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WhiskeyGrinder

(22,512 posts)
Thu Mar 21, 2024, 04:34 PM Mar 21

An incarcerated teacher taught his students that Jim Crow literacy tests were racist. Then he got fired.

https://www.wbez.org/stories/incarcerated-teacher-fired-for-teaching-about-racism/95a20032-3507-48a2-aef8-afac11482706

An incarcerated educator was fired from his teaching job at an Illinois prison after arguing with a prison counselor about whether he could teach students that literacy tests given to voters during the Jim Crow era were a racist attempt to suppress the Black vote.

Now the instructor, Anthony McNeal, is suing in federal court, claiming the counselor and the prison warden violated his First and Fourteenth Amendment rights.

McNeal was teaching a peer-led civics class the state is required to provide for people exiting prison at Centralia Correctional Center in southern Illinois. At the end of February, a federal lawsuit against the counselor and the prison warden was filed on behalf of McNeal, who said he was fired because he told students the literacy tests were racist.

(snip)

Nathan Tucker, the prison counselor supervising the class, interrupted McNeal and instructed him to present literacy tests “as having a legitimate nondiscriminatory purpose of ensuring that voters ‘knew what they were voting for’,” according to the complaint. Tucker did not respond to a request for comment.
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An incarcerated teacher taught his students that Jim Crow literacy tests were racist. Then he got fired. (Original Post) WhiskeyGrinder Mar 21 OP
Nathan Tucker is full of shit. If the literacy test was so important, then why were they only applied in towns that ... marble falls Mar 21 #1
Plus... ProfessorGAC Mar 21 #5
hey nathan...take the test. ret5hd Mar 21 #2
The first question alone could fail many!! Maeve Mar 22 #21
The truth is still the truth malaise Mar 21 #3
Didn't they failed potentional voters even if they passed? LiberalFighter Mar 21 #4
In some municipalities - yes JustAnotherGen Mar 21 #6
That and the poll tax. ananda Mar 21 #7
When I was a child, all adult black people were first names. Hermit-The-Prog Mar 21 #13
Infantilizing and erasing their history is part of the oppression. ananda Mar 23 #22
Not if my Daddy was around!!! He was adamant about age respect yellowdogintexas Mar 23 #27
The only problem is that his claim of violation of his Constitutional rights might not work. 4lbs Mar 21 #8
Murdered someone for $60 MichMan Mar 21 #9
oh so if he was "teaching other inmates" maybe "teacher" would be a better term? instructor could work too WhiskeyGrinder Mar 22 #18
What a repugnant take on the issue NanaCat Mar 23 #24
And that means what, exactly? yardwork Mar 23 #25
What's your point? He's a teacher. marble falls Mar 23 #26
So am I MichMan Mar 23 #31
Then you should understand he's doing the right thing - working through his punishment and improving ... marble falls Mar 23 #32
Agreed, he is trying to do just that MichMan Mar 23 #34
What the victim may or may not have been is speculation and not part of the equation. When we ... marble falls Mar 23 #35
Might I suggest Freire's Pedagogy of the Oppressed? Iris Mar 23 #33
I took a literacy test in Alabama Frances Mar 21 #10
Sad. I'm curious - how long ago did these two events happen? TheRickles Mar 21 #12
1963 Frances Mar 21 #14
Thanks. Only in America.... TheRickles Mar 22 #17
Not that is makes it any worse or better, but not only in America. Racism rears it's ugly head anywhere it can. marble falls Mar 23 #29
K&R Solly Mack Mar 21 #11
We should have literacy tests for MAGAts..... DemocraticPatriot Mar 21 #15
Of course, Southern Illinois AwakeAtLast Mar 22 #16
I was under the impression that when in prison... ProudMNDemocrat Mar 22 #19
They do not have full constitutional rights but they do retain limited rights under the First Amendment, are protected WhiskeyGrinder Mar 22 #20
This is a shameful understanding of prisoner rights. NanaCat Mar 23 #28
If that were true, it'd be worse. marble falls Mar 23 #30
Good lord. yardwork Mar 23 #23

marble falls

(57,479 posts)
1. Nathan Tucker is full of shit. If the literacy test was so important, then why were they only applied in towns that ...
Thu Mar 21, 2024, 05:04 PM
Mar 21

... that had significant minority populations and mostly in the South?

