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Demovictory9

(32,457 posts)
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 01:38 AM Nov 2019

Toddler on vegan diet dies

https://m.sfgate.com/news/article/A-baby-kept-on-a-vegan-diet-died-His-parents-14855623.php

The parents of an 18-month-old boy who died in September from malnourishment have been arrested by Florida police on charges of manslaughter and child neglect.

On Sept. 27, around 4 a.m., Sheila O'Leary nursed the child briefly and, she told authorities, became worried when he began breathing shallowly, the Florida Fort Myers News-Press reported. Rather than call for help, though, the O'Learys went to sleep.

The paramedics who responded to a 911 call later that day pronounced the boy dead at the Cape Coral, Florida, home; he weighed just 17 pounds when he died, according to police reports, significantly under the average weight for a child his age, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

Sheila and Ryan O'Leary told investigators that the vegan family only eats fruit, vegetables and raw foods, such as mangoes, rambutans, bananas and avocados, according to the News-Press. The parents supplemented the toddler's diet with breast milk.

The child, who was home-birthed had never seen a doctor.



59 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Toddler on vegan diet dies (Original Post) Demovictory9 Nov 2019 OP
If he was nursing he was not on a vegan diet. alittlelark Nov 2019 #1
If the mother who is breast feeding is on a vegan diet, Paka Nov 2019 #19
Most vegans have healthy diets. 30+% of India is vegan. alittlelark Nov 2019 #34
India is not 30% vegan LeftInTX Nov 2019 #41
And there's a reason than non meat eaters in India are healthy. Paka Nov 2019 #44
Of course nursing is vegan. Codeine Nov 2019 #22
Is sheep/goat/cow milk vegan? JustABozoOnThisBus Nov 2019 #24
No, dairy from a cow or sheep wouldn't be vegan. Codeine Nov 2019 #29
I disagree although it's mostly a matter of definition ... mr_lebowski Nov 2019 #57
What the f*** are you even talking about? tymorial Nov 2019 #54
Nobody was 'harping' on it, it's just technically wrong ... mr_lebowski Nov 2019 #56
Let me preface this customerserviceguy Nov 2019 #59
How dreadful for that little boy. CaliforniaPeggy Nov 2019 #2
Vegan may not have played into this at all. But it makes a good headline. Joe941 Nov 2019 #3
Not a vegan diet at all, just a deranged diet. hunter Nov 2019 #16
Ding ding malaise Nov 2019 #20
Winner winner chicken dinner FreeState Nov 2019 #43
+1000 Kurt V. Nov 2019 #45
yup fishwax Nov 2019 #46
Sounds like they starved their child to death over 18 months. aikoaiko Nov 2019 #4
'had never seen a doctor.' elleng Nov 2019 #5
1.3 million Floridians are denied healthcare because of the rejection of Medicaid expansion. Doodley Nov 2019 #8
I thought it was Medicaid, not Medicare? Tipperary Nov 2019 #12
Sorry. I misspoke. I am one of those without healthcare, but in Georgia. After my wife of mother Doodley Nov 2019 #13
I have a friend in the same boat, that is the only Tipperary Nov 2019 #17
Toddler with blue pants dies. greyl Nov 2019 #6
People who refuse to put red pants on their child should IndyOp Nov 2019 #36
Maybe if Florida had Medicaid expansion, he would have been seen by a doctor long before Doodley Nov 2019 #7
Where was DCF before this little boy died? dewsgirl Nov 2019 #9
They don't use divination at DCF Mariana Nov 2019 #37
You are correct.😔 dewsgirl Nov 2019 #38
DU clickbait and "headline" stupidity? Check! flvegan Nov 2019 #10
yup Piasladic Nov 2019 #11
Veganism should be outlawed because of this. BlueTsunami2018 Nov 2019 #14
No, but forcing your beliefs on a child should be outlawed. Lizzie Boredom Nov 2019 #18
Adequate nutrition is easily provided Codeine Nov 2019 #23
Perhaps a young'un's transition to a Vegan diet ought to be a right-Of-passage thing Vogon_Glory Nov 2019 #21
The O'Learys have other children: dalton99a Nov 2019 #15
This message was self-deleted by its author elocs Nov 2019 #25
Toddler neglected and abused to death dies. Being vegan had nothing to do with this. nt UniteFightBack Nov 2019 #26
Infants under the age of 1 need fat for proper development. Kaleva Nov 2019 #27
Lots of healthy fats in a good vegan diet. Codeine Nov 2019 #30
from what I've read, fortified foods are needed for an infant vegan diet Kaleva Nov 2019 #31
avocados Demovictory9 Nov 2019 #32
I still read that fortified foods are needed for an infant on a vegan diet. Kaleva Nov 2019 #33
So other than infants, Mendocino Nov 2019 #48
I don't have a problem with it for any age group. Kaleva Nov 2019 #49
If a mother is vegan only, Mendocino Nov 2019 #50
From an ariticle Kaleva Nov 2019 #55
People can be deficient Mendocino Nov 2019 #58
It seems all their children appear malnourished Farmer-Rick Nov 2019 #28
The parents themselves are close to a normal weight per the article. LisaL Nov 2019 #35
Well yes the father is normal Farmer-Rick Nov 2019 #39
No legumes or grains means a serious lack of amino acids n/t TexasBushwhacker Nov 2019 #40
I kinda wonder if they only ate what they were growing??? LeftInTX Nov 2019 #42
My cousin's daughter is raising both her children as vegans dflprincess Nov 2019 #47
bottom line, reagrdless of vegan or meat DonCoquixote Nov 2019 #51
Vegan diets are dangerous if you don't know what you're doing. Lunabell Nov 2019 #52
There is too much woo in the world tymorial Nov 2019 #53

