General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsPlease, folks, do NOT buy into and pass along all of the out-and-out CRAP that is
being spread by the internet and even so-called "news" outlets. The current flap about AOC making a "list" of moderates to be primaried is just one example.
Please---read what the woman ACTUALLY SAID! Not what someone says she said; not a paraphrase by an unknown ideologue; not an " interpretation" or a characterization or what some bloviating ASS (Can you say "Rush", boys and girls?) says she "really meant"! Read. What. She. Actually. Said. Please.
Millions are being paid to shameless whores whose primary job is to anger, confuse and divide us; to drive wedges into any schism and take our eyes off the prize. Are our kids and grandkids worth holding our tongue about "what's wrong with" a particular Democrat? Is defeating that sick sonofabitch in the White House worth voting for your 2nd, 3rd---or 8th---choice Democrat?
Let's rise above the BS and retake our democracy.
Stinky The Clown
(67,807 posts)Raine
(30,540 posts)Corbin Trent, a spokesman for Ocasio-Cortez, said she told her colleagues that Democrats who side with Republicans are putting themselves on a list.
She said that when activists ask her why she had to vote for a gun safety bill that also further empowers an agency that forcibly injects kids with psychotropic drugs, theyre going to want a list of names and shes going to give it to them, Trent said, referring to U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement.
Ocasio-Cortez on Friday disputed that she had directly threatened her colleagues, saying in a tweet that Democrats were inadvertently making a list of targets for the GOP and for progressive advocates by voting with Republicans.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/powerpost/house-democrats-explode-in-recriminations-as-liberals-lash-out-at-moderates/2019/02/28/c3d163fe-3b87-11e9-a06c-3ec8ed509d15_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.c59d8b0727df
Atticus
(15,124 posts)they were inadvertently making a list of targets for the GOP and for progressive advocates on their PRO-LIFE vote."
George II
(67,782 posts)....Texas Democratic Congressman Henry Cuellar next year because he wasn't "progressive" enough. Yet Cuellar has only voted ONCE against the Democratic position this session. She has voted against the Democratic position and with trump NINE times this session. Don't take my word for it, a complete list of every vote can be found here:
http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2019/index.asp
Kaleva
(36,307 posts)George II
(67,782 posts)Kaleva
(36,307 posts)Is that it? I don't see a quote from AOC anywhere in that article.
George II
(67,782 posts)Kaleva
(36,307 posts)"She and Justice Democrats said a month or so ago that they were "targeting" (their word).....
....Texas Democratic Congressman Henry Cuellar next year because he wasn't "progressive" enough. "
George II
(67,782 posts)Response to George II (Reply #22)
Kaleva This message was self-deleted by its author.
George II
(67,782 posts)Kaleva
(36,307 posts)George II
(67,782 posts)Kaleva
(36,307 posts)George II
(67,782 posts)lapucelle
(18,265 posts)like Corbin Trent and Saikat Chakrabati.
melman
(7,681 posts)How about telling people where to find it.
George II
(67,782 posts)You made a claim. Back it up.
George II
(67,782 posts)melman
(7,681 posts)And by hilarious I mean unbelievably cringeworthy.
How come you can't produce the quote? You said it was there. It's not.
lapucelle
(18,265 posts)Oh dear...
Mr. Chakrabarti must have very deep pockets. Besides the donation to the campaign to the Republican pastor, he donated an additional $13,500 to primary challengers to Democratic incumbents in the 2018 cycle.
https://www.followthemoney.org/entity-details?eid=44209287&default=contributor
George II
(67,782 posts)....among some of these people and Justice Democrats.
lapucelle
(18,265 posts)And one of them is now telling reporters that Cortez said things that she did not actually say?
She said that when activists ask her why she had to vote for a gun safety bill that also further empowers an agency that forcibly injects kids with psychotropic drugs, theyre going to want a list of names and shes going to give it to them, Trent said, referring to U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement.
Saikat Chakrabarti (Cortez's chief of staff) sided with a Republican candidate in 2018 and maxxed out on his contributions to the Republican pastor.
Is Cortez's chief of staff Saikat Chakrabarti on "the list"?
He belongs there.
George II
(67,782 posts)Saikat Chakrabarti and Trent Corbin were co-founders of Justice Democrats.
The first two board members of Justice Democrats were Saikat Chakrabarti and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (since removed from their website)
According to Saikat Chakrabarti he is also the founder of Brand New Congress.
