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Tennessee Hillbilly

(588 posts)
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 12:12 PM Nov 2019

Does Trump Know About Joe McCarthy's Fatal Mistake?

In the early 1950s, Senator Joe Mccarthy began making accusations of subversion and treason against many well-known U.S. individuals and organizations. The hearings he conducted destroyed many lives and careers. Very few were able to effectively stand up to him.

But in early 1954 McCarthy began attacking the U.S. Army, in particular accusing certain parts of it of being soft on communism.

This was a fatal mistake. The army was very well respected by the American public. Millions of Americans had served in it during two recent wars, and many had been able to significantly improve their subsequent lives through the training and educational opportunities they had received.

The army had the resources and the prestige to stand up to Mccarthy.

The Army–McCarthy hearings were televised nationally by the young ABC news network. The American public got its first view of McCarthy in action, and his reckless accusations, indignant bluster, and attempted bullying made a very bad impression. It quickly led to his downfall.

Trump has recently created a dispute with the U.S. military, trying to force the Navy to submit to his petty demands. I wonder if he knows about McCarthy's fatal mistake.

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Does Trump Know About Joe McCarthy's Fatal Mistake? (Original Post) Tennessee Hillbilly Nov 2019 OP
Yes what exactly will be the thing that will prove fatal for this cheating corrupt scumbag? nt UniteFightBack Nov 2019 #1
And this comes right on the heels of the Syria debacle. Mike 03 Nov 2019 #2
I read A Warning, I honestly don't think he would understand dewsgirl Nov 2019 #3
Agree with your post, but I hafta wash socks. n/t rzemanfl Nov 2019 #4
Absolutely leftieNanner Nov 2019 #5
As a rule, Trump is thoroughly ignorant. But, interestingly enough... Mister Ed Nov 2019 #23
Oh, he did leftieNanner Nov 2019 #24
The Key to this is "The American Public". dugog55 Nov 2019 #6
Already a Fascist State ruled by a limited group of Oligarchs. Lock him up. Nov 2019 #10
Back in the 50's on tv LiberalArkie Nov 2019 #13
Different Dynamic Eisenhower was president tirebiter Nov 2019 #7
Whole different culture. Wellstone ruled Nov 2019 #8
And McCarthy's Cohn also performed a similar slimy role with Trump. erronis Nov 2019 #11
Your last sentence says it all. Wellstone ruled Nov 2019 #15
Mixed. Igel Nov 2019 #21
Attacking the Power Centers in order to gain control is Wellstone ruled Nov 2019 #22
"Where's My Roy Cohn?" TheRickles Nov 2019 #9
Thanks for that reference. Now on my to-watch list. erronis Nov 2019 #12
Excellent movie! dhol82 Nov 2019 #18
Trump is a poorly educated buffoon. He knows nothing of history. He is led entirely by... NNadir Nov 2019 #14
But Trump's reckless accusations, indignant bluster, and attempted bullying nilram Nov 2019 #16
"Have You No Sense Of Decency, Sir?" Army- McCarthy Hearings, McCarthy appalachiablue Nov 2019 #17
In the 50's and 60's... Layzeebeaver Nov 2019 #19
No FauxNews/Right Wing echo chamber in the 50s..... Bromwell Nov 2019 #20

Mike 03

(16,616 posts)
2. And this comes right on the heels of the Syria debacle.
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 12:22 PM
Nov 2019

There must be a lot of raw anger in the Armed Forces now against this renegade president. Has it built up? Will it break open?

Important people resigned over Syria. Why won't they come forward?

dewsgirl

(14,961 posts)
3. I read A Warning, I honestly don't think he would understand
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 12:25 PM
Nov 2019

if someone tried their hardest to explain it to him. 😳

leftieNanner

(15,124 posts)
24. Oh, he did
Mon Nov 25, 2019, 01:21 PM
Nov 2019

He got rid of Jeff Sessions because he wanted "his Roy Cohn". Barr has stepped in to that role.

