General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsDavid Corn: Will Trump and His Enablers Ever Face Accountability for the Coronavirus Massacre?
https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2020/04/will-trump-and-his-enablers-ever-face-accountability-for-the-coronavirus-massacre/Will Trump and His Enablers Ever Face Accountability for the Coronavirus Massacre?
The Iraq War is not a good precedent.
David Corn
Washington, DC, Bureau ChiefBio | Follow
snip//
There has been an endless series of profound errors committed by Trump and his administration prior to and during this horrific crisis. Thennational security adviser John Bolton shut down the White Houses global health security office in 2018; the Trump team ignored a pandemic playbook left for it by the Obama administration. And Trump, the malignant narcissist, has, to no ones surprise, explicitly rejected all responsibility for the glaring missteps and deadly miscalculations. Instead, he has boasted about the ratings for his daily press briefings.
Trump and adoring sidekick Mike Pence will face a moment of judgment in November, when voters will render a verdict. But what of all the others who helped make this moment of mass-death possible? The Dear Leader crowd that supports Trump no matter what has echoed, protected, defended, and bolstered him as he has guided the nation into a nightmare of economic calamity and rampant death. You know who they are. (If not, watch this.) White House advisers Kellyanne Conway and Larry Kudlowwho each will likely look for remunerative gigs after their time with Trumpboth claimed the coronavirus was contained. Trumps newly acquired press secretary, Kayleigh McEnany, proclaimed in February, We will not see diseases like the coronavirus come here..and isnt it refreshing when contrasting it with the awful presidency of President Obama. Rush Limbaugh told his millions of Dittohead listeners that the coronavirus was no worse than the common cold. (Should he give back the Medal of Freedom Trump awarded him in February?) Numerous Fox-heads, including Hannity and Laura Ingraham, misled the public, reinforcing Trumps insistence that the threat was a hoax and discounting the seriousness of this virus. Only Trish Regan was booted by Fox after she derided what she called the coronavirus impeachment scam. The others have remained in place.
Then there is the Republican Party. None of its leaders have dared to challenge Trump, as he misrepresented the threat and lied about his administrations response. Rep. Devin Nunes (R-Calif.) encouraged his constituents to ignore calls for social distancing and to go to restaurants. Rep. Matt Gaetz (R-Fla.) mocked concerns about the virus by wearing a gas mask on the House floor. Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) and House Republican leader Kevin McCarthy (R-Calif.) never publicly questioned Trumps multiple blunders, and they continued to lead their party in a cultlike manner of total obeisance to Trump. Many others share the blame. Conservative and right-wing evangelical leaders, including Jerry Falwell Jr. of Liberty University and Matt Schlapp of the American Conservative Union, reinforced the no-big-deal theme that was pushed by Trumps White House and have considered Trump faultless.
So with thousands of Americans dying in part because of Trumps feckless and reckless response, who will be held responsible? Rep. Adam Schiff (D-Calif.), who prosecuted the impeachment case against Trump, has proposed creating a coronavirus commission like the 9/11 commission that investigated all the mistakes and misconceptions that preceded that horrible attack. The 9/11 commission produced a detailed and elegantly written report that offered a stunning indictment of the Bush-Cheney administration and the US intelligence community. (Still, Bush and Cheney were reelected.) But one can expect Trump, the Republicans, and their amen choir to rabidly oppose Schiffs idea (as Bush opposed establishing the 9/11 commission).
American society does not do accountability well. The instigators of the Iraq War did not suffer. Nor did the bankers who crashed the US economy in 2008. We do have elections, and Trump, Pence, and their Republican handmaids will be on the ballot in seven months. But what of the Fox barkers, the conservative movement that has become no more than a promotion vehicle for Trumpjackery, and the entire right-wing noise machine? With their obsessive devotion to Trump, they all have helped pave the way to a national massacre. Will they be able to wash the blood off their hands? Can a large and deplorable slice of the national political media apparatus be judged guilty of murderous culpability and locked up (metaphorically)?
