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FakeNoose

(32,645 posts)
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 03:35 PM Oct 2019

Paul Krugman on 3 possibilities - all are horrifying




Paul Krugman (verified)
@PaulKrugman

So did Trump just betray the Kurds because
(a) He has business interests in Turkey
(b) Erdogan, being a brutal autocrat, is his kind of guy
(c) His boss Vladimir Putin told him to

Remarkable that all three stories are perfectly plausible.


44.2K
9:53 AM - Oct 7, 2019

I'm going to say it's all three.



72 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Paul Krugman on 3 possibilities - all are horrifying (Original Post) FakeNoose Oct 2019 OP
I agree! Newest Reality Oct 2019 #1
One more... citizen blues Oct 2019 #40
(d) He's too stupid to realise they're our allies. meadowlander Oct 2019 #2
Not too stupid. He doesn't care. He is ... Whiskeytide Oct 2019 #7
Too true!!!! Mopar151 Oct 2019 #47
e) He's wagging the dog Rstrstx Oct 2019 #8
It's an avalanche of shit progressoid Oct 2019 #11
You know, that is a pretty good description of how it feels. smirkymonkey Oct 2019 #33
it's like a cowpatty tossing contest nt yellowdogintexas Oct 2019 #55
the secret is that we must sift bdamomma Oct 2019 #69
Not that this story paints him in a good light either Proud Liberal Dem Oct 2019 #13
He'll "pivot" and poof! Everything goes away (he thinks) Grokenstein Oct 2019 #20
Nothing matters to Trumpy except his personal gain. Eyeball_Kid Oct 2019 #19
He could care less about the Kurds. It doesn't affect him at all. IronLionZion Oct 2019 #50
I'd use the why not both gif qazplm135 Oct 2019 #3
Or Erdogan is threatening to release the bonesaw tapes. Tanuki Oct 2019 #4
This is what happens when you're blackmail-able. Maybe it's the P Tape NightWatcher Oct 2019 #6
Hey that's good - I didn't think of that FakeNoose Oct 2019 #28
AOTK Hermit-The-Prog Oct 2019 #5
Absolutely all 3 Midnightwalk Oct 2019 #9
DING! FirstLight Oct 2019 #10
Meanwhile, Jimmy Carter is building houses for homeless people, despite lagomorph777 Oct 2019 #24
Exactly... Presidency didn't define him.. FirstLight Oct 2019 #29
win win win situation certainot Oct 2019 #44
... Scurrilous Oct 2019 #12
A trifecta. roamer65 Oct 2019 #14
K & R & Retweeted! SunSeeker Oct 2019 #15
All 3. But, prioritized: 1. Putin's orders. 2. There's money in it for him somewhere. SuprstitionAintthWay Oct 2019 #16
We are a small step away Mr.Bill Oct 2019 #17
Very scary point you make. BlancheSplanchnik Oct 2019 #71
Let me throw in a fourth, very plausible possibility: beastie boy Oct 2019 #18
Ohhhh gawd.... Hekate Oct 2019 #21
c) His boss Vladimir Putin told him to Botany Oct 2019 #22
d. Trump is a wimp and afraid of Erdogan and Putin. Trump's father was a tough guy, Donnie is a Pepsidog Oct 2019 #23
The answer is all three. Then there's the fourth option, he is just pure evil. SummerSnow Oct 2019 #25
YES AND YES riversedge Oct 2019 #32
+1 dalton99a Oct 2019 #45
I vote for all three. blueinredohio Oct 2019 #26
or because war is profitable bucolic_frolic Oct 2019 #27
Laundered money from all 3 hits Trump Tower servers tonite. Captain Zero Oct 2019 #30
4th! Trump has no soul. riversedge Oct 2019 #31
(a) isn't debatable jmowreader Oct 2019 #34
Agreed FakeNoose Oct 2019 #35
Yes, just found this bdamomma Oct 2019 #70
This is frightening. Hopefully congress will have the good sense onetexan Oct 2019 #36
Erdogan told mf45 that he had dirt on Biden!!! Sancho Oct 2019 #37
None of which are mutually exclusive CabalPowered Oct 2019 #38
Trump is so easily out maneuvered and out played by these guys. patphil Oct 2019 #39
Oh, it's all three. dchill Oct 2019 #41
Ding! Ding! Ding! Winnah!!! Raster Oct 2019 #42
Option #4: The Kurds in southern Turkey and northern Syria are Shia. Efilroft Sul Oct 2019 #43
They will now side with Iran. roamer65 Oct 2019 #58
They'll have to for survival. Efilroft Sul Oct 2019 #62
to divert attention from impeachment Hamlette Oct 2019 #46
Khashoggi FreeWheatForever Oct 2019 #48
Even worse, the base is fine with any combination of the three. Lucky Luciano Oct 2019 #49
d) He's giving Republicans something to "oppose" him on. gulliver Oct 2019 #51
Except for one thing FakeNoose Oct 2019 #56
d) He is purposefully pissing off God and Republicans so bad Baked Potato Oct 2019 #52
#1 is the most likely. guillaumeb Oct 2019 #53
(d) All of the above Chicago1980 Oct 2019 #54
Another factor. moondust Oct 2019 #57
He left off "distraction from impeachment." NCLefty Oct 2019 #59
Threatening Congress ... emanymton69 Oct 2019 #60
My understanding... druidity33 Oct 2019 #61
All of the above... Nitram Oct 2019 #63
Yep. All three options are utterly horrifying. calimary Oct 2019 #64
I Believe That It's (d) All of the above. panfluteman Oct 2019 #65
And not mutually exclusive, be it noted. n/t malthaussen Oct 2019 #66
It Could Be All Three erpowers Oct 2019 #67
all three bdamomma Oct 2019 #68
In some alternate bizarro dimension, all three crimes are also impeachable... Blue_Tires Oct 2019 #72

