Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

Are_grits_groceries

(17,111 posts)
Sun Nov 18, 2012, 10:47 AM Nov 2012

Pentagon Spends $100,000 to Answer the Question ‘Did Jesus Die for Klingons Too?’

<snip>
The Washington Times reports that Oklahoma Senator Tom Coburn has brought to light some of the Pentagon’s non-security focused spending, which–as a small-government Republican–he naturally wants cut. Buried among the list of things the Pentagon supposedly spent money on, including a new form of rolled-up beef jerky, is this little gem:

$100,000 for a 2011 workshop on interstellar space travel that included a session entitled “Did Jesus die for Klingons too?” The session probed how Christian theology would apply in the event of the discovery of aliens.


We’re unsure how a workshop focusing on the hypothetical mixture of Star Trek and Christian doctrine cost $100,000, unless they actually hosted it in space, but perhaps that new rolled-up beef jerky is expensive to cater.

This isn’t the first time Klingons and Jesus have been thrown into the same mix. There’s actually a website called Klingons for Jesus, which satirically claims, “Jesus is the messiah the Klingons have been waiting for all along.”

Sadly, it appears the $100,000 question was never actually answered.
http://betabeat.com/2012/11/pentagon-spends-100000-to-answer-the-question-did-jesus-die-for-klingons-too/

Well they could have at least answered the question!
Morons on many levels.

18 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Pentagon Spends $100,000 to Answer the Question ‘Did Jesus Die for Klingons Too?’ (Original Post) Are_grits_groceries Nov 2012 OP
Maybe not totally stupid. Jackpine Radical Nov 2012 #1
That's exactly what I was thinking. Christian eschatology could be a national security msanthrope Nov 2012 #4
I feel so much safer. 99Forever Nov 2012 #2
i'm fine with this Enrique Nov 2012 #3
I think the answer is that Coburn is painting with a broad brush HereSince1628 Nov 2012 #5
+10^100 JHB Nov 2012 #14
Very TRUE! We do need oversight, but... reACTIONary Nov 2012 #15
I support them using this to bring attention to the Pentagon's outrageous budget... nt Comrade_McKenzie Nov 2012 #6
So when do we see edhopper Nov 2012 #7
Maybe more appropriate PATRICK Nov 2012 #8
Direct link to coburn's spin and the "report" Cerridwen Nov 2012 #9
Read 'The Men Who Stare At Goats' if Are_grits_groceries Nov 2012 #10
The point is, we should be examining the truly Cerridwen Nov 2012 #13
They could have asked me, I would have provided an answer for $65,000 demwing Nov 2012 #11
Coburn feels threatened that nadinbrzezinski Nov 2012 #12
+10 !!! (NT) reACTIONary Nov 2012 #18
Forgive them, for they know not what they do... reACTIONary Nov 2012 #16
Unfortunitly, Dr. Weidemann's paper is not yet available on line... reACTIONary Nov 2012 #17

Jackpine Radical

(45,274 posts)
1. Maybe not totally stupid.
Sun Nov 18, 2012, 10:52 AM
Nov 2012

It's nice to have some idea of how the lunatics in your society might respond to some eventuality such as a successful SETI contact. Will the snake handlers & flat-earthers go off the deep end? Will they think the aliens are demons? $100K isn't a great deal of money in Pentagon terms. Just a couple of toilet seats & a dozen hammers…

 

msanthrope

(37,549 posts)
4. That's exactly what I was thinking. Christian eschatology could be a national security
Sun Nov 18, 2012, 11:00 AM
Nov 2012

concern, particularly if some dipshits wanna usher in the Final Days.

Enrique

(27,461 posts)
3. i'm fine with this
Sun Nov 18, 2012, 10:58 AM
Nov 2012

for one thing $100,000 is essentially $0.00 by budget standards.

And despite the silly title, the topic sounds like something worth thinking about, and I have no problem with the government sponsoring it. It all depends on the context, it could be part of a very important program.

HereSince1628

(36,063 posts)
5. I think the answer is that Coburn is painting with a broad brush
Sun Nov 18, 2012, 11:01 AM
Nov 2012

The questionable presentation title, and its session don't sum to the whole of the workshop.

I came to science during the reign of Senator Proxmire's "Golden Fleece" award regularly denoucing science funding.

He mangaged to cut funding for one of my profs at SIU who wanted a device that measured human male erections, that deviced was needed for studies trying to distinguish psychological from cardiovascular causes of erectile dysfunction that are revealed by tumesence during sleep.

The answers to that research were part of the foundation on which the multi-billion dollar industry treating erectile dysfunction are based.

Over many years of watching politicians complain about things they don't understand I've learned that cheap shots questioning funding for research or meetings are mostly about the opportunity to score a cheap shot.


reACTIONary

(5,770 posts)
15. Very TRUE! We do need oversight, but...
Sun Nov 18, 2012, 11:45 AM
Nov 2012

...oversight is very different from grandstanding and taking cheep shots just for the publicity. A year or so ago there was a "golden fleece" type article ridiculing robotic research. They complained about a robot that was programmed to start with a disorganized heap of towels and fold them into a neat stack. This was ridiculed as a waste of money simply because the robot took longer to finish than a human being could.

Anyone who knows ANYTHING at all about robotics, artificial intelligence and machine perception would tell you how complicated a feat this was and how much of an advance this research represented. But we have these ideological megalomaniacs dis'ing real accomplishment.