Nations should have memories, Frederick Douglass once said. But Gore Vidal frequently referred to the United States of Amnesia. And the past is not a good prelude for accountability. Too often the culprits who contributed to death and destruction end up skating along, even experiencing personal benefit. At this moment, the priority for the nation is to rise above Trumps incompetence and contend with a killer virus that is robbing us of our friends, neighbors, and loved ones and causing severe economic and societal dislocation. But there ought to come a time for a tallying: who did what when, during a life-and-death national crisis. And it is not too early to be collecting receipts. None of this should be forgotten.
FarPoint
(12,437 posts)The republicans are primary players here who refuse to look beyond the pleasure of the greedy pot of gold they get with tRump
.It is over.
my opinion.
blueinredohio
(6,797 posts)both houses. Once they're out of office normally all is forgiven. What pisses me off the most is the republicans that will be back peddling how they really weren't behind Trump but but but.....
Bernardo de La Paz
(49,036 posts)BadgerMom
(2,771 posts)FarPoint
(12,437 posts)I just don't see a recovery...
Bernardo de La Paz
(49,036 posts)FarPoint
(12,437 posts)Being realistic...
Response to FarPoint (Reply #56)
geralmar This message was self-deleted by its author.
certainot
(9,090 posts)in history.
giving up while continuing to ignore talk radio is what putin would want
republicans like trump is heavily dependent on talk radio and more specifically, democrats continuing to ignore it. that is the key to destroying these shits doing something different, and with limbaugh possibly croaking in the near future the ad industry, the GOP, and trump admin must be nervous the talk radio monopoly was built around him.
advertisers on any rw radio station thats been denying covid are responsible for this as well as trump. and for decades of global warming denial. those stations are not doing political they might as well be working for putin. those stations and the advertisers and university and pro sports broadcasting that keeps them going need to hear total disgust and shunning from us.
if limbaugh had criticized trump for his response and began warning about covid all the other bllowhards and fox would have had to follow and so would trump.
recognizing talk radio and limbaughs part in this, not to mention getting trump even close to the WH opens a whole world of opportunities relative to so many issues besides corona. in desantis/ florida for instance, 20 llimbaugh stations need democrats to keep ignoring the fact that 5 universities broadcast on/endorse/support 20 limbaugh stations
convince one of those schools how stupid that is and the other schools would have to follow. those stations and their advertisers just endorsed 2 months of denying covid. if trump was paying $1000/hr for RW radio support and covid denial (that is now switching to blaming dems) those 20 stations x 15 hrs/day would be worth $1.5 MIL/WEEK! free for desantis and trump in florida alone. what was that in terms of that close race where desantis scraped by with a shitload of voter suppression those stations sold for years?
from fakenewsradio.org, FLORIDA 20 Florida 10, Florida St. 4 Miami 2, South Florida 2, Central Florida 2
a few letters to the ed in the state might make a difference, for instance, with uni admins with nothing to do
.
its the same in many states - without their rw radio advantage the cons and trump are fucked. with llimbaugh with heavy cancer it wouldn't take much pressure to force the ad industry to break up the monopoly
oldsoftie
(12,597 posts)Please dont!
Dont give them power they dont have. They dont convert anyone. The limbaugh listeners will simply find someone just like him whenever he stops his show. Only personal experiences will change the minds of the right wingers. I mentioned here awhile back that i had to listen to Limbaugh for 2-3 days a week for 20 YEARS. He didnt change what i believe or how I vote. His show; and the others, are just a big echo chamber. You dont stumble onto his show and suddenly become a GOP voter. You LOOK for him and his ilk to back up what you already think.
certainot
(9,090 posts)huge impact not because they reinforce preconceptions
talk radio is different from other media - it dominates many parts of the country where there are no free easy alts for politics and it has a huge secondary and tertiary effect on large parts of the population that are too busy or apathetic to look for truth and fact.
allowing a monopoly of coordinated radio stations to pump out lies without challenge on 1500 radio stations licensed to operate in the public interest is exactly why we're in this mess
the hate radio monopoly is the only major medium that operates outside free speech, democratic, and market/demand feedback mechanisms
btw- it energizes me!
