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wtmusic

(39,166 posts)
Tue Oct 9, 2012, 11:14 AM Oct 2012

A message for those who claim "taxing the rich hurts the economy".

Last edited Tue Oct 9, 2012, 12:35 PM - Edit history (1)

Let's get something straight right now - your taxes are 1/4 of what they were under Eisenhower, who actually ran budget surpluses AND grew the economy. Sure the deficit is high - the government can't pay its bills. Just like under Reagan who added $2 trillion to the national debt (see graph).

You say government doesn't work, that it's ineffective? That's because you're fucking STRANGLING it.



"Why the Wealthy Must Pay More

I understand. Nobody wants to pay more taxes. We all want to keep more. But the facts remain: Deficits have risen as tax rates on the wealthy have declined. See the first and third charts that appear below.

In fact, the overall tax rate on individuals has declined. See the second chart that appears below. Taxes as a percent of GDP have declined as profits as a percent of GDP have risen!

I hear you about the lower 50 percent of earners not paying any net taxes, but think about it. They don’t earn much. On average, about $25,000 per year (the 50th-percentile income is about $50,000). Let’s say we have a $500 billion annual budget shortfall and you can get half of the lower earners (35 million people making, say, between $25,000 and $50,000 per year) to pay $500 per year. You’ve raised a total of $17 billion. Not even a dent."

http://www.thebusinessowner.com/blog/2011/06/why-the-wealthy-must-pay-more

11 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
A message for those who claim "taxing the rich hurts the economy". (Original Post) wtmusic Oct 2012 OP
K&R HopeHoops Oct 2012 #1
K&R Wednesdays Oct 2012 #2
Good post! Bookmarked. nt Tennessee Gal Oct 2012 #3
As a complement to that, a look at where those burdens lay: JHB Oct 2012 #4
That is...awesome. wtmusic Oct 2012 #6
Excellent work. (edited) A HERETIC I AM Oct 2012 #10
There's a number of factors... JHB Oct 2012 #11
. n/t porphyrian Oct 2012 #5
Kick JHB Oct 2012 #7
Not exactly true taught_me_patience Oct 2012 #8
The graph shows the top marginal rate wtmusic Oct 2012 #9

JHB

(37,160 posts)
4. As a complement to that, a look at where those burdens lay:
Tue Oct 9, 2012, 12:37 PM
Oct 2012

Below is a chart I made showing CPI inflation-adjusted tax bracket thresholds based on numbers from the Federal Individual Income Tax Rates History of The Tax Foundation (http://www.taxfoundation.org/taxdata/show/151.html).

This chart just shows the taxable-income levels where one rate changed to the next. (Perhaps someone with better graphic presentation skills can get a better version). It doesn't show the rates themselves (go to the link above for the charts).

What I mainly wanted to show when I made this is how we treated income levels in the tax system in the past, which is a separate issue from what the rates actually were. For instance, during Obama's presidency there have been lots of arguments about raising taxes on income over $250,000 (often framed as "is $250 thousand/year 'rich'?&quot . In comparison, in 1955 there were 24 tax brackets (4 times as many as now). 16 of them, two-thirds of that number, affected taxable incomes over the equivalent of $250K. The highest bracket (the 91% one) affected income over ~$1.6million. OMG, Class Warfare! Socialism! Marxism!

And we know what sort of people were calling the president 'communist' back then. Birchers and other ranting cranks.

wtmusic

(39,166 posts)
6. That is...awesome.
Tue Oct 9, 2012, 12:42 PM
Oct 2012

(in the non-colloquial sense of the word). Great work.

The only thing that's trickling down on that chart is revenue.

A HERETIC I AM

(24,368 posts)
10. Excellent work. (edited)
Tue Oct 9, 2012, 07:32 PM
Oct 2012

For all their faults and all their greatness, my parents generation seemed to elect much smarter congress persons than we do.


Fwiw, I am a latter stage baby boomer, born in '59



Edit; or perhaps these days, the smart ones just don't want to run for office. Instead, we get morons on science committees that think the earth is 9000 years old. And the rest of the civilized world looks on and scratches its head and says " how did those nimrods ever make it to the moon?"

JHB

(37,160 posts)
11. There's a number of factors...
Wed Oct 10, 2012, 07:51 AM
Oct 2012

For instance, back in their generation there were limits to how much you could toss around "socialism" and "marxist" when there were actual other countries to point to as counterexamples. Sure there were areas where it played well, but elsewhere you had to use circumlocutions like "slippery slope" or just look like a damn fool. Plus once the Russians launched Sputnik there was a big push for science education, and the the dogs and firehoses against civil rights demonstrators was perfect Soviet-propaganda-fodder for a newly-decolonialized world, so the sheer fact that it made us look bad helped push the federal government to supporting voting rights and desegregation.


Then there's the rise of television advertising in politics (and televangelism), and the fundraising incentives that developed. People were more likely to cough up some dough if you pushed their hot buttons, and conservative direct-mailers like Richard Viguerie had the expertise and resources to do it. They were intended to be divisive because the intent was to break up the New Deal coalition.

Pile on top of that wealthy interests and corporations following the strategies of the Powell Memo, investing in think tanks and media resources to provide a more Washington-friendly intellectual/technocratic veneer to conservative policies, thickening the fogbank

And that's just some of it.

 

taught_me_patience

(5,477 posts)
8. Not exactly true
Tue Oct 9, 2012, 04:49 PM
Oct 2012

it depends on where the top marginal rate starts... and that will have a big impact on total income tax burden.

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