We just need to GOTV.

we know that. Also that voting in greater numbers than they've been suppressing/altering has managed to foil their evil plots in the past.

I do disagree with the implications of "just." The battle for power is huge, international, and existential. As more have become aware of danger, RW politicians increasingly every election do everything they can to overset the will of the people, including even allying with enemies of our nation to defeat us.

They forked their shit show over to him. Once he stabilized things, they blamed him for the things he couldn't fix (or did fix but were forgotten due to our short attention spans) and incrementally took things back until we found ourselves in our current debacle.

Just a theory.

n/t

They tend to steal elections that are close - Florida in 2000 and Ohio in 2004. There was so much evidence in both elections of election rigging, yet little was done to resolve the problems.

Their log range program for complete dominance will have succeeded.

As we speak the GOP Senate is taking the next major step.

Keeping the puppet Trump in place to finish the job of election dominance.

See my complete reply above https://www.democraticunderground.com/100212912129#post33

"Voter fraud" is a distraction from the real problem of election fraud.

We need paper ballots -- verifiable by voter; guardable (verifiable by public); countable by public.

Electronic voting fails on all three criteria:

1. With electronic voting, the voter cannot verify his or her ballot -- can only verify that something about the device changed

2. With electronic voting, the public cannot verify that a voter has cast 0 or many ballots -- can only verify the voter interacted with device

3. With electronic voting, the public cannot participate in, and cannot verify, the count.

No amount of pre-election or post-election testing of electronic devices cures any of the above 3 critical defects. People cannot see electrons moving in wires and chips, and those are the only physical tokens involved in electronic voting.

Reliance on a paper trail as backup to electronics is likewise defective because it conditions the public to accept the abstract, unverifiable electronic report instead of the physical, verifiable paper ballot.

TELEVISED HAND COUNTED PAPER BALLOTS - NOW!

Ok, If each ballot took 60 seconds to count (and that would be fast) to count them all would take 23.7 years. Yeah, that would work....

Your math doesn't work. The idea that would be counted only nationally is ludicrous.

There are 117,000 polling places in the U.S. So you would have to set up 117,000 TV facilities for the vote count. Yeah, they will be easy to do.... Cute, indeed...

https://www.eac.gov/documents/2017/11/15/eavs-deep-dive-poll-workers-and-polling-places

Hand the same big stack of ballots to 10 different people and ask them to count by hand. I suspect that you would get 10 different answers.

They showed their weakness in rigging elections with Obama.

But we have to come out everywhere and anywhere. We have to vote as if our democracy depends on it. It does.

When I have posted similar posts in the past I always get the "how do you explain Obama's win or 2018 house results."

Two points.
1. How does bringing a snowball into Senate to disprove global warming"
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2015/02/26/jim-inhofes-snowball-has-disproven-climate-change-once-and-for-all/

2. For a little world history, during WW II the British broke the German enigma code.
The codebreakers quickly realized that they could NOT use it every day because the Germans would realize that their code had been broken and would change it.

Or in today's world with a few word changes you have.... The GOP quickly realized that they could NOT use it to win every election because the American voters would realize that their election system had been broken.

The GOP would then tweak it to continue the subterfuge until all other "i" are dotted [utlimate voter suppression] and the "t" are crossed [stacking the judicial system to their complete advantage]. The job tRump, MoscowMitch, and the GOP Congress is now doing.

Then during WW II the allies implement ULTRA In today's language they added plausibility deniability [ULTRA] to mislead the Germans.
See https://www.quora.com/Why-didnt-the-German-Japanese-realize-their-code-was-broken-by-the-Allies for a complete explanation

See The Imitation Game (2014)

1. Obama won because enough non-blacks created voting coalitions to help him. There were enough suburban whites who joined to vote for him.

2. Obama won DESPITE voter suppression tactics like (a) closing polls down early in black precincts, (b) voter ID laws, (c) intimidation tactics, etc.

3. STUDENTS and other young people were motivated to vote, so the numbers were large enough to overcome #2 above.

4. Many rural voters, unmotivated by Romney, stayed home.

Just because they may or may not have been hacked voting machines in all parts of the country, or voter suppression tactics weren't widespread does not mean that there was no impact. All you need is a little treatment in important areas of the country (GA, OH, WI, PA, AZ). All you need is a little treatment of voter suppression tactics and faulty machines in a few precincts. It doesn't have to be widespread to be overtly damaging.

Yes, please GOTV, but don't be naive. Target the places that we know will be the targets of voter suppression tactics--in states and communities where it will matter most to suppress votes.

Then they hand off the shit economy to the Democrat. I've been through this cycle more than I care to mention.

When the Repukes are in charge of everything....

This, NOTHING can be done about it.

Kind of a twisted view of “democracy,” ‘eh?