But that doesn't mean that he understands what brought McCarthy down. He only looks at things through his own entitled lens. What's in it for me? So he sees Barr (Cohn) doing his bidding and he's good with that. His very fallible ego will not allow him to see the down side of his choices - because there hasn't been a down side. Yet.

dugog55

(296 posts)
6. The Key to this is "The American Public".
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 01:07 PM
Nov 2019

That was back in the 50's when the vast majority of Americans had common sense and decency. Most were hard working, relatively plain people that did not tolerate fakes and liars. They just knew that was not the way to live or behave. We have quite the opposite in our modern society. People watch "Reality" tv shows by the millions and honestly believe that is real life. Plus you have the 30% that would follow Trump to the gates of hell if he so requested.

Anyone with half a brain knows Trump is a lying sociopath and a corrupt to the core individual. They do not need to be convinced of his failings. I really do not think that there are any revelations that will sway the public one way or the other.

The conservative media, and RW radio and tv will not allow Trump to look horribly bad for the public either. The media wants a two horse race for Senate seats and the Presidency to help boost ratings for profit.

Between the "Fairness Doctrine" being dismantled and the SCOTUS ruling on "Citizens United" our democracy is on very shaky ground. Only a major Progressive push in the next decade, first rescind the two previous rulings, and next to restore fair and honest voting nation wide, will there be a chance for this Country not to slowly transform into a Fascist State.

Lock him up.

(6,933 posts)
10. Already a Fascist State ruled by a limited group of Oligarchs.
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 02:04 PM
Nov 2019

They purchase lawmakers to do their bidding and pay very little taxes, when not none at all.

LiberalArkie

(15,719 posts)
13. Back in the 50's on tv
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 02:10 PM
Nov 2019

Sports consisted of Friday night fights.

Music was dance shows on Saturday.
also the symphony on Saturday od Friday night

also documentaries several times a week. I still remember one of the NBC White paper shows about migrant labor.

Television and radio was as some would say "more intellectual" than today.

I always liked as a kid "Mister Wizard" on Saturday mornings.

 

Wellstone ruled

(34,661 posts)
8. Whole different culture.
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 01:42 PM
Nov 2019

In 1954 everyone had a Army Vet in the family and when Tail Gunner,who btw,was one big fat ass fake,attacked the Army,the Nation woke up to what the hell he and Cohn were up to. And with Korea fresh in everyone's minds,not a very bright idea to say the least.

Fun fact,the Parades on November 11,1954 were almost and in some Towns larger than those of 1945. Living in Wisconsin,this was our way of telling Tail Gunner Joe he had to go. BTW,it was one hell of a nasty day with rain and snow,how do I remember,High School Marching Band and a two mile round trip Parade Route.

erronis

(15,302 posts)
11. And McCarthy's Cohn also performed a similar slimy role with Trump.
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 02:05 PM
Nov 2019

The rot spreads far.

Back then I knew of quite a few honorable Republicans but I know of none now. The rot has spread - encouraged by our enemies.

Perhaps the red-baiting of the 50's is equivalent to the projection/gas-lighting of today. A false narrative to allow the actual evil to worm its way in.

 

Wellstone ruled

(34,661 posts)
15. Your last sentence says it all.
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 02:21 PM
Nov 2019

Every Village of any size during the fifties,had a Weekly Newspaper. And the more Conservative Editors loved to run the Red Scare garbage Banners. And the Newspapers run by old time Editors whom knew of or saw through McCarthy and Cohn,refused to print the Red Scare crap but instead printed story after story about the sources of and the Politics behind it.

We call it Gas-lighting now,but it was the same with a different name.

Igel

(35,320 posts)
21. Mixed.
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 04:02 PM
Nov 2019

There are still parts of US society that highly value and respect the military.

There are also parts of US society that typically see soldiers and think of Vietnam and Iraqi war crimes. Some of those are only pro-military when it's a (D) president doing what they think is necessary, or when it serves to say something bad about an (R) president.

