When I can't afford to eat shrimp. Can you see why some might be a little upset by that?

I take your point. But there is nothing that will not be used in unpopular ways.

You are probably (sorry to put words in your mouth) upset by some food stamp recipients, not by food stamps. And you probably recognize that the program is way up because of the rising poverty rate, not because Obama wants everyone to be dependent on the government.

Food stamps have value and people do use them to buy drugs and booze and cigarettes. There is a black market for food stamps. All true.

But excesses and abuses are (largely) unavoidable features of any program. There are people on unemployment insurance that could get a job tomorrow but prefer not to. Many medicare claims are fraudulant. All true.

Any program will have abuses because the only alternative is to cut the program down to a size where genuinely needy people will be left with nothing. There has to be some room for excess in order to reach all the target population.

As a kid in a poor family we received commodities as they called it. No food stamps just made our parents go to the fairgrounds and be treated like cattle to get their food dished out by how many members in the family were living at home. Some of those winters we would have starved. I'm still thin and I believe it is largely because of the fact I never had a full stomach as a kid.
Poor people living in a poor section of the country is not a crime and shouldn't be allowed to be seen as that.
We weren't poor because we wanted to be, we were poor because of the area where we lived never came back from the dust bowl days. We had property and a house although at the time neither were worth much but at least we had a place to live, a roof over our heads, a yard to play in, a garden spot to raise the food we mostly ate.
My mother could take a few beans, a few potatos and some flour and our wood fired kitchen stove and turn out a meal that would melt in your mouth. Just wasn't enough of it is all.

after the Great Depression. In case no one realizes that includes inner cities and Indian Reservations.

Not so much. There have always been parts of the cities desperately poor and the Indian Reservations have always been a national shame.

things had been about fixing the whole country then there should have been some positive change. There was not.

I think that a lot of us have seen food stamps used in an abusive manner. Programs are abused and it is unfortunate but that is the way it is. The right looks at this as the norm. We understand that it is not. This is very important.

The other night at the supermarket a gentleman checked out in front of me whith just over $50 worth of items that I would not have purchased myself. I am on no assistance. What I didn't see was the other persons using food stamps that had been to the store that day. Judgement cannot be made on one or two observations.

I also have no clue what his story was. There are situations where I wouldn't have faulted him for his purchase. Though those situations would be far and few between.

Excellent post. Programs designed to help feed the hungry must be made stronger.

What you should be working on in concert with other Americans is pushing for better worker's rights.. Which means collective bargaining, a minimum wage that pays an affordable living wage, and a slew of other items like paid time off, maternity/ paternity paid leave, sick time, and holiday time off or paid double time for.

I don't care what type of food a family that is using their EBT card buys with it. I'm not looking in the fat person's cart who is buying steak, chips, and cake, knowing he's a heart attack or diabetic waiting to happen and will cost more in medical care... Significantly more than the person buying shrimp. Or is their a specific menu poor people are allowed to choose from?

Being jealous of my neighbor fixes nothing. Division has kept us all down and has let Republicans win time and time again, which has turned this country into shambles. Be happy they are eating and keeping a Shrimp Boat Captain running his boat and keeping a crew.

I'm actually more pissed off at the Mitt Romney types hoarding their money in tax free shelters and making it tougher and tougher for the rest of the people in the country to make it. The Rich have bought the politicians and have worked the country over... they have made those at the bottom squabble over the scraps, while they eat the biggest piece of the pie... Nope, not mad at someone using food stamps. I'm more than fed up with the Rich eating it all up, and leaving scraps. They enjoy expensive bottles of wine and caviar and lobster and organic foods all cooked for them by a personal chef... all because they buy the politicians to keep their lifestyle for their elite selves.

Most of the shrimp in our supermarkets is farm-raised and imported. So, they're not necessarily helping out American shrimpers.

As for what kinds of food people should be able to buy with food stamps, being unemployed with an extremely limited budget has given me a different perspective on things. I can't afford steak or shrimp or most organic foods, either. I get a lot of my protein from beans, and cheese that's on sale and has coupons. Any meat I buy is the marked-down stuff that's about to go out of date. People on food stamps eat the same way, and I can't say I'd blame them if they wanted to splurge on a bag of shrimp now and then. I wonder how all these critics would feel if they were told that they were suddenly told, "No, you can't eat that. You need to eat the same tired, old beans and rice every day for the rest of your lives." They wouldn't like it. Yet, they want to condemn poor people that.

But that is regardless of my main point... The expression "working poor" should not even leave our lips ever... If one works, why are they poor... Why are so many worker able to qualify for food stamps (thinking of Walmart, who pulls in billions of dollars a year)? And then there is this thing "recession" thingy going on that is still pretty high, especially when one moves from area to area/ state to state...