Brand New Congress endorsed independent and republican candidates in 2018.
In 2017 Brand New Congress teamed up with Justice Democrats.
Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez' campaign manager in 2018 was Saikat Chakrabarti and her communications director was Trent Corbin
Saikat Chakrabarti is now her Congressional chief of staff and Trent Corbin is now her spokesperson
Saikat Chakrabarti personally contributed the maximum of $2700 to republican Robert Ryerse who ran for Congress in Arkansas, and now he's chief of staff for a Democrat in Congress.
How "progressive" is it to contribute to a republican candidate in ruby-red in Arkansas?
lapucelle
(18,265 posts)Last edited Sat Mar 2, 2019, 02:23 PM - Edit history (1)
Don't they know that THEY work for her, not the other way around?
George II
(67,782 posts)...an "in kind" contribution for strategic consulting. He was working FOR a republican's campaign!!
You can find details here:
https://www.fec.gov/data/receipts/?two_year_transaction_period=2018&data_type=processed&committee_id=C00639849&min_date=01%2F01%2F2017&max_date=12%2F31%2F2018
melman
(7,681 posts)Nowhere in the entire eight minutes and forty-seven seconds does she say that or anything like it. Nor does anyone else.
Atticus
(15,124 posts)MrModerate
(9,753 posts)George II
(67,782 posts)lapucelle
(18,265 posts)Last edited Sat Mar 2, 2019, 12:19 PM - Edit history (1)
Former board member / mouthpiece of Brand New Congress (a group that spent most of its candidate contribution budget funding Republican Party candidates) Corbin Trent might be the real problem.
Corbin: Myself, personally? I have no relationship whatsoever. The organization has very little. We intend to run within their structures, and in their primaries, and were thankful that theyve set up an infrastructure thats going to allow candidates to run in primaries. But we think that the party hasa long time agostopped representing the needs of the American people.
http://inthesetimes.com/article/20341/brand-new-congress-progressives-republican-party-democrat
Corbin Trent was on the board of the BNC PAC when it spent money this year in the effort of the Republican challenger looking to unseat the Democratic incumbent in a general election..
https://www.opensecrets.org/pacs/pacgot.php?cmte=C00613810&cycle=2018
The bulk of the remaining contributions that board member Corbin Trent's BNC PAC dispersed in 2018 was spent on unsuccessful primary challengers in Democratic races.
The only money Corbin Trent's group spent on a Democrats in the GE was the $950 in CA. In OK, Corbin Trent's group gave $3300 to the Republican who would have run against a Democratic in the general election.
The last thing Cortez needs are leeches like the former front man of a Republican candidate loving PAC putting words in her mouth.
Celerity
(43,399 posts)https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/congress-trump-score/house/
He is Pro-Life (votes that way), voted to ban abortion from all federal healthcare, voted to restrict minors going to an out of state abortion clinic, etc.
http://www.ontheissues.org/TX/Henry_Cuellar_Abortion.htm
http://time.com/4782994/democrats-anti-abortion-men-congress/
Rate A- by the NRA
https://www.texasmonthly.com/politics/how-the-nra-grades-the-34-members-of-texass-congressional-delegation/
U.S. Rep. Henry Cuellar, D, Laredo.
NRA rating: A-
NRA campaign contribution: $2,000
Raised money for a Republican
In the U.S. House, Democrat Henry Cuellar raises eyebrows by fundraising for Republican John Carter
https://www.texastribune.org/2018/09/11/democrat-henry-cuellar-fundraising-republican-john-carter/
Private Prison Campaign Cash Still Welcomed by Some Democrats in the Trump Era
https://rewire.news/article/2018/09/14/private-prison-campaign-cash-still-welcomed-by-some-democrats-in-the-trump-era/
No congressional Democrat has received more financial backing from private prisons than Rep. Henry Cuellar (D-TX), who has taken $88,990 from GEO Group and CoreCivic America since 2012, according to Open Secrets. Cuellar, who has voted in line with the president 68.9 percent of the time, has received more campaign cash from GEO Group in 2018 than any congressional lawmaker but Rep. John Culberson (R-TX). Almost all of Cuellars private prison campaign cash over the past six years has come from GEO Group, which has a history of in-custody deaths and other abuses. Cuellars office didnt answer questions submitted by Rewire.News about the Democrats acceptance of private prison campaign money.
