General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWhat is wrong with a 10 cent tax per bag on plastic bags in supermarkets?
I think it is a good idea. It might encourage lazy me to get serious about recycling those plastic bags instead of throwing them out after one use .
The CT state legislature is discussing this now and some folks view it as a regressive tax altho I can't see how.
I think it is a good idea and don't know why in the world anyone would object.
Tell me if you do and why?
Siwsan
(26,263 posts)They have both paper and plastic. Not sure what they cost because I always bring cloth bags.
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)I really should use them or just recycle mine ( we do have a bunch of them saved).
crazycatlady
(4,492 posts)I was there today and for the first time I didn't see plastic bags.
I also see a lot of people carrying their groceries out loose or in boxes.
Siwsan
(26,263 posts)I just wheeled the cart out, opened the car door, loaded the bags, and then returned the cart for my quarter.
I do most of my grocery shopping at Aldi's. LOVE that place.
crazycatlady
(4,492 posts)I noticed that my Fitbit does not count my steps if I'm pushing something. So I now avoid shopping carts like the plague.
I just carry my groceries around in boxes at Aldi. Baskets everywhere else. I do about 90% of my food shopping at Aldi.
Bettie
(16,109 posts)I'd never finish shopping if I didnt' use a cart!
llmart
(15,540 posts)They're originally from Whole Foods and I keep them in the trunk of my car.
I thought I read somewhere that Kroger was phasing out plastic bags altogether, but I haven't seen evidence of that yet.
politicaljunkie41910
(3,335 posts)Walmart in other states. They are a very thick, heavy duty plastic and last a very long time. I have lots of them and I think they are worth it. The reason I have so many is that occasionally, I drop by the store and I forgot to put some in the car. If it keeps them out of the oceans, and particularly the cheap, thin, free ones which break on you when you're walking from your car to your front door, I have no problem with it. When they first announced the policy, I thought it was going to be much worse than it's turned out to be. I thought they were going to charge us for those cheap ones that break, or tear on your way out the store to your car. But these are much more durable, and I can use them for lots of things.
crazycatlady
(4,492 posts)Effective 1/1/19. HOwever, all of the grocery stores are not in our town boundaries.
That said, at the library, boro hall, and several local businesses, they are giving away free cloth bags with the town's logo on them to anyone who wants them. You can get reusable bags at grocery stores for $1.
If you (generic) haven't already switched to reusables, you should. Some stores even give you a discount for using them.
watoos
(7,142 posts)They even have insulted reusable.
malaise
(269,004 posts)Stores were allowed to finish their stock.
It's amazing to see people walking with their own bags or using boxes.
CurtEastPoint
(18,644 posts)malaise
(269,004 posts)People are adjusting rather well.
madinmaryland
(64,933 posts)all we had were paper bags. That was when they actually taught the kids how to bag groceries. I can still pack a bag faster than most kids working now.
malaise
(269,004 posts)I am often amazed at packing these days - not the speed but the thoughtlessness in what they pack where.
Paper bags are back.
madinmaryland
(64,933 posts)There were no scanners, but even I can do it faster than just nearly any of the kids (though some are in their 40s or 50s).
Now I have to go yell at some kids to get off my lawn.
malaise
(269,004 posts)There is one young man who is great but most of them can't pack
I just wish the baggers were trained to not put heavy stuff on top of the bread or fresh fruits and vegetables.
Rorey
(8,445 posts)I found ways to amuse myself. A lot of customers acted like I wasn't even a person. Sometimes I'd make comments just to see if they were listening. One of my favorite's was telling them that I put their bread on the bottom to save room. It was fun seeing their reactions, always delayed.
(I didn't really put their bread on the bottom.)
KT2000
(20,577 posts)you find out who has a sense of humor.
malaise
(269,004 posts)csziggy
(34,136 posts)And almost every single time I have to ASK that the baggers put our frozen and/or cold items in those bags. They also tend to scatter similar items across several bags which makes it harder to put things up when I get home. I don't get how stupid the baggers are to not get it.
On the other hand, Publix hires mentally and physically challenged people as baggers and they tend to the best ones, taking extra care to put like items together and the cold things in the insulated bags. I suspect that the managers at Publix actually train those baggers while they expect the high school and college students (the "normals" who are hired as baggers to know how to do the job.
I mostly take my re-usable bags but sometimes have to ask for paper ones. I use paper bags to line my garbage cans - no plastic in those, either - and since I am so diligent about taking the re-usable bags with me I sometimes run low on paper bags.
KT2000
(20,577 posts)of the grocery baggers competition on his show. Hope you saw those bits because Letterman was a bagger too.
madinmaryland
(64,933 posts)Customers car. Less than 5% tipped.
When is the last time a grocery store would pack and take the groceries out to you car and put it in your trunk? 40 years.
