General Discussion

Ohioboy

(3,243 posts) Mon Feb 4, 2019, 11:57 AM Feb 2019

I hear there are some ground breaking advances in cancer research coming out of Israel

How is that the case, since Israel has universal healthcare? One of the biggest arguments I've always heard from Republicans is that universal healthcare hurts innovation and research, yet Israel is making advancements. What gives? Maybe that old talking point doesn't hold water?

http://nocamels.com/2018/04/research-breakthroughs-cancer-israel/

https://www.tabletmag.com/jewish-news-and-politics/245989/israel-universal-health-care

5 replies

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Highlight:

I hear there are some ground breaking advances in cancer research coming out of Israel (Original Post) Ohioboy Feb 2019 OP

It's a bogus argument SHRED Feb 2019 #1

NIH get the red out Feb 2019 #2

Many major advancements come from NIH or government grants marylandblue Feb 2019 #3

From the article: ehrnst Feb 2019 #4

Most "cures" fail in further testing, but some succeed Cicada Feb 2019 #5

SHRED

(28,136 posts)

1. It's a bogus argument

Reply to Ohioboy (Original post)

Mon Feb 4, 2019, 11:59 AM

Feb 2019

Pay people well and they will come up with medical advancements. You don't need privatization.

get the red out

(13,466 posts)

2. NIH

Reply to SHRED (Reply #1)

Mon Feb 4, 2019, 12:06 PM

Feb 2019

Not to mention that NIH grants to universities for research wouldn't have anything to do with how healthcare is funded. It would probably help the teaching hospitals since they wouldn't have to eat the cost of uninsured people who show up at their emergency rooms.

marylandblue

(12,344 posts)

3. Many major advancements come from NIH or government grants

Reply to Ohioboy (Original post)

Mon Feb 4, 2019, 12:09 PM

Feb 2019

But most people don't know that because the practical application is usually brought to market by a private company. So they credit they company rather than the government or university who first thought of it.

ehrnst

(32,640 posts)

4. From the article:

Reply to Ohioboy (Original post)

Mon Feb 4, 2019, 12:14 PM

Feb 2019

With the disease being the main cause of death in Israel,

universities, medical centers, hospitals, and labs have taken the lead in developing innovative care plans and undertaking sophisticated research to help advance understanding and knowledge of cancer,

of which there are over 100 types, and for which there is no known cure.

This is not an article about pharmacuetical companies doing research, if that's what you're referring to.

Also from the article:

Israel’s health system began in the pre-state era with the creation of Kupat Holim Clalit (KHC, or General Sick Fund) by the Worker’s Party in 1912.

By the mid-1970s, there were four health funds in Israel. KHC dominated the health system, however, insuring over 80 percent of the population. The Histadrut, the Labor Party, and KHC formed a kind of iron triangle, with health-insurance membership dues, combined with Histadrut domination of industry, serving as the financial and economic backbone of the Labor Party.

Their Universal Health Care is also not a single payer system:

While much controversy over the inequity caused by the privatization of access to medical care exists in Israel—the areas in which private expenditure really dominates are long-term care, dental care, and mental-health care, despite the recent inclusion of the latter in the standard basket. Israel’s private expenditure as a percent of its national health expenditure is about 40 percent, which is higher than the OECD average—but most of the comparable countries provide public financing for long-term and dental care.

They did not go from a 60 year old established for profit privatized health care coverage system to what they have (let alone a federally run single payer system) in eight years, as MFA will do as promised in at least one version.

Cicada

(4,533 posts)

5. Most "cures" fail in further testing, but some succeed

Reply to Ohioboy (Original post)

Mon Feb 4, 2019, 01:47 PM

Feb 2019

This “cure” is based on getting our immune system to attack cancer. Jimmy Carter was cured of brain cancer with this approach when before he was certain to die pronto. There have been some successes. This approach won the Nobel Prize for medicine last year. The co winner named Allison is a delight, a blues harmonica playing researcher at MD Anderson clinic straight out of middle of nowhere Alice Texas. An overweight sloppy guy who stuck with a crazy idea others were sure wouldn’t work. Will probably be remembered as the guy who actually did cure cancer once his approach is refined. The Israelis may not have it just yet. But this approach is promising as hell.

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