People need to eat. People don't want to always eat absolute crap all of the time. And the shrimp may just be for a special occasion like a birthday (and they can't afford to go out to enjoy someone else cook for them).

We absolutely need a world wide evaluation of what quality of life should look like, what's "enough", what direction do we need going forward, and how do we find equality but also allow for individuality and innovation? These discussions cannot even begin in our own country.. the politicians are bought and we have one party still race-baiting, trying to regulate women's bodies and their medical options, and hint that another may be gay (like that's supposed to be a bad thing or something).

They read one or two stories or have seen an incident in their local grocery and they are convinced that too many are abusing the system. I work in a grocery store (almost 20 years) and I know different. There may be an occasional splurge but mostly it is the basics. I remember the one and only time my family had food stamps for a month back in 1975. We had not eaten meat. fresh veggies or fruit for about two months, yes we splurged and had steak. You would have thought we had committed the worst crime ever from the looks and comments the clerk made to us. I made sure that I never treated anyone using food stamps like I was treated. What that checker did not know is that my husband had just returned from Vietnam and jobs were scarce.

Sure, someone receiving food stamps may be able to buy that bag of shrimp, but next week, when you still have fish sticks to eat, that person will have nothing, based on their high food stamp burn rate. Maybe you wish people would use food stamps more wisely in some outlier cases, such as the one you've mentioned. But you shouldn't begrudge the poor for receiving food stamps.

and it's food. Nobody's business but theirs what they buy.

... and back before they lost their jobs they'd celebrate at the Red Lobster um, er wait, a fancy local seafood place.

Damn, don't begrudge anyone who qualifies for food stamps something special every once in a while.

And shrimp ain't that special.

Otherwise our corporate lords and masters will soon have us eating soylent green, and chucking disdain at those who occasionally buy the blue stuff that's actually made out of plankton, soybeans, and gutter oil.

nt

I really wouldn't care what anybody buys for themselves. But, when it comes to food stamps, the taxpayers are paying for what they buy, and therefore, perceived extravagance is met with anger. It's even worse when my cart is filled with vegetables, because I, myself, cannot afford the same extravagance.

I don't mind my tax dollars going to food stamps at all. I get angry that my tax dollars paying for war.

And, nothing gives you a right to judge someone on any type of public assistance. You know nothing about someone's life.

Frozen shrimp don't cost very much, unless you are getting big ones or prawns.

Shrimp here are about half the price ground beef is. Veggies have nearly doubled in price in the last year. And the amount of veggies you need to feel satiated, vs the amount of shrimp you need is far, far more. Price-wise I'd say nearly double. Let's see - do I buy a bag of shrimp for $4 or 2 cucumbers for $2 each? Which one do you think is going to fill me and my 4 kids up more?

talking minced breaded 'shrimp poppers' which aren't really shrimp at all. I'm not arguing either way on the main issue, but you can get a lot of vegetables for the same price.

but CAN afford a cart full of vegetables, then you are the world's worst bargain shopper.

A bag of shrimp on sale at my local grocery store (And keep in mind I'm in Canada where prices are significantly higher than most US places) is $3 or $4 and at Walmart (ick, I know) it's $9 regular price for a JUMBO bag that lasts 2 meals for me and my 4 kids. A bag of apples? $6. A head of romaine lettuce? $2. A bag of carrots? $2. 1 cucumber? $2. A gallon of milk - $4.50. An effing 5lb bag of potatoes $6. Shrimp is not horribly expensive so stop acting like it's some huge luxury. IT's cheaper than ground beef where I am. But even so, I don't care if she was buying a bag of crab legs for $30. You don't know what the circumstances are. I can dream up many situations where the shrimp is not some sort of irresponsible purchase, even if it was expensive:

Maybe they can't afford a gift for their kid so the only thing the kid asked for was a nice meal of shrimp for their birthday.
Maybe they are entertaining their boss and their job depends on it.
Maybe their child's foods class at school requires it (my dd took 'foods' as an option and had to cook us a specific meal for grading as her final project)
Maybe a relative is at home sick and dying and asked for shrimp (read this in a non-fiction book once - some guy ran to the store to buy his dying daughter rootbeer because that is what she wanted. It happens)
Maybe they only recently lost their job and they are attending a potluck with relatives/friends and someone asked them to bring a shrimp-based dish and they didn't want to be embarrassed.