Cold War Spook
(1,279 posts)Your groceries are bagged, taken to your car and put where you want them. These people are not paid and live off your tips. We tip them $5 for bagging and $5 for taking them to our car. Plastic bags should be banned everywhere.
crazycatlady
(4,492 posts)I do not remember any grocery store taking your items to the car.
madinmaryland
(64,933 posts)crazycatlady
(4,492 posts)LibinMo
(533 posts)Order online-$25 min-credit card isn't charged until pickup. You park in designated space and they bring your groceries to your car. No tipping allowed. I hate going in Walmart. I was very skeptical that this would work but we've used it several times now and it's great.
Mr Lib is 83 and has dementia so this has solved a very big problem for us. The store is less than 10 minutes from here and he enjoys the car ride. I think some areas have free home delivery as well but I'm not ready for that.
MineralMan
(146,309 posts)from the local high school come in and bag groceries, hoping for donations to whatever they're raising money for. I let the kids bag my groceries. Once. After that experience, I just say, "No, thanks. I'll bag my own." The loaf of sliced sourdough bread does NOT go in the bag first, kids. Nope.
displacedtexan
(15,696 posts)Of course, the French heard sac when the woman said sack, and they all assured her that they didn't sell bags. Hilarity ensued... but not for the American woman.
And that was over 20 years ago.
We have so many reusable bags now that they're getting out of hand.
lamsmy
(155 posts)On plastic bags. But still mountains of packaging needs to go.
GP6971
(31,159 posts)in the Netherlands...took us by surprise the first time, but we got used to it and turned out to be very convenient.
phylny
(8,380 posts)we had to buy reusable bags for the week, but just left them in the rental for the next people.
malaise
(269,004 posts)It's a mess - lovely island - Antigua
msongs
(67,406 posts)CTyankee
(63,912 posts)me than fewer, heavier bags. So i would have to have many more reusables.
It's a real struggle for me to carry heavier full bags from the car to the house. I simply can't lift too much...
LisaM
(27,811 posts)Among other things, the bills assume that all people who shop have cars, and can just keep a supply of bags in the back or in the trunk. I generally do my shopping by bus or on foot. Unless I plan ahead, I don't have the bags I need before I go to the store. I try, I really do, but it's still not a perfect system.
Our stores do no accept plastic bags for recycling. I wish they did, but then I wish Washington state had returnable bottles and we don't have that either.
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)often a line and the wait for a few cents is just not worth it to most people but the most determined environmentally sane people. It would be better to get the money at the checkout.
SoCalNative
(4,613 posts)Most in European countries do not have cars, especially in the cities, and they seem to manage just fine bringing their own bags for shopping, and have for years. It's really more about not doing "big shops" all of the time but rather buying more frequently and fresher quality on a regular basis.
LisaM
(27,811 posts)Some places in the US qualify as food deserts, because there are no grocery stores within the city limits!
My nearest store is just under a mile away. This is pretty walkable for me (or I'll walk there and take the bus home), but the problem is the walk itself. I either have to cross over a 6-lane busy road with multiple types of lights and worry about ducking traffic turning right where the drivers are not looking for pedestrians (I wouldn't even consider this on a dark rainy night), or I have to take a hilly side street with no sidewalks and no street lights, not even a shoulder (I've had to jump in the ditch to get out of the way of cars before). If I had any kind of disability, walking to the store along these routes would not be an option. Further, it's hard for me to shake the memory of when I was shopping on foot and taking the bus home, and was physically assaulted by a man at the bus stop (just a few years back). I hear phantom footsteps every time I wait at that bus stop now.
In general, I support these bag laws, but it's not always as simple for all consumers. There's no one size fits all.
crazycatlady
(4,492 posts)CTyankee
(63,912 posts)elfin
(6,262 posts)They always accommodate.
I truly hate when my market closes all open "real" checkout aisles in favor of those self-checkouts that make using your own bags more difficult.
There s always some snag, So am switching to a bit more expensive store to avoid the hassle and the rage that they are letting people go for the bottom line costs.
LisaM
(27,811 posts)Even better, the cashier and the bagger were both really nice and sociable. It was a pleasant shopping experience, worth paying a little bit more.
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)People shopped several times per week, getting what they would eat within a couple of days. I know that with busier people today, that is somewhat impractical, but it would help with waste, including plastic waste.
athena
(4,187 posts)You can sling them over your shoulder so your core is doing the lifting rather than your hands. They also dont dig into your hands the way plastic bags do. Dont buy the cheap heavy-plastic stuff at the store. Get some high-quality cotton bags at ecobags.com. Youll never look back. Theyre light, and theyre washable. I have seven of them in the car. Theyre about eight years old and still have at least another year or two in them. I wash them every two weeks with the rest of the laundry.
