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Dennis Donovan

(18,770 posts)
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 03:12 PM Jun 2020

Clint Watts on unmarked WH LEO: "This is a no-go in America. Who are these guys?"

Clint Watts ✔@selectedwisdom

Do we even know if they are law enforcement? This is a no-go in America. Who are these guys? report to? their authority to enforce anything is? what happens if they injure or kill someone? If I'm a citizen, am I required to do anything these people say?

Garrett Haake ✔@GarrettHaake

Back outside the White House. Today the perimeter has been pushed back another half block. Federal law enforcement of some kind, but they won’t identify themselves, and all insignias and name plates have been removed.


imagine this scenario: 1 of these fully armored folks tells me to move, I don't, i'm in a public space, they tell me again, I ask who they are, they hit me, i hit back, what would nearby police do? would a cop step in and arrest me? on what grounds?

last note on this. This very likely to lead to a bunch of impersonation of law enforcement. Militia type groups, vigilantes dressing up same way, using force without any authority "protecting businesses" and "property" etc. Terrible precedent


2:56 PM - Jun 3, 2020







...and from Asha Rangappa:


Asha Rangappa ✔@AshaRangappa_

Exactly. On what basis are people expected to comply with their commands?? They are well within their rights to tell these dudes to take a hike unless and until they identify themselves and prove they are legitimate law enforcement. (and have a defense if they don't).

2:40 PM - Jun 3, 2020


also see:

At WH, Fed LEO won't identify themselves, and all insignias and name plates have been removed

Matthew Miller: "it's like Russia's little green men have taken over the nation's capital."
66 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Clint Watts on unmarked WH LEO: "This is a no-go in America. Who are these guys?" (Original Post) Dennis Donovan Jun 2020 OP
So, a heavily armed person with no badge Miguelito Loveless Jun 2020 #1
Aim for 2naSalit Jun 2020 #12
This. If they aren't identified as legit law enforcement Grokenstein Jun 2020 #28
I don't know who thought of putting them out there like that. Blue_true Jun 2020 #50
Protect yourself and your family paleotn Jun 2020 #23
They look more like out of work mall cops on a cosplay date C_U_L8R Jun 2020 #2
Very upsetting. Barr has mercenaries at the ready for trump. brush Jun 2020 #3
For all we know, it's just a bunch of gunhumpers from Michigan in costumes BamaRefugee Jun 2020 #4
Same heavily-armed crew who stormed the Michigan capitol calling for Whitmer's head on a pike? sop Jun 2020 #22
The new Pinkerton Agents? nt DURHAM D Jun 2020 #5
Appears so. ...nt 2naSalit Jun 2020 #13
I asked a similar question earlier malaise Jun 2020 #6
Thanks for this link, it was interesting dmr Jun 2020 #19
Mercenaries on American Land ace3csusm Jun 2020 #7
Contractors, most likely associated w/Eric Prince - what law enforcement authority do they have? AnotherMother4Peace Jun 2020 #8
Ding! Ding! Ding! Wounded Bear Jun 2020 #17
That's what I was thinking. smirkymonkey Jun 2020 #41
No official uniforms. One of the "thugs" had an Under Armour shirt peeking out from under his AnotherMother4Peace Jun 2020 #59
Apparently they are CBP; a dangerous, unregulated, unaccountable team created by the Patriot Act/ BComplex Jun 2020 #9
So don has his own personal army? Who the hell are these people? spanone Jun 2020 #10
Praetorian Guard. nt tblue37 Jun 2020 #34
They certainly appear to be well fed... or maybe they subsist on fast food. world wide wally Jun 2020 #37
Do they have authority over citizens? superpatriotman Jun 2020 #11
they would ave to idenitfy themselves 2naSalit Jun 2020 #14
I don't think it even matters at this point. They have guns and Trump's approval. smirkymonkey Jun 2020 #43
I have no doubt that 2naSalit Jun 2020 #60
Since when does this crowd concern themselves about... Trueblue Texan Jun 2020 #48
Obviously they don't and one of our 2naSalit Jun 2020 #62
He has it right I would say. LiberalFighter Jun 2020 #15
Seems they're prison riot control ornotna Jun 2020 #16
Hope someone takes lots of face shots so a wide search can be taken randr Jun 2020 #18
When random Feds and mercs run around with no insignia and no recognizable uniform, crickets Jun 2020 #20
The Boogaloo Bois hate police. Look who just gave them ideas. Blue_true Jun 2020 #52
That's even worse than just impersonating them. Oh, the idiocy. nt crickets Jun 2020 #54
Uniforms, and particularly badges, are called a "shield" for good reason. nt Blue_true Jun 2020 #53
Are Their Shirts Brown? DanieRains Jun 2020 #21
They are from the bureau of prisons as reported by CBS Chakaconcarne Jun 2020 #24
I wonder what authority they have over us non-prisoners. BusyBeingBest Jun 2020 #27
Shut up, convict. DO AS YOU'RE TOLD. HuskyOffset Jun 2020 #47
This is exactly what I posted about last night Hope the person who said my hair was on fire... Hekate Jun 2020 #25
2 days now and still no answers. Someone better fucking supply an answer BusyBeingBest Jun 2020 #26
Jack Booted Thugs Simeon Salus Jun 2020 #29
With Turd in the White House, it was always going to be only a matter of time ... Brother Mythos Jun 2020 #36
How will we know if we're in a police state state Mr. Ected Jun 2020 #30
THEY'RE PROBABLY BLACKWATER SECURITY AGENTS blakstoneranger Jun 2020 #31
Those dudes are Federal Corrections Officers BGBD Jun 2020 #65
These guys look more like Blackwater to me BGBD Jun 2020 #66
Picture on the right has American flag upside down on shoulder.. several do.. LiberalArkie Jun 2020 #32
Matthew Miller's one of the few who've (very briefly) said Hortensis Jun 2020 #33
This is Trump following Putin's methods... jimmyzvoice Jun 2020 #35
Trump's SS? rickyhall Jun 2020 #38
Eric Prince mercenary force. sarcasmo Jun 2020 #39
sounds like a Putin tactic RussBLib Jun 2020 #40
DEA? Only Yesterday DallasNE Jun 2020 #42
Undisciplined. Overweight. Frumpy. Tired to look at. Gotta be private militia. TheFourthMind Jun 2020 #44
Trump is so afraid that he has to have his own unauthorized private guards. Lonestarblue Jun 2020 #45
They are building a fortress around the White House... Trueblue Texan Jun 2020 #46
It doesn't matter whether he participates in Joe taking office. Blue_true Jun 2020 #55
I would say that this is the element of fascism that had been missing in trump's reign Poiuyt Jun 2020 #49
Customs and Border Protection. SergeStorms Jun 2020 #51
And this is how Barr has told trump he can get around Posse Comitatus. crickets Jun 2020 #56
Yeah, the criminality of this administration... SergeStorms Jun 2020 #63
Blackshirts struggle4progress Jun 2020 #57
Retweeted.. Exactly What We Were Thinking Cha Jun 2020 #58
They need to be approached by the actual Nat. Guard and asked "Who is your commanding officer?" Blue Owl Jun 2020 #61
This was me last night. Write your Congresscritters & ask to know who these guys are Hekate Jun 2020 #64

