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Fla Dem

(23,711 posts)
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 01:41 PM Jan 2020

It's time to call Moscow Mitch's bluff. Biden(s) have to agree to testify.

If McConnell won't allow Democratic witnesses unless they can get one or both of the Bidens, then I say Joe Biden has to step up to the plate and tell McConnell he would be more than happy to testify.

It would show a man of courage and conviction, a man who did no wrong, a man who puts country before politics. If HRC could testify for 11 hours in the Benghazi grilling, surely Joe Biden and even his son can testify and put this whole Burisma fallacy to rest.

I know it has nothing to do with the charges against Trump, but strategically it will put McConnell and Trump in a very precarious position. If Biden agrees to be a witness, then Trump and McConnell have to let the Dems have their witnesses and that's the last thing Trump and the Rethugs want. If they still deny the Dems their witnesses, then that pretty much is admitting Trump's guilt. And the Biden's wouldn't even have to testify.

So call Mitch's bluff. Joe has to show courage and a sense of duty. After all he wants to be President. That would go a long way toward him clinching a lot of undecided voters.

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It's time to call Moscow Mitch's bluff. Biden(s) have to agree to testify. (Original Post) Fla Dem Jan 2020 OP
But - he wasn't involved in the JustAnotherGen Jan 2020 #1
Equivalent to examining the sexual history of a rape victim. no_hypocrisy Jan 2020 #2
Hadn't thought of that but . . . JustAnotherGen Jan 2020 #11
The problem is EndlessWire Jan 2020 #21
If people who were not involved can be called mainstreetonce Jan 2020 #3
Sound good to me. Fla Dem Jan 2020 #20
I agree. n/t EndlessWire Jan 2020 #22
Basically agree. I don't think GOPers will call them because it will give both Bidens a chance to Hoyt Jan 2020 #4
Not only no but fuck no. n/t 5X Jan 2020 #5
Thanks for your detailed response! nt USALiberal Jan 2020 #12
I found it quite compelling lame54 Jan 2020 #14
No further details needed. (This post is devoid of any further textual entries.) 5X Jan 2020 #16
Certainly enlightening. Fla Dem Jan 2020 #19
hell...I'll testify.. stillcool Jan 2020 #6
They know as well as we do that the Bidens have nothing to say Takket Jan 2020 #7
I am not worried about Hunter testifying Gothmog Jan 2020 #8
This message was self-deleted by its author Gothmog Jan 2020 #8
Forcing Hunter Biden to testify will backfire Gothmog Jan 2020 #10
Thanks for this, I hadn't seen it. Fla Dem Jan 2020 #23
The long-awaited defense of Hunter Biden Gothmog Jan 2020 #24
Super bad idea... lame54 Jan 2020 #13
What narrative? That the Bidens agree to testify? Fla Dem Jan 2020 #18
Uh, no. Skidmore Jan 2020 #15
if one or both Bidens testified, wouldn't that take the air out of the GOP's sails? renate Jan 2020 #17

JustAnotherGen

(31,834 posts)
1. But - he wasn't involved in the
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 01:45 PM
Jan 2020

Phone Call (that uh - perfect one), requests to the newly elected President of Ukraine, quid pro quo . . .

The only way I would be okay with this is if MF45 gets its orange ass in the Senate to testify. And Biden shouldn't unless Moscow Mitch makes it happen.

EndlessWire

(6,550 posts)
21. The problem is
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 05:58 PM
Jan 2020

that we are trying to impeach one of the most powerful men in the world. If Biden doesn't know anything about something, then he can say so. If they want to examine some distasteful event from his VP, let someone object. We need our own witnesses in there.

I think it is entirely possible that Russia has hacked Ukraine and planted evidence. That would be the only calculation to make. Perhaps Ukraine has completed its investigation and would like to testify against Trump?

mainstreetonce

(4,178 posts)
3. If people who were not involved can be called
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 01:50 PM
Jan 2020

Then after the Bidens ,all Trump's children and Jared should be called.

 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
4. Basically agree. I don't think GOPers will call them because it will give both Bidens a chance to
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 01:51 PM
Jan 2020

set voters straight, including saying -- on national media -- that they did nothing wrong and nothing even close to what the trump's have done to profit off the presidency.

In any event, I think the Bidens need to appear if called. Will be quite disappointed if the Bidens refuse.

stillcool

(32,626 posts)
6. hell...I'll testify..
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 03:11 PM
Jan 2020

there is so much in my past that can be put on display. Make it all about me, instead of Trump who?

Takket

(21,599 posts)
7. They know as well as we do that the Bidens have nothing to say
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 03:43 PM
Jan 2020

And what drumpf did was illegal regardless of any “corruption” that may have taken place.