Tumbulu
(6,292 posts)Ive lived and worked in rural areas my adult life. Why do you think those guys who took over the wildlife reserve got freed? It has utterly infected the minds of rural people everywhere.
It is ignored opal our peril.
I love your ideas on how to get if finished with once and for all!
certainot
(9,090 posts)this disaster clear and recorded and no excuse for most of its advertisers and sports teams to desert them
it wouldn't take much aactitvism to get the attention of the ad industry, which is nervous about limbaugh hacking his lungs out on the radio
Tumbulu
(6,292 posts)Maybe after all these decades, something will be done about this.
Tumbulu
(6,292 posts)Maybe you were not swayed, but a whole lot of people that I know and even like and respect have been swayed. I think it is because it is so constant over so many decades now. It is just corrosive and it is why we have Trump and Republicans strangling us. It is where the tea party came from.
DENVERPOPS
(8,844 posts)Some of us, who have been screaming our heads off for forty years, are welcoming those who just recently arrived at the Party......
WHILE THE NATION SLEPT would be a great title for this book, except that title has already been taken......
Many who have been observing what has been going on for some time now, are drawing the conclusion at this point, that this new group of Republicans, and their cabal are one millimeter away from pulling off a complete COUP.......
We are now in checkmate, with the next move by Republicans being the actual installation of a Corporate Fascist Tyranny.........
Barring some miracle, WASF
Years ago, I remember some Bush aide saying to a reporter: We will do, and all you and the American people can do is stand back and watch..........Tell me that what he said has been proven wrong.......
BComplex
(8,064 posts)And trump and the republicans are like baby ducks, waddling after their mama Putin....swimming in Chernobyl waters.
live love laugh
(13,129 posts)at the inevitability of the next extermination on American soil.
NCDem47
(2,250 posts)...when DEMOCRATS are in control! Republicans always get a pass and D's get run out of office if they even look the wrong way. Horrible double standard. Infuriating!
sfstaxprep
(9,998 posts)Repubs couldn't care less if one of their own commits crime after crime after crime, so long as they achieve their goals.
Democrats feel shame and embarrassment when a fellow Democrat does likewise.
certainot
(9,090 posts)rw radio just spent 2 months calling covid a liberal hoax and now are shifting to blame this on democrats and brown people and immigrants and chinese - and of course they are also saying this death rate is highly inflated because many are dying of 'other things' - like preexisting conditions, like old age
that's what limbaugh is telling at ttis very moment to 20 mil people. the fuckjing limbaugh will do it on a national level and the local blowhards will be coordinated to do it on the local level, completely ignoring facts, and a lot of authoritarians
any advertiser on any rw radio station needs to own the deaths cause by helping trump deny covid for 2 months, posssibly to influence the elections, like when the republicans used ebola in 2014
spanone
(135,873 posts)he brazenly obstructed congress and congress let him off the hook
MyOwnPeace
(16,937 posts)it was the RepubliCon Senate who let IQ45 off of the hook - the Democratic House impeached him.
gibraltar72
(7,511 posts)to let George Bush off for lying us into war. If investigations had gone forward the Republican party would have been exposed for what it was and is. The Republican party would have been effectively killed. I would hope the Dems would look for the answers and hold people accountable. I think people are going to demand answers and will be accepting of the need to expose all the wrongdoing. This assumes we actually have an election of course.
War criminals must be punished
Tumbulu
(6,292 posts)and the power of Fox News to amplify the propaganda.
But he was not alone. All the urban liberals seem to ignore and remain mostly unaware of the power unchecked to date of these actors. Long funded by far right figures. 3 plus decades now of it.
But his mistakes were not malicious, they were attempts at being civil with a group of monsters who take any opportunity to continue their crusade. Which they appear to me to have won.
Hoping to be proven wrong.
Lonestarblue
(10,064 posts)In many rural areas, AM radio is all there is, other than broadcast media. On a few long drives through rural areas, Ive listened to AM radio and been appalledand this was before Trump was elected. I cant imagine the utter nonsense being put on the airwaves now. I expected the hate from people like Rush Limbaugh, but what surprised me were the Christian shows, on which ministers (or at least they were billed as ministers) preached a gospel never found in anyones Bible. Mostly, the sermons were diatribes against baby murderers, sinful women, gays, and Democrats, along with some jibes at the welfare state.
