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dlk

(11,572 posts)
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 11:57 AM Apr 16

As much as I admire Lawrence, I don't agree we can't incarcerate Trump

There are numerous government facilities where Trump could be held and the Secret Service would be able to provide their necessary protection 24/7. I believe in American ingenuity and it’s more a matter of can’t v. won’t.

Trump needs to be behind bars and when there’s a will, there’s a way.

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As much as I admire Lawrence, I don't agree we can't incarcerate Trump (Original Post) dlk Apr 16 OP
gitmo comes to mind. niyad Apr 16 #1
If only... dlk Apr 16 #7
If Trump were a Democrat, there would be no question his ass would be incarcerated after conviction. 50 Shades Of Blue Apr 16 #2
Exactly dlk Apr 16 #8
They're all falling over themselves Mr. Evil Apr 16 #23
I agree with you, but I find it hard to believe that any judge would have Poiuyt Apr 16 #34
Often other countries PatSeg Apr 16 #40
Totally agree with you. n/t ChazII Apr 16 #50
It is just a simple matter of the SS transferring custody to the Bureau of Prisons. Irish_Dem Apr 16 #3
It's not rocket science dlk Apr 16 #9
Better yet, Mr.Bill Apr 16 #19
No need to revoke. Just let the Bureau of Prisons give Trump Irish_Dem Apr 16 #21
Absolutely. If convicted his Secret Service protection should be revoked, along... thenelm1 Apr 16 #30
I agree. -misanthroptimist Apr 16 #4
They would be hauling him to Mr.Bill Apr 16 #20
Then there's no problem. -misanthroptimist Apr 16 #51
I agree. n/t Mr.Bill Apr 16 #52
It would not be a problem. Jirel Apr 16 #5
What's the problem? lees1975 Apr 16 #6
There are plenty of viable options dlk Apr 16 #12
Make sure he has NO phone, no pool, ProudMNDemocrat Apr 16 #10
House arrest isn't good enough dlk Apr 16 #13
NOPE! For he would find a way to get around the restrictions. ProudMNDemocrat Apr 16 #15
Merde A Lago was "a well secured facility with armed guards" speak easy Apr 16 #36
I think it could work. Demobrat Apr 16 #25
House arrest isn't good enough, but I'm guessing it's the worst he'll get William Seger Apr 16 #53
With re: to short-term, obviously the NY Judge Merchan would agree. He's twice threatened Trump w jail hlthe2b Apr 16 #11
A taste of what's to come dlk Apr 16 #14
I'm sorry, but if Trump becomes a convicted felon, why should we feel he is entitled to all the benefits now received... usaf-vet Apr 16 #16
I believe Lawrence is correct. republianmushroom Apr 16 #17
It's speaks volumes about us when we don't have the stomach to hold him truly accountable dlk Apr 16 #55
Even if jail was too difficult given SS, what about a strict house arrest with no internet access? karynnj Apr 16 #18
The same Secret Service that wiped their cell phones of evidence after J6? JoseBalow Apr 16 #57
I agree. 2naSalit Apr 16 #22
Just take away his phone, Mr. Evil Apr 16 #24
I bet the Mexicans would pay for it... Hugin Apr 16 #27
I'm with you there. Mr. Evil Apr 16 #29
As many times as I read this, I see "incinerate". Hugin Apr 16 #26
You're forgiven! Mr. Evil Apr 16 #32
I think that EndlessWire Apr 16 #28
Put him in Gitmo for the summer. lpbk2713 Apr 16 #31
I'll keep saying it Tree Lady Apr 16 #33
If Trump can't be incarcerated, then we do not have Equal Justice Under Law. Happy Hoosier Apr 16 #35
Agree 100% with you, trump is not special and should never be treated as such, he must be treated as any Escurumbele Apr 16 #37
We have a pool and a pond... Pond would be good for you. JoseBalow Apr 16 #38
Where there's a wall there's a way. Mblaze Apr 16 #39
Couldn't the SS just sign-off and transfer their responsibilities/obligations to the prison guards? Oopsie Daisy Apr 16 #41
I like your thinking! RainCaster Apr 16 #46
Trump loves comparing himself to Mandela, so let's accommodate him. Give him 27 years hard time. sop Apr 16 #42
I'm sure we could whip up some facilities at Alcatraz... ECL213 Apr 16 #43
When did Lawrence say that? ShazzieB Apr 16 #44
Lawrence said it last evening and Chris Hayes agreed dlk Apr 16 #54
Once the trial is over, any Pene-Max will do, but I think the one in Colorado is best RainCaster Apr 16 #45
I don't know how the details would/should be worked out, but Sogo Apr 16 #47
There's the matter of feasibility, and the matter of the will to do it Silent3 Apr 16 #48
Nixon is the problem RANDYWILDMAN Apr 16 #49
As a country, we continue to pay dearly for that bad decision dlk Apr 16 #56