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)Hermit-The-Prog
(33,346 posts)Got tired of multiple trips from the car to the house, so I bought a 2-wheeled dolly. A chest style cooler goes on first, then a large cardboard box on top of that, and the two usually hold all the groceries for 1 trip from car to kitchen.
Something like:
There are lighter duty, folding shopping carts available, too. Some have the triple wheel arrangements to make it easier to go up stairs.
The Velveteen Ocelot
(115,700 posts)and gives you a 5-cent discount if you bring your own bags, or you can choose to donate that nickel to the charity of the week. I collect and save my used plastic bags in my permanent bag, so when I go grocery shopping I just dump the plastic bags in their recycling bin at the door before I start shopping.
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)My back is so bad that I have instituted the 30 minute rule in the store. I must go through the store and check out in 30 minutes or my back gives out. It take more planning so I can go thru the supermarket without crisscrossing but I inevitably leave off one or two items...it's tough getting old and arthritic...
RockaFowler
(7,429 posts)I wish all stores would give you a discount for bringing in your own bags. It helps them as well as the environment!
athena
(4,187 posts)Theyre being down-cycled. Every plastic bag you get at the store is made from virgin plastic. Its good to recycle plastic bags, but its much better to bring your own bag.
The Velveteen Ocelot
(115,700 posts)and some bags from a few other places that only use plastic. I do bring my own bag to the grocery store.
athena
(4,187 posts)Thats what I do as well. But I think that the word recycling makes a lot of people feel good about behaviors that are bad for the environment. Thats why the plastics industry loves the word recycling so much.
The Velveteen Ocelot
(115,700 posts)which is used to make lawn furniture and decking, and some plastics can be turned into fabrics and rugs. But I agree that we'd be better off without so damn much of it in the first place.
athena
(4,187 posts)Most people think that when they recycle something, it gets made back into the same thing. They think theyre not hurting the environment when they accept a plastic bag or buy bottled water. Down-cycling does not reduce the demand for virgin plastic, which is why the plastics industry loves it. And the lawn furniture, polar fleece, etc., ends up sooner or later in a landfill, after depositing small particles of plastic all over the place.
On top of that, a lot of plastic just goes directly to a landfill, now that China is no longer accepting it. People should recycle, but not be fooled into thinking its doing all that much for the environment. As long as virgin plastic is cheaper than recycled plastic, recycling will not be a real solution to pollution.
Brother Buzz
(36,434 posts)You could bring it back for a buck, or use it again. Just an idea.
Aristus
(66,371 posts)I've been doing for close to fifteen years now.
So even if one of those snotty anti-environment types were to sneer (and I've actually heard this bullshit) : "Well, you know, you have to use one of those bags 300 times before there's any environmental benefit!" - I'm covered.
(I don't know where they get these numbers. Or why they'd make such an assertion; every time you use a reusable bag instead of a single-use plastic bag, that's at least one bag that isn't going to pollute the landscape or find its way into the waterways and harm marine life.)
BigmanPigman
(51,593 posts)forget and leave my bags in the car sometimes. I recycled all the plastic bags before they switched (storage bags, freezer bags, garbage bags, etc). Like you I prefer carrying many smaller bags than a few big ones. I have recycled all the old one and newer ones too since the stores switched.
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)You have to put them in the garbage bags! That makes no sense!
crazycatlady
(4,492 posts)In theory, all of the old plastic bags from returns would go there. In practice, the janitor threw them in the dumpster along with everything else.
BigmanPigman
(51,593 posts)My school had the teachers get students to recycle all the trash but the custodian tild me that the Recycle dumpster went into the same trash truck as the non-Recyclable materials.
Glimmer of Hope
(5,823 posts)Codeine
(25,586 posts)and its definitely helped to curb my wastefulness. I still end up buying the 10 cent bags quite often (Mr. Forgetful) but theyre thicker than the old bags were and are more easily used for other purposes rather than just being shitcanned or used for kitty litter.
mr_lebowski
(33,643 posts)Poiuyt
(18,123 posts)Qutzupalotl
(14,311 posts)So they lose 10 cents on every bag. They make it back in other ways, of course. (Plastic shopping bags are outlawed in Eugene, Oregon.) They have reusable bags available for sale, usually about a buck.
Something to think about as you set a cost for plastic bags you dont want plastic to be inadvertently cheaper to the customer than paper, or you reduce incentive.
JI7
(89,249 posts)it's a good idea
eleny
(46,166 posts)You either byob or buy one of their fabric bags. So if there's was a tax on bags I'd surely be at my sewing machines making them for myself and others.