Miguelito Loveless

(4,465 posts)
1. So, a heavily armed person with no badge
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 03:17 PM
Jun 2020

no markings of any sort runs screaming at you while pointing a weapon at you and your family: What is a law-abiding, conceal-carry gun owner to do?

Grokenstein

(5,722 posts)
28. This. If they aren't identified as legit law enforcement
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 05:26 PM
Jun 2020

Last edited Wed Jun 3, 2020, 06:37 PM - Edit history (1)

then they have no accountability and no authority and you have every right to defend yourself from whatever they have planned for you. (Spoiler alert: It's not anything good.)

Blue_true

(31,261 posts)
50. I don't know who thought of putting them out there like that.
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 06:35 PM
Jun 2020

It is a horrible idea. The insignia on the uniform and the badge identifying who they work for is what both give police authority to police and protect them from attack.

So, heavily armed men are out on the street with no badges or insignias. What makes them any different from common street gangs in that situation?

C_U_L8R

(45,001 posts)
2. They look more like out of work mall cops on a cosplay date
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 03:17 PM
Jun 2020

On other days, they dress up as furries and you know...

dmr

(28,347 posts)
19. Thanks for this link, it was interesting
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 04:48 PM
Jun 2020

I tell you what, I have an awful pit in my stomach. It's actually making me sick, nauseous.

In America!?!

I don't recognize her anymore. I want to cry.

ace3csusm

(969 posts)
7. Mercenaries on American Land
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 03:25 PM
Jun 2020

How far have we come, what else could they be they dont have badges or identifying peace control marks...This needs to be investigated, who brought them in ...Erik Prince ?

AnotherMother4Peace

(4,243 posts)
8. Contractors, most likely associated w/Eric Prince - what law enforcement authority do they have?
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 03:31 PM
Jun 2020

Very curious. Are their orders to be followed just like police? If they came to my door, what do I do. Can I "stand my ground"? Who are these people? Is there an "under the radar" police force in the U.S.? This is quite frightening.

