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What does it say when we have to factor in election theft (Original Post) edhopper Jul 2019 OP
Horrifying, scary and tragic. Golden Raisin Jul 2019 #1
Agreed pecosbob Jul 2019 #2
Heart breaking Iwasthere Jul 2019 #3
I have seen calculations that edhopper Jul 2019 #4
It's really the close elections that can be stolen & turnout can prevent that. elocs Jul 2019 #5
That is not a answer edhopper Jul 2019 #8
Please explain how you gerrymander a statewide presidential election? elocs Jul 2019 #12
I am talking about all the elections edhopper Jul 2019 #14
We must have paper receipts, and we must ecstatic Jul 2019 #6
Paper BALLOTS, not paper receipts. Paper ballots can be audited. Receipts are useless and illegal. hedda_foil Jul 2019 #13
That means we MUST win by an overwhelming margin Bayard Jul 2019 #7
Yes edhopper Jul 2019 #9
We shouldn't accept it as a norm Turin_C3PO Jul 2019 #11
True edhopper Jul 2019 #15
To be honest, Turin_C3PO Jul 2019 #16
Its been happening for along time. For me it is expected. aikoaiko Jul 2019 #10

pecosbob

(7,542 posts)
2. Agreed
Sat Jul 13, 2019, 10:47 AM
Jul 2019

Voter suppression, voter role purging, local voting impediments to the young and POC, social media manipulation, vote talley manipulation in states such as Ohio, Florida and Pennsylvania (election fraud) through backdoors and hacking. Foreign money galore for their campaigns. And old school ratf*ckery of every sort and flavor. They've pretty much pulled out all the stops.

Iwasthere

(3,169 posts)
3. Heart breaking
Sat Jul 13, 2019, 10:47 AM
Jul 2019

Karnacki at his big board will probably even have a column "and factoring in election theft".

edhopper

(33,606 posts)
4. I have seen calculations that
Sat Jul 13, 2019, 10:51 AM
Jul 2019

we lost as many as 10 seats in 2018 because of this shit.

I know we lost at least to in the Senate, GA and FL.

elocs

(22,597 posts)
5. It's really the close elections that can be stolen & turnout can prevent that.
Sat Jul 13, 2019, 11:18 AM
Jul 2019

But then we also have plenty of ready made excuses for any kind of loss. Why not? Trump will never accept a loss as reflecting the will of the voters. Had he lost in 2016 he would have claimed massive vote fraud, which he did anyways.
A massive turnout by the Left will overcome any voter suppression or funny business but there can't be any pouting or purity tests because only 1 of 2 people will be the next president: either Trump or the Democratic candidate. That's it.

edhopper

(33,606 posts)
8. That is not a answer
Sat Jul 13, 2019, 11:42 AM
Jul 2019

we have to beat them by at least 5%-10% is not the way the run a democracy.

Accepting this situation and saying we can overcome it if we want is a bad plan.

And gerrymandering squashes any turnout advantage anyway.

elocs

(22,597 posts)
12. Please explain how you gerrymander a statewide presidential election?
Sat Jul 13, 2019, 11:51 AM
Jul 2019

Or any statewide election.
Nothing is going to change in just a year and a half and so the only weapon we have is turnout so we had better use that or whine and cry about the results if we don't like it.

Less than 100,000 votes in 2016 determined Trump's electoral victory in Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania.

hedda_foil

(16,375 posts)
13. Paper BALLOTS, not paper receipts. Paper ballots can be audited. Receipts are useless and illegal.
Sat Jul 13, 2019, 11:56 AM
Jul 2019

So you have a piece of paper that shows you how you voted. Swell, but that doesn't mean your vote can't be changed inside the machine or in the central processing computers at the county or state level. Besides that, receipts were used in past centuries to show vote buyers in order to get paid for voting the way they wanted. They've been illegal for a long, long time.

Turin_C3PO

(14,033 posts)
11. We shouldn't accept it as a norm
Sat Jul 13, 2019, 11:47 AM
Jul 2019

but there’s not much we can do unless we win nationally and state-level elections in 2020. Then we can start addressing election fraud. Of course, we need the Senate also.

Turin_C3PO

(14,033 posts)
16. To be honest,
Sat Jul 13, 2019, 12:05 PM
Jul 2019

I’m not positive that vote-flipping has occurred. After all, Obama won twice and we recently won in 2018. I think Republicans primarily steal elections the old fashioned way: through voter suppression and, now, Russian propaganda.

aikoaiko

(34,183 posts)
10. Its been happening for along time. For me it is expected.
Sat Jul 13, 2019, 11:46 AM
Jul 2019

Granted, Russia as an active player in a huge scheme is new, but I expected the same type of troll farm work from the Kochs or others.

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