I'm ashamed to admit that I'm one of the "lazy me" folk. I do recycle the plastic at the grocery stores. But I should get my butt in gear and get sewing. Than I'd learn something new - I'd learn to sew vinyl. Tricky but not that hard. And who cares how a grocery bag looks so long as it's strong.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)My children do the same.
still_one
(92,190 posts)Last edited Wed Feb 27, 2019, 10:22 PM - Edit history (1)
Auggie
(31,171 posts)that's the way in most Bay Area counties
still_one
(92,190 posts)jalan48
(13,866 posts)BritVic
(262 posts)10p for a reusable sturdy bag - it reduced plastic bag use by about 85%. Some stores used to give out free replacements when they eventually wore out, but now they just recycle them and you pay for a new one. I wish supermarkets would switch to paper bags, however.
kimbutgar
(21,148 posts)They fold up into these little balls And I use them all the time. I never pay for bags. It's easy todo without. I was in Arizona recently where they gave me a bag and I pulled out my bag and said to fill it instead. They thought I was crazy.
Ferrets are Cool
(21,106 posts)I do not like where a LOT of my money is spent NOW. IF it were 100% used for research and development of environmental friendly plastic, I would not object at all. But I do not trust all politicians to spend my money wisely.
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)town's concerns. We have lots of towns in CT and no county form of government. However, we are a very progressive state overall and New Haven in particular. And it's nice to live in a town with a fabulous university that cares about liberal causes.
crazycatlady
(4,492 posts)I would support that money being used for environmental projects including cleanups.
Kablooie
(18,634 posts)for that you get a sturdier bag that can be reused.
The flimsy bags that clog up the oceans are banned.
I like that better than a tax.
procon
(15,805 posts)There were no supermarkets, just some small mom&pop shops. Most food was sold fresh from the farm or boat at open air markets.
I remember being fascinated watching the old fishermen darning scraps of tattered fishnets that were past mending. They made bags to whatever size the shopper wanted, their shuttles flying through the netting to sew up the edges and knot in wooden handles for carrying. Of course, mom made us kids lug all those heavy bags of groceries home.
I prefer net bags over cloth and I have a bunch of stretchy net bags that expand to hold an enormous amount of food, sometimes making them too heavy to lift.
BigDemVoter
(4,150 posts)They do it here in San Francisco, and just about everybody brings his/her own bag. Great way to help the environment and decrease the number of plastic bags thrown into the ocean.
maxsolomon
(33,345 posts)Plastic Bags are BANNED, for quite a few years now. 5 cents for a paper sack, but most people carry re-useable bags. Capitalism survived.
Also, Plastic STRAWS are banned. Go watch a video of a Sea Turtle getting one pulled out of it's nose and you'll be on Team Paper Straw.
KWR65
(1,098 posts)I just recycle my plastic bags when I go to the store. It is no big deal if you stick the plastic bags in your car trunk after every shopping trip.
Adrahil
(13,340 posts)It will disproportionately impact poor people.
Just ban em.
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)I think poor people care about the environment too. We all live in the same environment, after all, and we all breathe the same air.
Adrahil
(13,340 posts)... every penny counts. Ive been poor enough that made a week of meals out of a jar of ragu anf a box of pasta.
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)bag and brought back to the store the next time they shop
crazycatlady
(4,492 posts)Target offers a 5 cent discount for each bag you bring. So using the bag 20 times pays for itself. (Target is not alone, just the first store that discounts for reusables that comes to mind).
Also many organizations give away free bags with their logo on it. Go to any fair or festival. My town has been giving them out (local businesses, library, boro hall, and I believe they were given to the students at the school) in prep for their (now effective) ban on plastic bags.
When using public transit, the reusable bags hold so much more and are much less likely to break the way the flimsy plastic ones do.
ETA I know what it is like to be broke. I've been broke enough to steal rolls of TP from public restrooms.
area51
(11,909 posts)I'd rather see stores offer a small rebate per bag if you bring your own.
loyalsister
(13,390 posts)Poor people are more likely to use public transportation, including many disabled people. All have a hard enough time shopping and affording food to begin with. Making it more expensive or difficult to acquire food adds another barrier for some people who are already having to deal with too many.
Reinforcing biases against particular populations is not a progressive policy. How about retailers be good corporate citizens and absorb the cost of cloth bags which may be reused.
PoindexterOglethorpe
(25,857 posts)how do they get their purchases home? What they buy will be bagged in one way or another, and carried home some how. So carrying a couple of bags along in the first place really isn't that difficult.
Unless what they buy is magically teleported home.
loyalsister
(13,390 posts)Then we'll talk. It's difficult to carry them to the store without the wind getting them. Impossible to transport them in mounted containers without having one's personal space invaded. The logistics are extremely difficult, and the assumption that all bodies can perform as defined by non-disabled people is the root of the oppression we experience.
PoindexterOglethorpe
(25,857 posts)How do you manage at this point? How exactly are you holding an empty bag that it's being tossed about by the wind?
I realize I've never been wheelchair bound (although I was on crutches for six weeks when I was very pregnant, so I know a little bit about not being able to do regular things) but this is something you are dealing with all the time. There are plenty of bags to use that fold up fairly small and can be put in a pocket, or perhaps tucked into a carry thing attached to the chair.