Do I need to go on?
Whoever taught you patience should teach you some tolerance too. If you are too hard up to buy shrimp occasionally, then YOU need to look into food stamps and stop projecting your situation on others.
For shame.

the last week of the month meals were pretty grim - plain pasta, rice, peanut butter etc, So, when the stamps came we would usually have at least one special meal to start the month - steak, seafood or whatever. The rest of the time we had much simpler fare. Who is to say the people you see buying shrimp are not doing the same? My thoughts these days when I see someone using foodstamps is to be grateful I no longer need them.

That's what they are for. Problem solved.

Next time you see it happening, call them out on it.

I'm sure the look of embarrasment and humilty the will keep you warm and fuzzy for the rest of the day.

You should make a documentary of your exploits, there are quite a few scumbag Republicans who you'll find good company with...




Jackass.

When I can't afford the luxury of being similarly judgmental, because I have been on food stamps. Can you see why some might be a little upset by that?

Just the perceived extravagance when using them. Where is the line drawn? Would you be upset if you saw someone buying $100 worth of Filet Migon with foodstamps? How about $200 worth of caviar?

At the very least, you thing you have a right to dictate what they diet is.

I don't give a damn if they use their foodstamps on caviar and filet. Which we all know never happens, even if they own a Cadillac.

it's none of your business.

If i get 200 dollars a month for food stamps and I decide to be stupid and buy 200 dollars worth of caviar the mistake is on me. I am not getting any more than the other person that is buying beans and peanut butter.

Stop being a busy body and looking into peoples carts. It's none of your business!

Begrudging a mere perception is an exercise in absurdity.

As our perceptions rarely give us the story in its entirely, our anger then is based on little more than a presumption.

As for me, it's a petulant waste of time, but I'm certain you feel its constructive or helpful in one way or another.

Maybe learning patience would help out...

or a cell phone.

A tiny fraction of the top one percent in this country takes home one out of every eight dollars in this economy, and you are offended by the fact that some poor person might eat shrimp once in a while.

I strongly suggest a reorganization of priorities and resentments.








.

Thanks for the insight Ronnie.

I was in line behind a lady who paid for a huge amount of groceries with food stamps. After I checked out and went to the parking lot, that lady was loading all those groceries into the trunk of a brand-new Cadillac. She is someone I would label as a welfare queen.

You are the witness to welfare queen 2.0!!1!1!1

Thx for the ironic laugh.

I can get a bag of small frozen shrimp for $5.

Or, you could buy a loaf of bread, a package of American cheese and package of bologna that would last for at least 3 lunches.

american cheese food which is not cheese mostly oil.
Cheap white bread that has little or no nutritional value.
and processed meat by products.

I could buy a bag of five dollar shrimp, a bag of frozen mixed veggies and a bag of brown rice.
Spending less then ten dollars I would have enough food to feed two people three meals.
That would have more nutrition and keep your tummy filled longer than a single sandwich.

Shrimp for the poor? Not so much. Let 'em eat shrimp, not cake.

I'd rather push to see welfare denied to corporations, that's a far bigger drain on my wallet than a giant prawn dinner for the homeless.

Inefficient use of food stamps. But why get upset? There's a point where we have to draw the line about what other people are doing.

That large bag of shrimp could end up in a relitively healthy soup or ceviche that could easily feed a family for a week when mom and/or dad works and can't come home to make a healthy dinner from scratch every day.
I never feel upset when someone uses food stamps for anything. Who knows what their family will or won't eat?
And a shrimp ceviche with chips is far healthier than hamburger helper or mac n' cheese.
Haele

I don't like shrimp and won't eat 'em. I call them ocean cockroaches! :lol:

But in coastal areas seafoods can be as cheap or cheaper than beef or chicken!

Why are you monitoring what people on food stamps buy anyway? Would you rather them buy Wonder Bread and bologna and crap like that? Would that be more acceptable to you or maybe just more along the lines of what poor people should eat? They get a certain amount of money and what they buy with it is their own business. You should be happy that you don't have to be on food stamps, the fact that you can't buy shrimp may be unfortunate but they are at or under poverty level to get these stamps and if they want to eat shrimp who are you to judge?

It is the same as when I give money to homeless (supposed lazy rich people in Lexuses) on street corners. The money is now theirs, they can buy all the booze they want or they can buy a new pair of socks or a sandwich.

You have a very high white horse here, you need to dismount.

Last time I looked, shrimp were food.

How do you know the person wasn't going to cook up a huge shrimp gumbo that was going to last all week?

I think it is a shame in what many call the "greatest nation in the world" that there are not enough jobs, with everyone making a living wage, enough general fairness that we need food stamps at all.

