't forget,
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 08:40 AM
Jan 2019

a wall will end up costing at least 50 billion dollars, wasted tax dollars that could go to something else useful.

MyOwnPeace

(16,926 posts)
36. Imagine the materials (steel and/or concrete)
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 11:08 AM
Jan 2019

being used for roads and bridges.

Hmmmmm, who would gain by doing that?

What, the American people?

orangecrush

(19,546 posts)
44. Great point.
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 06:41 PM
Jan 2019

He is going to declare a "national emergency".

And if he gets away with it this time, it won't be the last time.

That you can bet the farm on.

The Wielding Truth

(11,415 posts)
51. Yes, but our laws and Constitution will hold the President and anyone who takes action
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 07:27 PM
Jan 2019

on his behalf to account. Any military who follows any illegal action inside the US will face court-martial. Any made up state of emergency by Trump will be contested by Congress and our Federal courts!

Trump is a reckless con man who is gifting us and playing us to the point of destroying our democracy and our rule of law!

Achilleaze

(15,543 posts)
2. "...straight out of Putin's think tank."
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 08:17 AM
Jan 2019

Aided & abetted by a greedy, submissive, immoral republican party that's willing to play dumb and to let America be systematically divided and weakened by a draft-dodging casino hustler, who they know is deeply in debt to the evil empire*

* per ronald republican reagan, for crying out loud

duforsure

(11,885 posts)
7. I agree
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 08:45 AM
Jan 2019

This is just another distraction used by putin and trump to use to divide with, and damage this country for his revenge. This isn't about a wall, its another act by trump.

 

Amimnoch

(4,558 posts)
9. Probably part of it, I think it's even more nefarious.
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 08:48 AM
Jan 2019

The new House cannot get the funding for, or really begin investigations into him until this is resolved. If they do find a way and start then the narrative will be "Rather than fix the government, the House is determined to go on witch hunts."

 

watoos

(7,142 posts)
22. This isn't latest breaking news but,
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 10:14 AM
Jan 2019

9 million more people voted for Democrats to go on so called witch hunts. Who gives a shit what Trumps 30% base thinks?

TheBlackAdder

(28,189 posts)
11. TPM's Editorial Blog Entry: Where This May Be Going
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 09:14 AM
Jan 2019

.



It is telling and entirely predictable that the first time President Trump is seriously checked by another branch of government he threatens to declare a national emergency and essentially rule by decree. As history teachers us, while authoritarianism usually sells itself on efficiency and power, it is far more often paired with failure and incompetence.

The danger of this kind of blatantly illegal resort of ‘national emergency’ powers speaks for itself. But I can see a reason why various players, maybe including Trump himself, might see this as a way out of the standoff.

President Trump could declare his emergency and say he’s building his wall. This lets Senate Republicans off the hook and allows them to pass budget bills to reopen the federal government. But the emergency declaration and actions taken under it would certainly spur immediate lawsuits. And I think there’s a good chance they’d succeed, at least succeed in getting into court.

So the government gets to open and Trump gets a face-saving way out of the standoff. He gets checked by the courts. But that just gives him another grievance and claim of unfairness, something he’s been happy to have and exploit in all the other immigration related actions he’s been stymied on.

Don’t get me wrong. This would still be a disaster for the country. And perhaps he wouldn’t get checked. These emergency provisions Congress created give the President a lot of power. But cynical members of the President’s party seem likely to see this as a painless (for them) way out of the impasse.



https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/where-this-may-be-going

.

orangecrush

(19,546 posts)
46. If he gets his "national emergency"
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 06:46 PM
Jan 2019

It won't be the last time he does it.

It will get worse.

I don't see this as political posturing, I see it as a direct challenge to the constitution.
 

watoos

(7,142 posts)
23. It's all Trump has left,
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 10:19 AM
Jan 2019

keep his small base in fear of brown and black people. I worked with these people in Mexico, Venezuela, Columbia, Chile. They are no different than American workers just trying to earn a living for their families.

Poiuyt

(18,122 posts)
15. I think it's about Trump's inability to admit that he lost
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 09:43 AM
Jan 2019

In Trump's world, there are winners and losers. If he backs down, he'll be seen as a loser, and he can't accept that. In his mind, he MUST be seen as a winner.

And if the Democrats back down and give him money for the wall, don't think that he won't gloat!

 

watoos

(7,142 posts)
24. Bingo!
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 10:22 AM
Jan 2019

This is why msnbc fired Dylan Ratigan. He was passionate about exposing crony capitalism. I never missed his 4PM show.

They are also packing the courts with their cronies. Libertarianism is a branch of white supremacy.

TrishaJ

(798 posts)
37. OR destroying the government
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 11:18 AM
Jan 2019

to stay out of prison for treason. That probably includes some Senate Republicans, such as Mitch McConnell. McConnell could end this today. He chooses not to. Wonder why?