ProfessorGAC

(65,381 posts)
5. Plus...
Thu Mar 21, 2024, 05:41 PM
Mar 21

...if it was just informative, why was one required to pass it to vote?
The fact that failing the test meant one couldn't vote is proof it was no just to ensure informed voters.
Sounds like Tucker is a sucker for whitewashiing.

Maeve

(42,309 posts)
21. The first question alone could fail many!!
Fri Mar 22, 2024, 08:41 AM
Mar 22
1.Draw a line around the number or letter of this sentence.

or maybe this one
6. In the space below, draw three circles, one inside (engulfed by) the other.

Is that one and then one inside another and you fail if you draw two inside one? Intentionally ambiguous? (of course it was!) And "draw a line around" could be rejected if it was more a circle than a line, depending on who was taking the test and who was scoring it.

JustAnotherGen

(32,025 posts)
6. In some municipalities - yes
Thu Mar 21, 2024, 05:47 PM
Mar 21

They administered it in Portuguese in Talladega in 1956.

They left tax payers and voters no choice but to cheat.

ananda

(28,895 posts)
7. That and the poll tax.
Thu Mar 21, 2024, 07:11 PM
Mar 21

I remember Jim Crow well.

A man used to come by the house to collect the
$2 poll tax.

Everything was separated into White and Colored.

And Black people rode in the back of the bus,
and most of them lived in subsidized housing
or those little shabby shotgun houses.

yellowdogintexas

(22,292 posts)
27. Not if my Daddy was around!!! He was adamant about age respect
Sat Mar 23, 2024, 09:11 AM
Mar 23

regardless of any other thing. If we did not address anyone more than 20 years older as "Miss Jane" or "Mister Joe" we would catch it when we got home. Also yes ma'm an yes sir. Sometime he would tell us in front of the elder person "who do you think you are, calling ____by her/his first name?"

Race did not matter with him.

I grew up in Kentucky, on the Tennessee state line, so this was exceptional for the time and the place (1950s- 1960s)

4lbs

(6,868 posts)
8. The only problem is that his claim of violation of his Constitutional rights might not work.
Thu Mar 21, 2024, 07:17 PM
Mar 21

It was established long ago through the court system in other cases, that prisoners (and many ex-cons) have nearly all their rights stripped once they are convicted.

If you have ever been convicted of a crime, then your employer can drug test you as often as they see fit. No amount of whining about "Right to Privacy" and "Illegal Search and Seizure" will work. If you decline, they can just simply fire you. If you try to take them to court claiming illegal termination, you will be asked why you declined a drug test, being an ex-con and all.

Many ex-cons/prisoners already cannot vote, own handguns, nor can they associate with other ex-cons. It may take as long as 7 or 10 years after their release to get those "rights" back. Even then, some people will give them some major league "side-eye" if they say, buy a gun or associate with another ex-con.

Any DUI/DWI on your record? Well then, the police can search your vehicle at will. The DUI/DWI automatically gives them "probable cause" and as a condition you automatically consent to any search. They can also question you as they see fit to determine your location whenever a crime takes place, to see if you were in the "general area" at the time.

So, even though his complaints may be valid, they might not hold up in court based on those above precedents.

MichMan

(12,002 posts)
9. Murdered someone for $60
Thu Mar 21, 2024, 07:20 PM
Mar 21

Last edited Thu Mar 21, 2024, 08:13 PM - Edit history (1)

Calling him an educator is a bit of a stretch.

He is an inmate serving a life sentence for first degree murder teaching other inmates in a peer led prison class.

WhiskeyGrinder

(22,512 posts)
18. oh so if he was "teaching other inmates" maybe "teacher" would be a better term? instructor could work too
Fri Mar 22, 2024, 07:47 AM
Mar 22

yardwork

(61,772 posts)
25. And that means what, exactly?
Sat Mar 23, 2024, 08:57 AM
Mar 23

That means that it's ok that the prison is demanding that mandatory classes for inmates teach false information?

