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humbled_opinion

(4,423 posts)
Sun Nov 4, 2012, 09:53 PM Nov 2012

Think tank recommends big benefits cuts

A new report by a liberal-leaning think tank recommends a dramatic overhaul of military pay, retirement and health care benefits as part of a $1 trillion cut in defense spending over 10 years.

The Center for American Progress calls for capping pay raises, eliminating military health benefits for many retirees who are covered by an employer-provided plan, and reducing the value of military retired pay as well as making retirees wait until age 60 to start receiving it.

Recommendations are included in a report, Rebalancing Our National Security, released Oct. 31 by the progressive think tank and advocacy group. The report opposes across-the-board cuts in defense spending that could occur beginning in January under sequestration but still calls for major reductions in defense spending.

http://www.airforcetimes.com/news/2012/11/military-think-tank-recommends-big-benefit-cuts-110112w/



This story ran in the Airforce Times and I got bombarded by the Teabags at my job that this somehow represents the Presidents second term agenda. I need ammo..

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Think tank recommends big benefits cuts (Original Post) humbled_opinion Nov 2012 OP
I do not think this will fly. This isn't the promise they made to the military who made a southernyankeebelle Nov 2012 #1
If they read the report, they can see it is from an think tank SickOfTheOnePct Nov 2012 #2
True but humbled_opinion Nov 2012 #3
I do find it odd SickOfTheOnePct Nov 2012 #5
Actually, much of this has been proposed by the administration already. woo me with science Nov 2012 #9
Well, I absolutely can't support getting rid of a defined benefit pension SickOfTheOnePct Nov 2012 #10
I have never seen a budget 'pie' chart, benld74 Nov 2012 #4
The devil is in the details. Cerridwen Nov 2012 #6
I agree SickOfTheOnePct Nov 2012 #7
Thanks. Let me go read that part so I can Cerridwen Nov 2012 #8
The baggers will say humbled_opinion Nov 2012 #11
Fortunately, I'm on a democratic board (edited) Cerridwen Nov 2012 #12
I can't and won't support this n/t SickOfTheOnePct Nov 2012 #13
+1 JRLeft Nov 2012 #15
And frankly, they would be right n/t SickOfTheOnePct Nov 2012 #14
Kick woo me with science Nov 2012 #16
 

southernyankeebelle

(11,304 posts)
1. I do not think this will fly. This isn't the promise they made to the military who made a
Sun Nov 4, 2012, 09:59 PM
Nov 2012

career and are going to retire or retired. They will never get people in the military to serve. They have to have incentives for them to reenlist and make it a career. I know my father, father-in-law and my husband all retired to have those benefits they earned.

SickOfTheOnePct

(7,290 posts)
2. If they read the report, they can see it is from an think tank
Sun Nov 4, 2012, 10:00 PM
Nov 2012

and not the Administration.

I can't say that I agree with all of it, but it certainly isn't coming from the White House.

humbled_opinion

(4,423 posts)
3. True but
Sun Nov 4, 2012, 10:07 PM
Nov 2012

Obviously the teabaggers claim that Progressives run the administration and that this is a liberal progressive think tank that the admin takes input from, in other words they claim this is the catalyst for the actions that Obama ultimately takes...

I guess I could just tell them that Democrats are not really supportive of taking any benefits away from the military and would fight against any President that would try.. and see how that goes..

SickOfTheOnePct

(7,290 posts)
5. I do find it odd
Sun Nov 4, 2012, 10:10 PM
Nov 2012

that a progressive think tank would advocate eliminating a defined benefit plan in favor of a defined contribution plan.

woo me with science

(32,139 posts)
9. Actually, much of this has been proposed by the administration already.
Sun Nov 4, 2012, 10:59 PM
Nov 2012

Read the article, and do a search on DU for previous posts about Tricare and military benefit changes proposed by the administration. Several of us posted quite angrily about it when the DOD plan was in the news. There is a difference between cutting back on drones and bloody empire, and cutting promised pensions and benefits for retirees who spent years uprooting their families and leaving them for years at a time to live and serve where the government told them to.