When Democrats are back in office, they need to pass a new fairness doctrine and they need to go back to the old law limiting the ownership of media outlets.
Democrats have a lot of cleanup to do just from this maladministration, but some of the cleanup needs to undo the things Reagan did.
Tumbulu
(6,292 posts)It was ignored and we are all paying a terrible price.
Solomon
(12,319 posts)tell her what kind of crap they are spewing on the radio. She always says "I don't care or worry about what the assholes are saying" and we get into an argument because I see the constant non stop propaganda as a serious problem.
A serious problem. I turned on c-span every morning and hear the callers spouting the exact same crap you hear on the radio. It's infuriating.
MyOwnPeace
(16,937 posts)They learned from their leader! If you hear it on Faux, you'll hear it as IQ45 policy the next day!
Tumbulu
(6,292 posts)And I do believe it is a coup.
We could not even get rid of him through an impeachment.
CrispyQ
(36,509 posts)and still do. I don't get it. It's like our side doesn't believe in marketing. We let the other side capture the narrative on all of the issues without a challenging message from our sidefor forty fucking years!
Tumbulu
(6,292 posts)Why do they still ignore this? Why cant Bloomberg buy all these stations up and turn them into music stations?
MyOwnPeace
(16,937 posts)"But his mistakes were not malicious, they were attempts at being civil with a group of monsters who take any opportunity to continue their crusade."
That is SO true - he was trying to be civil and respectful and getting no such thing in return. A "gentleman" in a fight with pigs.
I think his largest mistake was not taking the gloves off for the Merrick Garland nomination. I really don't know what he could have done - I just think about how the president has a "bully pulpit" and PRESIDENT OBAMA was never one to use it. Again, a gentleman in the pig sty.
Tumbulu
(6,292 posts)Thank you.
rampartc
(5,435 posts)at least 9/11 had an investigation.
the financial crash, and its $Ts aftermath, have not been investigated at all.
CaptainTruth
(6,601 posts)...as long as Bush, Cheney, & the PNAC cabal walk free.
They should have been held responsible for their actions & charged with war crimes.
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)Anything. Why I spoke out so vehemently for pushing with all our power to stop trump early on. He's only gotten worse. Now too many are dying.
N_E_1 for Tennis
(9,775 posts)accountable would be by turning him loose into the general public without any security and a press release of where and when hell be at some certain place. The mob would dispense justice.
Response to N_E_1 for Tennis (Reply #6)
geralmar This message was self-deleted by its author.
CaptYossarian
(6,448 posts)saidsimplesimon
(7,888 posts)It's a bitter pill, the knowing that "those who deny the truth are doomed to repeat it".
Solly Mack
(90,785 posts)Charitable understatement.
bucolic_frolic
(43,286 posts)but the Whiner-in-Chief will mitigate any adverse reaction so the MAGAt's will view it as Bury My Heart at Wounded Trump. Snowflakes! All of them!
Takket
(21,625 posts)I mean, all the evidence is there... but unfortunately we have all learned that evidence does not translate to accountability anymore.
in the broader sense Corn's article could simply be "Will Trump and His Enablers Ever Face Accountability?"
nothing came of the Mueller report
nothing came of Ukraine
nothing came of children dying in cages
what about Covid is going to be any different?
babylonsister
(171,091 posts)immigrants, as repulsive as that excuse is. Covid is different because so many Americans are dying. That's a big difference.
young_at_heart
(3,772 posts)I'm hoping some of them will be charged with criminal activity....but probably not. I am outraged at their treatment of Hillary Clinton and Christine Blasey Ford and so many others!
And
Baitball Blogger
(46,757 posts)The presidency should not be a place where a person can takes this country to its knees and get away with it.
hay rick
(7,639 posts)And, unlike justice, it's something all Americans can understand.
flying_wahini
(6,646 posts)If the Republicans manage to wrangle a win, we will never have fair elections OR accountability in the US again.
dalton99a
(81,570 posts)Fiendish Thingy
(15,656 posts)Any Democrats who favours looking forward, not back doesnt deserve to hold office.