Means the Secretary of State controls the voting apparatus. And quite frankly, If Democrats mess up and don't concentrate in states where voter suppression tactics are the greatest, then we deserve to lose. But Reps don't control everything. At least, not yet.

We need to FIGHT. Even if Trump "wins," through suppression and cheating, we should at least be fighting for the U.S. Senate where there is a strong chance for us to win seats even in Red states.

WE DO NOT HAVE THE LUXURY TO BE DEMORALIZED OR GIVE UP. We need to fight as if our very lives and the lives of our loved ones depend on it.

Also, I am a black woman. We do not have the time to stop fighting or the luxury. We don't have a choice.

I'm in a county (Allegheny County, PA) that's over 80% registered Democratic voters so it's easy to assume that Dems will normally win here. A lot of times, Republicans don't even try to run against Democratic candidates here. So OK, we're surrounded by red counties on all sides. How can we reach out and help the Dem candidates in other counties and other Districts? Citizen action, that's how!

How can we make sure that ALL votes get counted in every precinct and every county? It's part of getting out the vote that people don't realize. We can volunteer to help in the other areas that don't have the same Democratic majority that we enjoy. Sometimes just being there on election day is enough, making sure your fellow Democrats feel safe to vote in their home polling places.

during his first term, and the Diebold/ES&S machines co-owned by Republican Chuck Hagel. That election was total bullshit.

BINGO! Remote hacking of elections now possible.

manipulate the vote either electronically, gerrymander, move polling places, "Real ID" or just intimidate. Like Michael Moore said: "They're like sharks. They never sleep." They are truly the enemy of the people.

And it doesn’t matter.

Let's get our heads out of the sand. Recognize the real problem. And fight back. telling folks all we need to do is GOTV. Bring some friends along to vote too.

Clinton won 2.9 MILLION more votes than Trump. The way the system works it is NOT just winning the popular vote.

Otherwise, Clinton would be President, the SCOTUS would not be stacked to the right, voter suppression would not exist. Lies would not be part of press conferences, and so on and so on.............................................................and so on.

And by the way, I'm not lying the VOTE is rigged.

none of what you mention in the op is going to happen before the next election. Don’t those who espouse your belief that the outcome is rigged and pre determined run the risk of depressing turnout?

That would take the institutional power away from elected officials and put it in the hands of lobbyists & unelected, unknown staffers.

Also, I see having members of Congress with years and years of experience as a plus. Running the largest economy & most powerful military on the planet shouldn't be an entry-level position.

although only after the fact, to alert us to major discrepancies, so results can be contested.

You have to sample a large number so the lying responses get diluted. We did it for years.

On edit: You can give people the option to not respond, which could cut down on the number of people who feel pressured to lie. But of course, there are other reasons to lie, such as disdain for pollsters and to help steal an election or cover up its theft.

Never for me either.

I’ve been suspicious of Republican election theft ever since.

They’re the ones who appoint secretaries of state who oversee elections. The more governors we have, the fewer chances Republicans have to cheat. Even with that, though, cheating can take place at the precinct level. The biggest change I would like to see is a law requiring voting machine manufacturers to open their systems for review and a nonpartisan election security group appointed to review such programming. The programming for the aggregation of votes needs to be submitted before an election and locked up. Likewise, the after-election programming needs to be submitted as part of an automatic review. Currently, no voting machine manufacturer allows such reviews, making it particularly easy to change how votes are counted for each party.

If election officials know that their programming will be reviewed, they’re not likely to cheat.

not all states have their Gov appoint the Sec State. Here in KY the Sec State is elected at the same time as the Gov and Lt Gov.

On Edit: And I agree with the idea of paper ballots (here in KY we have paper ballots that we mark and then feed into a ballot reader, so the actual paper ballots are preserved if a recount is needed). I also would love to see Citizens United repealed and the Fairness Doctrine revived (and an independent bipartisan commission established to ensure that both sides of an issue are presented responsibly and not, for example, like the lies that FOX News puts out). I an ambivalent about term limits for Congress. Look at Nancy Pelosi or Adam Schiff or, for that matter, John McCain and compare and contrast with McConnell, Graham, Nunes and the like. Quite a conundrum.

Some SoS's are elected. We need to be active on those elections. Like Stalin (allegedly) said, "it doesn't matter who votes; what matters is who COUNTS the votes." Georgia 2018 is a textbook case of that. The SoS should NOT be allowed to oversee an election in which he/she is a candidate, or otherwise has an interest. Elections should be overseen statewide the way they are at the county level--by bipartisan boards, where all the major parties are represented.

. . . when DU was hacked on election night.

Link to tweet

We are screwed if our elections are not safe.

It of course stopped cold in the senate.

The only way we win these days is if we have an overwhelming turn out at the polls. I am very worried that too many other dictatorship countries support trump now and are most likely helping to rig our election now.