alittlelark

(18,890 posts)
1. If he was nursing he was not on a vegan diet.
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 01:48 AM
Nov 2019

The fact that the parents never took him to a doctor is a much more significant issue.

Paka

(2,760 posts)
19. If the mother who is breast feeding is on a vegan diet,
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 05:52 AM
Nov 2019

the beast feeding child is on a vegan diet. She cannot provide the proper nutrients that she doesn't have.

alittlelark

(18,890 posts)
34. Most vegans have healthy diets. 30+% of India is vegan.
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 03:14 PM
Nov 2019

There are those that can become unhealthy, but I imagine that if you are able to lactate you are not in ill health.

I am not a vegan, but I don't eat much meat.

LeftInTX

(25,380 posts)
41. India is not 30% vegan
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 06:11 PM
Nov 2019

Veganism was most common in the states of Gujarat (4.9%) and Maharashtra (4.0%).[127]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veganism

Dairy products and eggs are popular among non-meat consumers in India.

Paka

(2,760 posts)
44. And there's a reason than non meat eaters in India are healthy.
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 08:04 PM
Nov 2019

It's called single cell protein, which is prevalent due to lack of sanitary conditions, i.e. bacteria. Actually they are vegetarian, not vegan as they ingest large amounts of eggs and milk. I live in Southeast Asia and have spent extensive time in India.

JustABozoOnThisBus

(23,350 posts)
24. Is sheep/goat/cow milk vegan?
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 11:00 AM
Nov 2019

Coming from herbivores, it would seem to follow the same logic.

In the case of this child, I wonder if it nursed at all. The mother can eat what she wants, and there should still be protein in her milk.

Still, a sad case when a child dies from parental ignorance or neglect.

 

Codeine

(25,586 posts)
29. No, dairy from a cow or sheep wouldn't be vegan.
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 12:02 PM
Nov 2019

Sheep milk is for baby sheep, cow milk for baby cows, and people milk for baby people.

I really doubt the kid was nursing in reality, though; it sounds like a desperate attempt to cover up neglect after the fact. I know a handful of kids who are being raised vegan — most of them nursed but one didn’t (mom just wasn’t able to produce) and they’re all just fine. This poor little boy didn’t die because of veganism, he died because his parents are huge pieces of neglectful shit.

 

mr_lebowski

(33,643 posts)
57. I disagree although it's mostly a matter of definition ...
Mon Nov 25, 2019, 12:12 AM
Nov 2019

You're still consuming an animal (a mammal one, at that) protein ... it just happens to be the mammal 'homo sapiens'.

tymorial

(3,433 posts)
54. What the f*** are you even talking about?
Mon Nov 25, 2019, 12:04 AM
Nov 2019

Seriously are you going to harp on the fact that he was breastfeeding as not being "vegan?" Wgas. Seriously.

 

mr_lebowski

(33,643 posts)
56. Nobody was 'harping' on it, it's just technically wrong ...
Mon Nov 25, 2019, 12:09 AM
Nov 2019

Milk is not a vegan product. Even breast milk from your mother.

It's just not (my humble opinion, I suppose there's nothing 'official' on this).

Therefore, if the child had breast milk it was not on a vegan diet and the headline is incorrect.

Not a big deal, just a fact, IMHO. Still an animal protein.