Mr. Evil

(2,851 posts)
23. They're all falling over themselves
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 02:07 PM
Apr 16

worrying about 'how will it look if we imprison a former president?' The answer is obvious. It will look we have found our long lost integrity and our spine as a nation of laws.

For everything, there is a first time.

Poiuyt

(18,126 posts)
34. I agree with you, but I find it hard to believe that any judge would have
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 02:29 PM
Apr 16

the cajones to imprison Trump.

As Michael Cohen said, there are three classes of criminals in America -- There are the common people, there are the rich and famous, and then there's Donald Trump. He's going to get special privileges that no other American would get.

PatSeg

(47,519 posts)
40. Often other countries
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 02:37 PM
Apr 16

have used highly restricted house arrest, but obviously a place like Mar-a-Lago wouldn't be satisfactory. A few rooms with no Internet or cell phones. The Secret Service could be used to monitor him.

Irish_Dem

(47,147 posts)
3. It is just a simple matter of the SS transferring custody to the Bureau of Prisons.
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 12:03 PM
Apr 16

Everyone is making it much harder than it would be in reality.

Irish_Dem

(47,147 posts)
21. No need to revoke. Just let the Bureau of Prisons give Trump
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 02:04 PM
Apr 16

the same level of protection they give all other prisoners.

thenelm1

(854 posts)
30. Absolutely. If convicted his Secret Service protection should be revoked, along...
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 02:23 PM
Apr 16

any other "privledges" a past president has.

-misanthroptimist

(811 posts)
4. I agree.
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 12:20 PM
Apr 16

They also wouldn't need a full detail, either. One or two agents should be able to protect him adequately in a prison cell. They obviously wouldn't need armored vehicles or any other extraneous equipment. A couple armed guys should be more than enough to get the job done.

-misanthroptimist

(811 posts)
51. Then there's no problem.
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 03:45 PM
Apr 16

They were going have to go with him to his continual whine-fests anyway. So, when he's not in court they can assign fewer agents and give the rest the day(s) off or assign them somewhere else. It's not like court dates are a surprise.

Jirel

(2,018 posts)
5. It would not be a problem.
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 12:23 PM
Apr 16

You transfer custody from the SS. They would still be able to monitor security and approve procedures as the situation changes. Needy Amin would likely be in some level of solitary in a “country club” prison, or at worst incarcerated in Dump Tower under SS custody if they really, REALLY didn’t want to take responsibility for the f*cker at a prison. Regardless of the setting, he can easily be incarcerated.

lees1975

(3,865 posts)
6. What's the problem?
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 12:25 PM
Apr 16

Other than the poor secret service agents who have to go to jail with him.

Maybe we should re-activate the prison on Dry Tortugas, at the old Fort Jefferson, where the conspirators in the Lincoln assassination were imprisoned.

And let's get on with the other trials. We've waited too long for justice and the credibility of the justice department and the courts is diminished with every day that goes by.