citizen blues

(570 posts)
40. One more...
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 05:34 PM
Oct 2019

It's the price that Erdogan is demanding from Trump to sit on the audio of the Kashoggi murder, so Trumps doing it to appease his and Kushner's buddy over in Saudi, MBS.

Whiskeytide

(4,461 posts)
7. Not too stupid. He doesn't care. He is ...
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 03:46 PM
Oct 2019

... A wanna be dictator, and he’s catering to the world’s dictators so they’ll let him in the club. What happens to the Kurds is inconsequential as long as he scores points with his buddies.

He’s stupid in many, many ways. But this is NOT stupidity. This is his general asshole nature.

Mopar151

(9,989 posts)
47. Too true!!!!
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 08:10 PM
Oct 2019

If you was a real dictator, Donnie Boy, you'd hunt Kurds for sport! Show us you're a real man!

Rstrstx

(1,399 posts)
8. e) He's wagging the dog
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 03:47 PM
Oct 2019

Notice how the scandal stories have almost vanished from the news cycle today?

progressoid

(49,991 posts)
11. It's an avalanche of shit
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 03:58 PM
Oct 2019

You get knocked down by one turd story and just as you gain your balance another turd hits you in the face.

bdamomma

(63,875 posts)
69. the secret is that we must sift
Tue Oct 8, 2019, 11:36 AM
Oct 2019

through all the BS to realize that some things are BS and some things are not. Does that make sense???

Proud Liberal Dem

(24,414 posts)
13. Not that this story paints him in a good light either
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 04:06 PM
Oct 2019

If it was a distraction, it was a bad one. It's not going over particularly well with several Republicans.

Grokenstein

(5,725 posts)
20. He'll "pivot" and poof! Everything goes away (he thinks)
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 04:18 PM
Oct 2019

The "alternative" will still please no one but Erdogan, Lindsey Wormtongue will crawl back up in there, and Don-Don will have a fresh list of "disloyal" enemies.