Your takeaway from this whole story is that the inmate doesn't deserve to be called an educator?

MichMan

(12,002 posts)
31. So am I
Sat Mar 23, 2024, 10:09 AM
Mar 23

I did some training in basic statistics to coworkers at a manufacturing plant I retired from.

That means I can now refer to myself as a retired teacher and educator. That was something that never occurred to me before.

marble falls

(57,479 posts)
32. Then you should understand he's doing the right thing - working through his punishment and improving ...
Sat Mar 23, 2024, 10:48 AM
Mar 23

... himself. We are in the top three nations for incarcerating our population. A lot of us productive citizens are former and current prisoners. Reducing someone to "$60 for killing someone" is easy and unfair. Especially in a murdering over armed population like the US.

MichMan

(12,002 posts)
34. Agreed, he is trying to do just that
Sat Mar 23, 2024, 11:04 AM
Mar 23

Too bad the person he murdered lost every opportunity to have a fulfilling productive life.

I am very forgiving to someone making a poor decision and committing a robbery, burglary, or stealing a car. Much less forgiving to someone who commits rape or murder.

marble falls

(57,479 posts)
35. What the victim may or may not have been is speculation and not part of the equation. When we ...
Sat Mar 23, 2024, 11:59 AM
Mar 23

... prosecute a murderer we aren't looking for the justice for the victim. We are looking for justice for the perpetrator. We are judging him as someone who's broken a societal value or norm. The dead are beyond justice or anything else. They are evidence of a crime against society, society is reaffirming it's norm regarding murder.

Rape victims get no justice. If a person is wrongly convicted for rape and sentenced, did the rape victim get justice? How do you make a rape victim whole?

Frances

(8,548 posts)
10. I took a literacy test in Alabama
Thu Mar 21, 2024, 07:23 PM
Mar 21

A man gave it to me with just him and me in the office.
When I finished the test I asked the man if I passed.
He pointed to several questions and said, “You missed this and this and this”
I said, “But did I pass?”
He answered,”You are white. You passed.”
A friend from Tennessee said her mother volunteered to help administer literacy tests. Her mother was told to put a small W for white at the top of tests given to whites.

Frances

(8,548 posts)
14. 1963
Thu Mar 21, 2024, 09:06 PM
Mar 21

That was also the year my friend told me about her mother. I don’t know what year her mother volunteered

marble falls

(57,479 posts)
29. Not that is makes it any worse or better, but not only in America. Racism rears it's ugly head anywhere it can.
Sat Mar 23, 2024, 09:13 AM
Mar 23

AwakeAtLast

(14,134 posts)
16. Of course, Southern Illinois
Fri Mar 22, 2024, 12:25 AM
Mar 22

The only free state I know of that has a 'slave house'.

Some of the reddest parts of the country are here.

WhiskeyGrinder

(22,512 posts)
20. They do not have full constitutional rights but they do retain limited rights under the First Amendment, are protected
Fri Mar 22, 2024, 08:08 AM
Mar 22

under the Eighth and so on.

NanaCat

(1,510 posts)
28. This is a shameful understanding of prisoner rights.
Sat Mar 23, 2024, 09:13 AM
Mar 23

As per the ACLU:

In Turner v. Safley (1987), the U.S. Supreme Court made clear that “[p]rison walls do not form a barrier separating inmates from the protections of the Constitution.” Individuals retain certain fundamental rights, even when incarcerated.


For instance, they retain many free speech rights, such as:

Having the right to criticize prison conditions in their communications with people inside and outside the prison;

Having the right to express their political viewpoints and receive letters, books, magazines and etc that express said political viewpoint, as long as it is not seditious or violent in nature;

Not having speech or reception of letters, books, magazines and so on restricted for arbitrary reasons;

Are those free speech rights the same as outside the prison walls? Of course not, but they are nowhere near eradicated altogether, either.

Cannot believe that so many right here on DU think that prisoners don't retain certain fundamental rights.
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