There is no evidence whatsoever that the administration would be opposed to these measures, and quite a bit of evidence that they would embrace at least a very large part of it.

SickOfTheOnePct

(7,290 posts)
10. Well, I absolutely can't support getting rid of a defined benefit pension
Sun Nov 4, 2012, 11:00 PM
Nov 2012

for retired military members. Putting it off until they're older is one thing, but doing away with it completely is unacceptable, IMO.

benld74

(9,909 posts)
4. I have never seen a budget 'pie' chart,
Sun Nov 4, 2012, 10:10 PM
Nov 2012

that show how much of the overall military budget is spent on 'human' needs, pay, health, housing etc. You always see the portion spent on SS and Medicare though.
WOuld be nice if the military can get more detailed on their budget rather than just lumping everything into military spending.\
I go a feeling people would be really suprized.

Cerridwen

(13,260 posts)
6. The devil is in the details.
Sun Nov 4, 2012, 10:13 PM
Nov 2012

Just doing a quick skim over the report which, as noted, is a recommendation, it looks like the health care issue is about reducing the inefficiencies in health care services. As to pay, it's about giving the Pentagon what it asked for, smaller pay increases, than what the congress voted for; that is, congress ignored the Pentagon's requests and gave them more than they asked and this think tank says give them just what the Pentagon asked for.

As I said, it was a quick scan as the document is 119 pages.

Here's the think tank link: http://www.americanprogress.org/issues/security/report/2012/10/31/43074/rebalancing-our-national-security/

Here's the .pdf of the report: http://www.americanprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/UnifiedSecurityBudget.pdf


As usual, the facts leading to the truth don't fit on a bumper sticker.

SickOfTheOnePct

(7,290 posts)
7. I agree
Sun Nov 4, 2012, 10:16 PM
Nov 2012

The pay and health benefits issue I understand, as the government has already taken away incentives for retired military members to use their health benefits.

What's striking to me is the idea of doing away with the defined benefit retirement. At a time when public sector unions are fighting to keep defined benefit retirement plans, it seems strange to advocate taking such a benefit away from military members.

Cerridwen

(13,260 posts)
8. Thanks. Let me go read that part so I can
Sun Nov 4, 2012, 10:18 PM
Nov 2012

understand better what you're saying.

edit with updated info: Is this the portion to which you refer?

GD Hosts - this is a public document meant for public consumption and I'm not sure if the four-paragraph rule applies - please let me know if it does and I'll edit it down.

First, I have to note I hate the transition to 401(k)s. Having said that, they make some pretty good arguments for updating a system that's been in place since the 40s and which denies retirement benefits to those who've fought in our most recent wars. The "vesting structure" looks almost punitive the way it is presented here.

Retirement—$13 billion a year in the near term, as much as $70 billion per year
within 30 years


The Pentagon also calls for an overhaul of its retirement program in its fiscal year
2013 budget request. In the document, Secretary Panetta calls on Congress to
authorize the creation of a Military Retirement Modernization Commission. The
commission would be designed to help Congress and the Pentagon make the
politically difficult decisions necessary to reform the military’s outdated retirement
system, which has been long criticized for its inequality, inflexibility, and high costs.


The military retirement program, which has not been significantly updated since
the 1940s, adheres to a strict vesting structure—personnel with at least 20 years of
service receive a substantial pension for life; personnel who serve less than 20 years
receive no retirement benefits whatsoever. In addition, those who qualify to receive
benefits can begin collecting their pension immediately upon retiring, allowing
many military retirees to begin receiving retirement pay in their late 30s or early 40s.


This type of vesting system leads to three major problems. First, the vast majority
of veterans—particularly enlisted personnel—leave the service with no retirement
benefits: Only 17 percent of service members remain in the force long enough to
qualify for the military’s retirement program.114 Perhaps most troubling, enlisted
troops in ground-combat units in the Army and the Marines—the men and
women who have borne the brunt of the fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan— are
among the least likely to achieve any retirement benefits.115


Second, the military’s retirement system restricts the ability of the Department
of Defense to manage the size and skillset of the force. Due to the 20-year vesting
requirement, Pentagon managers are reluctant to separate personnel who have
served more than 10 years but less than 20, not wanting to leave service members
without a job and retirement savings. As a result, the Department of Defense is
forced to either separate service members early in their careers or keep them until
they reach 20 years, even if they are underperforming, unhappy, or ill-suited to the
immediate needs of the military.