 

watoos

(7,142 posts)
29. Jesus, the WSJ took a year and a half,
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 10:27 AM
Jan 2019

to expose the Trump crime family. How daddy had to bail out little Donnie to the tune of 400 million dollars. How the Trump crime family laundered money, was involved in tax fraud and numerous forms of criminal corruption.

The freaking M$M carried this bombshell expose for 24 fucking hours. The M$M is not our friend, they are complicit with the far right.

dubyadiprecession

(5,707 posts)
34. Trump is a lousy deal maker...
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 10:51 AM
Jan 2019

Trump couldn’t get Mexico or the republican congress to pay for it. Now he’s down to the Democrats as being his last resort.

Midnightwalk

(3,131 posts)
40. Didn't you hear
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 11:57 AM
Jan 2019

Mexico is paying for this with the adjustment to NAFTA that hasn’t been approved yet. The 5 billion is just a short term loan until we get that money

Don’t worry. It’s not like they would lie about it.

Lonestarblue

(9,981 posts)
21. And where are the Republicans in Congress?
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 10:10 AM
Jan 2019

Congress needs to step up and work for citizens who are suffering from this shutdown and just pass a funding bill with a veto-proof majority in both Houses. They do not need Trump’s agreement, and Trump himself has shown that negotiating with him is useless because you can’t believe a word he says or that he will actually do what he says. Republicans just need the courage to do what is right for the people and get government operating again.

 

Amimnoch

(4,558 posts)
28. Snowflake republicans are shit scared to go against the Fuhrer.
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 10:26 AM
Jan 2019

Many of them know they'll very likely be voted out by Democratic Party candidates come 2020 (especially in the Senate), but they also know they have no chance at all if they make Orange Hitler's shit list. They'll grasp at whatever they can to try and hold power.

Lonestarblue

(9,981 posts)
33. Republicans have power they refuse to take.
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 10:46 AM
Jan 2019

Most of these people serve ruby red districts that will only elect Republicans. If they start now painting Trump as an irrational president and communicate that message to their constituents, they can reduce some of Trump’s influence and also reduce their chances of being primaried by a Trump fanatic.

Those Republicans who are not running in 2020 should also step up to the plate and take a stand for the people. What do they have to fear from Trump?

scarytomcat

(1,706 posts)
26. Congress needs to take back their power and put a bill on his desk
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 10:25 AM
Jan 2019

right now the ball is in the Senate's court then
if he vetos they need to override it

 

watoos

(7,142 posts)
30. Speaker Pelosi has this;
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 10:32 AM
Jan 2019

She is busting up reopening the government into smaller bills. One of the first bills she will send to Mitch is a bill to open up the IRS so that people can get their tax returns on time. The pressure will build on turtle face and the Senators who are up for election in 2020. Once she gets Mitch to put one of the bills up for vote in the Senate, Republicans will have to vote for it overwhelmingly. Next question, will Trump have the guts to veto it?

scarytomcat

(1,706 posts)
32. still the Senate needs to stand up
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 10:39 AM
Jan 2019

she can not get this done alone, Mitch needs to do his part
the government needs to be opened now

lark

(23,097 posts)
31. He's just following his masters orders.
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 10:38 AM
Jan 2019

PUtin told him to leave Syria, and to shut down the border as a distraction to the Democratic congress and to punish the American people for putting him in check. It also sets the stage for him to declare a state of emergency and who knows what else he'd throw into that cesspool besides the wall. Would it be changing freedom of speech to freedom of speech as long as it's not negative about the current administration? Would he declare the right to remove judges who block his Russia first priorities, who knows what other damage he'd include. The question is will he really go this far? Already, his administration is rolling back the Syria leaving within 30 days, obviously Bolton isn't fully onboard with Russia first. What will Erdogan and PUtin do about his treachery with them? Will he say Bolton's lying (haven't heard any pushback at all from him on this - yet) and we'll leave when he says? Will he admit to selling out the Kurds - don't think so, but that's obviously part of the deal with Turkey.

It must totally suck to be him. He just can't keep up with all of his lies and all of his toadies won't toe the line either. Will he get rid of Bolton, just slap him down and say he's wrong, or face the ire of PUtin and Erdogan by staying in Syria?

BadgerMom

(2,771 posts)
35. K/R
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 10:58 AM
Jan 2019

This x 5 billion. And, to our detriment, the mainstream media is too dim, cautious and unaware to pick up on it.

ProfessorPlum

(11,256 posts)
41. The Shock Doctrine is all about the elite exploiting crises to fuck over the poor.
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 01:47 PM
Jan 2019

And now Trump will create a crisis out of thin air if there aren't any real ones around.

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