He was the only Democrat to vote for a House bill that would have made it easier to deport unaccompanied minors from Central America.
https://www.expressnews.com/news/local/article/Cuellar-From-migrant-family-to-growing-clout-in-5801927.php
We have to send a signal, he said.
Rated as low as 25% on LGBTQ Issues by the Human Rights Campaign in some years
https://www.hrc.org/resources/congressional-scorecard
Was strongly against same-sex marriage
http://www.qsanantonio.com/cuellar-gallego.html
Has an anti-LGBTQ voting record
https://www.washingtonblade.com/2014/04/02/meet-8-house-dems-dont-co-sponsor-enda/
He is the 2nd most conservative Democrat in the House, now that Sinema was elected to the Senate from Arizona.
GovTrack
https://www.govtrack.us/congress/members/report-cards/2017/party-house-democrat/ideology
2017 Report Cards
House Democrats / Ideology Score
These special year-end statistics dissect the legislative records of Members of Congress during the 2017 legislative year (Jan 3, 2017-Dec 31, 2017), looking at Members who served at the end of that period. This page was last updated on Jan 6, 2018.
HOUSE DEMOCRATS
most conservative
#1 0.71 Rep. Collin Peterson [D-MN7]
#2 0.64 Sen. Kyrsten Sinema [D-AZ] now US Senator
#3 0.57 Rep. Henry Cuellar [D-TX28]
#4 0.54 Rep. Ron Kind [D-WI3]
#5 0.53 Rep. Josh Gottheimer [D-NJ5]
#6 0.53 Rep. Jim Costa [D-CA16]
#7 0.50 Rep. Kurt Schrader [D-OR5]
#8 0.47 Rep. Tom OHalleran [D-AZ1]
#9 0.47 Rep. Vicente Gonzalez [D-TX15]
#10 0.45 Rep. John Delaney [D-MD6, 2013-2018]
#11 0.45 Rep. Gene Green [D-TX29, 1993-2018]
#12 0.45 Rep. Filemon Vela [D-TX34]
#13 0.44 Rep. Timothy Walz [D-MN1, 2007-2018]
#14 0.44 Rep. Cheri Bustos [D-IL17] <<< have seen her mentioned as a possible future Speaker of the House
#15 0.44 Rep. A. Dutch Ruppersberger [D-MD2]
#16 0.44 Rep. Bradley Schneider [D-IL10]
#17 0.44 Rep. Daniel Lipinski [D-IL3]
#18 0.44 Rep. Stephanie Murphy [D-FL7]
#19 0.44 Rep. David Loebsack [D-IA2]
#20 0.44 Rep. Sanford Bishop [D-GA2]
Its a safe Democratic district
HELL YES I HOPE HE IS PRIMARIED
TexasTowelie
(112,219 posts)Cuellar even has an elementary school in Laredo named after him.
One of the reasons why he is rated as a conservative is his position on abortion. He is a Roman Catholic and so is a large percentage of that congressional district, so in that respect he is representing the viewpoint of his constituent. His positions on LGBT issues and the NRA are also consistent with the values of the majority of voters in that district. While I disagree with him on all of the above, I'm not aware of anytime when his vote was considered to be a tiebreaker so I won't fault him for voting consistent with the wishes of the people he represents.
A so called "progressive" or "democratic socialist" stands no chance in that district. Historically, the organization of any political movements in that area is based more upon ethnicity (e.g., La Raza Unida) than upon political ideology. That's why a challenger to him didn't arise in his previous elections including 2018.
BTW, his voting record for this session of Congress is more progressive than most Democrats including AOC.
Most of the above is only my opinion, but I grew up in the Congressional district adjacent to Cuellar's district so I do have some additional insight about the voters in that district.
Atticus
(15,124 posts)have misrepresented what she said in this instance. I used her situation as an EXAMPLE of trollery and biased journalism simply because it was "fresh" and being discussed in the current news cycle.
that's a big difference from quotes taken out of context.
lapucelle
(18,265 posts)George II
(67,782 posts)Atticus
(15,124 posts)manor321
(3,344 posts)And Ken Dilanian retweeted Painter's tweet.
Always remember where people like Richard Painter came from.
GeorgeGist
(25,321 posts)OilemFirchen
(7,143 posts)House Democrats explode in recriminations as liberals lash out at moderates
George II
(67,782 posts)George II
(67,782 posts)....and now her official Spokesperson.
