And depressing.

Weaponized willful ignorance is what it it is.

Than it is to convince them they have been fooled.

I see it in my own family.

I have one sister I can talk to for reals(1 out of 5 family members).

FAUX News took the rest

WWI is no joke.

trump and limbaugh are coordinated and limbaugh calls it a hoax and forcing masks is a dem way to attack trump. people need to consider what would happen if limbaugh didn't lead 1500 radio stations and fox to deny global warming, single, payer, covid, etc.
they used jerome corsi (wikileaks/mueller report) and limbaugh as the october surprise in 2014 to use ebola to get 9 senate seats - why not again with covid? trump is stupid enough to think he could control it.

limbaugh works for putin whether he knows or not - fed by putin tools, and dem investigations and media need to start connecting the dots

tear. I will not utter the standard bromides. I will, however, mourn for the evil and destruction he helped to create.

i was hoping for incurable syphilis

Nope, it’s not and that mask you’re wearing pushes that point home.

That's what happens when cults fall apart and the true believers world is shattered. That's why you see people who in the past who would have been ashamed of their behavior acting the way they do in stories, etc.

I refer to the Faux Fantasyland, of course. The mask situation is a very recent manifestation of that phenomenon.

Every time I hear one of those polls that puts Biden ahead 52 percent to 39 percent, I always think, What the HELL is wrong with that 39 percent? Are those people INSANE or what? What you wrote explains what's wrong with those 39 percent.

-- Ron

nt

It is scary. I won't sleep well until this is over. I only hope I can sleep well afterwards

this isn’t just to make sure trump loses. It’s to neuter this entire faux universe. If those lunatics no longer get any viable representation, the worst GOP can do is Nixon, Raegan or W. And that we can deal with.

None of this is real to them. I've had a few conversations with such. Everything's a conspiracy and a hoax, and every time I have an answer for their conspiracy, they're always moving the goal posts.

to prevent them from even considering anything that might make them change their views, even a little tiny bit. If you present them with facts, arguments, or even questions that might challenge their ideas, they instantly change the subject to something else. From what I've seen it's entirely unconscious and automatic. They don't even realize they're doing it.

day but...." or some variation suggesting it came out of limbaugh's ass - because a lot of it does and they know it.

There's a facemask learning curve that most of us ambled through in March involving homemade masks, Amazon searches, figuring out how long they last and whether the cheap ones at the supermarket are a bargain (they are), and etc. Since nobody in their media-bubble walked them through it, they never figured it out, and won't trouble themselves to do a little googling.

Once they get their free 10-pack of disposable masks somewhere they are probably going to stop grumbling. Every person in the country should have received a free pack with a sheet of instructions six months ago but as far as I know it never happened here, or anywhere that I'm aware of. So they're mad, and not just here.

I live in a sort of bubble because I work in a hospital as a volunteer, my wife is a retired RN and others in my family work in the medical field, so plenty of mask knowledge was already present in our world. After my wife retired she took up quilting as a hobby, bought a very good sewing machine and now can sew just about anything. So masks appeared in our house in late February. Good ones with filters.

She even knew what kind of furnace filters to get to make into filters that will trap a virus.

If this situation worsens and hangs around much longer, people are going to need to learn that some of the things that are passing for masks are not really the best way to go. A cowboy kerchief pulled up over your nose is not the best way to stop the virus from getting into the air.

Of course, this will be another chance for them to say we were wrong when we told them any face covering was okay, so why should they believe us now.

It's all about ignorance and the non-willingness to learn, which unfortunately runs rampant in our society.

but expecting everyone to suddenly start wearing their own was asking a lot, too much for many, even many smart professional people.

p.s. DU was a great resource as usual. Thanks to all who posted links and stories on how to make, find and use a face mask.

Lets call it Republican Alternate Reality Syndrome or RARS.

Little easier to remember and pronounce.

