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applegrove

(118,711 posts)
Sat May 30, 2020, 05:50 PM May 2020

Roberts Upholds COVID-19 Restrictions on Churches, Scolds Kavanaugh

Roberts Upholds COVID-19 Restrictions on Churches, Scolds Kavanaugh

By MARK JOSEPH STERN at Slate

MAY 30, 20209:45 AM

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/05/supreme-court-coronavirus-california-churches.html

"SNIP.....

Friday at midnight, the Supreme Court rejected a church’s challenge to California’s COVID-19 restrictions by a 5–4 vote, with Chief Justice John Roberts joining the liberals. In a pointed opinion, Roberts indicated that he will not join conservative judges’ escalating efforts to override public health measures in the name of religious freedom. Justice Brett Kavanaugh’s dissent, by contrast, falsely accused the state of religious discrimination in an extremely misleading opinion that omits the most important facts of the case. Roberts went out of his way to scold Kavanaugh’s dishonest vilification of the state.

SCOTUS’ late-night order in South Bay United Pentecostal Church v. Newsom divided the justices into two camps: those who acknowledge reality, and those who ignore it to score ideological points. The case began when a California church accused Gov. Gavin Newsom of violating its religious freedom. Newsom’s current COVID-19 policy limits attendance at houses of worship to 25 percent of building capacity or a maximum of 100 attendees, whichever is lower. At the same time, it allows certain secular businesses, like grocery stores, to operate under looser guidelines, allowing more people to enter. The church claimed this disparate treatment between churches and commercial establishments runs afoul of the First Amendment.

As Roberts noted, however, California does not impose uniform rules on all places where people assemble. The state does strictly limit church attendance. But it applies “similar or more severe restrictions” to “lectures, concerts, movie showings, spectator sports, and theatrical performances.” So the question for the court is less constitutional than scientific: From an epidemiological perspective, are churches more like grocery stores or concerts? And that, the chief justice concluded, is a question for lawmakers, not federal judges.

“The precise question of when restrictions on particular social activities should be lifted during the pandemic,” Roberts declared, “is a dynamic and fact-intensive matter subject to reasonable disagreement.” The Constitution leaves such decisions “to the politically accountable officials of the state,” whose decisions “should not be subject to second-guessing” by judges who lack “background, competence, and expertise to assess public health.” Multiple coronavirus outbreaks in California have been traced back to religious services. California has good reason to treat churches more like concerts—where people “congregate in large groups” and “remain in close proximity for extended periods”—than grocery stores, where they can social distance. For courts, that should be the end of the matter.

......SNIP"

45 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Roberts Upholds COVID-19 Restrictions on Churches, Scolds Kavanaugh (Original Post) applegrove May 2020 OP
Kavanaugh's dishonest vilification of the state. SWBTATTReg May 2020 #1
TY.. shocking that a BLOTUS appointed MAGAT would try to Distort Cha May 2020 #5
Me too. I was surprised. NT SWBTATTReg May 2020 #8
Chief Justice John Roberts does not have to be worried about being fired by Trump.. Stuart G May 2020 #2
Haha.. good point! Roberts can sit up there and defy Cha May 2020 #6
Defying BLOTUS! liberalla May 2020 #12
Trump will stoop to anything to get his way, however. Chemisse May 2020 #10
Even a stopped clock is right twice a day. BComplex May 2020 #3
On this one, he got it right. A very good sign. Stuart G May 2020 #4
it's a good sign AlexSFCA May 2020 #11
Agreed... dixiechiken1 May 2020 #7
Yeah, he throws us a bone now and then not fooled May 2020 #34
He voted the right way cuz no repuke donors lobbied him on it. BlancheSplanchnik May 2020 #42
He was totally useless on impeachment trial. rickyhall May 2020 #9
Correct.......... MyOwnPeace May 2020 #13
Exactly! mountain grammy May 2020 #27
His job in an impeachment was not to act as a Judge. Blue_true May 2020 #29
No. Not true. He inserted himself a couple of times to hurt the impeachment. BComplex May 2020 #45
FOUR Supreme Court Justices with law degrees voted against states' public health measures? bucolic_frolic May 2020 #14
I wonder if anyone has tried to argue that lifting church restrictions IS religious discrimination? royable May 2020 #15
Good take. nt applegrove May 2020 #16
I'm putting that out to see what type of response I get. LiberalFighter May 2020 #18
Really good point. Pepsidog May 2020 #20
+1 crickets May 2020 #33
Taken slightly differently quakerboy May 2020 #37
The other Justices need to go after Kavanaugh more. LiberalFighter May 2020 #17
They can dissent, which they do. Only Roberts can really rebuke him - he's the Chief Justice. ehrnst May 2020 #22
Vintage Roberts KentuckyWoman May 2020 #19
He does seem to have that tendency. nt Blue_true May 2020 #30
'As one lawyer quipped about Kavanaugh's opinion on Twitter, Hortensis May 2020 #21
One more reason Biden should expand and pack SCOTUS upon his inauguration nt Fiendish Thingy May 2020 #23
I agree with that action. nt Blue_true May 2020 #31
The Beer Boofer gets spanked by the Chief Justice! RainCaster May 2020 #24
Kavadouche is a lying sack of shit 47of74 May 2020 #25
"...by judges who lack "background, competence, and expertise to assess public health." yonder May 2020 #26
Though it's doubtful that Kavanaugh would notice. jaxexpat May 2020 #28
Roberts has a chronic health issue dlk May 2020 #32
He'll be slammin' the cool pops tonight. snort May 2020 #35
Hey Brett go wave your dick somewhere else Blue Owl May 2020 #36
Brett Kavanaugh's dissent, by contrast, falsely accused the state of religious discrimination Historic NY May 2020 #38
He doesn't care. He will go out for a beer with his right wing friends applegrove May 2020 #39
Justice Beer Bong Weenie Waver will strike again Hermit-The-Prog May 2020 #40
Dems need to make plans to impeach "kav the rapist" Miigwech May 2020 #41
The big "test" will be when he judges the ability of Congress to get those tax returns and the turbinetree May 2020 #43
Didn't Roberts also help save the ACA? manhattan123 May 2020 #44

