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Who tipped off Lev and Igor (Original Post) malaise Jan 2020 OP
And where did all the money come from? randr Jan 2020 #1
Morning Joe (1/16/20), "And Russia paid for all of this." Botany Jan 2020 #5
There was an OP here from Mrs Overall malaise Jan 2020 #7
And where did all the money go? They were indicted for illegal campaign contributions. Midnight Writer Jan 2020 #66
Excellent question. Kingofalldems Jan 2020 #2
The answer is Adam Schiff jberryhill Jan 2020 #14
"The answer is ..." or "my guess it might be ..." marble falls Jan 2020 #21
I don't understand your question jberryhill Jan 2020 #24
You're guessing. The subpoena itself was motivation enough. marble falls Jan 2020 #26
That's exactly what I'm saying jberryhill Jan 2020 #31
Why are you blaming this all on Adam Schiff? yardwork Jan 2020 #34
HIS COMMITTEE SUBPOENAED THEM jberryhill Jan 2020 #35
It was a joke. yardwork Jan 2020 #44
This exchange should be in the DU lounge. eom guillaumeb Jan 2020 #77
My mistake. I got the impression you were saying Schiff got on the phone ... marble falls Jan 2020 #40
That's what the prosecutor who indicted Parnas said jberryhill Jan 2020 #52
Its the times we live in. There appears to be subtext even where's there none .. marble falls Jan 2020 #58
II'm with you 100%. The process actually works, and there aren't as many conspiracies as people ... marble falls Jan 2020 #70
Didn't they meet with Giuliani at the Trump Hotel that afternoon? kentuck Jan 2020 #3
Yes malaise Jan 2020 #8
I remember that as well NewJeffCT Jan 2020 #18
But but but Schiff was responsible!! Kingofalldems Jan 2020 #22
They were subpoenaed, bought the tickets, met with Giuliani, and went to the airport jberryhill Jan 2020 #25
So there was no phone call from one of the henchman ? Kingofalldems Jan 2020 #27
Between getting the supoenas and buying the tickets? jberryhill Jan 2020 #33
Yes, I am saying they were ordered to leave via phone. Kingofalldems Jan 2020 #36
Okay, when was this call made and by whom jberryhill Jan 2020 #37
Not really a good try there. Kingofalldems Jan 2020 #41
But prosecutors, and now the Democrats, have his phone, text and email records jberryhill Jan 2020 #54
William Barr. Kingofalldems Jan 2020 #55
Okay, so William Barr tipped off Parnas jberryhill Jan 2020 #56
You seem to be trying too hard. Kingofalldems Jan 2020 #57
Just chiming in to support you jberry. Some of the reactions here are wierd. lagomorph777 Jan 2020 #49
And Giuliani had a ticket to Vienna for the next day? kentuck Jan 2020 #38
That's correct jberryhill Jan 2020 #45
The indictment was announced the following day, Oct. 10. The Velveteen Ocelot Jan 2020 #39
Right.. ugh jberryhill Jan 2020 #47
The logical answer is that Rudy told them to get the tickets, THEN Eyeball_Kid Jan 2020 #79
There's no indication they were permanently leaving jberryhill Jan 2020 #4
Excellent points -nt Piasladic Jan 2020 #9
I had thought they bought 1 way tickets NewJeffCT Jan 2020 #19
Yes, and? jberryhill Jan 2020 #29
They had one way tickets. That's what was reported. rainy Jan 2020 #32
Yeah, and? jberryhill Jan 2020 #63
Lev was getting money from this guy... Zoonart Jan 2020 #6
Great question ! duforsure Jan 2020 #10
Probably 2naSalit Jan 2020 #11
Where did you hear that? jberryhill Jan 2020 #12
Okay so they bought the tickets at some other time 2naSalit Jan 2020 #15
I think these people are trying to make it more complicated than it is Bev54 Jan 2020 #60
Adam Schiff jberryhill Jan 2020 #13
Maybe not. Everyone else was ignoring subpoenas. Why wouldn't... brush Jan 2020 #59
Okay, I'll give you a piece of advice jberryhill Jan 2020 #61
Why not ignore the subpoena like everyone else? brush Jan 2020 #64
Because they are not White House employees jberryhill Jan 2020 #67
Yet trump okayed Dowd to be his attorney. Maybe you missed... brush Jan 2020 #68
That's been known for a while jberryhill Jan 2020 #69
What's obvious is they didn't have to respond to the subpoena. brush Jan 2020 #71
Lol jberryhill Jan 2020 #72
Everyone has an opinion, and no one wants to admit the obvious. brush Jan 2020 #73
I hope this is brought up at the impeachment trial. world wide wally Jan 2020 #16
Kick and rec big time for the gatekeepers. Kingofalldems Jan 2020 #17
Rudy Colludy. onecaliberal Jan 2020 #20
Lev knows plenty. Kingofalldems Jan 2020 #23
+1 Barr visits Epstein; Epstein dies shortly after under shady circumstances. lagomorph777 Jan 2020 #51
Rudy G still has connections in the F.B.I. Iliyah Jan 2020 #28
Did Schiff tell them to leave the country? Hardly. Kingofalldems Jan 2020 #30
Nobody said that jberryhill Jan 2020 #42
So you have evidence they were not told to leave? Kingofalldems Jan 2020 #46
I have evidence of what motivated them to leave jberryhill Jan 2020 #48
This thread and your valiant attempt at reason sums up my decision GulfCoast66 Jan 2020 #83
Tickets had to be purchased with a credit card. MontanaMama Jan 2020 #43
Older Lev article eyeofnewt Jan 2020 #50
Thanks for this malaise Jan 2020 #53
Vlad sarcasmo Jan 2020 #62
Busting them at the airport was good for law enforcement. Baked Potato Jan 2020 #65
Rudy. milestogo Jan 2020 #74
Mine too malaise Jan 2020 #78
It will come out eventually in his book NCProgressive Jan 2020 #75
They could have easily hidden on top of an old church as gargoyles SummerSnow Jan 2020 #76
Did they pay for the tickets with cash? The Wizard Jan 2020 #80
The Great Obstructor Kid Berwyn Jan 2020 #81
This should be an OP malaise Jan 2020 #82
Think of the Future! Kid Berwyn Jan 2020 #84
He only enlists to slaughter animals malaise Jan 2020 #85