ProudMNDemocrat

(16,786 posts)
10. Make sure he has NO phone, no pool,
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 12:32 PM
Apr 16

He has no pets. He does not smoke. No luxuries like favorite foods, diet Coke, chocolate ice cream.

Make life for a convicted felon hard for him.

No VOTING either if convicted. Oppsie daisy, Donnie. You lose that right.

ProudMNDemocrat

(16,786 posts)
15. NOPE! For he would find a way to get around the restrictions.
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 12:53 PM
Apr 16

It has to be a well secured facility with armed guards, isolated for a length of time. NO Privileges. Other than a few visitors for 15 minutes at a time.

Even when CONVICTED before being sentenced, there are strict rules. Michael Cohen is all to familiar with those.

Demobrat

(8,983 posts)
25. I think it could work.
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 02:14 PM
Apr 16

Confine him to the smallest bedroom on the property with a bath attached. Door comes off the bath. Brick over the windows. Replace bedroom door with iron bars. 24/7 guards and video surveillance of the room. No TV. No internet. No phone. No privacy. Prison food only. Prison garb only. Shower works for ten minutes three times a week. Lights on a timer. Bed is a prison bunk. No other furniture. No heat. No air conditioning. He is taken in cuffs to meet with visitors in another room. Make home confinement as much like actual prison as possible, and it could work for everyone. Even the ones who have to guard/protect him. They could utilize the rest of the property so it wouldn’t have to be the assignment from hell for them.

hlthe2b

(102,303 posts)
11. With re: to short-term, obviously the NY Judge Merchan would agree. He's twice threatened Trump w jail
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 12:33 PM
Apr 16

and I wish he'd subject him to 30 minutes in the Manhattan jail with a warning that it (time) would be increased 4x with each disruption or breach of his gag order. Tell me how SS can't stand outside his cell for 30 minutes along with local jail staff? Bullshist.

usaf-vet

(6,189 posts)
16. I'm sorry, but if Trump becomes a convicted felon, why should we feel he is entitled to all the benefits now received...
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 01:05 PM
Apr 16

.... as a former president.

Will we help even in a small way to build a presidential library?

Are we going to provide him with lifetime Secret Service protection? A lifetime pension?

The sheer fact that he has taken it upon himself to do things, many unlawful, that 44 presidents before him didn't do, in my mind, calls for a revision of how he is treated in the future.

Here is a summary of the benefits the former 44 presidents received. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Former_Presidents_Act

In my opinion, if and when he becomes a convicted felon, especially in the classified documents case, Trump should, without exception, be treated like any other FELON. He deserves a jail term, but when released, he should be shown the door and not expect ANY further benefits.

I know in the past, there was a fear that former presidents could pass on sensitive information. I doubt he has the mental acuity to retain any information he might have been privy to. He didn't read his daily briefing reports and wanted them condensed to one page.

When the truth of what corrupt things he and his family did to enrich themselves is known, I believe history will see him as a cancerous blot in the office he once held.

Here is at least one author's suggestion of what might happen if a President refuses to leave. We need to start thinking about this possibility. If it is ever going to happen, 2024 is likely when we will sadly see it play itself out.

https://www.rd.com/article/what-happens-if-a-president-wont-leave-office/



republianmushroom

(13,621 posts)
17. I believe Lawrence is correct.
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 01:06 PM
Apr 16

Parts of the DOJ didn't even want him investigated. And many still don't.

38 months and counting (includes foot dragging)

karynnj

(59,504 posts)
18. Even if jail was too difficult given SS, what about a strict house arrest with no internet access?
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 01:37 PM
Apr 16

Consider his SS detail could function as jailers.

Mr. Evil

(2,851 posts)
24. Just take away his phone,
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 02:14 PM
Apr 16

his burnt to a crisp steak and ketchup supply. Then just build a wall around MAG-A-Lardo. You know how much he loves walls.

Hugin

(33,167 posts)
27. I bet the Mexicans would pay for it...
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 02:18 PM
Apr 16

If they could have exclusive rights to post travel ads on the perimeter.

