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babylonsister

(171,066 posts)
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 02:54 PM Apr 2019

How Bad Does It Have to Get?

https://www.commondreams.org/views/2019/04/27/how-bad-does-it-have-get?fbclid=IwAR3MRimbkp9rg0mUTEXi6pTUnwX03CNu3qnpJa34RWvAYRRNxBIPSK8pvTc

Saturday, April 27, 2019
by Common Dreams
How Bad Does It Have to Get?
by Robert Freeman

How Bad Does It Have to Get? (cc/DonkeyHotey)


It’s bad enough that he lost the election by 3,000,000 popular votes.
It’s bad enough that the Russians helped him get elected by manipulating social media in critical electoral college states.
It’s bad enough that he helped the Russians do that by providing them confidential polling data to guide their Facebook ad targeting.
It’s bad enough that those ads were seen by more than 100,000,000 people when the total electoral college difference over three states was 70,000 votes.
It’s bad enough that those involved with his campaign who were also engaged with the Russians lied repeatedly, both publicly and under oath, about that engagement.
It’s bad enough that many tens of millions of dollars mysteriously disappeared from his inauguration committee, and he feels no compunction to explain where it went.
It’s bad enough that he brags about groping women and grabbing them by the pussy. Is there an honest woman in the country who admires that? Wants that?
It’s bad enough that he’s been credibly accused of sexual assault by more than 20 women.
It’s bad enough that he is an unindicted co-conspirator in the felony to commit election finance fraud by paying hush money to a Playboy bunny and a porn star.
It’s bad enough that he filed for bankruptcy six times, stiffing workers, contractors, and lenders for tens of millions of dollars.
It’s bad enough that his resorts and other properties for years hired undocumented aliens, even as he railed against a “tidal wave” of illegal immigrants.
It’s bad enough that he inherited $413,000,000 from his father, much of it through illegal tax dodges, but pretends to be a self-made man.
It’s bad enough that his “charitable” foundation was ordered shut down after having been revealed to be a sham, used to help promote his business and political interests.
It’s bad enough he claims he was a good student, but threatens to sue any schools that release his grades.
It’s bad enough he claims to be a brilliant businessman but refuses to release his taxes which would prove it. Or, disprove it.
It’s bad enough that he says the Mueller report “totally exonerates” him, yet refuses to allow it to be released, or, for critical witnesses to be able to testify about it.
It’s bad enough that he grossly understated the value of his assets to dodge taxes, while grossly overstating their value to secure bank loans.
It’s bad enough that the Mueller report detailed 10 instances of obstruction of justice that would be criminal, were he not the president and, so, immune from indictment.
It’s bad enough that he’s a pathological liar, telling almost 10,000 lies since assuming office, literally not being able to deal with reality.
It’s bad enough, his boot-licking of Putin at Helsinki, where he said he believed Putin about Russian interference in the 2016 election, but not his own intelligence chiefs.
It’s bad enough that he has separated thousands of immigrant children from their parents, put them in cages, and then lost track of them.
It’s bad enough that he praised neo-Nazi marchers in Charlottesville two years ago, then re-defended them just a few days ago.
It’s bad enough that, though sworn to ensure that the laws are faithfully executed, he told immigration officials to break the law, promising to pardon them if they were convicted.
It’s bad enough that he told senior White House aides to lie to the Mueller commission about his efforts to obstruct the same commission’s investigation.
It’s bad enough that he smeared a Gold Star Family whose son was killed in Iraq.
It’s bad enough that he repeatedly smeared bona-fide Vietnam war hero, John McCain, while he, himself, wrangled five draft deferments to dodge service in the same war.
It’s bad enough he promised to help the working man, but immediately passed a $1.5 trillion tax cut that went almost exclusively to corporations and the wealthy.
It’s bad enough he continues to claim he’s building The Wall when not a single inch of new wall has been built since he took office.
It’s bad enough he promised to protect Social Security but just two weeks ago submitted a budget that cuts benefits to millions, including seniors in poverty.
It’s bad enough that he refuses to cooperate with Congressional hearings, trashing the Constitution and the checks and balances at the very heart of our form of government.