Botany

(70,601 posts)
5. Morning Joe (1/16/20), "And Russia paid for all of this."
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 09:46 AM
Jan 2020

Bottom Line.

Dmytro Firtash was paying for all this Ukraine "rat fucking" of our democracy and he was
using Russian money which must have been approved of by Vlad Putin.

Midnight Writer

(21,816 posts)
66. And where did all the money go? They were indicted for illegal campaign contributions.
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 02:31 PM
Jan 2020

I would like to see a list of who got the money, in addition to who it came from.

Not seeing the type of investigative reporting on this that I would expect.

 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
14. The answer is Adam Schiff
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 10:26 AM
Jan 2020
https://nypost.com/2019/11/01/giuliani-crony-igor-fruman-was-arrested-getting-on-vienna-bound-flight/

“What is clear is he was subpoenaed by Congress, and indicated he was not going to comply,” prosecutor Nicholas Roos told Manhattan federal Judge Paul Oetken.

On Oct. 8, a day after getting the subpoena, Fruman bought an $8,000 one-way ticket, and was arrested “on the jet bridge”
on Oct. 9, said Roos — who added that the observant Jew had oddly booked a flight for Yom Kippur, one of the holiest days on the Jewish calendar.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/10/us/politics/lev-parnas-igor-fruman-arrested-giuliani.html

Mr. Parnas and Mr. Fruman are witnesses in their impeachment inquiry, and Mr. Parnas had been scheduled to be questioned Thursday by investigators.

marble falls

(57,343 posts)
21. "The answer is ..." or "my guess it might be ..."
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 10:34 AM
Jan 2020

You don't think the subpoena itself might have made him leave?

 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
24. I don't understand your question
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 10:43 AM
Jan 2020

Yes, I think the subpoena was the reason they wanted to leave.

He got the subpoena, bought the ticket, met with Giuliani, and was arrested on the jetway to the plane.

Malaise's question is "who tipped them off?"

They weren't "tipped off". They were leaving the country to avoid testifying pursuant to having just been subpoenaed to do so.
 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
31. That's exactly what I'm saying
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 10:51 AM
Jan 2020

I think you must be deeply misunderstanding what I am saying here.

I believe the subpoena was what motivated them to get out of Dodge and lay low someplace. Yes, the subpoena was motivation enough. That's correct.

They got the subpoenas and bought the tickets. Seems pretty obvious to me.
 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
35. HIS COMMITTEE SUBPOENAED THEM
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 10:55 AM
Jan 2020

Good God, people, how hard is this to understand....

The timeline is:

1. ADAM SCHIFF SUBPOENAED THEM

2. THEY BOUGHT TICKETS TO LEAVE THE COUNTRY

3. THEY MET WITH GIULIANI

4. THEY WERE ARRESTED AT THE AIRPORT

The OP asks "who tipped them off?"