Lastly, while the military’s retirement program serves only a small minority of the
force, it provides an exceedingly generous benefit, often providing 40 years of pen-
sion payments in return for 20 years of service. As a result, the program now costs
taxpayers more than $100 billion per year, an exceedingly steep price tag for a pro-
gram hampered by serious flaws.116 This number is projected to double by 2034.
49 Center for American Progress | Institute for Policy Studies | Rebalancing Our National Security


Certainly Secretary Panetta is right to draw attention to the military’s troubled retire-
ment system, but a third military retirement commission is unnecessary. In recent
years the Department of Defense has carried out two separate studies of the flaws in
the military retirement system— one by the Defense Business Board and another
by the Quadrennial Review of Military Compensation—and both have already
provided the Pentagon and Congress with answers to its retirement problem.


We urge Secretary Panetta to use his authority to work with Congress to reform
the system by replacing the current retirement system with a 401(k)-style defined
contribution plan. Compensation incentives such as gate-and-separation pays
should also be used to assist with force shaping. Under our 401(k) model—
based on the recommendations of the Pentagon’s Defense Business Board—the
Pentagon would contribute at least 16 percent of each service members’ base pay
annually, about twice the average private-sector contribution.117


Further, gate-pay awards—given to service members when they achieve a speci-
fied year of service—would help Pentagon managers encourage people to stay in
the force, while separation pays—awarded to personnel who choose to leave the
force—could be used to provide an incentive for personnel to leave. Such reforms
would greatly decrease the number of veterans leaving the force without any
retirement benefits, increase the Pentagon’s force management options, and begin
to address the long-term fiscal challenges facing the retirement system.


In making our recommendations we understand that it is imperative changes
to the military retirement system do not negatively affect service members who
have planned their retirement around these benefits. We contend, however, that it
would be wrong to allow so many of the men and women who have fought in Iraq
and Afghanistan to remain on a system that will deny the vast majority of them
any retirement benefits.

Specifically, we recommend a three-part transition to a 401(k)-based retirement
system.


• Military personnel with more than 10 years of service would have the option to
either remain in the current system or switch to the 401(k).
• Personnel with less than 10 years of service would have the option of enroll-
ing in the new 401(k) system or enrolling in a slightly modified version of the
current pension system, which would vest at 10 years but provide slightly less
50 Center for American Progress | Institute for Policy Studies | Rebalancing Our National Security retired pay—40 percent of base pay at 20 years, rather than the 50 percent per-
mitted under the current system. It would begin paying out at age 60.
• All new recruits would automatically enroll in the 401(k) system.
If left unreformed, military retirement costs are projected to grow to $217 billion
by 2034.118 Military pay and health care reform will allow the Pentagon to achieve
substantial savings in the near term. Retirement reform, however, presents the
greatest opportunity for savings. Implementing these recommendations would
allow savings of approximately $13 billion per year in the near term. Even more
importantly these reforms would hold the government’s retirement costs at some-
where between $114 billion and $146 billion in FY 2034, ensuring savings of at
least $70 billion in that year.119


humbled_opinion

(4,423 posts)
11. The baggers will say
Sun Nov 4, 2012, 11:10 PM
Nov 2012

that if I support anyting like this than I should also favor a complete overhaul of Social Security for the younger generation for many of the same reasons you just cited...

Cerridwen

(13,260 posts)
12. Fortunately, I'm on a democratic board (edited)
Sun Nov 4, 2012, 11:12 PM
Nov 2012

so I don't have to tap-dance with the binary-thinking, two-dimensional baggers who can't see beyond their hate-filled rhetoric.

edited to add: oops, sorry. This post is no help to you at all. I got distracted and then realized this read rather shitty. I'm sorry. I'll leave it up though so any replies that might happen don't look funky and out of sorts.

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