We could go on. And on. And on. And on. But as bad as all of this is, the real question is, “When does it get so bad that we will no longer tolerate this scum running the country, dividing us against each other, desecrating our values, degrading our civic spaces, and destroying our institutions?” When does it get bad enough that WE will actually do something to stop being so mocked, so humiliated, and so defiled? When will we have Republican Congressmen who will get up off their knees before him and represent us, the people who actually elected them, and defend our country against the greatest domestic threat it has faced in over a century?
62 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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How Bad Does It Have to Get? (Original Post) babylonsister Apr 2019 OP
Drastic times call for drastic measures watoos Apr 2019 #1
I'll second that. RVN VET71 Apr 2019 #19
That's drastic?? triron Apr 2019 #34
Thanks for that. It's good to know how much we've been through. Chin music Apr 2019 #2
Message auto-removed Name removed Apr 2019 #3
Civil disobedience? crazytown Apr 2019 #4
One thing that would destroy Trump quickly Mr.Bill Apr 2019 #5
that seems unlikely to happen, given that most trading is done by algorithms these days anarch Apr 2019 #43
it's not the algorithms, it's the fact that the stock market only cares about profits. unblock Apr 2019 #51
No matter what the pundits and apologists say-- ginnyinWI Apr 2019 #6
I have been asking myself that question every day for the last year and a half. smirkymonkey Apr 2019 #7
This MFM008 Apr 2019 #55
When one of Red Don's crew says its OK to get help from Russia in US elections? uponit7771 Apr 2019 #8
It's more of my theory that advertising ruins everything. Initech Apr 2019 #9
Ask the Republicans in the Congress wryter2000 Apr 2019 #10
Yup that's bad enough. FailureToCommunicate Apr 2019 #11
Even with your list kacekwl Apr 2019 #12
Impeach. Now. (nt) Paladin Apr 2019 #13
+1 myohmy2 Apr 2019 #40
House votes for impeachment... N_E_1 for Tennis Apr 2019 #14
Kentucky needs to help save their country notinkansas Apr 2019 #38
DEMS-please.. go after congressional republicans EVERY FUCKING ONE OF THEM.. pangaia Apr 2019 #15
Don't expect the M$M to get involved in exposing the truth. Haggis for Breakfast Apr 2019 #28
Agreed. I watched 60 Minutes tonight, and during the segments on immigration and Nato c-rational Apr 2019 #29
Congratulations !! You have been awakened ! Haggis for Breakfast Apr 2019 #30
CRICKETS is right. argghh !! pangaia Apr 2019 #32
And Les "It may not be good for America, but it's damn good for CBS" Moonves n/t MarcA Apr 2019 #39
This!!!!! McKim Apr 2019 #46
We must DESTROY the GOP at all levels of the 2020 ballot...and beyond. RobertDevereaux Apr 2019 #16
What to do with FOX and hate radio? Grasswire2 Apr 2019 #21
Great question! RobertDevereaux Apr 2019 #22
We could start by arresting McConnell. Why hasn't he been arrested by FBI? Ford_Prefect Apr 2019 #17
Hell, Sam Ervin said he was going to arrest RVN VET71 Apr 2019 #20
Not exactly StarfishSaver Apr 2019 #37
Sadly, you are correct RVN VET71 May 2019 #60
For deplorables, two factors determine elections Xipe Totec Apr 2019 #18
Putin hacked the DNC Nuggets Apr 2019 #23
K & R x 1,000,000. pazzyanne Apr 2019 #24
When I read this and the comments, I see ONE THING... Grasswire2 Apr 2019 #25
It's About Time!!!! McKim Apr 2019 #47
IMPEACH HIM. VOX Apr 2019 #26
The Constitution can't wait until 2020 nt Fiendish Thingy Apr 2019 #27
A-fucking-men Blue Owl Apr 2019 #31
We Have to Beat the Psycho. Cha Apr 2019 #33
Really colsohlibgal Apr 2019 #35
A deep recession, sorry to say. sandensea Apr 2019 #36
Its true... yuiyoshida Apr 2019 #41
The gop leadership also has russian money, so, it's not going to stop until the press runs: lindysalsagal Apr 2019 #42
Well, Nancy says we aren't there yet. pdsimdars Apr 2019 #44
Pelosi is speaking of impeaching on paper. Honeycombe8 Apr 2019 #45
Give me a break with your talking point. It is their JOB. Impeach is THEIR duty. pdsimdars Apr 2019 #50
You misread. That's a common error by some. Honeycombe8 Apr 2019 #56
A common mistake by many is that impeachment is the senate removing someone from office pdsimdars Apr 2019 #57
No. Honeycombe8 Apr 2019 #58
We disagree pdsimdars Apr 2019 #59
The biggest worry is that we did not stop the russians in 2016 despite knowing what they were up to BSdetect Apr 2019 #48
While I agree with all you wrote Ferrets are Cool Apr 2019 #49
It's a Jonesian cult, it will be bad enough when they line up and drink the kool-aid. Pepsidog Apr 2019 #52
K&R BlueJac Apr 2019 #53
It's obviously not bad enough, as unbelievable as it sounds. Eyeball_Kid Apr 2019 #54
People simply don't care unless it hurts them personally. Oneironaut May 2019 #61
Trump already told us: He can shoot someone on 5th Avenue and get away with it. Blaukraut May 2019 #62