They were "tipped off" by the fact that ADAM SCHIFF SUBPOENAED THEM TO TESTIFY.

It's not actually being "tipped off", but Malaise asked for the name of the person who notified them that they were of interest in the investigation.

That name would be the chair of the committee that subpoenaed them.

So, now you are asking me why I credit Adam Schiff for issuing the subpoenas that motivated them to attempt to leave?

WTF?

marble falls

(57,343 posts)
40. My mistake. I got the impression you were saying Schiff got on the phone ...
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 10:59 AM
Jan 2020

to Lev to tell get the hell out of Dodge to set him up for an arrest for fleeing.

Sorry. We agree once again. The Subpoena from Congress was all the motivation he needed.

You're too clever for us to follow you sometimes.

 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
52. That's what the prosecutor who indicted Parnas said
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 11:13 AM
Jan 2020

But there are, of course, those who are going to take issue with the actual person responsible for pursuing Parnas criminally, and instead decide to believe in something more imaginative.

marble falls

(57,343 posts)
58. Its the times we live in. There appears to be subtext even where's there none ..
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 11:45 AM
Jan 2020

sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

marble falls

(57,343 posts)
70. II'm with you 100%. The process actually works, and there aren't as many conspiracies as people ...
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 05:03 PM
Jan 2020

like to think there are.

I can't believe I tried to read more into your comment than was there.

 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
25. They were subpoenaed, bought the tickets, met with Giuliani, and went to the airport
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 10:44 AM
Jan 2020

Why is that hard to understand?

They bought the tickets right after they got the subpoenas.

Then they met with Giuliani - after they already had their tickets.

Then they were arrested later that day.
 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
33. Between getting the supoenas and buying the tickets?
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 10:53 AM
Jan 2020

Go ahead and post a link to whatever it is you are referring to between the time they were subpoenaed (Oct 8) and bought the tickets (Oct 9).

They already had the tickets when they met with Giuliani.

So it appears the most likely reason why they were leaving was because they had just received the subpoenas and were going to avoid appearing.

Kingofalldems

(38,492 posts)
36. Yes, I am saying they were ordered to leave via phone.
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 10:57 AM
Jan 2020

Or text. Or email. Who ordered that? Certainly not Schiff.

 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
54. But prosecutors, and now the Democrats, have his phone, text and email records
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 11:37 AM
Jan 2020

The prosecutor who is responsible for having Parnas arrested says that Parnas was trying to leave because he didn't want to testify in response to the subpoena. I've quoted him in this thread from the NYT article.

So, either the prosecutor who arrested Parnas is lying, because you know better, or for some reason there are phone, text and email records they don't have, despite seizing all of his devices when he was arrested.

I'm more interested to know who, in your opinion, got Parnas' own prosecutor to lie about it, than who tipped off Parnas.
 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
56. Okay, so William Barr tipped off Parnas
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 11:42 AM
Jan 2020

And then persuaded the prosecutor who indicted Parnas to lie about why he was leaving the country.

As with Epstein, wouldn't it have been easier to not indict him in the first place?

Kingofalldems

(38,492 posts)
57. You seem to be trying too hard.
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 11:44 AM
Jan 2020

Barr is in charge of the investigation as he was also in charge of keeping Jeff Epstein safe.

Got it now?

lagomorph777

(30,613 posts)
49. Just chiming in to support you jberry. Some of the reactions here are wierd.
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 11:05 AM
Jan 2020

People seem to be attributing all kinds of malice to your simple observations.

 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
45. That's correct
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 11:02 AM
Jan 2020

Why is it difficult to grasp that Parnas and Fruman got the subpoenas on the 8th, bought tickets on the 9th, met with Giuliani on the 10th to plan their next meetup in Vienna, and then were arrested as they were leaving.

Did you expect them to travel together or something?

The Velveteen Ocelot

(115,888 posts)
39. The indictment was announced the following day, Oct. 10.
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 10:59 AM
Jan 2020
https://www.justice.gov/usao-sdny/pr/lev-parnas-and-igor-fruman-charged-conspiring-violate-straw-and-foreign-donor-bans Were they dodging the subpoena or the indictment? Presumably they didn't know about the indictment until the 10th. I think the reason the question of whether they were tipped off came up because of the timing. They were arrested on the 9th and the announcement of the indictment was the next day, so were they just trying to avoid having to testify or were they tipped off that they'd been indicted?
 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
47. Right.. ugh
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 11:03 AM
Jan 2020

they were arrested late on the 9th, the day after they were subpoenaed. The news reports are dated the next day.