There are certainly some abuses within the program (name a program or policy that does not get abused by someone, somewhere), but have we not seen enough abuse of the 99% by the 1% over these last 30+ years that perhaps we should point our anger at the true culprits and not someone who is using food stamps to survive?

no one food period! I don't care if it is Lobster Tails.

Unless it is brand new, you don't know the circumstances that landed them in the position where they came to be on food stamps.

I posted about the welfare queen and similar stories and how the Dixiecrats became NC GOP led by Jesse Helms and then took a failing Reagan to his first primary victory, 1976 NC. From there they went national, refined by Arthur Finkelstein.

I personally first heard this attack around 1953, but it goes back earlier. It started as an attack on Social Security and AFDC claiming it created the Welfare State on the way to socialism and communism. This story would be followed by attacks on Eleanor Roosevelt, the UN, and Justice Warren.

I have long suggested we should issue Food Stamps to every legal resident, call it a tax rebate.

Shrimp can be a good value, not sure why a problem.

Agree that it would very close scrutiny to determine that someone is using the FS debit card.

and buy an affordable car and use the extra money to buy food

????

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People make assumptions and form opinions without knowing the facts and that is a form of bigotry when it comes to how some look at people who need help!

They drive fancy cars and get TRILLIONS in welfare.

Sell the darn thing for $15k....buy a $5k car and put the rest in savings.

If I can drive a $4k Chevy AND pay for my own groceries, so can food stamp recipients.

Bigotry my butt...it's called common sense and living within one's means.

A $5,000 car is going to a wore out car that needs continuous repair. You would spend the cash you got from the other car fixing the cheaper and more likely older car with more miles.

When you are broke, you don't think about moving to a less reliable vehicle.

Why keep apologizing for someone on food stamps that owns a Cadillac?

I got rid of my Camry and got an older Cavalier. Banked the cash and have no problems with the Cavalier...cept for new brakes.

I get better gas mileage now and have a bit of cash in savings.

Get rid of the head banging smilie....doesn't do anything for ya....

...for a Cavalier of all things.

I owned a Cavalier once, for similar reasons. Bought it used. It was all I could afford. Or so I thought at the time. Two years later, after more breakdowns than I care to remember, I junked that automobile and never looked back. It was the crappiest auto I have ever owned and that is saying something. And I did spend lots of money over that 2 years getting it fixed.

Anyway as others have pointed out, and I agree, it doesn't make a lot of sense to sell a good reliable automobile and buy a cheaper, unreliable one. That extra cash only lasts so long; in my experience, the automobile will have a major problem just about the time the money is running out.

Well in any case, good luck!

It takes me from home to work and then back home again.

The Camry...can you say CASH COW????

My boss owns a $2.5M house on a golf course. Wanna guess what he drives? A 2007 Jeep, with a bunch of miles on it. Cranks the windows down, no alarm, etc. Doesn't own a Caddy....isn't on food stamps....works for a living. That 4 year old car takes him up to his "cabin" every other week.

It's all about choices, my friend. If one can drive a Cadillac, one can buy their own food.

You would have to be in their shoes before you can pass judgement, "cept" it is like:banghead:


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Welfare is anything but a badge of honor for those who use it!

if you can post that many smilies!

Quit making excuses for people that abuse the system.

I work my ass off, my fiance works his ass off, we cut corners and take care of my nieces and nephews....

I don't need to walk in anybody's shoes.

If one can drive a Cadillac and still use food stamps...something is wrong with the system.

I have no problem with helping those in difficult situations....just don't like the abuse. Such as....you have 2 kids and you are on food stamps...why have the 3rd kid?????

I don't need anything they advertise with coupons.

With rare exception, the only things advertised are the things you don't need.

or soup? or paper towels? or cereal? Cause those are the coupons I used this weekend

Soup I make in the crockpot with whatever I've got in the cupboard, garden, or freezer.

Cereal and paper towels? The makers of those are buying brand awareness with those coupons.

The cereal grain I eat mostly is bulk brown rice. No coupons for that.

I really don't want to know about consumer labeled cereal or paper towel brands, although I do pay some attention to my wife's brand preferences...

But I will confess, if coupons for beer were legal in our state...

Just ask anyone who has done price changes in the retail sector (I did price changes for safeway for years). Coupons, loyalty cards, ect. get you to buy branded items.... their brand. It's a game they play just like coke and pepsi, trading off sale weeks. They know that they still make a huge profit on their sale prices. Instead of giving you the best price everyday they play games with you. You think they are giving you a deal when really all they are doing is selling to you at a fair price that still allows them a pretty good profit.

And a cabin and works you 12 hours every day for chump change?