CONservatives might go by a label other than “republican”, as for example, they called themselves democrats a century ago, but it’s the toxic conservative mindset that remains consistent through space and time.

their worldview hinges on being able to control reality by simply pushing whatever talking point foxnews/hate radio/donnie/etc. want to push. their role as foot soldiers is to parrot back those talking points, to shout down anyone who disagrees, etc.

these are partly loyalty tests, partly how they bully their narrative into public discourse, and mostly how they exert and extent their power by simply crowding out and belittling other voices.

kneeling was a never a sign of disrespect ever in any context, until donnie a black man publicly objected to black people being killed by the government. so all of a sudden every republican instantly agreed that kneeling as a sign of disrespect and that they had to rail against that, to crowd out any discussion of the real problem of our government killing black people.


not wearing a mask while an airborne, contagious pandemic is going on, and beyond that, getting in peoples' faces to shout about it, is biological terrorism, and they'd instantly recognize it as such if a bunch of muslims did exactly what they are doing. but critical reasoning and logic are simply not a part of their construction of reality. they get their reality from foxnews, etc.


where i disagree is how vital the mask issue is to them. it's really no more or less vital than any other of their idiotic talking points. donnie has already started wearing a mask, and they're starting to talk about him being ok with it. pretty soon they will say it was his idea all along and he's saved lives by leading on this issue and blah blah blah and his minions will eat up and start wearing masks and forget they ever opposed it.


the point is not any one issue. the point for them is the attacks from outside. any democrat who challenges their worldview is a danger. but foxnews or donnie can change it in a heartbeat, no problem. because it's not about the fact or the issue, it's about who's in charge of determining with reality.

Especially this part:

"kneeling was a never a sign of disrespect ever in any context, until donnie a black man publicly objected to black people being killed by the government. so all of a sudden every republican instantly agreed that kneeling as a sign of disrespect and that they had to rail against that, to crowd out any discussion of the real problem of our government killing black people."

Were part of the collective memory. It took the country acting as a community to get through those. Then came the great fiction that government was bad.

it really is their sole mantra

government was the problem. If it was, why did he want to be in charge of it?

Which many of them were members of before they did a 180 when they got off drugs, got religion and joined AA or had kids.

The world on their own became a scary place and they retreated to their "Safe" childhood era where others did their thinking for them. Hence Limpballs and company, etc., became the parent, the authority figure for many of them.

Conservatives in the Vietnam War era supported Government by and large whereas now, as their hero St Ronnie said: Government IS the problem.

I'm from that era myself and I've witnessed classmates, who once spoke perfect English with no trace of an accent, somehow acquire the most outlandish southern drawl since I last spoke with them. Funny thing is, they all took up different versions, from Alabama to West Virginia style.

Most of those people always were fake though. Don't even get me started on the ones who became cops.

Friends are breaking up and families are splitting over the chasm that propaganda has created.

It’s a cold civil war, thanks to trump, conservatives and their propaganda media.

There are tons of engineers in that world, they know how to do math. And they're damn proud to tell you that.

What they don't seem to have is the ability to apply that skill to new topics, or topics they're not familiar with.

While I try hard not to disparage peoples religious views, there is a very strong anti-enlightenment viewpoint among many evangelical Christian groups. They want the benefits science can bring them, but the greater implication of that science makes them violently angry.

They've had power for the last 40 years. The virus, global warming and a lot of other things are a showing that their beliefs are not simply wrong, but killing them and their fellow humans. They had a choice, but being proudly wrong is easier to swallow than humbly admitting a mistake.

An assertion by a pointy-headed liberal professor who never did an honest day's work in his or her life?

(a true "real man" right-winger would leave off the "or her" because a woman can't possibly be a "real" professor)

They get paid to make these kinds of assertions, so that's why they do it. Just like the so-called climate "scientists" get paid to scare people. By Soros of course.

And what is "equals" anyway? Just a liberal term that they throw around like "equality" and "inequality" to advance their Soros-Hillary-Satan Democrat-Islamo-Maoist agenda.

I know these professors have tricks to "prove" to each other that the two sides of an equation are equivalent. But my brother is a magician and he's got all kinds of tricks too to fool people. We know all the tricks. Nobody fooling us.

Blah blah blah

I highly recommend the book “Fantasyland” by Kurt Anderson, which chronicles America’s delusional relationship with reality from the pilgrims to the present day.

is friction when their perceived reality finally makes contact with actual reality. Actual reality isn't malleable and doesn't give a damn what they believe.

Attributes that do not exist in Faux Fantasyland or, as I like to call it, Dumbfuckistan.

We'd ALL be learning German and Japanese right now...which isn't a bad thing.....but you get my point, right?

and part of a plot by FDR to force socialism on them

I'm ashamed of the mentality of the cult amuriKKKan today....and there are MILLIONS of them. Just sad.

Conservatives see their ideology dying, and they are fighting to keep it alive, the only way they know how.

There were plenty of them around then, & earlier.

What they didn't have then was the internet & a collection of forums that allowed them to band together and reinforce each other. They had the "Letters to the Editor" in the local paper, cultish churches, fringy organizations - not much else.