Gothmog

(145,424 posts)
8. I am not worried about Hunter testifying
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 04:06 PM
Jan 2020

Here are some facts including that the fact that Hunter was a biglaw firm that was advising this company https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2020/1/5/1907833/-The-long-awaited-defense-of-Hunter-Biden

Following Paradigm, Biden continued working as a lobbyist for several years and was appointed to the board of Amtrak by President George W. Bush. He had also been the vice chairman of the National Railroad Passenger Corporation. He then founded a private equity firm, Rosemont Seneca Partners, in 2009, which later partnered with the Chinese government to form yet another equity firm, called BHR, where he held an unpaid board position. Trump likes to argue that Biden took “tons of money” from China, but again—this position was unpaid.
He ended his lobbying career and left the Amtrak board as his father became vice president, then started another consulting firm in 2008, as noted by Newsweek.

In 2008, Hunter Biden also founded Seneca Global Advisors, a consulting firm that helps companies expand into global markets. His earnings from Rosemont Seneca and Seneca Global Advisors are not publicly available.

Biden then joined the law firm Boies Schiller Flexner, which features superstar lawyer David Boies as its primary partner and chairman. While at Boies Schiller, Biden was involved in advising Burisma, which was a client at the time being personally handled by Biden, who was advising them on corporate reform, according to Hunter Biden’s lawyer, George Mesires:

In April 2014, Hunter was asked to join the board of Burisma, the largest independent natural gas producer in Ukraine. At the time, Hunter was of counsel with Boies Schiller Flexner LLP [fn 1] (“Boies Schiller”), a major U.S. law firm, and was advising Burisma on its corporate reform initiatives, an important aspect of fueling Burisma’s international growth and diversity. Vibrant energy production, particularly natural gas, was central to Ukraine’s independence and to stemming the tide of Vladimir Putin’s attack on the principles of a democratic Europe.

To further its goals of independence, Burisma sought to adopt standards and practices traditionally employed by Western companies. At Hunter’s urging, Boies Schiller engaged Nardello & Co., a leading global investigative firm, to assess, among other things, Burisma’s corporate structure and governance practices. Burisma agreed to pay the legal expenses of Boies Schiller to support Hunter in developing corporate reform initiatives.

Because of Burisma’s stated commitment to corporate best practices, it was able to attract well-qualified board members, including the former president of Poland, Aleksander Kwasniewski, a leading advocate of democratic principles in the region. President Kwasniewski, familiar with Hunter’s work on behalf of Burisma, recommended that Hunter join the board.

Again, this view is consistent that Biden ultimately joined by the board for Burisma Holdings to help it with its efforts regarding “corporate governance,” as noted by Wikipedia.

In the aftermath of the 2014 Ukrainian revolution, Mykola Zlochevsky faced a money laundering investigation,[33][34] and his company Burisma Holdings, the largest natural gas producer in Ukraine,[14] assembled a "high-profile international board" in response.[35][34] Biden, then an attorney with Boies Schiller Flexner, was hired to help Burisma with corporate governance best practices, and a consulting firm in which Biden is a partner was also retained by Burisma.[36][37][38] Chris Heinz, John Kerry's stepson, opposed his partners Devon Archer and Hunter Biden joining the board in 2014 due to the reputational risk.[34] Among those who joined the board of directors in April 2014 were Biden, Archer and former Polish president Aleksander Kwaśniewski.[39] Biden served on the board of Burisma until his term expired in April 2019,[40] receiving compensation of up to $50,000 per month in some months.[37][41]

So it appears that Biden was placed on the board of Burisma as part of its effort to “clean up” its practices after the allegations of money laundering by Zlochevsky, which had previously occurred in 2012. Biden took a pay cut to be on the board compared to what he’d earned as an investment banker, although it may have been an upgrade compared to what he likely earned at Boies Schiller. Biden had nothing to do with the investigation of Zlochevsky and was never investigated himself.

Being on the board of AMTRACK and being with the biglaw firm that was advising this company are sufficient qualifications for Hunter to be appointed on the board.

Response to Fla Dem (Original post)

Gothmog

(145,424 posts)
10. Forcing Hunter Biden to testify will backfire
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 04:08 PM
Jan 2020



But as CNN’s Michael Smerconish noted on Saturday, this strategy might not even work.
Enjoy progressive journalism? Help fight right-wing disinformation by supporting Raw Story. Click to learn more.

“This is my theory, pure speculation,” said Smerconish. “I have this vision on the Democratic side of the aisle, some who know Hunter Biden, are sort of rubbing their hands and saying, yeah, yeah, just keep begging for this guy.”

“The Republicans have created such a caricature of him. In other words, they set the bar so low,” continued Smerconish. “And then all of a sudden, Hunter Biden comes in. He’s a handsome guy. He’s articulate. He’s smart. He went to Georgetown, he went to Yale Law. He puts sentences together that are not indicative of having committed anything illicit, other than earning money, perhaps because of the name with which he was bestowed. And Americans say, ‘Oh my god, is that all there is?’ It could completely backfire. It’s one of the intangibles. I don’t know, but I’m paying attention.”

