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SuprstitionAintthWay

(386 posts)
Tue Oct 8, 2019, 05:05 PM Oct 2019

Anyone else think Putin seeing 2020 polling mightve got anxious, pushed Trump to expedite things ---

-- "things" being the multiple deliverables for Russia he is extorting out of his Agent Orange -- and thereby inadvertently precipitated this late summer and fall's even-worse-than-usual avalanche of criminal behavior from the Potus?

Putin surely wants Trump to get 2 terms, but already months ago the prospects for that -- even with more Russian hacking and help than last time, which is a given -- were starting to look more and more sketchy. Putin has to have recognized the strong and growing chance that at the end of January 2021 Russia will lose its greatest foreign subversion success ever: an already utterly corrupt man, on whom they have devastating amounts of kompromat, in the U.S. presidency.

The list of what Putin wants from Trump is long, but so far he's only gotten a little of it. If the ending date of this unique, amazing opportunity for Russia is coming up in early 2021, what else is the man holding the kompromat over Trump's head going to do other than say, Let's hurry it up on the deliverables you owe me, please? Possibly without the "please" part.

If that signal from Moscow arrived in April, May, or June it'd line up with the start of Trump's much-intensified interest in pressuring political "favors" out of Ukraine.

I think the biggest things Putin wants from Trump are:

1. The U.S. out of NATO. Trump has tried, but they both have to realize that that's not gonna happen. So no. 1 goes in the "failed" column.

2. Zelensky to "confer" with Putin and agree that in exchange for, oh, no violence (or maybe even just less violence?) in eastern Ukraime, Ukraine withdraws all its territorial claims to Crimea. The international sanctions were placed on Russia over Crimea. So if that, uh... "gets resolved to Ukraine's satisfaction," the argument will be that it's time to REMOVE THE SANCTIONS. Now, Ukraine is not of a mind to enter into such an agreement. What if, though, the supplier of the military aid that it is absolutely dependent on to survive encourages Ukraine to do that? This summer Trump urged Zelensky to talk with Putin, that he was sure the two of them could work something out. To me, that was the most ominous single thing I saw in the Trump-Zelenksy coms.

And

3. The U.S. out of Syria so Putin and Assad can get on unencumbered with what they want to do there. (The U.S. out of Afghanistan on Russia's border, too, of course. But that one's tougher to do; and someone restraining the Taliban is not a bad thing for Russia, either.)

There's quite a list of other things Putin wants out of Trump. Undermine the EU, re-admission in the G-8, "clear" Russia of 2016 election interference, "prove" Manafort innocent and free him so he won't flip on oligarchs, the FSB wants its U.S. spy residences back, and apparently Putin wanted the U.S out of the recon overflights multinational ageeement. Etc etc. But 2 and 3 above sufficiently illustrate the theory.

Which, to summarize, is:

- Putin worried about his Agent Orange not getting a 2nd term.
- So he giddy-up'ed his Oval Office stooge along a few months ago. "Let's get moving on some of these major deliverables, shall we?"
- Setting Trump off or pushing him along on multiple criminal missions we're now seeing uncovered.
- The Get Biden one being Trump's own fixation, but the boss must heartily agree with it. Dirty up the 2020 election... even more? Of course, yes! It was Russia that came up with ways to come after Hillary, so who knows, they may have even suggested some of the Get Biden schemes.
- What Putin didn't anticipate (but probably should have) is Trump blundering the jobs so badly he'd quickly get himself impeached.
- Which ironically could result in Putin's stooge having even less time in office to do great things for Russia.

Elaborate description, I know. But, it is all very involved. Trump and Putin are cornucopias of malice and criminality.

7 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Anyone else think Putin seeing 2020 polling mightve got anxious, pushed Trump to expedite things --- (Original Post) SuprstitionAintthWay Oct 2019 OP
Putin is thinking of primarying Trump; Putin says Trump a RINO. Xipe Totec Oct 2019 #1
He's not a red... He's an orange. dchill Oct 2019 #3
There does seem to be an air of desperation these past few days. GoCubsGo Oct 2019 #2
Rump is a traitor, no less. Thing is, that the Russians / Putin didn't count on, is literally how.. SWBTATTReg Oct 2019 #4
It would be so great if after Trump's no longer any use to them SuprstitionAintthWay Oct 2019 #5
I think Putin got a lot more than he ever anticipated. Xolodno Oct 2019 #6
Does tRump have a back channel to Putin for advice, since tRump doesn't listen to his own Cabinet? WyattKansas Oct 2019 #7

GoCubsGo

(32,086 posts)
2. There does seem to be an air of desperation these past few days.
Tue Oct 8, 2019, 05:11 PM
Oct 2019

Whether it's Trump or Putin or others, remains to be seen. But, yeah. It feels like there's a rush to get things done.

SWBTATTReg

(22,130 posts)
4. Rump is a traitor, no less. Thing is, that the Russians / Putin didn't count on, is literally how..
Tue Oct 8, 2019, 05:19 PM
Oct 2019

stupid trump really is. So Putin messed up...anyone who declares bankruptcies six times, it should have sent out a loud and clear message to Putin and cronies but it didn't, or it did, and they didn't anticipate just how idiotic rump is. I suspect that they will cut rump loose, by perhaps finally releasing the bedroom tapes of rump doing it.