'No shirt no shoes no service'

They are still occasionally seen once in awhile.

Reefer Madness, McCarthyism, justification for Vietnam. They have been selling themselves and their base a customized fiction for a century.

It is to sow dissent. To create animosity between groups. It is to break up "e pluribus unum".

would be widely accepted and implemented but then you remember how long it took people to accept protections like seat belts, larger toys, helmets for motorcycles, etc.

It isn’t until laws are passed, forcing us to keep from killing ourselves, that lifesaving practices are accepted. And then there’s still a lot of grudges.

I'm probably going to use it.

There has always been this contingent in our population.
Right wing radio has just increased their numbers and their rabidness.

Here are the details about the seat belt fight:
[link:https://www.businessinsider.com/when-americans-went-to-war-against-seat-belts-2020]

Here's a corrected one (last two characters got dropped in your post):
https://www.businessinsider.com/when-americans-went-to-war-against-seat-belts-2020-5

All I found in the article that constituted going to war was that some people cut them out of their own cars and some went to court. Nothing comparable to screaming tirades and physical violence.

like they now scream in the face of people wearing masks

Car salesmen didn't fear being assaulted for only selling cars with seatbelts like grocery store workers fear assault from anti-maks customers

There has been a huge increase in the daily lvel of political violence

I refused to wear a seat belt for years after they came out. I rationalized it by saying I couldn't escape a burning or sinking car as easily, but the statistics were overwhelming that they saved many more lives than the rare one that was lost, and I acknowledged that as that info came out. I just didn't want to, damned if I understand why now.

I finally started wearing it when my son was in drivers ed. It was more his worry over me than the speil he gave me that made me start belting up. And now I won't even pull out of the driveway without it on.

I've never seen anything in life that compares to the anti-mask fervor of today. It's fueled by a political polarization so extreme that it's cultish. Just as with cults, a whole different reality is embraced.

watch Fox or who are not Trump supporters.

"Liberal Democrats are the most likely to say they have worn masks (83% say they’ve done so all or most of the time, vs. 71% of moderate Democrats)."


https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2020/06/23/most-americans-say-they-regularly-wore-a-mask-in-stores-in-the-past-month-fewer-see-others-doing-it/


Still lots of people not wearing masks as they should be - I am literally sitting 25 feet away from my neighbors (immigrants and staunch Democrats) having yet another mask-less pool party with 20 people in attendance, half of which are over the age of 60.

secondary and tertiary audience all over the country, including conservative democrats, family, neighbors, coworkers and people living in places where the dumbshit dittoheads sneer at masks

Not all that sure about that.

I guess there can a version of peer pressure, but I'd think the fact that we're dealing with an honest to goodness pandemic where masks are one of the only things between us and possible sickness would be enough to override it - especially by those who understand the consequences.

First, there is a tendency for some people to let their guard down around friends and family. For example, they'll wear a mask in an elevator with strangers, but take it off when they get inside of an office or inside the home of someone they're visiting.

Then there's the issue of those who are ignoring the pandemic completely, as if they have no idea what's going on. Long lines at the club, department stores, etc. I have no idea what they're thinking, or if they're thinking. My brother still regularly works out at the gym, maskless, because he says life must go on. He says it's impossible to find home gym equipment and he prioritizes being in shape over staying safe from corona. I finally stopped the nice talk and scolded him and he promised to wear a mask when he goes out, but there's no telling if he has done it or not.

At the end if the day, Americans simply aren't used to the mask lifestyle and there's still a huge learning curve involved. In some cases, it might be necessary to buy masks for them otherwise it won't get done.

but social media, etc - along with the general cultural reverence for stupid and disdain of "smartness" in the US
There were crazies and wackos in the past to be sure - but they couldn't connect with the others as easy as it is now.

Couple that with the very real erosion of any concern for the public by a substantial protection of government, business, etc - along with the exposed failure of these "institution" by the very same "new media" of the internet and you get what we have now.

We continue to miss the very real historical shift in power in terms of controlling and/or disseminating information: spoken to print, print to radio, radio to TV, TV to internet. All extremely powerful changes happening right now at an even faster pace than before.


They say Hitler was one of the first to really USE radio
Reagan may have been the "movie" president
Clinton may have been the spark that created all the cable news TV
Trump is the product of the slide between the worst of TV (reality tv, sensational news, etc) and the Internet of crack pots, hate, etc

I don't think we have yet seen the full "reveal" of the future of all this. The massive amounts of "behind the scenes" either by bots, putin, zuckerber's frankenstein (facebook), along with tracking and AI are all in the infant stages. That's one of the main reasons we have to get the fascist out of office and start rebuilding what we want the future to be.