PATRICK

(12,228 posts)
8. Maybe more appropriate
Sun Nov 18, 2012, 11:07 AM
Nov 2012

would be the absolute recognition that the Pentagon has zero relevance in interplanetary relations on any level would make out passing out the crucifixes the only viable option. Maybe in shedding the weapons and uniforms and wearing white robes, waving palm fronds and releasing doves to show we have religious value would elicit pity if not fool them.

I doubt there is any imaginative or rational planning done about something so speculative or unprecedented. They have trouble enough coping with Earth crap and it shows completely in how they blow money on blowing smoke.

Cerridwen

(13,258 posts)
9. Direct link to coburn's spin and the "report"
Sun Nov 18, 2012, 11:08 AM
Nov 2012

First, you'll notice coburn goes for the low hanging fruit; stuff easy to ridicule when taken out of context and which he can trust will never be looked at more closely. Next you'll notice, he's worried these "silly" expenditures take away from our ability to make bigger and badder...well, let me quote him here:

The $67.9 billion in savings in the “Department of Everything” report could pay for a third of the cost of the planned fleet of new strategic bombers for the Air Force. It could, likewise, pay a third of the cost of the fleet of Ohio-class replacement nuclear submarines for the Navy. For the Army, $16 billion over ten years – about 25 percent of the savings in the report – could mean robust funding for modernization or purchase of new rifles and light machine guns for every soldier.


His site: http://www.coburn.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/pressreleases?ContentRecord_id=e3ace3df-25a9-47c4-8c43-1403e134ce11

Direct link to the .pdf report: http://coburn.senate.gov/public//index.cfm?a=Files.Serve&File_id=00783b5a-f0fe-4f80-90d6-019695e52d2d

A quote about the "Klingon" controversy in the report:

Further, DARPA paid nearly $100,000 for a strategy planning workshop on the 100 Year Starship project last year included an interesting discussion involving the Klingons, a fictional alien species who were villains and then later allies of humanity in the Star Trek series. The session entitled “Did Jesus die for Klingons too?” featured philosophy professor Christian Weidemann of Germany’s Ruhr-University Bochum who pondered the theological conflict to Christianity if intelligent life was found on other planets.

This September, the 100-Year Starship organization spent $21,000 from the Pentagon to host another gathering for space travel enthusiasts.53 The focus of the meeting was to discuss how to get a manned spaceship to a planet in another solar system within the next century – a goal described as “most grandiose ... at a time when only two nations – neither of them the United States, at least currently – can send humans into space.”54

Most of the sessions were out-of-this-world. Participants discussed very long-distance
traveling that would take thousands of years, proposing either we need to create much faster spaceships or to manipulate space-time to accommodate our human needs.55 The ship would likely be propelled by a “warp bubble,” but a scientist with the National Aeronautics and Space Administration (NASA) researching such a possibility cautioned “nobody should get excited at this point.”56 He further noted the type of energy needed would costs tens of billions of dollars per gram to produce.57


Space exploration should never get in the way of our ability to wage war.

There are additional links to the programs themselves which appear to be more interested in research for advancement than research to wage war.

If tom coburn told me the sky was blue, I'd grab a gas mask before checking to see what they were pumping in the atmosphere. his "reports" would make bernays blush.

Never, ever, take this guy or his flunkies at their word...never.


Are_grits_groceries

(17,111 posts)
10. Read 'The Men Who Stare At Goats' if
Sun Nov 18, 2012, 11:18 AM
Nov 2012

you want to find some interesting government research. They dabble at anything and everything.

Cerridwen

(13,258 posts)
13. The point is, we should be examining the truly
Sun Nov 18, 2012, 11:32 AM
Nov 2012

horrific stuff rather than being distracted by the "silly" shit.

coburn is about distracting from the horrific by focusing on the "silly". It's an effective way to paint the government as useless and worse.

I'd rather not help them with their propaganda catapulting.

 

demwing

(16,916 posts)
11. They could have asked me, I would have provided an answer for $65,000
Sun Nov 18, 2012, 11:18 AM
Nov 2012

roughly the total of my student loans. I wouldn't even need to see the cash. just wipe out my debt.

The answer is "No."

Klingons are fictional.
Jesus is fictional.
If Jesus died for Klingons, it was a fictional death, and only matters in a fictional setting.


 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
12. Coburn feels threatened that
Sun Nov 18, 2012, 11:24 AM
Nov 2012

DoD is taking seriously the findings of xeno biology. It is just a matter of time and when it happens, some sections of Christianity (Yes Senator I am looking at you) will go into denial or end of the world thinking.

You might argue about the cost, but hey, Coburn should be careful. I guarantee this conference funded more than just a conference. It's like those $400.00 hammers of years past.

As to food...yes, it's expensive to develop. And yes, troops need to eat.

reACTIONary

(5,770 posts)
17. Unfortunitly, Dr. Weidemann's paper is not yet available on line...
Sun Nov 18, 2012, 12:30 PM
Nov 2012

... I really hate all these news articles that give brief summaries of papers, reports and research but do not link to the ORIGINAL source! The original source should ALWAYS be on line and a link should ALWAYS be provided.

Here is a link to the symposium, proceedings to be (electronically) published early next year: http://100yss.org/

Here is Dr. Weidemann's vita: http://www.ruhr-uni-bochum.de/ph-th/mitarbeiter/cw.html#LOP

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Pentagon Spends $100,000 ...