Perhaps I seem heartless, but the basic thing is that if you're already going to and from stores, however it is you're doing that, adding a couple of fold-up bags to the mix somehow doesn't seem that onerous. And you can still choose to pay 10cents a bag if it really is completely out of the question to bring along your own bag. You are still going to be getting home with whatever you've bought, something you presumably know how to do.
I honestly don't see where disability factors in here.
loyalsister
(13,390 posts)You have not experienced the liberation they provide to a person who wants to wheel to the store a few blocks away, or drive/roll to the bus stop. Particularly when wind is blowing or when picking up a little speed. All the while using armrest controls or manually maneuvering ones body via a chair.
Imagine having to manage the bags while driving. A wheelchair user performs their personal transport with 2 limbs. It makes carrying objects more difficult than for someone using four. I would think that this might have become apparent when you used crutches.
Forcing them to do it both ways makes it more cumbersome than it is to carry bags home when they have enough weight to sit in a person's lap without blowing away.
UniteFightBack
(8,231 posts)their own bag if you don't want to 'tax' people.
Snackshack
(2,541 posts)Is wrong with that.
Personally I think plastic bags should be banned altogether. But if a 10¢ tax per bag gets people to move away from plastic bags and use re-usable cloth bags so be it.
stopwastingmymoney
(2,042 posts)No plastic and the paper ones cost 10 cents
Canvas bags have become the norm, I was already doing that anyway
It seems to work fine, some people were really mad about it though
I do occasionally see people walking out with a pile of items in their arms
But imagine how much plastic trash we've collectively saved!
Oh, and if you're worried about carrying them, i.e. People without cars, look up Chico bags, they fold up really small and can live in your purse.
Luciferous
(6,080 posts)for bringing your own.
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)I like them. they also have a line that is for disabled folk who need someone to pump the gas for them. That's us...
rufus dog
(8,419 posts)Approved by voters and implemented a week or two after the election.
No biggie, I usually buy just a bag at a time so it fits in my hands and hoodie pockets.
Always carry a couple of bags in the trunk, almost always don't bring them in.
My wife has some good Trader Joe bags, I think they sold them for a buck or two, last forever.
I noticed Costco doesn't give out boxes, maybe you have to ask. Again, no biggie, load the stuff up in the back and drive. May take an extra trip to the car to unload.
crazycatlady
(4,492 posts)They make state specific ones and whenever I'm in a new state, I am sure to get that state's.
rufus dog
(8,419 posts)Will have to look in back of the wifes car to see if she only has CA bags.
crazycatlady
(4,492 posts)Whoever designed them has a sense of humor. I'm in NJ and the NJ one has a playlist with songs like "Corn to Run" and "Living on a Pear" on it. The NY one says "give me your tasty, your scrumptious, your muddled mint and lime yearning to breathe free, the refuse of artificial preservatives at your Trader Joe's store. Send these, the organic tempeh tossed to me, I lift my plate beside the golden orange."
(THe NY one is currently sitting in my living room loaded with pussyhats for the next protest).
shanti
(21,675 posts)at least most of the time! I have so many reusable bags it's not funny, more than I need, really. My favorite ones are the humungous Costco bags that I got years ago. Saves several trips in from the car and they are strong.
CA doesn't really recycle those thin bags anymore. China doesn't want them.
nolabear
(41,963 posts)They charge us a nickel for paper ones. There are still plastic options for produce but they cause trouble so we try not to use them.
Im awful at taking my own but I use the hell out of those paper ones and recycle or compost them.
sinkingfeeling
(51,457 posts)until March 1, 2018, I walked to my local grocery with my bags, 2 or 3 times a week. Unfortunately, Walmart forced my store to close.
sharedvalues
(6,916 posts)LAS14
(13,783 posts)It's a town tax. Other towns are moving in that direction. I think Boston has done that, but maybe not yet.
Meowmee
(5,164 posts)Per bag. Im not sure if this goes towards recycling but my guess is it is prolly just making the state richer. I have used my own bags mostly for quite a while now but I still use the plastics sometimes and then use them for garbage bags after. I have tried the biodegradeable garbage bags but they are useless, they fall apart as soon as moisture hits them or over time and they are very expensive.
I suspect many of the recycle programs lie about what happens from things people at the centers have told me. Due to these issues and too many crazy demands from our county about our recycle and brush pick up I think I may not recycle plastcis anymore since it creates more emissions anyway.
Liberal In Texas
(13,553 posts)local gov't. was just too progressive or something, and killed all local laws on bag charges.
I always take bags to the store, even the pharmacy....and usually keep a spare in the side passenger door pocket in case I forget.