Oh my god look at this crap he's even more out of his gourd than ever


Eyeball_Kid

(7,432 posts)
19. Nothing matters to Trumpy except his personal gain.
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 04:12 PM
Oct 2019

So it's an absolute certainty that Trumpy is getting something out of his "surrendering" to Turkey. He's "Transactional Trumpy." He's keeping his Turkey properties safe and he's expanding his land holdings. That's why he's letting Turkey slaughter the Kurds. He'd drop a nuke on anyone if it meant more money flowing into his bank accounts.

NightWatcher

(39,343 posts)
6. This is what happens when you're blackmail-able. Maybe it's the P Tape
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 03:42 PM
Oct 2019

He's the most dangerous thing to our National Security

FakeNoose

(32,645 posts)
28. Hey that's good - I didn't think of that
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 04:58 PM
Oct 2019

They already released audiotapes of his murder, I wonder if the Turkish police have something additional?

Midnightwalk

(3,131 posts)
9. Absolutely all 3
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 03:52 PM
Oct 2019

He’s not hard to understand if you put yourself in the right state if mind.

3d chess is a lousy metaphor. It’s more like 3d narcissistic corruption. Don’t ascribe any normal human emotion or thought to him and it’s easier to understand.

Even his grifts have grifts. It’s not that he’d be bored with only one corrupt angle in something. It’s that his mind only operates in narcissistic or corrupt ways. Once one grift is conceived his mind moves on to thinking of the next.

To stop would let himself be consumed by his fears and emptiness.

FirstLight

(13,360 posts)
10. DING!
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 03:57 PM
Oct 2019

...and the worst part is those who pay the price (people on the ground) which he has NO iota of awareness or care for.

We need to get him out of office before he starts setting the WH on fire...or Congress...literally or figuratively. His Comments on Schiff and Pelosi alone are dangerous. If we protested, you think he'd blink at "aggressive" ,measures...?

we are so screwn....

lagomorph777

(30,613 posts)
24. Meanwhile, Jimmy Carter is building houses for homeless people, despite
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 04:48 PM
Oct 2019

being in his 90s and with a ton of stitches on his face after suffering a bad fall.

That's how it's done, people.

FirstLight

(13,360 posts)
29. Exactly... Presidency didn't define him..
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 04:58 PM
Oct 2019

He used it as a piece of his path toward making a difference...

16. All 3. But, prioritized: 1. Putin's orders. 2. There's money in it for him somewhere.
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 04:08 PM
Oct 2019

3. He fantasizes about locking up his political opponents and reporters who won't parrot his proclamations. Erdogan is strong! powerful! tough! shoots "spies"! ...and Trump dreams of all that every night.

Mr.Bill

(24,303 posts)
17. We are a small step away
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 04:08 PM
Oct 2019

from him having members of Congress arrested. He has literally accused them of crimes carrying the death penalty, and he has an AG who will carry out the arrests.

beastie boy

(9,375 posts)
18. Let me throw in a fourth, very plausible possibility:
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 04:10 PM
Oct 2019

Trump sold the Kurds out because Erdogan promised him dirt on Biden.

Botany

(70,516 posts)
22. c) His boss Vladimir Putin told him to
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 04:36 PM
Oct 2019

Just like the Donbass region of the Ukraine the area that the Kurds were in Syria is
right in the way Vlad's Oil and or Gas pipelines.

In all my years I have never seen somebody as corrupt as Trump.


BTW a & b are good answers too.

Pepsidog

(6,254 posts)
23. d. Trump is a wimp and afraid of Erdogan and Putin. Trump's father was a tough guy, Donnie is a
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 04:36 PM
Oct 2019

wimpy guy, a bully with no substance, can’t back up His threats. Erdogan probably bulldozed him in the convo and wimpy little Donnie did what he was told.

