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UTUSN

(70,711 posts)
Wed Feb 20, 2019, 10:32 PM Feb 2019

Anybody (besides us old ones) heard of Daniel ELLSBERG?

********QUOTE********

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Ellsberg

Daniel Ellsberg

.... ...while employed by the RAND Corporation, precipitated a national political controversy in 1971 when he released the Pentagon Papers, a top-secret Pentagon study of the U.S. government decision-making in relation to the Vietnam War, to The New York Times and other newspapers.

On January 3, 1973, Ellsberg was charged under the Espionage Act of 1917 along with other charges of theft and conspiracy, carrying a total maximum sentence of 115 years. Due to governmental misconduct and illegal evidence-gathering, and the defense by Leonard Boudin and Harvard Law School professor Charles Nesson, Judge William Matthew Byrne Jr. dismissed all charges against Ellsberg on May 11, 1973. ....

...Ellsberg came to understand about the Vietnam War that:

It was no more a "civil war" after 1955 or 1960 than it had been during the U.S.-supported French attempt at colonial reconquest. .... In terms of the UN Charter and of our own avowed ideals, it was a war of foreign aggression, American aggression.[9] ....

By 1969 Ellsberg began attending anti-war events while still remaining in his position at RAND. He experienced an epiphany attending a War Resisters League conference at Haverford College in August 1969, listening to a speech given by a draft resister named Randy Kehler, who said he was "very excited" that he would soon be able to join his friends in prison.[10][11] ....

In late 1969, with the assistance of his former RAND Corporation colleague Anthony Russo, Ellsberg secretly made several sets of photocopies of the classified documents to which he had access; these later became known as the Pentagon Papers. They revealed that, early on, the government had knowledge that the war as then resourced could most likely not be won. Further, as an editor of The New York Times was to write much later, these documents "demonstrated, among other things, that the Johnson Administration had systematically lied, not only to the public but also to Congress, about a subject of transcendent national interest and significance".[13] ....

Throughout 1970, Ellsberg covertly attempted to persuade a few sympathetic U.S. Senators—among them J. William Fulbright, chair of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, and George McGovern, a leading opponent of the war—to release the papers on the Senate floor, because a Senator could not be prosecuted for anything he said on the record before the Senate.[15] ....

On Sunday, June 13, 1971, the Times published the first of nine excerpts from, and commentaries on, the 7,000 page collection. For 15 days, the Times was prevented from publishing its articles by court order requested by the Nixon administration. Meanwhile, while eluding an FBI manhunt for thirteen days, Ellsberg leaked the documents to The Washington Post and 17 other newspapers.[17] On June 30, the US Supreme Court ordered free resumption of publication by the Times (New York Times Co. v. United States). Two days prior to the Supreme Court's decision, Ellsberg publicly admitted his role in releasing the Pentagon Papers to the press.[18]

On June 29, 1971, U.S. Senator Mike Gravel of Alaska entered 4,100 pages of the Papers into the record of his Subcommittee on Public Buildings and Grounds—pages which he had received from Ellsberg via Ben Bagdikian, then an editor at the Washington Post. ....