That forcing you to wear a seat belt violates your rights than the argument that requiring you to wear a mask violates your rights.

If you don't wear a seatbelts, maybe if you have an accident, you could die. You're stupid but you don't kill someone else.

If you don't wear a mask, you might spread a virus and kill someone.

There is no scientific reality to a true believer. It is as simple as that.

Those who accept that the invisible can cause great destruction are acting in ways meant to reduce dangers to self and other.
Others who deny (diminish) the need to protect their selves or others are acting in ways congruent with increasing the danger.

Now, if one is wrong about the danger, using masks and distancing causes no harm; mask sellers get richer.
However if the other is wrong, people die; masklessness manifests moral miasma; morticians get richer.

And there is no way to live with them in anything like our current society moving forward. They cannot live with us, and we cannot live with them. I think we are all in for some really sucky times. I see no magic solution to this problem moving forward.

The racists refuse to accept that Obama is better than Trump in any way.

Trump failed in his handling of this virus along with everything else.

They want to believe that the virus was something liberals did to trump to hurt him.

Seat belt usage was shockingly low prior to the implementation of mandatory laws (around 14% in the United States). And there was very shrill objection when states began to implement them.

When seatbelt interlocks were added to vehicles in the 1970s, there was a booming business for garages that would clandestinely disconnect them.

I can also remember the reaction when cities began to required owners to pick up their pet's waste (poop-scooper laws). Despite substantial evidence that it was a serious public health problem, there were many who claimed that this was tyrannical government overreach. Most people were sick of stepping in it, but it took a while for everyone to get on-board (and there are still those who are not).

We've also been through this with resistance to 2nd-hand tobacco smoke.

25 years ago. (it is the law now-) And I know someone who died by not having a bicycle helmet. That happened 50 years ago,and it wasn't the law then either.

...Lots and lots of people had to die, before people buckled up. People talked about those that died, and passed it on...So and so died because he/she did not wear a seat belt. Same thing here. Smart people know the truth. And the truth is very simple. "You wear a mask

....Non believers are the same as they were before. You don't need a mask because it ain't that bad, ain't that bad. And, "It ain't going to happen to me." But after someone you know was killed because.."no seat belt" and word got out that so and so got killed...well then people buckled up. Eventually, states passed laws that said, ...."You must wear a seat belt And, after a while, even though most of us were buckled up already, then the rest buckled up. And, most important...parents wanted their children to buckle up, so their children did not die a horrible early death..So the kids got used to wearing seat belts, and now everyone wears one. It ain't a hoax, it is a safety measure to protect your family..

....Same damn story..The anti-maskers are much too stupid and anti- rulers, to know the solid truth. It is a very simple safety measure to protect your life..not some hoax put out by someone to order you to do something..

....So they don't get it, and many will die. I wear a mask almost all the time. Very uncomfortable..but pneumonia is far more uncomfortable.. I've been there with pneumonia, and I don't want it again, ever.

But they did make up stories about how "yer more likely to survive if yer thrown clear of the car." Or "If you drive into a lake yer gonna drown cuz you won't be able to get your seatbelt off." Just like they're making up stories now about how "masks actually cause more deaths than not wearing one." Stupid fucks.

never be "united" states ever again.

rethugs are just anti-safety

Reagan beat Carter.

I was pretty young at the time, but that does not seem like a result you get when people are not living in fantasyland

I’m late to the party, but I love the post. People get their beliefs from the social group they inhabit. They believe what their friends believe.

It’s so simple, everybody ignores it.

Until this original post.

Well done.

f*cked up. I checked out a rightwing forum and was shocked to see the majority of posters still think it's all a big hoax. The infected numbers and deaths are all fake. It's all an attempt to bring trump down. I assume that anyone who attempts to inject reality is swiftly banned.

I read an article, I think in the NYT, about America's not very great relationship with with public health. Basically it outlined how Americans, since the beginning, have had a problem with not only funding public health, but acting in pro-public health ways. The population since yellow fever, diphtheria and smallpox has had a substantial percentage that just didn't want to go along with what was prescribed during outbreaks of health problems. In fact, people resisted the smallpox vaccine until they made it the law. The same thing that is happening now has been around since forever in this country.