RVN VET71

(2,690 posts)
19. I'll second that.
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 05:54 PM
Apr 2019

The GOP will never go along with it, of course; but every one of those soulless bastards will have to stand up publicly and be counted as enablers of treason and corruption.

Chin music

(23,002 posts)
2. Thanks for that. It's good to know how much we've been through.
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 03:08 PM
Apr 2019

I'm anxious in the extreme for all of us.
Repubs are just MIA. When you're sitting on a pile of dough, theres no real need for urgency. After ll, THEY"RE ok right? Don't rock the boat.
Money in politics has been a bane. After Citizens United, we turned a hard corner, and it hasn't been good.

Response to babylonsister (Original post)

anarch

(6,535 posts)
43. that seems unlikely to happen, given that most trading is done by algorithms these days
Mon Apr 29, 2019, 06:09 AM
Apr 2019

I get the sense that technology has allowed the stock market to nearly entirely ignore the "economy" as it relates to average working class families, as long as profits are being made at the top. You'd think the extended period of wage stagnation in the face of a steadily increasing corporate profits would be unsustainable, but between the systematic assaults on unions over the past couple decades, and the switch from an actual product/manufacturing based economy, to a consumer-based economy, then to a debt-based economy, and now to whatever the fuck this is (attention-based economy?), those at the top seem to have found a nifty way to keep peoples' attention focused...well, anywhere but on them really, and on how fucked over the average worker is at this point.

Yes, it's all about money, but since 2008 I don't feel there's as much connection between the various stock-market indicators and the strength of the actual economy, or the purchasing power of your average working class person. That is to say, I think the stock market could be effectively manipulated at this point such that any "crash" would have to involve all of society, not just stock prices, because there's always some computer program waiting to snatch up stock on the cheap whenever there's a price drop, etc., and you're just not going to see the same kind of human panic affect the numbers as we used to. I dunno; it's just my pet theory, I have not substantiating evidence. I just don't think the stock market has so much direct correlation to the financial security of the average American as it's made out to have.

unblock

(52,232 posts)
51. it's not the algorithms, it's the fact that the stock market only cares about profits.
Mon Apr 29, 2019, 10:23 AM
Apr 2019

your last sentence is the most accurate. the stock market doesn't care about the average american or the long-term security of the economy or fair distribution of wealth or anything like that. the stock market cares only about the expected net present value of corporate profits. period.

the stock market is amoral. it doesn't care where corporations get their profits from. they're happy to see profits if a company markets a better product that helps people, but it's also happy if a company gets profits by cutting wages and benefits or laying off a ton of people.

automation, lower wages in other countries, and weakened unions have combined to make it very difficult for ordinary people to get a share of the profits.

so the overall economy can look good by aggregate measures like gdp, and the stock market can grow as corporate profits grow, but the rest of us feel left out.


eventually we will suffer as the next recession will crush many, many people. it's going to be really bad recession and the government will not likely be in a position to really help the masses the way we will need.

but in the meanwhile, hey, there are profits to be made. and investors won't be overly bothered because once american consumers are sucked dry, they will simply turn their attention to the growing market of indian and chinese consumers....

ginnyinWI

(17,276 posts)
6. No matter what the pundits and apologists say--
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 04:27 PM
Apr 2019

Remember how the Mid-terms turned out. That's what us people out here really think of this guy. I think the beltway has to remember that.