********UNQUOTE*******










48 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Anybody (besides us old ones) heard of Daniel ELLSBERG? (Original Post) UTUSN Feb 2019 OP
There is an excellent TV movie with PatSeg Feb 2019 #1
Thanks, I'll look for that. Ilsa Feb 2019 #30
Yes PatSeg Feb 2019 #31
I think there was real value in the story of Kay Graham's role in the Post. She took chances that CTyankee Feb 2019 #37
Oh yes PatSeg Feb 2019 #38
And Spielberg! CTyankee Feb 2019 #40
there is also a 2hr Cavett show jodymarie aimee Feb 2019 #32
Thanks, I'll look for it PatSeg Feb 2019 #33
I haven't found the Daniel Ellsberg one PatSeg Feb 2019 #34
we get his vintage shows on a retro channel each nite at 8PM jodymarie aimee Feb 2019 #35
Oh, I'm salivating here! PatSeg Feb 2019 #36
mine is a tier jodymarie aimee Feb 2019 #39
Thanks PatSeg Feb 2019 #47
LOL Please Don't Complain itcfish Feb 2019 #42
no one is complaining or LOL ing... jodymarie aimee Feb 2019 #43
Sorry itcfish Feb 2019 #44
Yes that was excellent. milestogo Feb 2019 #46
And so few people have heard of it PatSeg Feb 2019 #48
I associate that name with the word "psychiatrist" Awsi Dooger Feb 2019 #2
What we don't remember is happening now. Ha ha. UTUSN Feb 2019 #3
I think key details of Mueller's report will be revealed Zorro Feb 2019 #14
IIRC Nixon gang looked for info to 'prove' Ellsb was crazy. They broke into his dr's office bobbieinok Feb 2019 #23
This incident put so much in motion. Haggis for Breakfast Feb 2019 #4
Which is what we need now. In the immediate future. UTUSN Feb 2019 #5
It should be noted that Ellsberg spent close to a year trying to get grantcart Feb 2019 #6
See the movie The Post, elleng Feb 2019 #7
yes! this mopinko Feb 2019 #10
Saw it again recently, and it is as good as I remember Hekate Feb 2019 #28
I wonder how different the WaPo and NYT of back then would be handling today's situation? yonder Feb 2019 #8
Please read shadowmayor Feb 2019 #9
Our immediate need is the MUELLER report - a la ELLSBERG and The Pentagon Papers UTUSN Feb 2019 #11
But NOT before it is COMPLETE! majdrfrtim Feb 2019 #12
I remember those years though they are a bit hazy. It was a big step in exposing our government's jalan48 Feb 2019 #13
That was then. NOW is about us needing an ELLSBERG for the MUELLER report. UTUSN Feb 2019 #16
+1000 jalan48 Feb 2019 #21
Ellsberg's Courage Revealed the Lies Being Perpetrated About the Vietnam War dlk Feb 2019 #15
Post #16. UTUSN Feb 2019 #17
Yes! dlk Feb 2019 #19
This old guy has been thinking about Ellsberg too. watoos Feb 2019 #18
Darn! JoeOtterbein Feb 2019 #20
I saw him speak at Berkeley a few months before the start of the American war on Iraq. deurbano Feb 2019 #22
He came to the anti-war protest in Crawford, Texas broiles Feb 2019 #24
Just finished reading "Blind Ambition" IncaRoads Feb 2019 #25
I remember, but then I'm an 'old guy'. triron Feb 2019 #26
I remember him well. But then, I'm an old one. shanny Feb 2019 #27
Hell yes.I was a young-married in Honolulu & had to go find a newsstand that carried the national... Hekate Feb 2019 #29
This message was self-deleted by its author scheming daemons Feb 2019 #41
And unlike Edward Snowden, Blue_Tires Feb 2019 #45

PatSeg

(47,501 posts)
1. There is an excellent TV movie with
Wed Feb 20, 2019, 10:40 PM
Feb 2019

James Spader from 2003 called The Pentagon Papers. If you can find it, it is worth watching, very informative. I ended up buying it on DVD so I could watch it again.

Ilsa

(61,695 posts)
30. Thanks, I'll look for that.
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 05:58 AM
Feb 2019

His role in The Post was significantly diminished. That movie was more about Graham claiming her position of leadership in a male-dominated world.

PatSeg

(47,501 posts)
31. Yes
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 09:59 AM
Feb 2019

I was disappointed in The Post. I think my expectations were for something different. The Pentagon Papers is told from Ellsberg's point of view and at times, it was a nail-biter. It really made me appreciate the man much more. It was a made-for-cable movie, TNT I think, and I can't believe it wasn't rerun. Perhaps too political?

CTyankee

(63,912 posts)
37. I think there was real value in the story of Kay Graham's role in the Post. She took chances that
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 12:17 PM
Feb 2019

she was not raised to take. She was afraid, "but did it anyway." I admired that and I think Meryl Streep understood her and played her perfectly.