Edited that this is basically my opinion.

customerserviceguy

(25,183 posts)
59. Let me preface this
Mon Nov 25, 2019, 09:07 AM
Nov 2019

by saying that I am not a vegan or vegetarian, but it seems that there is a difference between keeping an animal penned up to take its milk to feed humans, and a breastfeeding mother who has given her full consent to feeding her child that way.

CaliforniaPeggy

(149,640 posts)
2. How dreadful for that little boy.
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 01:50 AM
Nov 2019

His parents are idiots! Home births are OK, if they've been properly assessed by a nurse-midwife or other health professional.

And no pediatrician!

They need to be educated before any more children arrive in that household.

hunter

(38,317 posts)
16. Not a vegan diet at all, just a deranged diet.
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 03:47 AM
Nov 2019

If someone killed their kid with a bacon only diet what would the headline be?



aikoaiko

(34,172 posts)
4. Sounds like they starved their child to death over 18 months.
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 01:52 AM
Nov 2019


Terrible. Just terrible.


I wouldn't think this has anything to do with a vegan diet though. Especially if the mother was actually breast feeding.

Doodley

(9,094 posts)
8. 1.3 million Floridians are denied healthcare because of the rejection of Medicaid expansion.
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 02:00 AM
Nov 2019

Last edited Sun Nov 24, 2019, 03:12 AM - Edit history (1)

Doodley

(9,094 posts)
13. Sorry. I misspoke. I am one of those without healthcare, but in Georgia. After my wife of mother
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 03:18 AM
Nov 2019

-in-laws health cost, there's not enough for me.

IndyOp

(15,524 posts)
36. People who refuse to put red pants on their child should
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 04:49 PM
Nov 2019

have the child removed from their home.



Doodley

(9,094 posts)
7. Maybe if Florida had Medicaid expansion, he would have been seen by a doctor long before
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 01:58 AM
Nov 2019

Last edited Sun Nov 24, 2019, 03:12 AM - Edit history (1)

this fateful conclusion.

Mariana

(14,858 posts)
37. They don't use divination at DCF
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 04:57 PM
Nov 2019

to figure out which families have children who need help. Someone has to actually report a potential abuse or neglect situation to them, before they can investigate and take any action.

Piasladic

(1,160 posts)
11. yup
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 02:43 AM
Nov 2019

And I know on Monday, my co-worker will say something about vegans being child-murdering morons.

BlueTsunami2018

(3,492 posts)
14. Veganism should be outlawed because of this.
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 03:18 AM
Nov 2019

Or at least government regulated until a person can make an informed decision on what they like to eat.

On the tit, mandatory.

 

Lizzie Boredom

(16 posts)
18. No, but forcing your beliefs on a child should be outlawed.
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 05:20 AM
Nov 2019

If this child wanted to become vegan by his own volition he could've made that choice after he turned 18. Until then the parents should've provided him adequate nutrition from a balanced diet.

 

Codeine

(25,586 posts)
23. Adequate nutrition is easily provided
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 09:24 AM
Nov 2019

by a vegan diet. There are vegan children everywhere who are thriving.

Vogon_Glory

(9,118 posts)
21. Perhaps a young'un's transition to a Vegan diet ought to be a right-Of-passage thing
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 08:52 AM
Nov 2019

AFTER THEY REACH A CERTAIN AGE OF PHYSICAL DEVELOPMENT AND AFTER THEIR PHYSICIAN SAYS THEY’RE READY.

That was clearly NOT the case with this 18 month old.

dalton99a

(81,516 posts)
15. The O'Learys have other children:
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 03:30 AM
Nov 2019
Sheila O'Leary called 911 when she noticed her son was not breathing and was cold. Ryan O'Leary tried to resuscitate the child, but he was pronounced dead when Lee County Emergency Medics arrived at their Cape Coral home.

When a detective met with the O'Learys, they were standing near their minivan, which had three other children inside.

Two of those children are Ryan and Sheila O'Leary's biological children and were described as extremely small for their ages, 3 and 5, and were pale and yellowish in color, the statement says.

They both weighed under the third percentile for their ages, and one of those children also had blackened teeth indicating dental decay, which required surgery.

The third child in the minivan appeared to be the healthiest of the children, and is Sheila O'Leary's daughter with a different father who lives in Virginia.

According to the parental custody, the older child visits the biological father in Virginia every two months for a few weeks, which is likely explains her healthier appearance, police said in the statement.