 

smirkymonkey

(63,221 posts)
7. I have been asking myself that question every day for the last year and a half.
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 04:30 PM
Apr 2019

He is a fucking nightmare. I honestly can't wait until he kicks the bucket because I never want to see or hear from him again.

Initech

(100,076 posts)
9. It's more of my theory that advertising ruins everything.
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 04:34 PM
Apr 2019

It's just bile and garbage piled on top of bile and garbage to sell us junk. Advertising wants to target us, and the Russians exploited that for political gain. It's the reason why I will never turn off my ad blocker and the reason why I think it's garbage.

kacekwl

(7,017 posts)
12. Even with your list
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 05:10 PM
Apr 2019

and I'm sure there's more to add , we hesitate to even file an impeachment hearing. Time is quickly running out.

N_E_1 for Tennis

(9,724 posts)
14. House votes for impeachment...
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 05:26 PM
Apr 2019

Senate investigates...McConnell is majority leader ...in depth legitimate investigations?...not a chance.
Nerves and patience wearing real thin right now.

pangaia

(24,324 posts)
15. DEMS-please.. go after congressional republicans EVERY FUCKING ONE OF THEM..
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 05:33 PM
Apr 2019

ON TV, NEWSPAPERS, RADIO, SOCIAL MEDIA --- did I say SOCIAL MEDIA !!!!

Get organized, hire somebody who knows how to spread memes and truthful info just like the fascists spread lies and propaganda.
What the fuck is the matter with you?????



It's simple!
A college PR freshman could figure it out.

Shit, even I could figure it out..

Haggis for Breakfast

(6,831 posts)
28. Don't expect the M$M to get involved in exposing the truth.
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 09:38 PM
Apr 2019

Seriously. Wake up.

The M$M is not invested in getting the truth out to the public. Excuse me, but where has everyone been ? No less than Jeff Zucker (President, Chairman, of NBC/CNN) said that trmp was a horrible person but that he was GREAT FOR RATINGS. And THAT, my friends, is ALL the M$M gives a fuck about.

If it weren't true, there would be hoards of investigative journalists or reporters (Anybody remember those guys ?) out there, kicking over every rock, digging up every lead, compiling the facts and FOLLOWING THE MONEY to the truth and fearlessly reporting it out.

What do we have now ? CRICKETS !!!

You hear anyone on ANY network/platform ANYWHERE doing this ? CRICKETS !!!

The M$M is interested in ONE thing and ONE thing only. RATINGS. Ratings = money. They don't want to see him indicted, tried and put in prison - which is exactly what any functioning democracy would do. They want trmp to stay around because he runs the news cycle. When was the last time you thought that you didn't need to tune in to find out what fuckery he engaged in today ? People are afraid to not tune in, in case he does something that affects their lives, families, jobs, security.

But do NOT look to the media to do anything that would take their cash cow off the screen. It isn't in their interest. They don't give a fuck about you, me or this country. The are too busy worshipping their GOD -- $$$$$$$$$$.

c-rational

(2,593 posts)
29. Agreed. I watched 60 Minutes tonight, and during the segments on immigration and Nato
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 09:55 PM
Apr 2019

exercises I had the sinking feeling they were putting Trump in a good light. I could and could not fathom why. M$M is complicit.

McKim

(2,412 posts)
46. This!!!!!
Mon Apr 29, 2019, 09:01 AM
Apr 2019

This!!! I will never forget how the MSM made a god out of Trump during the presidential elections.
They just couldn’t cover his antics enough!

RVN VET71

(2,690 posts)
20. Hell, Sam Ervin said he was going to arrest
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 05:56 PM
Apr 2019

anyone in Nixon's staff who ignored a subpoena to appear. I think Cummings and Schiff are certainly empowered to do the same -- and I pray they will if Barr attempts to ignore the subpoena he's going to get.