PatSeg

(47,501 posts)
38. Oh yes
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 12:44 PM
Feb 2019

I appreciated the story. It just wasn't quite what I was expecting. I love Meryl Streep's portrayal of Graham and it was a take on the story I hadn't heard before.

Also, there was an awful lot of hype about the movie before I saw it, so I felt it didn't live up to the hype. Streep always does however.

 

jodymarie aimee

(3,975 posts)
32. there is also a 2hr Cavett show
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 11:06 AM
Feb 2019

he is the only guest, I think...It is magnificent...may be able to get a taste on U Tube.

PatSeg

(47,501 posts)
34. I haven't found the Daniel Ellsberg one
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 11:32 AM
Feb 2019

but I found a lot of fascinating episodes. I may have to binge-watch Dick Cavett. I remember loving his show years ago.

 

jodymarie aimee

(3,975 posts)
35. we get his vintage shows on a retro channel each nite at 8PM
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 11:57 AM
Feb 2019

I just saw one with David Carradine and Barbara Seagull(remember how she changed her name) and the baby Free 1971..tons of cool politicos...Jane Peter and Henry Fonda on with MORT FRICKING SAHL..1970..coming up is Bruce Dern who I love love love..it will be him as a young buck...Jimmi Hendrix Janis...BEST EVER the day after Woodstock 1969 Joni CSN Grace and Jefferson Airplane...Dick was a straight and didn't know what to do with them...on and on....the vintage ones are sometimes very hard to find...

There is also a 2hr one with Richard Burton...died and gone to heaven....such literate conversation...something we are lacking in 2019.

PatSeg

(47,501 posts)
36. Oh, I'm salivating here!
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 12:10 PM
Feb 2019

What retro channel do you get? I have a few on DISH, but I usually don't watch them.

 

jodymarie aimee

(3,975 posts)
39. mine is a tier
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 12:46 PM
Feb 2019

189 190 191 192 193 194

191 is the Cavett old shows...there is no name of channel, just local call letters. It begins in the morning with Dark Shadows The Fugitive 2 Donna Reed 2 Petticoat Junction 2 Mary Tyler Moore 2 Newhart then they do a DECADES show for the day in history..2 Ed Sullivans...2 Cavetts..if you look at the programs maybe you can find channel..

192 has Archie and Kotter and Maude and old Johnny Carsons that are good. Maude had John Wayne on and ragged on Nixon to him..pretty funny...

PatSeg

(47,501 posts)
47. Thanks
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 01:04 PM
Feb 2019

I'll do a search for Dick Cavatt. I love watching some of the old TV shows. All in the Family in particular is timeless, funny as ever.

itcfish

(1,828 posts)
42. LOL Please Don't Complain
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 12:54 PM
Feb 2019

We now have TV programs like The Kardashians, Duck Dynasty and The Real Wives of Beverly Hills. (so sad) I find today's TV programs are just an insult to every American's intelligence.

 

jodymarie aimee

(3,975 posts)
43. no one is complaining or LOL ing...
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 12:56 PM
Feb 2019

I said Burton/Cavett was splendid and a treat to watch....as folks used to be so eloquent...2019 is the complaint I have..

 

Awsi Dooger

(14,565 posts)
2. I associate that name with the word "psychiatrist"
Wed Feb 20, 2019, 10:41 PM
Feb 2019

I was in junior high during the Watergate hearings and watched as much coverage as I could, before and after school. Seemingly every time Daniel Ellsberg's name came up, the word "psychiatrist" was attached.

I remember it was his psychiatrist and something unlawful happened but for the spirit of this thread I'm not going to look it up. It takes two to be embarrassed and I don't feel shamed for not remembering every detail of something from that age.

Zorro

(15,740 posts)
14. I think key details of Mueller's report will be revealed
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 12:07 AM
Feb 2019

and the information will be shocking to the nation.

Of course it won't be shocking to DUers, but it should answer the question as to whether Trump is an active Russian asset or just a useful idiot. I suspect it may be the latter, but I could be surprised.