SWBTATTReg

(22,144 posts)
1. Kavanaugh's dishonest vilification of the state.
Sat May 30, 2020, 06:31 PM
May 2020

The pretend supreme court justice was chewed out basically by Roberts. This had to hurt...as it should since K tried to distort the issue.

Cha

(297,347 posts)
5. TY.. shocking that a BLOTUS appointed MAGAT would try to Distort
Sat May 30, 2020, 06:50 PM
May 2020

the issue to make California look bad.

Grateful for Roberts.. wow!

Stuart G

(38,436 posts)
2. Chief Justice John Roberts does not have to be worried about being fired by Trump..
Sat May 30, 2020, 06:37 PM
May 2020

Let's see, how can that be?
Some people, a lot smarter than Trump,
Had an idea that all can see.
Called the Constitution of the U.S.A.
Written in those days.
By brilliant men.
Who cared about the U.S.A.
And they had their say..
And that say, is still important today.

Thank You...time for a tip of the hat...

Chemisse

(30,813 posts)
10. Trump will stoop to anything to get his way, however.
Sat May 30, 2020, 07:09 PM
May 2020

If K doesn't take this position willingly, he might be vulnerable to blackmail.

AlexSFCA

(6,139 posts)
11. it's a good sign
Sat May 30, 2020, 07:09 PM
May 2020

realistically, any right-winger can make an easy case here of government overreach but roberts not only rejected it but with force, this very rightwing point of view. Unfortunately, it may mean that he will also side with anti-choice crowd, similarly, by deferring to lawmakers to decide.

dixiechiken1

(2,113 posts)
7. Agreed...
Sat May 30, 2020, 07:02 PM
May 2020

I agree with his decision on this but he still scares the crap outta me. He is a dyed in the wool wingnut with a lot of power. A LOT of power.

not fooled

(5,801 posts)
34. Yeah, he throws us a bone now and then
Sun May 31, 2020, 12:24 AM
May 2020

while always marching forward to institute a fascist oligarchy.

MyOwnPeace

(16,928 posts)
13. Correct..........
Sat May 30, 2020, 07:16 PM
May 2020

this is NOT a time to think that he has had his "Come to Jesus" moment regarding IQ45 and Moscow Mitch.

Blue_true

(31,261 posts)
29. His job in an impeachment was not to act as a Judge.
Sat May 30, 2020, 10:09 PM
May 2020

He had no constitutional charter to make rulings on anything. Impeachment is considered a political process, Roberts was just there to insure that the rules the Founders set for the process was followed. Like it or not, he did his role as called for.