 

StarfishSaver

(18,486 posts)
37. Not exactly
Mon Apr 29, 2019, 12:38 AM
Apr 2019

He said that, if it looked like it would take two or three years to go to court to compel cooperation, he would recommend that the Senate send the sergeant-at-arms to make arrests.

Ervin Suggests Penalizing Aides of Nixon Who Balk
New York Times, March 19, 1973
...
Senator Ervin said on the Columbia Broadcasting System television program “Face the Nation” that he, too, would welcome a court test “because the President has stretched the doctrine of executive privilege far beyond its true boundaries and far beyond any precedmit on the subject.”

But, he added, if it appeared that the committee's investigation was “going to be delayed two or three years while it's getting to the Supreme Court,” he would be prepared to take more severe steps.

“I'd recommend to the Senate they send the sergeant‐at arms of the Senate to arrest a White House aide or any other witness who refuses to appear,” he said, “and let the Senate try him.”

https://www.nytimes.com/1973/03/19/archives/ervin-suggests-penalizing-aides-of-nixon-who-balk-ervin-suggests.html


This was framed as a "suggestion," not a threat - which makes sense since Ervin didn't have the authority to order anyone's arrest.

RVN VET71

(2,690 posts)
60. Sadly, you are correct
Wed May 1, 2019, 07:34 AM
May 2019

Congress can certify contempt and refer it to the U.S. Attorney who could then present it to a grand jury -- if he wants to. Apparently, when the Republicans attempted to take this action against Eric Holder, the U.S. Attorney's Office refused to act on it. In basketball, I think, a guard might pass the ball to the center standing unguarded beneath the basket. But the center is at liberty to hold the ball until the clock runs out.

Damn! But thanks for the information.

Xipe Totec

(43,890 posts)
18. For deplorables, two factors determine elections
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 05:50 PM
Apr 2019

1.- The price of a gallon of gas
2.- The price of a six-pack of beer.

 

Nuggets

(525 posts)
23. Putin hacked the DNC
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 07:37 PM
Apr 2019

possibly for getting the names and address of those making donations. All of them obvious Dem voters to be knocked off voter rolls in areas where needed.

I think he helped the Russians by providing them polling data so they could delete, or otherwise list Democrats as non registered in state voter registration databases as well as for Facebook ad targeting.
I also believe getting a list of registered Democratic voters and precisely where they live is exactly what Trump’s election commission was after.

BUT, in answer to your question, I think it will take at least until the 2020 elections because many people believe Democrats will gain majorities and turn this ship around.

If that doesn’t happen, it won’t be until enough of the upper middle class starts getting hit hard due to Republican policies.

Grasswire2

(13,570 posts)
25. When I read this and the comments, I see ONE THING...
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 08:55 PM
Apr 2019

...that critical mass is building for people to take to the streets.

Not with pussy hats and stilt walkers and crepe paper whales.

But following the example of the Civil Rights marches.

Just a mass of people gathering, walking perhaps, singing perhaps.

THAT is what will scare the hell out of the RW.

It must be peaceful, or it will be turned against Dems.

It must be wise, and avoid any possibility of a false flag incident.

Just a show of solidarity on behalf of the Rule of Law and the Constitution.

It would work.

colsohlibgal

(5,275 posts)
35. Really
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 11:05 PM
Apr 2019

Not only is this excuse for a human being a terrible illegitimate President he is ultra unlikeable to a comfortable majority of us.

I hate the Electoral College with a passion. Minus that hocus pocus no Dubya, no dumb Donnie.

sandensea

(21,635 posts)
36. A deep recession, sorry to say.
Sun Apr 28, 2019, 11:43 PM
Apr 2019

It's the only thing that seems to wake enough people up to the sheer horror, incompetence - and treasonousness - of recent GOP presidents, sadly.

lindysalsagal

(20,686 posts)
42. The gop leadership also has russian money, so, it's not going to stop until the press runs:
Mon Apr 29, 2019, 05:56 AM
Apr 2019
https://www.dallasnews.com/opinion/commentary/2018/05/08/putins-proxies-helped-funnel-millions-gop-campaigns

Editor's note May 8, 2018: This column originally published December 15, 2017. New allegations about $500k in payments from a Russian oligarch made to Trump attorney Michael Cohen have placed it back in the news.