As an aside, Neil Sheehan, the NYT reporter who was provided the Pentagon Papers by Ellsberg, wrote what I consider the definitive book on the Vietnam War -- A Bright Shining Lie: John Paul Vann and America in Vietnam. Ellsberg, Sheehan, and Vann were all well acquainted, and their relationships are described in this extraordinary book. Very highly recommended.

grantcart

(53,061 posts)
6. It should be noted that Ellsberg spent close to a year trying to get
Wed Feb 20, 2019, 10:52 PM
Feb 2019

The information out sharing it with various leaders in Congress and apparently many of the copies were made in congressional offices. Also the material had to do with policies and never compromised the safety of military in the field.

Hekate

(90,714 posts)
28. Saw it again recently, and it is as good as I remember
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 02:00 AM
Feb 2019

Two thumbs up ( a nod to Siskal and Ebert)

yonder

(9,667 posts)
8. I wonder how different the WaPo and NYT of back then would be handling today's situation?
Wed Feb 20, 2019, 11:21 PM
Feb 2019

From that account, they seemed to be very interested in bringing some light to that story.

Was it because of protecting the public interest or selling more papers? Why does it seem so different today?

shadowmayor

(1,325 posts)
9. Please read
Wed Feb 20, 2019, 11:28 PM
Feb 2019

His latest book is Doomsday Machine, one of the most frightening rundowns of the nuclear weapon world we live under.

jalan48

(13,870 posts)
13. I remember those years though they are a bit hazy. It was a big step in exposing our government's
Wed Feb 20, 2019, 11:59 PM
Feb 2019

lies about the Vietnam War and helping to bring it to an end.

jalan48

(13,870 posts)
21. +1000
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 12:31 AM
Feb 2019

I think it's all coming out. If Trump was going to stop it he would have needed to do it at the beginning.

dlk

(11,569 posts)
15. Ellsberg's Courage Revealed the Lies Being Perpetrated About the Vietnam War
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 12:23 AM
Feb 2019

The Vietnam war changed our country forever.

 

watoos

(7,142 posts)
18. This old guy has been thinking about Ellsberg too.
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 12:26 AM
Feb 2019

I hope this Barr guy isn't a Judas, I freaking don't trust him.

deurbano

(2,895 posts)
22. I saw him speak at Berkeley a few months before the start of the American war on Iraq.
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 12:53 AM
Feb 2019

I remember he said the war was already a done deal... and that presidents first decide to go to war, then find the justification. (Weapons of mass destruction...)

broiles

(1,367 posts)
24. He came to the anti-war protest in Crawford, Texas
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 01:07 AM
Feb 2019

and was arrested along with others. He said that the
deputies were the nicest who had ever arrested him. My husband got him out of jail. My husband ask me to snap a picture of the two of them, I messed up and cut their heads off.

IncaRoads

(97 posts)
25. Just finished reading "Blind Ambition"
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 01:08 AM
Feb 2019

Liddy had his photo taken outside of his psych's office.

What a fucking lunatic.

 

shanny

(6,709 posts)
27. I remember him well. But then, I'm an old one.
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 01:34 AM
Feb 2019

He was and is a hero. There have been a few similar heroes in recent years who, in my view, have been unaccountably vilified.

Hekate

(90,714 posts)
29. Hell yes.I was a young-married in Honolulu & had to go find a newsstand that carried the national...
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 02:08 AM
Feb 2019

...newspapers so I could actually hold that piece of history in my hands. I'm sure I still have it in a box somewhere.

Today I really feel like we turned a corner with the revelations from McCabe's interview with Nicolle Wallace, his conversation in the green room with members of her panel, and then her panel discussion after the interview.

The look on Frank Figluzzi's face was something to behold.

Response to UTUSN (Original post)

Blue_Tires

(55,445 posts)
45. And unlike Edward Snowden,
Thu Feb 21, 2019, 01:00 PM
Feb 2019

Ellsberg managed to somehow do all this *without* sharing our primo secrets with Red China and then defecting to Moscow...

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