 

smirkymonkey

(63,221 posts)
41. That's what I was thinking.
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 06:00 PM
Jun 2020

Why would our military show up out of their official uniforms? Is that even legal? I really hope someone is investigating this. If this situation isn't dealt with legally, we can expect a repeat performance on election day. This is so incredibly fucked up.

I really can't believe this is the United States of America.

AnotherMother4Peace

(4,243 posts)
59. No official uniforms. One of the "thugs" had an Under Armour shirt peeking out from under his
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 07:06 PM
Jun 2020

outerwear. No, definitely not official law enforcement or military uniforms.

BComplex

(8,049 posts)
9. Apparently they are CBP; a dangerous, unregulated, unaccountable team created by the Patriot Act/
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 03:36 PM
Jun 2020

Homeland Security Act of 2003. Heavily financed and accountable to nobody.

On edit: Here's a thread where I was asking this question and some DUers had possible answers.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100213532854

2naSalit

(86,579 posts)
14. they would ave to idenitfy themselves
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 04:13 PM
Jun 2020

to take action legally, that is if they have any authority at all.

 

smirkymonkey

(63,221 posts)
43. I don't think it even matters at this point. They have guns and Trump's approval.
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 06:05 PM
Jun 2020

Our municipal police aren't even held accountable. What makes anyone think that Trump's personal paramilitary officers will be?

Expect to see them back in early November.

2naSalit

(86,579 posts)
60. I have no doubt that
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 08:38 PM
Jun 2020

you are correct. As I've said elsewhere, I have been wondering when they would show up. I saw this coming the minute I heard that Eprince and wcheney were working together. I'm just thankful that I was able to secure my location while they were still setting the stage.

2naSalit

(86,579 posts)
62. Obviously they don't and one of our
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 08:39 PM
Jun 2020

challenges is deciding when they aren't going to apply in our minds as well.

crickets

(25,969 posts)
20. When random Feds and mercs run around with no insignia and no recognizable uniform,
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 04:52 PM
Jun 2020

they've invited cosplayers to join in, whether by design or not. Start the countdown for white supremacy groups to ditch the all black and start dressing like these goons. Police and military have uniforms, name badges, and rank insignia for good reason. Setting this precedent is not badass, it's irresponsible and stupid.

Blue_true

(31,261 posts)
52. The Boogaloo Bois hate police. Look who just gave them ideas.
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 06:44 PM
Jun 2020

They hate POC also, but police officers appear to be their first concern, from what I have read about them.

Imagine people like boogaloos being able to cop dress up and get behind police lines. The havoc that they can cause then.

Hekate

(90,674 posts)
25. This is exactly what I posted about last night Hope the person who said my hair was on fire...
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 05:11 PM
Jun 2020

...sees this. I’d paste the link but today am operating off my cellphone because of a planned electrical outage in our neighborhood.

WRITE YOUR CONGRESSIONAL REPS

BusyBeingBest

(8,052 posts)
26. 2 days now and still no answers. Someone better fucking supply an answer
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 05:24 PM
Jun 2020

or the House needs to demand hearings.

Simeon Salus

(1,142 posts)
29. Jack Booted Thugs
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 05:30 PM
Jun 2020

We've been warned for years by the right, and the right wing nutjobs have finally fulfilled their own prophesy.

Brother Mythos

(1,442 posts)
36. With Turd in the White House, it was always going to be only a matter of time ...
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 05:46 PM
Jun 2020

before the jackbooted thugs showed up.

And, here they are.

 

blakstoneranger

(333 posts)
31. THEY'RE PROBABLY BLACKWATER SECURITY AGENTS
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 05:33 PM
Jun 2020

Yes, they're still around (and so is dickhead cheney), they routinely shot at, and killed unarmed citizens during the katrina crisis and we all know what they did in Iraq. DON'T MESS WITH THESE GUYS UNLESS YOU'RE SERIOUS--THEY WILL KILL YOU AS SOON AS LOOK AT YOU. IF THEY GET THE ORDER, THEY WILL SHOOT TO KILL.

 

BGBD

(3,282 posts)
65. Those dudes are Federal Corrections Officers
Thu Jun 4, 2020, 01:37 AM
Jun 2020

You can see the patches on some of them.

Blackwater guys would be much better equipped and wouldn't look like a bunch of out of shape amateurs like a lot of these guys do. This is a SORT team, used to yanking an unruly prisoner out and tossing their cell.

