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NOT a defeatist thread, but what can be done in the face of obstruction? (Original Post) Stinky The Clown Oct 2019 OP
We have to win the election RandySF Oct 2019 #1
So we're banking the entire survival of America OliverQ Oct 2019 #4
Pretty much. And we'll see voter suppression like never before. Garrett78 Oct 2019 #6
a fool's errand. Grasswire2 Oct 2019 #7
Well, some of us will be preparing anyway. RandySF Oct 2019 #14
Most important - make sure the people know exactly what is going on. They are stonewalling! RDANGELO Oct 2019 #2
public opinion IS changing. Grasswire2 Oct 2019 #8
Articles of Impeachment elleng Oct 2019 #3
Looks like Trump's road map. Midnight Writer Oct 2019 #13
November 2020: "Trump claims voter fraud, refuses to concede; DOJ demands investigation" dalton99a Oct 2019 #5
Our greatest weapon of all has yet to be used. Grasswire2 Oct 2019 #9
Have you been to any anti-tRump protest marches? BigmanPigman Oct 2019 #12
Some thoughts Midnightwalk Oct 2019 #10
I have an idea. It's not legal and if I mention it I would be banned forever, but smirkymonkey Oct 2019 #11
Too many layers of security LeftInTX Oct 2019 #15
 

OliverQ

(3,363 posts)
4. So we're banking the entire survival of America
Wed Oct 9, 2019, 12:29 AM
Oct 2019

on an election that is already rigged in Trump's favor by Russia and the GOP?

Grasswire2

(13,571 posts)
7. a fool's errand.
Wed Oct 9, 2019, 01:32 AM
Oct 2019

Cue Comey, Wray, Coates, Mueller who all told us UNDER OATH that the election is rigged "as we sit here"


All T has to do is botch several state results, refer to SCOTUS for resolution, and VOILA. Fait accompli.

CANNOT WAIT FOR ELECTION. CANNOT RELY ON ELECTION.

RDANGELO

(3,435 posts)
2. Most important - make sure the people know exactly what is going on. They are stonewalling!
Wed Oct 9, 2019, 12:22 AM
Oct 2019

That's what is happening, and that is why the poll numbers for the inquiry and impeachment are going up. They need to make it clear that obstruction will be included in the articles of impeachment. He may not be removed from office, but this will affect the election.

Grasswire2

(13,571 posts)
8. public opinion IS changing.
Wed Oct 9, 2019, 01:34 AM
Oct 2019

Trump's numbers TODAY on approval of an inquiry are the same that Nixon's were MONTHS later during the Senate trial!!

MSNBC, tonight.

elleng

(131,159 posts)
3. Articles of Impeachment
Wed Oct 9, 2019, 12:22 AM
Oct 2019

The means used to implement this course of conduct or plan included one or more of the following:

making false or misleading statements to lawfully authorized investigative officers and employees of the United States;
withholding relevant and material evidence or information from lawfully authorized investigative officers and employees of the United States;
approving, condoning, acquiescing in, and counselling witnesses with respect to the giving of false or misleading statements to lawfully authorized investigative officers and employees of the United States and false or misleading testimony in duly instituted judicial and congressional proceedings;
interfering or endeavouring to interfere with the conduct of investigations by the Department of Justice of the United States, the Federal Bureau of Investigation, the office of Watergate Special Prosecution Force, and Congressional Committees;
approving, condoning, and acquiescing in, the surreptitious payment of substantial sums of money for the purpose of obtaining the silence or influencing the testimony of witnesses, potential witnesses or individuals who participated in such unlawful entry and other illegal activities;
endeavouring to misuse the Central Intelligence Agency, an agency of the United States;
disseminating information received from officers of the Department of Justice of the United States to subjects of investigations conducted by lawfully authorized investigative officers and employees of the United States, for the purpose of aiding and assisting such subjects in their attempts to avoid criminal liability;
making or causing to be made false or misleading public statements for the purpose of deceiving the people of the United States into believing that a thorough and complete investigation had been conducted with respect to allegations of misconduct on the part of personnel of the executive branch of the United States and personnel of the Committee for the Re-election of the President, and that there was no involvement of such personnel in such misconduct: or
endeavouring to cause prospective defendants, and individuals duly tried and convicted, to expect favoured treatment and consideration in return for their silence or false testimony, or rewarding individuals for their silence or false testimony.

https://watergate.info/impeachment/articles-of-impeachment

dalton99a

(81,599 posts)
5. November 2020: "Trump claims voter fraud, refuses to concede; DOJ demands investigation"
Wed Oct 9, 2019, 12:31 AM
Oct 2019

"Republicans decline to comment"

Grasswire2

(13,571 posts)
9. Our greatest weapon of all has yet to be used.
Wed Oct 9, 2019, 01:38 AM
Oct 2019

People in the street.

Look to the model of the Civil Rights Era. Just people gathered together in their good clothes, standing, walking, determined.

No papier mache whales, no drummers or stilt walkers or pink pussy hats.

Just people en masse. People of all kinds.

THAT will make a tyrant tremble.

We are the ones we have been waiting for. People in the street will provide cover for Dems in Congress.

BigmanPigman

(51,636 posts)
12. Have you been to any anti-tRump protest marches?
Wed Oct 9, 2019, 02:05 AM
Oct 2019

There have been tons where I live but I know that rural areas don't have many and when they do the turnout isn't very large. People give me an assortment of excuses for not attending over the past 3 years. Basically they use anything for an excuse and this is in a blue area too. The fucking moron's actions haven't had a large negative impact on their personal lives to make it a priority for a few hours every few months. Very discouraging. I am really pissed off since I finally have had my activist activities reduced due to my failing health. I knew it would happen but didn't know when. It sucks!

Midnightwalk

(3,131 posts)
10. Some thoughts
Wed Oct 9, 2019, 02:02 AM
Oct 2019

First of all stop treating the documents as necessary to impeachment. I think Pelosi or Schiff pointed out that obstruction is impeachable. We have enough evidence he has asked foreign countries for help in his campaign which is criminal and impeachable. Start saying that if there is anything exculpatory bring it forward now before it’s too late.

The only issue in the upcoming election is winning. I agree we are going to face interference. We can’t be defeatist. Treat it as having to win by a bigger margin. Nothing is lost by acting that way.

Also stop worrying about policy differences. Worry about not providing fodder for attack ads. For example I don’t think the answer to “they are going to take away your private insurance” is yes we are but that’s better for you. The right answer is no we’re not we are giving you more options and the republicans are the ones who have spent 10 years fight to take away the affordable care act.


We need to use talking points more effectively. Particularly from the candidates. I want all of them saying that getting foreigners to attack the Bidens is really an attack on all Americans. That Barr is obstructing justice and must stop actin as trump’s personal lawyer. Never took a marketing class but even I know repetition works. I don’t want their personal spin on it. I want who says it most convincingly

There are other tools but I think they would backfire. The house holds the power of the purse. We could shut down government but i think that work against us.

Just my 2 cents

 

smirkymonkey

(63,221 posts)
11. I have an idea. It's not legal and if I mention it I would be banned forever, but
Wed Oct 9, 2019, 02:04 AM
Oct 2019

it's probably the only thing that will work.

LeftInTX

(25,567 posts)
15. Too many layers of security
Wed Oct 9, 2019, 02:13 AM
Oct 2019

It's like wishing for a hurricane to hit Mar a Lago and not damage the rest of Palm Beach

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