In 2009, she was placed with the biological father in Virginia because she "failed to thrive" in Sheila O'Leary's care.

According to jail records, the parents appear close to a normal range for their heights and weights. Sheila O'Leary is 5 feet tall weighed 90 pounds at her booking; Ryan O'Leary is 6 feet and weighs 160 pounds.

https://www.news-press.com/story/news/crime/2019/11/12/malnourished-toddler-weighed-17-lbs-time-death-family-vegan-sheila-oleary-ryan-oleary-cape-coral/2577087001/

Response to Demovictory9 (Original post)

Kaleva

(36,312 posts)
27. Infants under the age of 1 need fat for proper development.
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 11:31 AM
Nov 2019

I do not know if a vegan diet for an infant does that.

 

Codeine

(25,586 posts)
30. Lots of healthy fats in a good vegan diet.
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 12:06 PM
Nov 2019

Veganism didn’t kill that little boy, bad parents killed him, and I hope they rot in a cell forever.

Kaleva

(36,312 posts)
31. from what I've read, fortified foods are needed for an infant vegan diet
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 12:18 PM
Nov 2019

I should have been more clear in my previous post. I'm not trying to say a vegan diet killed the toddler. Parental neglect killed him.

Kaleva

(36,312 posts)
49. I don't have a problem with it for any age group.
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 11:07 PM
Nov 2019

Again, going by what I've read on the subject, a vegan diet for an infant under the age of 1 is fine as long as some of the foods are fortified.

Mendocino

(7,495 posts)
50. If a mother is vegan only,
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 11:48 PM
Nov 2019

is there a insufficient nutritional levels for those babies from those mothers?

Kaleva

(36,312 posts)
55. From an ariticle
Mon Nov 25, 2019, 12:08 AM
Nov 2019

"Vegan diet and breast milk

Babies that grow up in vegan families also need breast milk for proper development.

You should supplement this milk with vitamin B12 so that your baby gets all the necessary nutrients. Depending on the type of food the family eats, the baby might also need iodine."

https://youaremom.com/babies/vegan-diet-breast-milk/

Mendocino

(7,495 posts)
58. People can be deficient
Mon Nov 25, 2019, 12:26 AM
Nov 2019

for adults and infants for B12 or iodine, without being vegan. Most animal feed (up to 90%) are fortified with B12. Iodine has recommended for decades (goiter belt). Micronutrients were once prevalent in "dirty" soil and impure water.

Farmer-Rick

(10,185 posts)
28. It seems all their children appear malnourished
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 11:55 AM
Nov 2019

Even the parents are too thin for their weight.

There is some kind of psychopathy about food with these parents. They need some serious intervention before their other children die.

LisaL

(44,973 posts)
35. The parents themselves are close to a normal weight per the article.
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 03:35 PM
Nov 2019

The father is within the normal range but mother is slightly below.

Farmer-Rick

(10,185 posts)
39. Well yes the father is normal
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 05:04 PM
Nov 2019

The mother is less than 18.5 BMI which is considered underweight, especially for a woman.

Something weird is going on about food. Who doesn't feed their children? It's instinctive to feed your babies.

LeftInTX

(25,380 posts)
42. I kinda wonder if they only ate what they were growing???
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 06:20 PM
Nov 2019
mangoes, rambutans, bananas and avocados


All of these would grow in a South Florida backyard. Who knows...a short article doesn't provide more details?? I think legumes might take a summer break in South Florida. Corn and amaranth (not a true grain) are one of the very few warm season grains. Wheat, oats and rye are cool season and rice is an aquatic.

dflprincess

(28,079 posts)
47. My cousin's daughter is raising both her children as vegans
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 10:38 PM
Nov 2019

though she and her husband know what they're doing. Their pediatrician says he's never seen healthier kids and neither one has ever had anything more serious than a cold (and she does vaccinate).

DonCoquixote

(13,616 posts)
51. bottom line, reagrdless of vegan or meat
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 11:51 PM
Nov 2019

You always have the kid see a DOCTOR, especialy as there are then thousand other things that could kill a child regardles of meat or veggies.

Lunabell

(6,089 posts)
52. Vegan diets are dangerous if you don't know what you're doing.
Mon Nov 25, 2019, 12:00 AM
Nov 2019

There can be a serious deficit of calories, iron, protein or vitamin b12. If you're a sane vegan and do it correctly, it is beneficial to both body and the planet.

I'm an omnivore who can't, no, won't be vegan due to my voracious appetite for bacon, cheeseburgers, steak, shrimp and other tasty little animals.

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