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pnwmom

(108,990 posts)
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:18 PM Nov 2019

Could Trump cancel the 2020 election? Kurt Eichenwald says YES, under Emergency Powers.

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1190367840454533120.html

1. For those who don’t understand the fragility of American democracy in the hands of an unscrupulous autocrat - a scenario never imagined possible by the Founders under our Constituion - the cancellation of elections is quite simple and arguably legal. Which is why...

2...I fear for 2020. It all comes down to presidential emergency powers. They are poorly defined in the Constituion and under law. They are enormous and Trump clearly has been told that - remember how trump keeps saying he can do *anything* under the Constituion. Back when.... '

SNIP

13...so FOR GODS SAKE stop the nonsense of raging over whether there is a public option or Medicare for all as a primary voting issue, or whether someone is a “corporate democrat” or a “socialist”. None of that matters this time. We are IN this position because idiots...

14...did not recognize what was at stake in 2016, played silly games about “both sides are equally bad.” This is the same game that was played in the German federal elections in 1932, where people voting for the “can’t win” candidate gave enormous power to Hitler...

15...just three years later, hitler declared a national emergency, dissolved the legislature and called for new elections. And soon after that, the “protest candidate and his supporters were locked up.

Can’t happen here? I never thought it could. Then again, I never thought...

https://kurteichenwald.com/bio/

Bio
Kurt Eichenwald is the New York Times bestselling author of four previous nonfiction books. His second, The Informant, was made into a movie starring Matt Damon and directed by Steven Soderbergh. In addition to his distinguished work as a senior writer at Newsweek and a contributing editor at Vanity Fair, Eichenwald spent two decades as a senior writer at The New York Times, where he was a two-time finalist for the Pulitzer Prize. He is also a two-time winner of the George Polk Award, as well as the winner of the Payne Award for Ethics in Journalism and an Emmy Award nominee.
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Could Trump cancel the 2020 election? Kurt Eichenwald says YES, under Emergency Powers. (Original Post) pnwmom Nov 2019 OP
That's scary, but I don't think he could do it The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2019 #1
Don't give him any ideas. 2naSalit Nov 2019 #2
I don't think even with this S.C. that will happen still_one Nov 2019 #3
Stop normalizing this shit. No, he could NOT do that. nt coti Nov 2019 #4
Did you read the whole thread? nt pnwmom Nov 2019 #5
Yes, I read it three DU postings ago, yesterday. coti Nov 2019 #7
Hope your belief makes you feel better. I don't. triron Nov 2019 #44
The Alarming Scope of the President's Emergency Powers Celerity Nov 2019 #8
Thank you. Haggis for Breakfast Nov 2019 #10
yw! Celerity Nov 2019 #11
Back attcha, shipmate. Haggis for Breakfast Nov 2019 #12
Back in 2004 there was a lot of nonsense about W cancelling that election. PoindexterOglethorpe Nov 2019 #6
No poll showed W losing by a landslide Polybius Nov 2019 #16
Yeah, but the rumors were rife. PoindexterOglethorpe Nov 2019 #41
I have been talking about THIS for over a year. Haggis for Breakfast Nov 2019 #9
Cool. I like how you insist anyone who disagrees with you doesn't understand constitutional law unblock Nov 2019 #23
The Constitution can't be overridden by a federal statute StarfishSaver Nov 2019 #27
The Emergency Powers Act does *not* override the Constitution, for those of you The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2019 #39
We do NOT have "Emergency Powers Act," ..you put it quotes not me. AncientGeezer Nov 2019 #42
I can't see how it benefits us in any way for shitwits to argue he can do this struggle4progress Nov 2019 #13
It was also easily refuted in the last DU thread by Hermit-the-Prog by reference to Article II, coti Nov 2019 #17
It's a Trump pipe dream, intended to generate a reaction... TwilightZone Nov 2019 #22
Notably zero qualifications in law jberryhill Nov 2019 #14
Did any legal geniuses before 2017 predict Trump's successes in rolling over pnwmom Nov 2019 #18
Pretty much all of them. And all of us. TwilightZone Nov 2019 #21
That's a different issue StarfishSaver Nov 2019 #31
Legal geniuses? jberryhill Nov 2019 #35
He Better Not colsohlibgal Nov 2019 #15
LOL. This guy doesn't know what he's talking about, but apparently good click bait PSPS Nov 2019 #19
Nah, zero chance of that happening. TwilightZone Nov 2019 #20
That would be breaking the compact between the states...the Constitution. roamer65 Nov 2019 #24
THE SKY IS FALLING!!!!!!!! H2O Man Nov 2019 #25
One of last things I'm concerned about. Hoyt Nov 2019 #26
The fact that no one has ever done it makes it... dchill Nov 2019 #28
The only thing scary about this, Bayard Nov 2019 #29
This will happen Miguelito Loveless Nov 2019 #30
I think a bunch of the folks who are enabling him have a stake in it too. Jarqui Nov 2019 #32
Kurt must have found tinfoil on rollback at Walmart Jake Stern Nov 2019 #33
You're counting on no vacancies between now and Jan. 2021. pnwmom Nov 2019 #34
Eichenwald is spewing fear mongering nonsense Fiendish Thingy Nov 2019 #36
Eichenwald has done some very valuable reporting, but The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2019 #40
The first problem is that we have no Presidential election... TreasonousBastard Nov 2019 #37
If he did there would be an uprising. ... spin Nov 2019 #38
Eichenwald should spend time re-visiting the real world onenote Nov 2019 #43