FakeNoose

(32,645 posts)
35. Agreed
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 05:11 PM
Oct 2019

I think Paul Krugman's point is to make us realize that Chump stands a lot to gain (and nothing to lose) by screwing our allies.

onetexan

(13,043 posts)
36. This is frightening. Hopefully congress will have the good sense
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 05:15 PM
Oct 2019

To unite & put a stop to this horror.

patphil

(6,182 posts)
39. Trump is so easily out maneuvered and out played by these guys.
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 05:21 PM
Oct 2019

It'd be funny if it wasn't so damn serious.
What's it going to take for the Republicans to realize he is putting the nation at risk with his lame-brained foreign policy decisions.
This decision of his will kill thousands of people short term, and many more long term.
And, it will greatly diminish us in the eyes of both our allies and enemies.

Patrick Phillips

Efilroft Sul

(3,579 posts)
43. Option #4: The Kurds in southern Turkey and northern Syria are Shia.
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 06:10 PM
Oct 2019

MSB in Saudi Arabia (Sunni) might be calling the shots to Trump, too, seeing this as an opportunity to stick it to Iran.

Efilroft Sul

(3,579 posts)
62. They'll have to for survival.
Tue Oct 8, 2019, 08:28 AM
Oct 2019

Twenty years from now, our kids will be subjected to an act of Kurdish terrorism resulting from Trump's reckless disregard.

FreeWheatForever

(53 posts)
48. Khashoggi
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 08:22 PM
Oct 2019

He told Dump that he ALSO has tapes of the conversations about the Khashoggi murder. Duplicates of the ones Dump has locked away in the secret server. "Shall I release them or are you going to get out of the way now?"

gulliver

(13,186 posts)
51. d) He's giving Republicans something to "oppose" him on.
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 09:12 PM
Oct 2019

He'll then change his mind giving Republicans a "win."

Republicans will then say there's no need to toss out either them or Trump. Our system of checks and balances worked. Trump went too far and Republicans checked him on it.

IOW, it's Kabuki designed to raise the Republican Senate's cred for the election and for when they refuse to convict. Trump changing his mind at their behest means they aren't his lapdogs.

FakeNoose

(32,645 posts)
56. Except for one thing
Mon Oct 7, 2019, 10:41 PM
Oct 2019

... the Kurds will already be dead by then. Erdogan has just started bombing northern Syria tonight.



moondust

(19,993 posts)
57. Another factor.
Tue Oct 8, 2019, 01:07 AM
Oct 2019
Turkey Accepts Russian S-400 Missile System, Rankling U.S. And NATO
~
Turkey went ahead with the deal despite warnings from the U.S. that buying the Russian system could prompt sanctions.
~

From threats of sanctions on Turkey to inviting a potential genocide of Kurdish allies by Turkey in less than 3 months?

emanymton69

(124 posts)
60. Threatening Congress ...
Tue Oct 8, 2019, 07:23 AM
Oct 2019

*
Much is being said about why 'the chosen one' has made this move. But keep in mind, his handlers are threatening Congress, "You follow through on the impeachment, and before he goes down, el presidente stupido will tear up all treaties, alliances, allegiances, and agreements. He will burn down the USA."

Ema Nymton
-@;?.
*

druidity33

(6,446 posts)
61. My understanding...
Tue Oct 8, 2019, 07:42 AM
Oct 2019

is that we've been screwing over the Kurds for a very long time. They've never been our first consideration in the region... so inevitably they get the shit end of the stick. Probably because there is no financial incentive to help the Kurds, though having a strong secular government in the region would be a plus. What Trump is doing here is awful, but i can't help but think other Presidents might have done the same thing. Only quieter and over a longer period of time...



erpowers

(9,350 posts)
67. It Could Be All Three
Tue Oct 8, 2019, 11:32 AM
Oct 2019

Sadly, it could be all three. The situation discussed in this tweet is at least one reason there needs to be legislation passed that requires future presidents to sell all assets that could cause, or be seen as causing a conflict of interest.

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