Gothmog

(145,424 posts)
24. The long-awaited defense of Hunter Biden
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 11:12 PM
Jan 2020

Here are some facts including that the fact that Hunter was a biglaw firm that was advising this company https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2020/1/5/1907833/-The-long-awaited-defense-of-Hunter-Biden

Following Paradigm, Biden continued working as a lobbyist for several years and was appointed to the board of Amtrak by President George W. Bush. He had also been the vice chairman of the National Railroad Passenger Corporation. He then founded a private equity firm, Rosemont Seneca Partners, in 2009, which later partnered with the Chinese government to form yet another equity firm, called BHR, where he held an unpaid board position. Trump likes to argue that Biden took “tons of money” from China, but again—this position was unpaid.
He ended his lobbying career and left the Amtrak board as his father became vice president, then started another consulting firm in 2008, as noted by Newsweek.

In 2008, Hunter Biden also founded Seneca Global Advisors, a consulting firm that helps companies expand into global markets. His earnings from Rosemont Seneca and Seneca Global Advisors are not publicly available.

Biden then joined the law firm Boies Schiller Flexner, which features superstar lawyer David Boies as its primary partner and chairman. While at Boies Schiller, Biden was involved in advising Burisma, which was a client at the time being personally handled by Biden, who was advising them on corporate reform, according to Hunter Biden’s lawyer, George Mesires:

In April 2014, Hunter was asked to join the board of Burisma, the largest independent natural gas producer in Ukraine. At the time, Hunter was of counsel with Boies Schiller Flexner LLP [fn 1] (“Boies Schiller”), a major U.S. law firm, and was advising Burisma on its corporate reform initiatives, an important aspect of fueling Burisma’s international growth and diversity. Vibrant energy production, particularly natural gas, was central to Ukraine’s independence and to stemming the tide of Vladimir Putin’s attack on the principles of a democratic Europe.

To further its goals of independence, Burisma sought to adopt standards and practices traditionally employed by Western companies. At Hunter’s urging, Boies Schiller engaged Nardello & Co., a leading global investigative firm, to assess, among other things, Burisma’s corporate structure and governance practices. Burisma agreed to pay the legal expenses of Boies Schiller to support Hunter in developing corporate reform initiatives.

Because of Burisma’s stated commitment to corporate best practices, it was able to attract well-qualified board members, including the former president of Poland, Aleksander Kwasniewski, a leading advocate of democratic principles in the region. President Kwasniewski, familiar with Hunter’s work on behalf of Burisma, recommended that Hunter join the board.

Again, this view is consistent that Biden ultimately joined by the board for Burisma Holdings to help it with its efforts regarding “corporate governance,” as noted by Wikipedia.

In the aftermath of the 2014 Ukrainian revolution, Mykola Zlochevsky faced a money laundering investigation,[33][34] and his company Burisma Holdings, the largest natural gas producer in Ukraine,[14] assembled a "high-profile international board" in response.[35][34] Biden, then an attorney with Boies Schiller Flexner, was hired to help Burisma with corporate governance best practices, and a consulting firm in which Biden is a partner was also retained by Burisma.[36][37][38] Chris Heinz, John Kerry's stepson, opposed his partners Devon Archer and Hunter Biden joining the board in 2014 due to the reputational risk.[34] Among those who joined the board of directors in April 2014 were Biden, Archer and former Polish president Aleksander Kwaśniewski.[39] Biden served on the board of Burisma until his term expired in April 2019,[40] receiving compensation of up to $50,000 per month in some months.[37][41]

So it appears that Biden was placed on the board of Burisma as part of its effort to “clean up” its practices after the allegations of money laundering by Zlochevsky, which had previously occurred in 2012. Biden took a pay cut to be on the board compared to what he’d earned as an investment banker, although it may have been an upgrade compared to what he likely earned at Boies Schiller. Biden had nothing to do with the investigation of Zlochevsky and was never investigated himself.

Being on the board of AMTRACK and being with the biglaw firm that was advising this company are sufficient qualifications for Hunter to be appointed on the board.

Fla Dem

(23,711 posts)
18. What narrative? That the Bidens agree to testify?
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 05:55 PM
Jan 2020

It's never going to get that far because McConnell and Trump don't want any witnesses. It's exactly the game Trump is playing, saying he doesn't mind having witnesses because he knows McConnell will never let there be witnesses. It's all a bluff. So let's call their bluff.

How many narratives can there be? They've already pushed about a 100 of them. One more isn't going to make a difference.

Skidmore

(37,364 posts)
15. Uh, no.
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 05:22 PM
Jan 2020

Neither one of the Bidens were on that phone call extorting a foreign leader and compromising our national security for personal gain.

renate

(13,776 posts)
17. if one or both Bidens testified, wouldn't that take the air out of the GOP's sails?
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 05:42 PM
Jan 2020

They did nothing wrong. So... testify, clear their names, and call the GOP's bluff so the truth can come out.

I don't see the harm in giving Mitch a "win" if it ends up biting him in the ass.

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