That's how the dots get connected.
Kaleva
(36,307 posts)"I didnt say that they were putting themselves on a list for primaries. I said that by Dems distinguishing themselves by breaking off on procedural MTR votes, they were inadvertently making a list of targets for the GOP and for progressive advocates on their pro-ICE vote."
Link to tweet
AOC also said this:
"She told Politico: I am expending zero energy in trying to recruit other candidates to run against Democrats."
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/1/29/18188601/justice-democrats-alexandria-ocasio-cortezes-aoc
OilemFirchen
(7,143 posts)is her spokesperson?
The "bloviating ASS"?
That seems unfortunate, eh?
certainot
(9,090 posts)heres limbaugh on 1/22/19, while calling AOC a dunce, upstart little crumb-cruncher, commie, babe, marxist, etc., created a silly premise that Democratic leaders would get media to take her out just so he could repeat take her out half dozen times
..
transcribed at Sonix.ai:
so the day is going to come where she's gonna make somebody (Dems) mad or she's going to be too successful and will legitimately challenge somebody that has more power than she has. And they're not going to be interested in working with her and welcoming her in because they're not going to trust her so they're gonna take her out. This happens. I mean Soviet leaders were routinely targeted for assassination. They tried to kill Gorbachev during perestroika and glasnost.
limbaugh on 600 radio stations, 260 or 43% of them endorsed by 88 universities, sets the tone for 1500 radio stations
Bernardo de La Paz
(49,002 posts)"Oh no, I never suggested anyone assassinate her; I just mentioned her frequently in the same paragraph as discussing assassination" he will say.
nini
(16,672 posts)So, I'm confused here. I blocked them after I saw that and won't go back and double check.. But they were using her in their post about going after certain Dems.
She needs to set them straight if she is not part of that.. and soon.
crazytown
(7,277 posts)This happened is the caucus meeting where the Speaker is laying down the law on voting with the GOP on procedural resolutions: this is no day at he beach.
Its out in the open, shoulder to shoulder with the leadership, the opposite of ideologically motivated division.
watoos
(7,142 posts)Anyone bashing AOC for ripping moderate Dems better rip Speaker Pelosi for doing the same.
Seems to me a very dumb idea for Dems to be ripping on AOC when Republicans fear her.
Maybe if people dig deep enough they can Franken her?
FreepFryer
(7,077 posts)Rose couldnt even effectively manage a caucus for the office lottery, and his insistence on opposing the Speaker of the House is a requisite for keeping the crucial support of Staten Island and Brooklyn Republicans, who for some reason decided to vote for him over their own incumbent in 2018.
But a more experienced Hill creature would have seen this coming. The top floor of Cannon is widely considered the least-desirable real estate in the office market. Most of the elevators in the building dont even go up there. Couldnt the team have anchored their office cluster there to begin with? Would it have helped their odds to wheel and deal with other members of their class?
It is clear that when it comes to maneuvering we still have something to learn, Rose said. This just shows how hard it is to get something done in Washington, D.C.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/max-rose-came-to-congress-to-do-big-things-but-first-he-has-to-do-dumb-things/2018/12/03/fc119072-f70d-11e8-8d64-4e79db33382f_story.html
brooklynite
(94,585 posts)BTW, do you have an objection to an actual vote of his, other than for Speaker, which was clearly worked out with Pelosi in advance?
Fun fact: Max is on the Homeland Security and Veteran's Affairs Committees. Not the sort of assignments you get if the Speaker is unhappy with you.
FreepFryer
(7,077 posts)George II
(67,782 posts)...Democrat to be elected to that seat since 2010. And people are already taking shots at him.
Squinch
(50,950 posts)at each others throats if they depict a schism in the Democratic party and mention AOC. Whenever I see a story doing both if those things, I look for trolling. And I ALWAYS find it.
Lets for once be smart and remember a few things:
1)AOC is often great but sometimes makes ill-considered statements. Just as often though, her words are twisted by those who mean harm to ALL OF US.
2) We are all Democrats. THERE IS NO SCHISM IN THE PARTY! Don't let republicans, ratfuckers or trolls tell you there is!
Atticus
(15,124 posts)Uncle Joe
(58,364 posts)Thanks for the thread Atticus.