As Special Counsel Robert Mueller's team probes deeper into potential collusion between Trump officials and representatives of the Russian government, investigators are taking a closer look at political contributions made by U.S. citizens with close ties to Russia.

Buried in the campaign finance reports available to the public are some troubling connections between a group of wealthy donors with ties to Russia and their political contributions to President Donald Trump and a number of top Republican leaders. And thanks to changes in campaign finance laws, the political contributions are legal. We have allowed our campaign finance laws to become a strategic threat to our country.

In 2017, donations continued, with $41,000 going to both Republican and Democrat candidates, along with $1 million to McConnell's Senate Leadership Fund.


Until the press finally runs this truth: Many of our leaders should be impeached, nothing will change.

Honeycombe8

(37,648 posts)
45. Pelosi is speaking of impeaching on paper.
Mon Apr 29, 2019, 08:44 AM
Apr 2019

We don't have the power to DO anything about Trump, really. The Republicans are in charge. We CAN impeach on paper, for historical reasons. But that doesn't actually DO anything about him, does it?

What's your game plan to get rid of him?

 

pdsimdars

(6,007 posts)
50. Give me a break with your talking point. It is their JOB. Impeach is THEIR duty.
Mon Apr 29, 2019, 10:11 AM
Apr 2019

It was put there for a reason. If they don't do their duty, they are normalizing this behavior which means, if our Democracy survives, it will be worse next time because they were afraid to do their JOB.
On an assembly line, I have MY duties, my job, just because someone else later down the line does a lousy job doesn't mean I shouldn't do MY job to the best of my abilities. Impeachment is their JOB in cases of someone UNFIT. Do you seriously think Trump is fit to be president? If not, the House's JOB is to impeach. You can wiggle and spin all you want, but it is their JOB to IMPEACH someone UNFIT. I think he is unfit. Apparently you and Pelosi don't. You are mistaken.

Honeycombe8

(37,648 posts)
56. You misread. That's a common error by some.
Mon Apr 29, 2019, 02:51 PM
Apr 2019

Read my post again. I didn't say he shouldn't be impeached on paper. Neither did Pelosi.

So let's say they decide to impeach. What evidence would you use to draw up the impeachment papers? The Mueller Report? Well...that's not evidence. That's a report of evidence. Exactly what evidence, we don't know, because Congress hasn't obtained that part of the report.

The Mueller Report is an impression of the evidence. That's not a basis for impeachment by itself, without having the evidence attached to it, is my understanding.

The people with legal counsel know what they're doing. When they do it, it will be done right. It's not like you think...you just type out "I think Trump did some things wrong! I say we impeach him. How 'bout it? Sign at the bottom if you agree."

It's a legal process that lists with specificity WHAT Trump has done that supports impeachment, and refers to the impeachment guidelines and the supporting evidence for the claims. It's a legal document.

The House of Rep is getting their ducks in a row. Mueller will be testifying in May. The public has to be behind it, or we could win the battle but lose the war. Right now, most of the public thinks Trump was cleared. They need to see that he wasn't. At least the non-Trumpers.

 

pdsimdars

(6,007 posts)
57. A common mistake by many is that impeachment is the senate removing someone from office
Mon Apr 29, 2019, 04:24 PM
Apr 2019

But as far as I understand it impeachment is a process, like an investigation. And investigation gathers the facts and information and then writes an indictment or doesn't. Like that at the end of the House process they write up articles of impeachment or not. It doesn't "become" impeachment at the end when the articles of impeachment are written up, but is a process.
And it is that word "impeachment" that the Democrats are afraid of because the Republicans are daring them to come into that briar patch.

Honeycombe8

(37,648 posts)
58. No.
Mon Apr 29, 2019, 04:58 PM
Apr 2019

Impeachment in the House is a vote that says he's impeached for _____________ (then lists the charges against him, and cites the evidence in support).