GOTV is the most important action we can do for the 2020 election.

gerrymandering and electing based on popular vote there'd be no need to pursue term limits or getting rid of the EC. I'm with you on #12 and some people are pushing for 18-year staggered terms for all federal judges including USSC justices. They would still be employed for life but after 18 years they would leave their position and become (at their same salary) advisory or other type of judges in federal courts until their retirement.

Term limits is not the problem if Citizens United was reversed and elections were publicly funded. Provided that PACs were abolished as well as making sure that absolutely no foreign contributions were made. If individual contributions are still allowed then reduce the limit allowed.

Term limits would actually give the executive branch more power. Consider that it takes time for congressional members to know the ins and outs of all those depts and agencies. As well as how they all function. And develop relationships with the officials or employees. Sure the staff they hire might be able fill in some of those spots but a congressional member needs to interact to understand the needs and functions.

As to fixing the laws that protect a sitting president from being charged for crimes while in office. There are no laws preventing it. It is only a DOJ policy they made up to avoid prosecuting. They came up with a policy about their boss because they have a conflict of interest. The Constitution does not prohibit it and there are no laws regarding. Maybe there should be an independent agency that is not controlled by the executive branch to investigate and prosecute.

It is an intertwined nightmare to unravel.

It avoids giving the executive branch more power.

A computer security expert says he found that a forensic image of the election server central to a legal battle over the integrity of Georgia elections showed signs that the original server was hacked.

The server was left exposed to the open internet for at least six months, a problem the same expert discovered in August 2016. It was subsequently wiped clean in mid-2017 with no notice, just days after election integrity activists filed a lawsuit seeking an overhaul of what they called the state's unreliable and negligently run election system.

In late December 2019, the plaintiffs were finally able to obtain a copy of the server's contents that the FBI made in March 2017 and retained — after the state allegedly dragged its feet in securing the image.

State officials have said they've seen no evidence that any election-related data was compromised. But they also long refused to submit the server image for an independent examination

_________________________________________________

love the last part: "But they also long refused to submit the server image for an independent examination"

Elections are conducted at the local level and are presided over by both parties by people from the community who know one another.

You may already do this, but if you have this concern, you could volunteer to help conduct the election in your area.

I know of an election skeptic who had become well known for his investigation of election machine software. He was invited to do this and ended up being much less concerned.

The head of Diebold promised to deliver Ohio’s electoral votes for Bush, and he did—among lots of malfunctioning Diebold hardware and software in Democratic precincts. Most local people who volunteer to help on election day never have access to the programming of voting machines, so they have no way to know whether, for example, the vote totals of Republican precincts have been programmed at 1.05% while those for Democratic precincts are programmed at .96%. Someone does a test run of machines before an election. I’m not sure who does that in different states, but that’s the point at which programming could be changed.

Here’s an interesting article about Diebold in Ohio.
https://columbusfreepress.com/article/diebold-indicted-its-spectre-still-haunts-ohio-elections

... since Walden W. O'Dell, the chief executive of Diebold, was not referring to his company's machines. And as others have remarked, there has been plenty of Democratic presidents since 2004 - Diebold must be really bad at stealing votes.

Please do not spread wacky theories like this. You are actually advising Democratic voters that voting is pointless!

Screwed everything up financially and politically, they let us spend all our political capital fixing the problems and once fixed they rig it to win again.

This election could go either way, it is messed up enough that they might let us win if its not a progressive. They got the judges they wanted so they might give it back to fix things again.

If you really think about it they don’t like him or what he is doing to military either but he is black mailing them about impeachment. They can just make sure he loses and they can see to it he leaves.

Along with all of the nail biter elections that Democrats have won recently, Doug Jones in Alabama, Conor Lamb in 2018, Tony Evers in Wisconsin, the recent Kentucky governors race, Louisiana governors race, etc.

The part that needs a Supreme Court ruling to change (Citizens United) or a majority Senate vote have even more difficult pathways than the rest of your list, but it’s still a good list

Any time Democrats win, it's because our GOTV overcame their vote alteration attempts. When Democrats lose, well, it's not because the Republicans got more votes, it HAS to be because they hacked the vote totals, right?

Plus, it provides an excuse for EVERY lost election without having to actually prove anything. "Insert candidate" didn't run a bad campaign, he's just a victim of vote rigging!

Around the world, We sure do suck at it

In every close election, we invariably hear that many more people were prevented from voting than the margin of victory. Preventing people from voting also increases the apathy. I am always horrified when I hear stories of people having to wait hours to vote.

All of the other issues do influence how people end up voting, but in my mind, if the first issue is remedied, none of the others will matter as much.

It would have had no effect on Fox News even if it was still in place

Ranked choice would have handed Gore the election in 2000, and probably HRC in 2016.