Mr. Evil

(2,851 posts)
32. You're forgiven!
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 02:24 PM
Apr 16

Of course he's so toxic he'd probably burn in perpetuity not unlike that forever coal fire under Centralia, PA.

EndlessWire

(6,538 posts)
28. I think that
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 02:19 PM
Apr 16

J. Merchan can fairly sentence a convicted Trump without any consideration of where he will serve the sentence, be it prison, a country club, house arrest, or other. Obviously, Gitmo is out.

But, once he's decided what is fair, I think the jail system, or the Bureau of Prisons, or whoever decides at the state level, will decide where they can successfully put him. He is a civilian, a citizen, despite his bluster of being the next President. The Secret Service can be whittled down to just one guy--or all of them. It doesn't matter. It just wouldn't be a plush assignment.

Trump can be held in solitary confinement (like he did to Cohen) due to keeping his nasty ass safe. He can be held away from Genpop, and carted back and forth to his other trials.

Why has this become so hard? If he's convicted and J. Merchan sends him to jail for 90 days, or four years, there is a spot for him. He has to be put in a spot where outside protestors can't be allowed daily interaction with him.

It's not J. Merchan's problem. His duty is to dish out the punishment within fair guidelines, not to decide the punishment based on what we can handle. We've got this.

Tree Lady

(11,479 posts)
33. I'll keep saying it
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 02:24 PM
Apr 16

military prison. Keep him separate with secret service down the hall in a office.

Escurumbele

(3,396 posts)
37. Agree 100% with you, trump is not special and should never be treated as such, he must be treated as any
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 02:31 PM
Apr 16

other criminal would be treated if convicted.

Oopsie Daisy

(2,642 posts)
41. Couldn't the SS just sign-off and transfer their responsibilities/obligations to the prison guards?
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 02:39 PM
Apr 16

If felons forfeit their voting rights and ill-gotten gains, then they should also forfeit luxuries like SS protection.

sop

(10,208 posts)
42. Trump loves comparing himself to Mandela, so let's accommodate him. Give him 27 years hard time.
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 02:41 PM
Apr 16

ECL213

(213 posts)
43. I'm sure we could whip up some facilities at Alcatraz...
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 02:42 PM
Apr 16

Hell, I'll bet Mexico would even pay for the remodel.

ShazzieB

(16,432 posts)
44. When did Lawrence say that?
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 02:48 PM
Apr 16

Just wondering, because I don't recall ever hearing him voice those sentiments.

I agree that there are ways to incarcerate Trump, but I could live with house arrest and an ankle bracelet plus no social media posting, as long as he can never run for office again.

I realize I may be in the minority on this, but those are my sentiments. I'm more concerned about protecting the country from him than inflicting the harshest punishment possible.

Yeah, I know I'm weird!

dlk

(11,572 posts)
54. Lawrence said it last evening and Chris Hayes agreed
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 10:46 PM
Apr 16

Lawrence has excellent experience and insight. I just hope he's wrong.

RainCaster

(10,889 posts)
45. Once the trial is over, any Pene-Max will do, but I think the one in Colorado is best
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 02:48 PM
Apr 16

Put him in with the drug lords. A few SS guys to watch the cameras from their safe distant location. Who cares when he has a heart attack? Haul him out when he's cold.

Sogo

(4,987 posts)
47. I don't know how the details would/should be worked out, but
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 02:53 PM
Apr 16

the last thing we want is to make a martyr out of tsf.

Whatever stops short of that is fine with me. I really don't care, do you?

Silent3

(15,237 posts)
48. There's the matter of feasibility, and the matter of the will to do it
Tue Apr 16, 2024, 02:55 PM
Apr 16

It's the will to do it that is most lacking.

While many here on DU (and rightfully so) fiercely want to see Trump behind bars, we're up against a system that's accustomed to coddling the rich, powerful, and well-connected, and terrified of being involved in harsh actions against Trump.

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