BComplex

(8,054 posts)
45. No. Not true. He inserted himself a couple of times to hurt the impeachment.
Sun May 31, 2020, 07:28 PM
May 2020

He was not neutral by any stretch of the imagination.

bucolic_frolic

(43,205 posts)
14. FOUR Supreme Court Justices with law degrees voted against states' public health measures?
Sat May 30, 2020, 07:18 PM
May 2020

Yikes. They really do live in the age of the Scopes Monkey Trial

royable

(1,264 posts)
15. I wonder if anyone has tried to argue that lifting church restrictions IS religious discrimination?
Sat May 30, 2020, 07:29 PM
May 2020

If California officials were to tell churchgoers that it's fine for them return to conditions of unsafe social contact, they are being treated differently than sports fans and concert-goers and theatre-goers who can't return to sporting events, concerts, or theater. If the church-goers are told they can return to church, they are being targeted for COVID-19 illness and death. How is that not discrimination against church-goers?

quakerboy

(13,920 posts)
37. Taken slightly differently
Sun May 31, 2020, 02:47 AM
May 2020

If Christians have legal protections to gather in conspiracy's to murder.. Why cant other religions do the same with government guaranteed freedom from interference.

KentuckyWoman

(6,688 posts)
19. Vintage Roberts
Sat May 30, 2020, 08:05 PM
May 2020

I could be wrong, but seems to me He tends to err on the side of less intrusion into local matters.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
21. 'As one lawyer quipped about Kavanaugh's opinion on Twitter,
Sat May 30, 2020, 08:24 PM
May 2020
“does Justice Kavanaugh really think 100+ people hang out in marijuana dispensaries for a few hours together and sing?”'

Kavanaugh, in other words, wouldn’t allow states to make reasonable distinctions between churches and other places of business based on the kind of activity that goes on in that business — and whether that activity is likely to spread the coronavirus.

Had Kavanaugh’s views prevailed, they would have imposed severe limits on the state’s ability to prevent coronavirus from spreading in places of worship. If there is a sudden outbreak of the virus in California, and the state decides to close all businesses except for grocery stores, Kavanaugh’s opinion suggests that the state may not impose any restrictions on churches that it doesn’t also impose on grocers — even though people will starve if they can’t buy food.

Nevertheless, the fact that Kavanaugh wound up in dissent is significant, not just because of the public health implications, but because it suggests that Roberts might break with his fellow Republicans in future “religious liberty” cases. The Court, for example, plans to hear Fulton v. City of Philadelphia in the fall — a case asking whether religious organizations have a constitutional right to defy Philadelphia’s ban on anti-LGBTQ discrimination by government contractors.

Among other things, the plaintiffs in Fulton ask the Supreme Court to overrule Smith and give religious objectors an exceedingly broad power to defy laws that they disagree with on religious grounds. But Roberts’s vote in South Bay United suggests, at the very least, he recognizes that the Court must not afford so much special solicitude to religious conservatives that it endangers public health.

https://www.vox.com/2020/5/30/21275379/supreme-court-churches-roberts-kavanaugh-south-bay-united-pentecostal-newsom

yonder

(9,668 posts)
26. "...by judges who lack "background, competence, and expertise to assess public health."
Sat May 30, 2020, 08:52 PM
May 2020

I suppose Roberts was referencing judges in general but would like to think he was giving Kavanaugh a good poke in the ribs too.

dlk

(11,572 posts)
32. Roberts has a chronic health issue
Sat May 30, 2020, 10:22 PM
May 2020

In matters of public health he often rules with the liberals. His smackdown of Kavanaugh is priceless!

Historic NY

(37,451 posts)
38. Brett Kavanaugh's dissent, by contrast, falsely accused the state of religious discrimination
Sun May 31, 2020, 03:58 AM
May 2020

in an extremely misleading opinion that omits the most important facts of the case. Roberts went out of his way to scold Kavanaugh’s dishonest vilification of the state.

I suggest that he be required to recuse himself from any proceeding dealing with the state of California.....we now know he is biased .

applegrove

(118,711 posts)
39. He doesn't care. He will go out for a beer with his right wing friends
Sun May 31, 2020, 04:56 AM
May 2020

and laugh about it. The cult must be nurtured.

 

Miigwech

(3,741 posts)
41. Dems need to make plans to impeach "kav the rapist"
Sun May 31, 2020, 10:24 AM
May 2020

As soon as we take over in Nov., the Senate, House and the Presidency ... kick the plans into action so we can rid the Supreme Court from this supremely unqualified excuse for a man.

turbinetree

(24,703 posts)
43. The big "test" will be when he judges the ability of Congress to get those tax returns and the
Sun May 31, 2020, 02:37 PM
May 2020

State of New York criminal proceedings on those tax returns about the sociopaths megalomaniac................I still do not trust him, he voted to tell voters that they had to stand in line to vote in Wisconsin, and he also has eviscerated the voting rights act.............

manhattan123

(302 posts)
44. Didn't Roberts also help save the ACA?
Sun May 31, 2020, 04:10 PM
May 2020

No question he's a right-winger, and likely rules opposite the way I would like 99 percent of the time, but it seems he will do the right thing once in a while in important cases. Certainly more than Alito, Thomas, Kavanugh and those other creeps.

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