Blackwater guys aren't cheap and won't be manning a line. They'll be posted up at high value spots, and carrying guns.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
33. Matthew Miller's one of the few who've (very briefly) said
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 05:40 PM
Jun 2020

FBI Director James Comey interfered in the election against Hillary Clinton. Repeat, extremely briefly actually, but I saw him make those references probably three times. And at one of them a whole circle of MSNBC talking heads briefly bobbed and murmured agreement before dropping the scalding-hot potato and quick-pivoting to another topic.

RussBLib

(9,008 posts)
40. sounds like a Putin tactic
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 05:57 PM
Jun 2020

When Russia "invaded" Ukraine, lots of soldiers removed all identifying markings from their clothes, so Putin could say he didn't know who they were.

And we know Trump is rather, uh, "beholden" to Putin.

TheFourthMind

(343 posts)
44. Undisciplined. Overweight. Frumpy. Tired to look at. Gotta be private militia.
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 06:05 PM
Jun 2020

Or, ex mall cops as noted by another in this thread. A fifty yard dash by protesters will put them out of commission.

Lonestarblue

(9,981 posts)
45. Trump is so afraid that he has to have his own unauthorized private guards.
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 06:07 PM
Jun 2020

Why should any protester listen to these guys. How are they authorized to arrest anyone? They’re just there because Trump is shaking in his shoes because he only has something like a thousand police officers between him and the big bad peaceful protesters. Obama would be out talking to them. Biden already has been out talking to them. Trump hides in the bunker. What a wienie!

Trueblue Texan

(2,429 posts)
46. They are building a fortress around the White House...
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 06:09 PM
Jun 2020

...so that on inauguration day he will be barricaded in and his personal army will fight to hold his position in office. Far fetched? What is far fetched these days?

Blue_true

(31,261 posts)
55. It doesn't matter whether he participates in Joe taking office.
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 06:58 PM
Jun 2020

Once Joe is President, he is CIC, he can sic the military on anyone refusing to turn over the keys to the White House.

What we need to do is insure that Joe is in position to take office.

Poiuyt

(18,123 posts)
49. I would say that this is the element of fascism that had been missing in trump's reign
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 06:23 PM
Jun 2020

Having jack-booted thugs pushing people around completes it. I will say with confidence that trump and his administration are fascist.

SergeStorms

(19,200 posts)
51. Customs and Border Protection.
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 06:37 PM
Jun 2020

CBP Deploys Border Officers to Washington, D.C. Citing 'Acts Of Domestic Terrorism' Amid George Floyd Protests
By Chantal Da Silva On 6/2/20 at 10:26 AM EDT

S. Customs and Border Protection personnel are being deployed across the country in response to protests over the death of George Floyd, a black man who died after a white police officer, Derek Chauvin, kneeled on his neck for nearly nine minutes during an arrest.

In a statement published on Twitter, Acting CBP Commissioner Mark Morgan said the agency deployed personnel to the National Capital Region, the metropolitan area centered on Washington, D.C.

Morgan said the deployment had been ordered to "assist law enforcement partners" with responding to protests, which he claimed had "devolved into chaos [and] acts of domestic terrorism by groups of radicals [and] agitators."

Read more https://www.newsweek.com/cbp-deploys-border-officers-washington-dc-domestic-terrorism-george-floyd-protests-1508111

crickets

(25,969 posts)
56. And this is how Barr has told trump he can get around Posse Comitatus.
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 06:59 PM
Jun 2020

Congress needs to step on the gas with proceedings to rein Billy in. in the meantime, here's hoping governors can refuse, and have the good sense to do so.

Miami already has kept most of them out.

https://miami.cbslocal.com/2020/06/02/federal-riot-team-miami-washington-d-c/

“I was unaware they were here. We didn’t ask them to be here. We told them we didn’t need them here. There is no reason for them to be here.” said Mayor Gimenez.

“There originally was supposed to be 110 of them, the federal agents, but we turned them away. There were 23 of them, dealing with stuff inside federal prison. They are still staying at the hotel, but they were told they weren’t needed. This is federal stuff going back and forth,” said Miami-Dade Police Director Ramirez.

Director Ramirez added that the federal law enforcement agents have not been used for anything.


The few who remained apparently are not being allowed on the streets. Good.

SergeStorms

(19,200 posts)
63. Yeah, the criminality of this administration...
Wed Jun 3, 2020, 11:45 PM
Jun 2020

knows no bounds. They think they can do, and get away with, anything they want. Thanks to the criminals in the Senate who've been abetting everything TrumpCo. does they have been getting away with it, so far. The republican party needs a good ass whipping this November, and hopefully we can hand them their asses. Let's see how they like it when the shoe is on the other foot for awhile. Sending 20 or so to prison would make a lot of us feel better as well.

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