The Velveteen Ocelot

(115,806 posts)
1. That's scary, but I don't think he could do it
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:20 PM
Nov 2019

because elections and the electoral college are controlled by individual states. He could try to disrupt things by declaring some kind of bogus emergency, but he can't stop states from holding elections or their electors from voting.

coti

(4,612 posts)
7. Yes, I read it three DU postings ago, yesterday.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:34 PM
Nov 2019

The dude is wrong, and even if an argument could be made that he might be able to postpone an election- which it can't...we had an election during WWII and THE CIVIL WAR, for criminy's sake- what you don't do is go around trying to tell everyone that it's PERFECTLY CONSTITUTIONAL for the wanna-be dictator to try to destroy our democracy.

Haggis for Breakfast

(6,831 posts)
12. Back attcha, shipmate.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:45 PM
Nov 2019

People do not understand the lengths this man will go to to hold onto power, cover his six and stay out of prison. He doesn't need anyone's approval to evoke the Emergency Powers Act. Combine that with what we already know about trumpie . . . . Worried yet ??

PoindexterOglethorpe

(25,873 posts)
6. Back in 2004 there was a lot of nonsense about W cancelling that election.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:33 PM
Nov 2019

Didn't happen then, and it won't happen now.

Polybius

(15,465 posts)
16. No poll showed W losing by a landslide
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:54 PM
Nov 2019

He likely though he would win on his own. Not saying he would have canceled the election though.

PoindexterOglethorpe

(25,873 posts)
41. Yeah, but the rumors were rife.
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 11:20 AM
Nov 2019

Keep in mind that even during the Civil War we had elections.

And any attempt to cancel elections would be quickly squashed by the courts, up to and including the Supreme Court.

Haggis for Breakfast

(6,831 posts)
9. I have been talking about THIS for over a year.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:37 PM
Nov 2019

For those of you unfamiliar with Constitutional law, YES, he absolutely CAN do this. Don't talk about something you don't understand. Under the "Emergency Powers Act," the president is granted sweeping, unilateral powers that would scare the fecal matter right out of your bum.

trumpie is desperate, and like a cornered animal, he is capable of doing anything to protect his ass. ANYTHING. As the impeachment hearings gear up and the evidence starts coming out, remember this. We are going to hear things that he does not want to see the light of day, and it is far worse than we know. Just wait. The time period between now and the election is going to be one bumpy ride, so strap in.