It's true that in '54 everybody still had a vet in their family, and a lot of war dead, and had just helped trounce the Nazis and the Japanese military state and that's not the case now. But it's more than just that. When you want power, you attack current power centers and weaken them. The difficult thing is that when you need them, you find them weakened.

 

Wellstone ruled

(34,661 posts)
22. Attacking the Power Centers in order to gain control is
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 04:13 PM
Nov 2019

what McCarthy,Cohn and Nixon were after. All about proving some stupid theory if you are against me,well you must be a Commie and there for we have the Countries Interest in mind and them Elites and Liberals are the Bad Guys.

TheRickles

(2,065 posts)
9. "Where's My Roy Cohn?"
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 02:02 PM
Nov 2019

I highly recommend this recent documentary about McCarthy's right hand man, one of the sleaziest men to ever grace our public stage. There was a whole gay sub-text to the Army-McCarthy hearings, as Cohn was trying to get special treatment by the Army for his (closeted gay) friend, and wouldn't take no for an answer.

Cohn's mentorship of Trump is described only briefly in the film, but that makes the parallels all the more powerful. By the end of the film, when Cohn can't acknowledge that he's dying of AIDS (he was closeted, too), you actually feel sorry for him.

NNadir

(33,525 posts)
14. Trump is a poorly educated buffoon. He knows nothing of history. He is led entirely by...
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 02:11 PM
Nov 2019

...the Dunning Kruger effect, his genitals, his racism and his greed.

There is nothing else to him.

nilram

(2,888 posts)
16. But Trump's reckless accusations, indignant bluster, and attempted bullying
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 02:45 PM
Nov 2019

are already on full display. Apparently, it makes a bad impression only to some.

appalachiablue

(41,144 posts)
17. "Have You No Sense Of Decency, Sir?" Army- McCarthy Hearings, McCarthy
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 02:53 PM
Nov 2019


Joseph Welch, chief counsel for the U.S. Army, tires of Sen. Joseph McCarthy's (R-WI) accusations and innuendo regarding Communist infiltration at the televised Army-McCarthy Hearings in WDC, June 9, 1954. Roy Cohn, attorney for McCarthy shakes his head. 'McCarthyism,' Communist 'Red Scare,' Cold War, 'Lavender Scare,' Homosexual Blackmail, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_McCarthy

Army- McCarthy Hearings, Senate hearing derived from Senator Joseph McCarthy's hunt for communists in US, April–June, 1954, Washington DC. Participants, The two sides of the hearing: US Army (accusing their opponents of blackmail), Joseph McCarthy, Roy Cohn and G. David Schine (accusing the Army of communism). Result: End of the McCarthy Era. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Army%E2%80%93McCarthy_hearings

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1017559546

Layzeebeaver

(1,624 posts)
19. In the 50's and 60's...
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 03:00 PM
Nov 2019

We also had social media. But it consisted of a newspaper and the local diner.

Today, McCarthy would have had a field day. His “best before date” would have been extended for years.

Today’s media environment requires extended civics engagement by individual citizens. And civics is the one thing that has been eliminated from our social agenda.

It will take several generations to recover from this assuming we have sufficiently progressive leadership both nationally and in the key states.

Bromwell

(123 posts)
20. No FauxNews/Right Wing echo chamber in the 50s.....
Sun Nov 24, 2019, 03:01 PM
Nov 2019

I think when all us sane and decent humans analyze this stuff....we can't compare the past with today's climate. It can be used to possibly predict how things will turn out but back then, we didn't have traitors among our elected officials on the right. I mean a BUNCH of traitors.

Plus 35-40% of the voters are being lied to 24/7. I don't know...I am really starting to worry tRump will get away with everything...if nobody enforces the laws or the norms b/c one traitorous side has a majority in the Senate and simply won't do it...we're in trouble.

America needs to take the country back by voting EVERY SINGLE ONE OUT.

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