TryLogic
(1,723 posts)those who would challenge profiteering businesses (big banks, payday lenders, pharmaceuticals, big oil, etc.).
those who would challenge the greedy class, A.K.A., the billionaire class.
those who speak truth to power.
those who challenge the politicians who have much power due to seniority. (I noticed at the Cohen hearing it was the more senior Republicans who became crazy, out-of-their-minds hostile.)
Honeycombe8
(37,648 posts)by a moderate who I think thought he was targeted? The article I read did not mention that anyone denied it.
spanone
(135,841 posts)pdsimdars
(6,007 posts)PatrickforO
(14,576 posts)because she does not care if she is reelected for another term or not. Which frees her up to be sometimes painfully honest.
Lists? I don't think so. Transparency? Hard questions? Integrity? Yes. I do think so.
Here's what my friend Dan, a longtime student of Noam Chomsky and phenomena such as the shock doctrine, manufactured consent and the doctrine of American exceptionalism said about AOC:
So, just remember when you criticize this young lady, or any of the other new members of Congress who are pointing out embarrassing things about 'the way stuff gets done around here' that some things do in fact need to change.
As to 'primarying' people, I'll say this: In theory, at least, we elect people to go to DC and hopefully represent our interests in the face of lobbies and corporate corruption. In fact, most don't, because it is hard, the playing field is NOT level, and most people in office are ruled by fear of not being reelected as opposed to fear of falling short doing the right thing for us.
Truth is, I have gotten pretty darned tired of politicians telling me what they think I want to hear, then going to DC and getting very little done that actually helps me and my family. I'm SICK of that. It needs to end, and the way it ends is to shine the light on things that don't help us much. The Green New Deal non-binding resolution is a prime example of that. HOW THE HELL MUCH COURAGE DOES IT TAKE TO VOTE 'AYE' ON THIS? My grandkids need the politicians to DO THE RIGHT THING on climate change NOW. Not ten years from now.
All of you worry so much about groups like 'Justice Democrats,' well I will tell you this: It may be the reason we worry about them is that they are not afraid to upset the apple cart, they aren't afraid to point out inconvenient things, they aren't afraid to fight the status quo, and they aren't afraid to talk bluntly about kitchen table issues.
Above all, they aren't afraid of serving only one term and being defeated. To my mind, in a government that is ostensibly 'of, by and for' us, the people, THOSE are the exact kind of people we need to be electing.
Consider this, if you will: there are maybe 800 people in DC that call the shots. If they wanted a Green New Deal, they could legislate that tomorrow. If they wanted to raise taxes and give us Medicare for all, they could do that tomorrow. If they wanted to cut our military budget gradually back (so states like mine with lots of DoD and Energy contracts don't get hurt too bad) so we aren't paying more than the 8 countries behind us, they could tomorrow. If they wanted to reinstate the Reagan cuts to Medicare and make it cover 100% and not 80%, they could tomorrow. If they wanted to rebuild this nation's infrastructure, they could enact legislation to do that tomorrow. If they wanted to reverse the wealth and income inequality and redistribute some of that money to things that actually help people, they could do that tomorrow. If they wanted to pay off the national debt, they could actually READ Article 1, section 8 of the Constitution and do that within a year.
Yes, as an economist, I know all about unintended consequences, and we need to do our very best to pass legislation that helps the most people while at the same time being flexible enough to tweak those laws or even reverse them if they aren't working.
AOC is scary to the establishment because she is a reformer without vices and without fear of the powers that be. Teddy Roosevelt was such. Lincoln was such.
Speaking for myself, I will vote my own conscience in any primary and support the candidate that I feel will act most vigorously and wisely to enact law and policy that actually makes my life, and the lives of my family better. Yeah, I support Democrats, and if my primary candidate loses, I support the one we put forward, but why have empty suits when there are actually people who would go to DC and WORK to do the right thing? I try and support people who will DO what needs to be done instead of just SAYING what needs to be done.
We should all always be looking critically at those we elect and holding them accountable for what they do.
Locrian
(4,522 posts)I have zero respect for the "establishment" that chooses to support donors when >60%, 70%, 80%?? of the people support an issue and they chose to ignore it.
McKim
(2,412 posts)Stop dissing each other and feeding the fights. Get to work to elect your candidate of choice. This is a distraction and we should have one comment and then not jump on the bandwagon of fighting. Dont take the bait! Just ONE comment: Lets you and him fight! Answer: No!
demmiblue
(36,858 posts)Damn, I can see less than 50% of the responses in this thread.
Some seem to be doing TrumPutin's job for them.