And, by all means, read the full Act, but not close to bedtime. It WILL keep you up all night.

unblock

(52,286 posts)
23. Cool. I like how you insist anyone who disagrees with you doesn't understand constitutional law
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 11:43 PM
Nov 2019

Federal law doesn't outweigh constitutional requirements.

Federal law can't take away an explicit power of the states in the constitution, namely, to determine the next president on a schedule and in a manner clearly laid out in the constitution.

If Donnie invokes any provision of federal law to cancel the presidential election, the it should be declared unconstitutional. Yes, it's true that the Supreme Court might side with Donnie, but that has nothing to do with constitutional law. Instead, that would be a clear and obvious misinterpretation for partisan reasons. I.e., that would be ignoring the Constituion.

 

StarfishSaver

(18,486 posts)
27. The Constitution can't be overridden by a federal statute
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 11:59 PM
Nov 2019

Congress can pass a law giving the Speaker of the House sweeping unilateral powers to appoint governors and mayors, but that doesn't mean the courts or anyone else must recognize them.

The Velveteen Ocelot

(115,806 posts)
39. The Emergency Powers Act does *not* override the Constitution, for those of you
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 09:34 AM
Nov 2019

who are *ahem* unfamiliar with Constitutional law. The Constitution provides that elections and the Electoral College are controlled by the states, and since the Constitution is controlling over federal statutes, the act doesn't vitiate elections. Trump can declare all the emergencies he wants but he can't prevent the states from holding elections.

 

AncientGeezer

(2,146 posts)
42. We do NOT have "Emergency Powers Act," ..you put it quotes not me.
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 12:13 PM
Nov 2019

That's a repealed British law.
We have the National Emergencies Act and it does not authorize any POTUS to violate the Constitution.

struggle4progress

(118,320 posts)
13. I can't see how it benefits us in any way for shitwits to argue he can do this
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:50 PM
Nov 2019

There's no provision in the constitution for it, and to my knowledge nobody has ever claimed to be able to do this

If some jackass tries it, I want people to say with one voice "No, you can't do that" -- I don't want them to wring their hands and worry whether it's allowed

In my humble opinion, anybody who says he can do this is objectively a troll for Trump and effectively an enemy of my country

coti

(4,612 posts)
17. It was also easily refuted in the last DU thread by Hermit-the-Prog by reference to Article II,
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:56 PM
Nov 2019

Section 1:

Article II
Section 1

The executive power shall be vested in a President of the United States of America. He shall hold his office during the term of four years, and, together with the Vice President, chosen for the same term, be elected, as follows:

Each state shall appoint, in such manner as the Legislature thereof may direct, a number of electors, equal to the whole number of Senators and Representatives to which the State may be entitled in the Congress: but no Senator or Representative, or person holding an office of trust or profit under the United States, shall be appointed an elector.

The Congress may determine the time of choosing the electors, and the day on which they shall give their votes; which day shall be the same throughout the United States.



Emphasis added.

The term is 4 years. Election is under the power of states' legislatures and Congress. The President has no say in it, emergency or not.

TwilightZone

(25,473 posts)
22. It's a Trump pipe dream, intended to generate a reaction...
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 11:30 PM
Nov 2019

which it invariably does.

I don't understand why "we" keep falling for it. It's utter nonsense.

 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
14. Notably zero qualifications in law
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:52 PM
Nov 2019

But I like how his lack of legal qualifications is highlighted in the OP.

The federal government doesn’t even conduct our elections, for starters.

And, no, an Emmy nomination doesn’t make it true.

pnwmom

(108,990 posts)
18. Did any legal geniuses before 2017 predict Trump's successes in rolling over
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 11:04 PM
Nov 2019

the Senate and much of the judiciary?

TwilightZone

(25,473 posts)
21. Pretty much all of them. And all of us.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 11:27 PM
Nov 2019

Everyone knew that the GOP Senate would just roll over and everyone *should* have known that Trump would remake the judiciary at the first opportunity. None of this is a surprise.