Polly Hennessey
(6,797 posts)Here in Northern California, we have been doing it for a year or so. Took me awhile to remember my own bags. I would always leave them in the car. Now I have a stash of really cute reusable bags. I even use mesh bags for my produce. Not a problem at all.
Texasgal
(17,045 posts)Just instituted the plastic bag ban a few years ago. You wouldn't believe the gnashing and grinding of teeth!
Since then it has seemed to work out well. Of course my concern was initially with people that may not be able to afford the bags but in the long run it seems to be working. If you cannot afford the bags you are able to take your groceries out bag less which a lot of people do.
In my own observation it appears that a lot less of these plastic bags are clogging sidewalks and roadways after the ban was installed.
Unfortunately, the city was sued and now the bags are no longer against the law. However, most of us have gotten used to the ban and bring our own.
I won't lie, it was difficult at first, but it's now like second nature.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)If you dont bring your own bag, you have to buy one.
Unfortunately they still sell the plastic ones. I long ago got in the habit of bringing cloth bags to the store, so it comes naturally to me here.
I did buy a bunch of Tescos plastic bags to take back because they have the Welsh dragon on them.
OnDoutside
(19,956 posts)Revanchist
(1,375 posts)But would the tax also apply to the bags for produce and meats or just the check out bags? I normally bring my own bags but still wrap meat in the bags provided and bag my fruits and veggies.
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)I think it is those white plastic bags used at checkout.
fishwax
(29,149 posts)I've been using cloth and other reusable bags for close to twenty years now, but I'll admit I don't always remember. And I never had them at my office, so if I grabbed a snack and a drink at the CVS for lunch or if I picked up a few things for later I would usually wind up with plastic bags. Now they charge ten cents, but the bags are sturdier. I've bought two of the ten cent bags in the past month, because I've forgotten my own bag and had too much to carry back. It has definitely made me more conscientious. And while I often refused a bag before anyway now I make a point of not getting the bag unless I really need it or know i can use it for some other purpose soon. Not because the ten cents is expensive, but just because the extra step and cost remind me that it's worth the effort not to be wasteful.
ooky
(8,923 posts)I bring my own reusable bags or ask for paper if I forget to bring reusable. But most shoppers unfortunately still aren't environmentally conscious. While I have no problem with the tax I think the better option would be to just ban the plastic bags altogether. Shoppers would figure it out pretty quickly and it is no big deal to bring your own reusable bags.
kerry-is-my-prez
(8,133 posts)Rest of the lazy bastards.
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)them to the store when you shop again. So if you use five bags, that 50 cents. Period. I can't see it hitting the poor hard and it helps the environment we ALL live in. I am truly confused here so help me out...
crazycatlady
(4,492 posts)They charge for bags. You can buy them, bring your own, carry your groceries loose, or use the boxes the food was shipped in. People learn to survive.
Iggo
(47,552 posts)namahage
(1,157 posts)since they're the ones most likely not just to purchase things that need to be bagged (groceries can be bagged, flatscreens can't), but also to have fewer options of transportation and the like (ever tried to carry a box of diapers and jars of baby food in your hands on a bus?)
Here in CA there is an exception carved out for EBT users--perhaps there will be the same in CT?
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)What these plastic bags do to animals and birds is frightening.
I'm hoping that kids today are taught about these threats to the environment in school and can talk about it with their parents.
namahage
(1,157 posts)No walking involved?
That is not to say there isn't a problem in need of a solution, or that sacrifices are not needed. The problem is that the same 10 cents--which must be paid by the consumer unless there is an exception--will affect a poorer person more that a wealthier one, especially if said poorer person would need more bags (because they would buy more stuff needing bags).
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)to my Stop and Shop in the Westville section of NH (a middle class neighborhood that is very diverse and a great place to live). So yes, the public buses serve the public using the supermarket where I live.
athena
(4,187 posts)full of groceries? Have you ever tried to get on public transportation with them?
Ive been poor. And I had my own reusable cotton bags when I was poor. Two sturdy bags were all I needed as a single person. Sure, they cost money, but they were much easier to carry. And many stores will give you a five- or ten-cent credit per bag for bringing your own bags.
namahage
(1,157 posts)And that they could be all single so that two cotton bags would be all they would need, since those kids sure consume a lot.
Seriously, though--why does the burden need to fall more heavily on the poor, especially if wealthier people can simply pay for the convenience?
CA, to its credit, provides reusable bags to EBT and WIC users free of charge. Sure, those bags are only marginally thicker than the "single-use" bags they replaced, but it's a nod to the inherent regressiveness of a "bag tax."
athena
(4,187 posts)Did you even think about what I said about carrying plastic bags? It seems that youre talking about poor people who can drive to the grocery store. I beg you to try, just once, to walk two blocks with a set of plastic bags full of groceries. I couldnt do it as a single person, and youre telling me it can be done with groceries for multiple people.