Eyeball_Kid

(7,434 posts)
79. The logical answer is that Rudy told them to get the tickets, THEN
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 08:23 PM
Jan 2020

met with them. Both events happening on the same time line aren't incompatible.

 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
4. There's no indication they were permanently leaving
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 09:45 AM
Jan 2020

Why buy round trip tickets if you are planning to come back on a private plane or don't have a fixed return date.

Do you suppose Lev was leaving his wife, too?

And if he was leaving his wife, don't you think she figured that out? Then why did she cooperate in hiding the extra million dollars from Firtash?
 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
29. Yes, and?
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 10:49 AM
Jan 2020

All that means is that they weren't planning on coming back from Vienna, or had no immediate plans to come back.

They were frequently provided transportation on private jets. If they had a ride back already, they wouldn't buy round trip tickets.

Giuliani was ALSO planning to go to Vienna as well, and cancelled that trip.

But, if they were going to Vienna, and then going from Vienna to Ukraine, and planning to come back from some other place, why would they buy round trip tickets?
 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
63. Yeah, and?
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 01:29 PM
Jan 2020

How does that mean they were permanently leaving the country?

Hell, I left the country on a one way ticket just two years ago. Came back on one too. Since my trip started in Paris and ended in Geneva, there was no reason to buy a round trip ticket.

Zoonart

(11,886 posts)
6. Lev was getting money from this guy...
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 09:46 AM
Jan 2020
A billionaire Republican donor helped to bankroll travel by Lev Parnas, the indicted associate of Rudy Giuliani, as Parnas maneuvered to press the Ukrainian government to announce investigations that would help President Donald Trump politically.


https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2020/01/billionaire-oil-magnate-funded-travel-by-lev-parnas/

Don't know who tipped him off though.

duforsure

(11,885 posts)
10. Great question !
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 09:59 AM
Jan 2020

Was Putin's intel feeding them information, and that they had been discovered? Does trump have moles installed in our intel agencies for Putin ?

 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
12. Where did you hear that?
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 10:22 AM
Jan 2020

It's interesting to see how misinformation filters through DU.

https://nypost.com/2019/11/01/giuliani-crony-igor-fruman-was-arrested-getting-on-vienna-bound-flight/

“What is clear is he was subpoenaed by Congress, and indicated he was not going to comply,” prosecutor Nicholas Roos told Manhattan federal Judge Paul Oetken.

On Oct. 8, a day after getting the subpoena, Fruman bought an $8,000 one-way ticket, and was arrested “on the jet bridge” on Oct. 9
, said Roos — who added that the observant Jew had oddly booked a flight for Yom Kippur, one of the holiest days on the Jewish calendar.


https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/10/us/politics/lev-parnas-igor-fruman-arrested-giuliani.html

Mr. Parnas and Mr. Fruman are witnesses in their impeachment inquiry, and Mr. Parnas had been scheduled to be questioned Thursday by investigators.

It's one thing to simply be ignorant of the timeline, such as the OP who is apparently unaware that there was no "tip off" - Parnas had been subpoenaed to testify to Congress, met with Giuliani, and decided to leave.

Of course, the investigation into the campaign finance charges long pre-dates that.

However, I would be interested to know where you heard that the tickets were purchased hours after meeting with Giuliani, since you apparently know something that nobody in the press does.

2naSalit

(86,824 posts)
15. Okay so they bought the tickets at some other time
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 10:27 AM
Jan 2020

my error. I was going on the point, heard many times on RMS for one source, that the two had lunch less than 24 hrs before going to the airport where they were arrested.

My speculation was off, time for more coffee I guess.

Bev54

(10,074 posts)
60. I think these people are trying to make it more complicated than it is
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 12:51 PM
Jan 2020

They do not understand Occam's Razor.

 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
13. Adam Schiff
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 10:24 AM
Jan 2020

They had been subpoenaed to testify to Congress the day before they decided to leave.

So, that's the name you are looking for.

brush

(53,922 posts)
59. Maybe not. Everyone else was ignoring subpoenas. Why wouldn't...
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 12:03 PM
Jan 2020

Last edited Fri Jan 17, 2020, 12:50 PM - Edit history (1)

they? Maybe being tipped off they were being indicted was what scared them.

That could very easily have come through a meeting, a text or
phone call on the 8th or 9th. Ghouliani is the obvious one to
suspect, but it could be someone else.