In the House, it's on paper. It passes to the Senate, which if voted to impeach, then and only then can they remove him.

The Republican Senate will not vote to impeach. So only the House can vote to impeach, not remove him. So it will be a record in the historical records, like Bill Clinton's is.

We shouldn't be rash, just because it will feel good. We get one shot at it. It needs to be done right. And the public needs to be behind it.

Our reps have legal counsel. They know what they're doing. But it's not an easy 1-2-3 like some people think.

The word "impeach" carries a lot of weight. It's important, if not critical, that the public be on board as much as possible, or the Republicans may not only win the Presidency, but may win even more seats in the Senate.

(The Republicans won the Presidential election after the House impeached Bill Clinton, but lost seats in the House.)

BSdetect

(8,998 posts)
48. The biggest worry is that we did not stop the russians in 2016 despite knowing what they were up to
Mon Apr 29, 2019, 09:15 AM
Apr 2019

And little is being done to stop them doing similar things in 2020 - assuming there is even an election then.

They have used every flaw in this democracy to insert confusion and hatred.

Ferrets are Cool

(21,106 posts)
49. While I agree with all you wrote
Mon Apr 29, 2019, 09:21 AM
Apr 2019

who is this "WE" you speak of?

What can YOU and I do besides call our reps and vote?

Eyeball_Kid

(7,432 posts)
54. It's obviously not bad enough, as unbelievable as it sounds.
Mon Apr 29, 2019, 11:23 AM
Apr 2019

The GOP leadership sees everything as just fine. It matters little to them whether Trumpy suspends the Constitution-- something that's nearly a guarantee if he's not stopped in his tracks. The logic of his actions, when we survey the above "it's bad enough" litany, is that the only way he can protect himself from defeat is if he continues to ignore Congress. Doing so then places him at risk of being cut off at the knees by the Judiciary, something that he also must not risk. His only alternative is to render both branches as inferior to his position by suspending the Constitution (He can call a National Emergency, and under the Patriot Act, he can install martial law). That's the odd thing about GOP acquiescence. Enabling Trumpy means that they are disabling themselves. But they are blind to their own demise. If Trumpy respects the Rule of Law, he'll be defeated at the polls or sooner. He can't afford to respect the Rule of Law. He must win at any and all costs. He's lawless and does not view laws as constraining. He simply ignores them and "wins."

GOPers refuse to take lessons from history. They are in the position of Hitler's own enablers from the 1930s. Trumpy is not Hitler, but he's also not a benevolent dictator. But Dictator he is, and he's in the process, RIGHT NOW, of securing his position as the unitary head of all of government. GOPers may or may not understand this. Either way, they do so at their own peril. Whether Trumpy wins or loses, the GOP loses. Their status as a national political party is approaching the sycophantic, which means that they lick Trumpy's ass as a matter of course. There is no opposition to Trumpy within the GOP.

If the GOP acts in opposition to Trumpy, they can save themselves from irrelevancy. But they won't. They don't have the nerve, they don't have the guts. They are cowards.

Oneironaut

(5,495 posts)
61. People simply don't care unless it hurts them personally.
Wed May 1, 2019, 10:11 AM
May 2019

It’s always been like that. It’s partially why Trump won.

“Minorities are INVADING and stealing YOUR money. I’ll keep those useless brown eaters out of the country.”

“I’ll make the economy great so that your 401K grows, even if it’s at the expense of other people.”

“I’ll keep your job safe from the brown job stealers!”

“I’ll take charge from the evil government that wants to steal your money through taxes and Cadillac-driving, Obama-Phone dialing Welfare Queens! THEY don’t deserve your hard earned money!”

- I’ll oppress the undesirables - especially those vile LGBTQ’s that want to destroy YOUR family structure! This is our America, not theirs!”

It doesn’t matter how bad it gets, so long as the main group in society is convinced they can maintain dominance over everyone else. They can be kings of the trash heap.

Blaukraut

(5,693 posts)
62. Trump already told us: He can shoot someone on 5th Avenue and get away with it.
Wed May 1, 2019, 10:15 AM
May 2019

We should have believed him.

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