Reusable bags hold a lot more than plastic bags do. You can put them over your shoulder, so you can carry a lot more at a time. For a family of one single parent and two children, four bags would be enough for a weeks worth of groceries. I have seven in my car now, but three are usually enough for me and my husband.
Im sorry, but anyone who claims that its easier to carry groceries in plastic bags than in cotton canvas bags on public transportation has probably never tried walking any distance with plastic bags full of groceries.
namahage
(1,157 posts)are more useful and overall better for the environment than single-use bags.
What I'm pointing out is that the bag charge--like sales tax and VAT--is regressive by its nature. And it would seem unfair that poor people are the ones tasked with being more prepared by investing in cloth bags and the like, while the wealthy can simply buy their way out of the problem.
The OP asked how the tax could be considered regressive, and I simply pointed out how a universal tax, applied to everyone regardless of differences in circumstances, can have a regressive effect.
You know, maybe we could do something like this. You know how you need your membership card to enter a Costco? What if we banned plastic bags, and forced shoppers to show their reusable bags at the door before being permitted to enter?
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)poor people don't seem to care as much as better off folks when it comes to the environment. How do we know they do not feel just as strongly as we do, even if their contribution is considered regressive (which I don't believe it is). They have a stake in the health of our environment, just as we do. We all breathe the same air.
namahage
(1,157 posts)is proportionately more onerous for the poor, compared to the better off--but the tax is applied equally to all.
THAT is what makes it regressive.
It has nothing to do with intent or desire, unless you're saying that apparently paying the tax for a poor person is exactly the same as a wealthy person, and any difficulty a poor person might experience is just them not wanting clean air badly enough.
And like I said previously, regressiveness in tax policy can be mitigated by carving out exceptions. CA requires stores to provide reusable (NOT single-use) bags to WIC and EBT users free of charge. Similarly, sales tax (which is also considered a regressive tax) isn't charged on eligible SNAP purchases.
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)customers. That is correct. So it is either no charge on plastic bags or the status quo. This one time charge of 10 cents per bag is a bargain when we consider what the cost of the damage to our environment is. So if you have 5 bags of groceries on average in a shopping trip, that is 50 cents. You bring home the bags, take out the groceries and throw the bags in the car for the next shopping trip, or by the door if you take a bus. You go into the store, buy your groceries and give them your bags for packing up your stuff. Rinse, repeat. Your 50 cents has been saved over and over again.
For the life of me, I can't figure out why you object to this idea. It's a win, win for everyone and for our landfill.
namahage
(1,157 posts)I am simply explaining why the tax is inherently regressive. I understand the term carries the negative connotation of being not just not for, but against progress.
That does NOT mean I don't agree that something should be done--even if that what needs to be done will necessarily impact some people--in this case, the less wealthy--proportionately harder than others.
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)Then we'd all be on the same playing field and income disparities would not matter.
Like that's gonna happen.
namahage
(1,157 posts)that income disparities would not matter.
Sure, it means that poor people would not have to worry about buying bags. But that also means that the wealthy--if they even bother to use the bags at all--would be free to use the money elsewhere.
Then, of course, is the obvious. Who pays for it? Certainly not the stores, who will likely have to hike up prices to cover the costs. Guess who raised prices will affect more?
Finally, we might also consider that the costs of maintaining cloth bags (washing, repairing, etc.) are also present, and guess which group gets affected by these more? Hint: it isn't the rich.
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)Here is where we, sadly, have to weigh the importance of income disparities. That is, income disparity, not plastic bags, is the problem. Plastic bags impose another burden on the poor in that they pay more (unfairly) to solve our common problem: environmental destruction.
Since this overall issue cannot be settled at the supermarket counter, we have to make up for it elsewhere and that is taxing the rich more in income or wealth taxes, which conservatives despise. It is there that we have to fight the ultimate battle.
janterry
(4,429 posts)t-shirts. Just a few seams and it's done.
dawg day
(7,947 posts)So most people bring their own bags. (Except me, because I never remember.)
No one complains- everyone seems to have adjusted.
CountAllVotes
(20,870 posts)If you don't have your own bags, you pay $.10 for one of them.
Some stores will give you $.05 for one re-used as a nice gesture.
I just bought a box of 1,000 of them for use myself.
Cost was $17.00 -- should last for many years!
Nothing new btw.
stopbush
(24,396 posts)We use the heavier, reinforced and reusable plastic bags that Ralphs in CA sells for $1.
Vinca
(50,273 posts)of dragging bags around with you all the time it's okay. You can still buy a paper bag for 5 cents if you want one, but it looks like most people are using tote bags when they shop.
PoindexterOglethorpe
(25,857 posts)an ordinance was passed requiring a 10 cent charge for bags. I have a whole bunch of bags in my car -- I know! Such an elitist, a car! -- and always grab more than I think I'm going to need when I grocery shop.