MyOwnPeace
(16,937 posts)Speaker Pelosi, I do NOT want to hear about ANYTHING being "off the table!"
Fiendish Thingy
(15,656 posts)Although I fear we will need to revive the Independent Counsel laws to get true, complete justice.
MyOwnPeace
(16,937 posts)Thinking back over the years and the relationships between the "president" and the AG - the worst I had ever seen was Nixon/Mitchell - part of the Watergate team. Mitchell actually did jail time.
Hmmmmm - wonder how Billy Barr would do around "shower time?"
samnsara
(17,635 posts)ffr
(22,671 posts)And the penalties must be draconian and harsh to prevent this from happening again.
quakerboy
(13,921 posts)I feel hopeful we will win, and win big. But the people we are going to win with are the "let bygones be bygones" sort, not the "take it to them and make sure it never happens again" sort
Odawg
(37 posts)And this MF will be reelected. The american people are too frightened and stupid to see what is going on. It's hopeless.
Demsrule86
(68,667 posts)DBoon
(22,397 posts)There was never any accountability for Iran/Contra
This has gone on for decades.
It needs to stop now. No pardons, no sweeping malfeasance under the rug, no more making nice with criminals.
Kablooie
(18,641 posts)And it will,possibly push him over the top to win another term.
They will say that 2 million might have died and Trump prevented that.
empedocles
(15,751 posts)In January, trump was riding high. Much higher than we on DU thought possible.
Polls showed people, and voters, at record or near record highs, that they were very content with the way things were going.
Easily measured, were small investors rushing into stock markets, as well market traders, and institutional managers, including pension funds. Stocks and housing high. Many polls reflected a lot of consumer satisfaction - including political polls. Seemed that too many were not ready to upend the Republicons.
All sorts of problems [healthcare for too many, wealth gaps, infrastructure neglect, bubbles of all kinds, epidemic, 'correction' difficulties] - were pushed to the side.
Now, with CV19 various counts, hitting closer to home, 'public sentiment' is noticeably changing. Much faster than public sentiment usually changes, [much more slowly than DUer's can barely stand]. Personally, that 40% trump support, was unbearable to me.
Situations will get worse, very possibly much worse, before leveling out even. January 2020 'happiness'/employment levels may not be reached for many years.
However, in that horrendously despairingly dark and huge cloud, the precarious silver lining may be relatively fast changes in 'public sentiment' - enough for overwhelming positive change by November, trump gone - and all that may bring.
That can be our hope.
MyOwnPeace
(16,937 posts)We're looking at the public's perception of what's going on. For the past 3 years its been about things "away from here" - not close to home, especially for those supporting IQ45.
I remember about a year or so ago there was a prison guard in Florida (a tRump supporter) that was not pleased with the 2018 voting, what with the Dems regaining control of the House. She was complaining about the job IQ45 was doing. Her quote was: "He's not hurting the people he should be hurting."
So now?
"Wait - this is happening to me?"
Yes, people are "forced" to stay home - out of work - kids are not in school - shopping is not what it "should" be - money issues are getting ugly - neighbors/friends are actually sick. Who did this to us?
Yes, public perception SHOULD be changing. Let's hope all of these "FUBARS" add up to a blue tsunami vote in November!
empedocles
(15,751 posts)Thank you.
Alvin the Terrible
(8 posts)Republicans have never been truly punished for their crimes.
They may get voted out but, that's about it.
oldsoftie
(12,597 posts)duforsure
(11,885 posts)We're really screwed.
sarcasmo
(23,968 posts)sop
(10,244 posts)Betteridge's law of headlines states: "Any headline that ends in a question mark can be answered by the word no."
Hotler
(11,445 posts)bdamomma
(63,922 posts)or genocide, he is a criminal. In past history we should be aware that this POS will have his reckoning day.
AmericanCanuck
(1,102 posts)Such heinous assholes should never breathe free.