Many, many of us tried to warn Stein fans, both-siders, and other assorted misfits of the coming judicial catastrophe, starting with the Supreme Court, but many blew it off. And here we are.

 

StarfishSaver

(18,486 posts)
31. That's a different issue
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 12:05 AM
Nov 2019

The Supreme Court has not allowed Trump to violate the Constitution nor has it upheld any federal law that blatantly abrogates the power explicitly conferred upon the states by the Constitution.

This is tinfoil hat material that can be advanced with a straight face only by a commentator who lacks any basic knowledge of the law and the courts.

TwilightZone

(25,473 posts)
20. Nah, zero chance of that happening.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 11:23 PM
Nov 2019

There's more to an election cycle than the presidency. There is zero chance that the entire electoral system is going to grind to a halt if Trump just waves his tiny little hands.

It's a pipe dream of Trump's that's designed to generate a reaction, which it invariably does. It's much ado about nothing. Ignore it.

I agree with point #13. We should be focusing on what we will do for voters, similar to our approach in 2018, and focus on the 95%+ we have in common and not giving the policy differences all of the focus. And the "corporate Democrat" nonsense got old in 2016 (well before that, to be fair). It should have died there.

roamer65

(36,747 posts)
24. That would be breaking the compact between the states...the Constitution.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 11:51 PM
Nov 2019

If the compact is broken, then the states are free to hold elections on their own. I would expect separatist candidates would win in many of those states, especially CA and NY.

Bayard

(22,123 posts)
29. The only thing scary about this,
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 12:01 AM
Nov 2019

Is that tRump thinks the Constitution is something for him to blow his nose on. No respect. He's made it abundantly clear that he doesn't feel the need to abide by it.

Jarqui

(10,129 posts)
32. I think a bunch of the folks who are enabling him have a stake in it too.
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 12:12 AM
Nov 2019

If Trump goes down, they might as well.

Maybe that's why they haven't dumped Trump already.

Jake Stern

(3,145 posts)
33. Kurt must have found tinfoil on rollback at Walmart
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 12:56 AM
Nov 2019

Roberts is far too concerned about his legacy to ever side with this. The vote will be 5-4 against Trump.

Fiendish Thingy

(15,650 posts)
36. Eichenwald is spewing fear mongering nonsense
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 01:33 AM
Nov 2019

Not that Trump isn't crazy enough to try to cancel an election, but he's crazy to think Trump would get away with it.

If Trump even floated a trial balloon tweet about cancelling the election, you'd see support for impeachment and removal shoot up to 80-90%. If he actually issued an emergency order (based on what?), people would be in the streets, and his approval would be in single digits.

Remember, an emergency declaration can be overturned by congress.

There was a post elsewhere on DU about an analysis of Trump's base, and how his support from them is not invincible.

The Velveteen Ocelot

(115,806 posts)
40. Eichenwald has done some very valuable reporting, but
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 09:36 AM
Nov 2019

this just isn't accurate, and he doesn't seem to know much about the Constitution.

TreasonousBastard

(43,049 posts)
37. The first problem is that we have no Presidential election...
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 02:57 AM
Nov 2019

What we have is a meeting of the Electoral College, a creature created by the states and with no specific requirement to follow the general election.

The "Will of the People" is therefore technically irrelevant to who becomes President. So, even with an emergency greater then Pearl Harbor, no President will be able to install himself in office perpetually.

Yes, there are dictatos around the world who. have done this, but none with the protections or history we have

Hitler did manage to do this, but it was after a war that destroyed Germany, during a depression that hit it far worse than most other nations and the Soviets were knocking at the back door.

Hitler did, at the time, seem llke the least bad option.

spin

(17,493 posts)
38. If he did there would be an uprising. ...
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 05:37 AM
Nov 2019

Perhaps there are some good reasons to preserve the Second Amendment. It may come in handy one day.

onenote

(42,737 posts)
43. Eichenwald should spend time re-visiting the real world
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 12:15 PM
Nov 2019

instead of turning himself into an attention monger.

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