A bigger issue with me is that too many stores have only giant carts, and I never need anything that large. The small two-tier ones are far and away better. Unless you're buying enough stuff to need the big one, of course. Wish all the stores would have both.
If I ever move to another city, it will likely be one with better public transportation. Maybe I'll be able to live within walking distance of a good grocery store, which I've done more than once in my life. I learned very quickly not to buy more than I could easily carry home, which is likewise true of any of the fore-mentioned poor people who use public transport.
womanofthehills
(8,710 posts)You bring your own or put your groceries into boxes they have available. I like this.
Whole foods has paper bags only, but if you bring your own, you get to choose a small refund or to donate the amt. to a charity.
I love that we are a blue state with so many organic food stores.
Skidmore
(37,364 posts)IKEA bags. They last forever and are lightweight. They also come in several sizes.
BlueintheSTL
(135 posts)Trader Joe's recently got rid of plastic bags and now when I go in there I am giving your standard large brown paper bag for just a couple of items -- what a waste.
Solly Mack
(90,767 posts)brought their own bags though. I collected a lot of shopping bags I still use. Favorites bags were the big Ikea bags. I have bags in every color. Some designed to hold bottles and glass. Some for cold items that must stay cold. Small to very large bags. Depending.
It was euro 10 cent back then for those wishing to use a store plastic bag. The use of plastic was very much discouraged.
You get used to carrying your own bags with you. It becomes habit. I keep some in my car for the just in case. I have a 3 bag pouch in my purse. Folds neatly away and doesn't take a lot of room but the bags are a good size.
People adapt.
Hekate
(90,690 posts)...bags in the trunk of my car, I usually have my purchases returned to the cart unbagged, then bag them myself when I open the trunk.
Costco has no bags, just cardboard boxes from their food-merchandise. Trader Joes has no plastic, just paper grocery bags which can be reused indefinitely. Target has big plastic bags for which they charge you, and no paper bags.
When I am going from one store to another in a big mall, I want individual bags for my purchases that I can put my receipts into. It feels much more secure. I save the small bags for walking the dog, and the big ones for trash, but still...
I wish they would all just go back to paper bags. Merchants present this as a problem that originated with the customers, but it did not. I remember when Von's, Ralph's, and other grocery stores switched to plastic and made it extremely hard to request paper grocery bags. The baggers began throwing things into flimsy plastic bags in a jumble that smashed bread and bananas and broke eggs, so heavy with cans the bags split, so hard to carry with the ties that my arthritic fingers hurt, and so knobbly and shifty I could not (and cannot) carry those bags in my arms close to my body.
Anyhow -- community by community, shoppers are talking back their choices and rejecting plastic. Again, merchants blame someone else, like politicians. Well -- we elected those politicians, and I thank them.
Turbineguy
(37,331 posts)Against republican religion.
It might work if you go like this. "For every person who pays the 10 cent bag tax, we will give $100,000 to a needy billionaire!"
GulfCoast66
(11,949 posts)We line our kitchen trash can with them.
Put our yard waste in them for pickup.
The wife wraps presents in them.
I use them to drain deep fried food(Im from Louisiana. We deep fry!)
Paint on them.
Carry all our stuff to goodwill as we slowly deciliter our home.
Paint on them.
And so many more uses.
OnDoutside
(19,956 posts)number of plastic bags from 300m to 30m in the first year alone. The cheapy bag you would get in a supermarket now costs about 38 US cents, but a reusable strong plastic bag costs about 1 dollar, and you can get environmentally friendly reusable cloth/canvas bags for about the same price as well.
It really didn't take much of an adjustment at all, to get used to. I have a few cloth bags that fold into a pocket that I keep in the car etc for the spontaneous purchase.
fierywoman
(7,683 posts)malaise
(269,004 posts)randr
(12,412 posts)Sin taxes, levies designed to curtail consumption, are an example of a "nannie state" and never address the problem directly.
Plastic bags are a product of oil/extraction dependence and harmful to our environment.
Rewards for consumer use of recycled bags makes more sense. Saves money and the environment at the same time.
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)it's for a good cause and being advanced by our governor, ned Lamont, whom I voted for.
femmedem
(8,203 posts)I have five cats. I scoop a lot of litter.
I don't generate much other trash. about one more plastic bag worth per week. If I were to stop using the store bags, I'd end up buying plastic bags instead.
That said, I support the tax because most people are not in my position, and even for me, ten cents per bag is cheaper than buying plastic trash bags.
CountAllVotes
(20,870 posts)That is why I bought 1,000 of them in a box for $17.00.
I have three indoor cats and the cat litter needs to be scooped out every day!
Need these bags and I hate paying $.10 for one of them.
$17.00/1000 = .017 per bag
femmedem
(8,203 posts)CountAllVotes
(20,870 posts)Check there for a deal is what I think.