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DemocratSinceBirth

(99,710 posts)
Sat Sep 28, 2019, 05:39 PM Sep 2019

Thoughts on impeachment thread. Please share yours*

It seems as if our party has crossed the Rubicon on impeachment. There is no turning back now. Prior to the Ukraine Affair I was content to defeat Trump at the ballot box but Trump's decision to pressure a foreign leader to deliver dirt on his domestic political rivals and use the coffers of the United States as leverage is beyond the proverbial pale. I would argue it's infinitely worse than Andrew Johnson violating the Office Of Tenure Act, Richard Nixon covering up a burglary of the opposing party's headquarters, and Bill Clinton dissembling under oath about what sex is and isn't.

There are some wags that argue impeachment will inure to Trump's benefit and point to the fact the Democrats reversed a historical trend and picked up six House seats in a mid term election in the second term of an incumbent president during the Clinton impeachment. What they neglect to mention is the Republicans won the next presidential election despite an economy that was growing at 4.1% per annum because their candidate promised to restore honor and dignity to the White House. They also neglect to mention Bill Clinton wasn't Donald Trump. He was a lovable rogue who was at 69% approval on the eve of his impeachment in the House and at 73% approval on the eve of his acquittal in the Senate:



If the Democrats were to turn back now they would demoralize our base. Impeachment is a win win. Our base will be mobilized when we impeach him and mobilized by anger when the Republican Senate presumably acquits him.

“There is a tide in the affairs of men / Which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune.”


* I probably put more thought into this thread than any thread I started in a decade.

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Thoughts on impeachment thread. Please share yours* (Original Post) DemocratSinceBirth Sep 2019 OP
I don't think the situations are comparable. TwilightZone Sep 2019 #1
Our base is bigger than their base so if both bases are equally mobilized we win. DemocratSinceBirth Sep 2019 #3
Don't expect history to repeat itself LeftInTX Sep 2019 #2
I would be demoralized if he weren't impeached over this. flibbitygiblets Sep 2019 #4
Exactly DemocratSinceBirth Sep 2019 #5

TwilightZone

(25,471 posts)
1. I don't think the situations are comparable.
Sat Sep 28, 2019, 05:53 PM
Sep 2019

For the reasons you noted, but also because Clinton's impeachment was pretty clearly purely a political act. Trump is all but begging to be impeached for a sustained pattern of behavior that makes Clinton's acts look like jaywalking.

"Impeachment is a win win. "

I don't think there's any way to know that for certain, because we've never been here before. Impeachment may mobilize Democrats, but Democrats, as shown by the midterms and the polls, are already quite mobilized.

I don't buy the argument that not impeaching Trump would demoralize Democrats. There's just no evidence of that, outside of places like DU where we hyper-analyize and overreact to everything. In the real world, everyone on the left and much of the middle understands the threat and will act accordingly.

The impeachment - and Trump's likely acquittal - will mobilize his base. Which base will be mobilized more is a total unknown.

Regardless of impeachment and its outcome, turnout is, and always was, going to be the key in 2020.

LeftInTX

(25,383 posts)
2. Don't expect history to repeat itself
Sat Sep 28, 2019, 05:53 PM
Sep 2019

He's not Bill Clinton
He's not Nixon (Who resigned)

This is not Watergate.

Congress is not the same.
The electorate is not the same.

Trump will not resign

I highly doubt the senate will remove him, but you never know.

I don't know how this will affect Trump's approval.
However, I tend to think it will have a negative impact on Trump.

More cabinet members will leave and there might be criminal charges for them.

flibbitygiblets

(7,220 posts)
4. I would be demoralized if he weren't impeached over this.
Sat Sep 28, 2019, 06:00 PM
Sep 2019

It's got to happen because it's the right thing to do. He has to follow the law. If we don't we're done as a democracy. Also, they're BETTING we don't. They're PRAYING we don't. The weak pushback we're getting is nothing but bluster to try and get us to have the ridiculous conversation about whether we should risk impeachment.

It's congress' JOB to provide oversight.

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