 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
61. Okay, I'll give you a piece of advice
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 01:25 PM
Jan 2020

If you think you are the subject of a sealed indictment, don't buy a ticket to leave the country on a commercial airline.

Just out of curiosity, have you flown abroad in, say, the last couple of years?

All that information you have to provide up front to get a boarding pass for a foreign flight is required for a couple of reasons. One of those reasons is to be able to prevent people from leaving who shouldn't be.

If you want to get out of the country because you think you might get nabbed, take a private flight or walk into Tijuana.

You know who else knows it would be a stupid thing to do? Giuliani.
 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
67. Because they are not White House employees
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 03:02 PM
Jan 2020

Perhaps you missed the part where Trump said he didn't know who they are.

The White House did not object to their subpoenas.

So, I thought it was pretty obvious why they weren't claiming executive privilege excused them from appearing.

That would be pretty stupid, don't you think? For them to say "the White House won't let us" when the White House is saying they don't even know these guys?

I thought that was pretty obvious.

brush

(53,922 posts)
68. Yet trump okayed Dowd to be his attorney. Maybe you missed...
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 03:10 PM
Jan 2020

that coming out on Rachel last night?

 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
69. That's been known for a while
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 04:41 PM
Jan 2020

That has been known ever since Dowd wrote that screwy letter to the Committee in comic sans.

So what.

Neither the White House nor these lunkheads claimed any excuse for not responding to the subpoenas.

Instead, they decided to leave the country.

Your observation has nothing to do with the fact that they did not object to the subpoenas, and Dowd did not communicate an objection to them either.

If they were going to challenge the subpoenas, they wouldn't have been getting on an airplane to Vienna. That's pretty fucking obvious.

 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
72. Lol
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 07:13 PM
Jan 2020

They are not in the same category as ANY of the people on whose behalf the White House has formally objected to subpoenas.

They did not object to the subpoenas.

Their lawyer did not object to the subpoenas.

The White House did not object to the subpoenas.

They got the subpoenas, they bought plane tickets, they met with Rudy, and they were going to get out of Dodge.

If anyone wanted to kill them, then Vienna or even Ukraine, would be as good a place as any.

Oh, oh, I know, the Trump Cabal is so inept, they can't manage to kill someone without getting them into a federal lockup first. Yah, go with that.

lagomorph777

(30,613 posts)
51. +1 Barr visits Epstein; Epstein dies shortly after under shady circumstances.
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 11:09 AM
Jan 2020

By putting it all out there, Lev makes it pointless to try to silence him with Polonium or something.

 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
42. Nobody said that
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 10:59 AM
Jan 2020

Adam Schiff's committe subpoenaed them. Then, they bought tickets to leave, because they did not want to testify. Then they met with Giuliani. Then, they were arrested at the airport.

Nobody said Schiff told them to leave.

It's obvious what motivated them to leave - i.e. the subpoenas that Schiff's committee issued to them, just before they bought the tickets.
 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
48. I have evidence of what motivated them to leave
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 11:04 AM
Jan 2020

The subpoenas they had just received were an obvious and strong motivation for them to leave.

That is evidence of their motivation to leave.

GulfCoast66

(11,949 posts)
83. This thread and your valiant attempt at reason sums up my decision
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 10:27 PM
Jan 2020

To take a month break from DU which I suspect will continue till we have a nominee.

Between the Trump is going down now/going to suspend the election/ declare Marshall(SP) law and other Jade Helm level CT stuff I needed a mental break. Plus the fishing is about to get good.

Hope to read your stuff here in a few months.

Thanks for hanging in.

MontanaMama

(23,344 posts)
43. Tickets had to be purchased with a credit card.
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 11:00 AM
Jan 2020

Could the airline be issued a subpoena to get that info?

eyeofnewt

(146 posts)
50. Older Lev article
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 11:08 AM
Jan 2020

This is an interview with Parnas from back in the day, October 2019, when Trump knew him 😆
His lawyer stated he had a one way ticket because a round trip would be $20k...ha
Also, he showed up with a bodyguard to this interview, which is telling in itself. If he thought he should worry about safety then .... haha

https://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/why-lev-parnas-worked-for-rudy-giuliani-and-donald-trump

Baked Potato

(7,733 posts)
65. Busting them at the airport was good for law enforcement.
Fri Jan 17, 2020, 01:41 PM
Jan 2020

There was a safe, controlled environment to operate in.

malaise

(269,211 posts)
85. He only enlists to slaughter animals
Sat Jan 18, 2020, 10:57 AM
Jan 2020

The entire family will be disgraced pariahs along before 2024

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Who tipped off Lev and Ig...