5. It would be so great if after Trump's no longer any use to them
Tue Oct 8, 2019, 05:41 PM
Oct 2019

...they did just that. Dumped all of the kompromat out before the public for the world to marvel at and recoil from. Beat their chests, do an end zone dance and crow, Yep, he was our bitch the whole time!

Reasons why they probably won't, though:

1. It would force even Congressional Republicans to help reverse everything Trump did manage to do on Russia's orders.

2. It would send Trump straight to federal prison. Which, great, and too bad we don't shoot traitors and spies anymore. But Russia always has been and always wlll be heavily in the extortion business. Treating their biggest turncoat ever that way, helping land him in prison, would be bad for their future extortion-of-national-leaders business.

Xolodno

(6,395 posts)
6. I think Putin got a lot more than he ever anticipated.
Tue Oct 8, 2019, 05:55 PM
Oct 2019

His goal was to hamstring a President Clinton with domestic issues and less focused on foreign. Getting the doofus Trump probably surprised the shit out him.

And he's milked it for all its worth;

1. US is no longer globally looked upon as a reliable partner.

2. Our Military is having issues no thanks to his stupid border wall.

3. Ever since the USA has been in existence and before, agriculture was a major export. And despite other nations having the capability, we were so cemented with the infrastructure, the cost of entry to the market kept other nations out. Now, I doubt some of our agriculture will ever recover.

4. Minimizing our role in Syria, for good. I think Turkey's latest actions come due to the fact they know Trump is on his way out, so its now or never.

5. Ukraine was strong armed into the Russia deal by the EU (of course, I blame a lot of this shit on Bush who sent the snow ball down the hill)...the US helped in stopping fulfillment of it, but now...they don't have a choice.

6. Weakening of NATO (again, I think Bush got it going...but Trump certainly took it to new heights). Even getting Turkey, which has always been nothing more than a member out of convenience to even further disenfranchise itself (side note, I think Turkey is going to regret warmer relations with Russia later down the road, but that's a longer post).

7. Trump getting impeached furthers Putin's aims. The USA, the leader of the free world, forced to remove a highly corrupt leader is a very bad black eye on the world stage. End of story.

8. Russia's trade with the US consists primarily of vodka and caviar. They are not hurting for the lack of trade with the US. What hurts them are the European Sanctions, granted they pivoted east which took a lot of the brunt. But they still want better trade with Europe, getting most of the Ukraine issue (see #5) taken care of will allow the rest of Europe to ease sanctions (which they have been slowly and quietly doing already).

9. Ukraine can kiss Crimea goodbye. In a decade, some kind of deal will be made (forgiving Ukraine loans, etc.) and sovereignty of Crimea will be recognized by most of the world as Russia.

10. BRIC nations have expanded without the involvement of the USA. Which means our influence in their sphere's is stunted.

WyattKansas

(1,648 posts)
7. Does tRump have a back channel to Putin for advice, since tRump doesn't listen to his own Cabinet?
Tue Oct 8, 2019, 07:07 PM
Oct 2019

tRump has repeatedly claimed that the NSA, CIA, and FBI cannot be trusted or listened to for advice, and tRump has even been destroying them.

tRump pulls delusional deals out of his flubbery diaper wearing backside that even republicans and his own Cabinet know are the dumbest things to even bring up, let alone lock the U.S. into his imbecile deals.

tRumps playbook has been to destroy and weaken as much as possible with the United States to forfeit it's superpower status and empower it's adversaries.

***
Remember back when tRump was getting ready to move into the White House and immediately after?
Didn't Jared try to set up a secret way to communicate with Putin without it ever becoming known to anyone forever?

***

Is the United States sure that tRump is not taking direct marching orders from Putin, since his moves only benefit Putin and even pisses off republicans?

And remember, tRump makes sure to destroy everything to do with any conversations he has with Putin so that no record can be exposed. Who gives a shit if it can't stay secret forever, because the U.S. Government is damaged to the point that everything that was done before is no longer the rule... Much like what is happening now. Are you really sure it will all come out some day if the U.S. Government has been changed to a Supreme Presidency?

Actually, the questions I asked are legitimate concerns about tRump and his conduct.
How many think tRump wouldn't betray the United States for his own gain?

The reason Faux Newz hooked so many people and voters is because they always made claims in the form of a question without going into any details. If you don't tell someone what to believe, then simply make them want to know more on their own. The details that they refused to acknowledge before might suddenly become more interesting with all of the abrupt changes to the rule of law and dumb tRump ideas. So what if they screw up in reverse this time and it drags more republicans down with it... Leningrad Lindsey & Moscow Mitch with the rest of the comrades cast of players.

The rest of the real Press should be at least asking legitimate concerns about tRump, since he has been acting like a Rogue Fool to even the republicans. Just keep asking the questions about whether tRump is getting secret orders from Russia over and over. It beats tRump at his own game, because the details already on record will destroy him.

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