Which makes selling not too profitable.
Also as strange as it might sound, some people from better off families might give them their nice used car so they have a reliable vehicle but would be upset if they sell it. You might ask why their family wouldn't help them buy food, but some people are odd.

It's on a debit card now. Unless someone is hovering right in their face and sees them push the EBT button, I would LOVE to know how people know? Not snarking, I am serious. People on here, people on TV, people IRL are always talking about what they saw people buy on food stamps. How?

I also don't care what food people buy on food stamps, and also think toiletries and TP should also be included.

How incredibly nosey you would have to be to notice not only what the person is buying but how they are paying for it. Seriously, do people actually stand in line at the grocery store and look at what the person in front of them is buying and then crane their neck to see how they are paying for it? Ugh...

especially after working a 12 hour day and are trying to get dinner home to the family, while trying to stay awake

I love the holier than thou people posting in this thread....yeah, you never look in somebody else's cart or watch how they pay...I call BullShit

Also, lots of stuff wasn't allowed so you might have to do separate transactions for one order. There may still be some of that. We used to have to run some type of paperwork through our check 'endorser'(i can't remember the actual name of the machine) which would print the items purchased. The customer needed to have it to be reimbursed or to continue the program... or something. It's been a long time. I do remember that it singled people out and some were obv. embarrassed by having to say it. Not all, but some.

If you know what your state's EBT card looks like then it's not hard to pick them out. I've seen it every once in a while.

WIC was the worst because the items they were permitted to buy were extremely restrictive. Also, the food stamps were like Monopoly money and you were not permitted to give change in cash. I remember making people wait while I went to the office to get smaller denominations of food stamps.

My recollection was that many of the people were absolutley mortified at having to use food stamps and WIC vouchers. I never saw what I would consider extravagence.

have someone looking over our shoulders to see what we are buying.

Everyone knows what EBT cards look like.

Now I will. (NOT!!!)

I do...especially when the line is 6 people deep and I have just worked 12 hours and just wanna get dinner home and relax.

You know you look! So, ifyou're ever in AZ, you'll know what our EBT cards look like.

on edit: I work with a lady who buys $150 worth of food stamps for $100 cash from a neighbor. What do you think the neighbor does with the $100? Why would she sell her food stamps for $50 less than what they are worth?

easily stopped. It would have to be stopped at the store when the buyer is using the card. What is done in our area is that the real owner of the card and the buyer shop together and then the owner of the card does the paying. Thus there is no way to prove this.

I once wrote to the Bread for the World leader regarding ways I have seen people cheat on food stamps. They wrote me back and said they are very aware of this and will not do anything about it because for every cheater there are thousands of people who need the program and use it the way it is supposed to be used.

In other words - yes some people do cheat. But this program is the best safety net program we have for the people who really need help.

You just worked 12 hours and just want to get home and relax. Fine, me too, if I were in that situation.

But what does looking over someone's shoulder at the EBT card they're using, have to do with you getting home faster?

Call me confused.

you're confused

Looking over someone's shoulder? When was the last time you were in a check-out line in a grocery store? The POS is right there in front of everyone. See the cactus.....food stamps!

the food stamp card carrier goes to the grocery store with the one that "bought" the money on the card.....she plugs in her PIN # and off they go.....the food stamp recipient with cash and the "buyer" with the food. Easy as pie. Then the food stamp carrier goes out and buys a 40 and some pot......

The average food stamp amount received in Arizona is $128 per month, and you've got to jump thru hoops to get it. If you are seeing corruption,perhaps you ought to report it.

I swear that child eats twice his weight in food a day (again, only a slight exaggeration).

I spend over $128 /week on groceries for the two of us. I can't even remember how much it cost to feed all three of my children at one time.

I admit I could be more frugal, I could clip coupons ... I could do a significant amount of things to reduce my grocery bill (if only I had time).

My rambling point : $128/ month can barely keep folk from starvation

It hit me that my post could imply that my 15 year old was obese ... he is anything but ... he's well over 6 feet and an athletic weight lifter (all of this just makes him hungrier

You gotta do what you gotta do....if the recipient is there, they can whip out their ID

I don't give a flying f**k. Just don't play with the system.

I live in a lower-income area and I have to say that not once at the grocery store have I noticed someone using the food stamp debit card. Not once.

As for food choices, that's their own choice. They don't need to justify it to me. Maybe steak was on sale cheap and they're "splurging" once and eating ramen the rest of the week.

is food stamps!!!

K&R

Ever notice that? Whenever there's any sort of economic problems (and often when there isn't), the first, last and only thing people talk about cutting is the programs that poor people rely on.

The classism dircted at the poor in the USA is even worse than it is here in England (although not by much and the ConDems are trying hard to catch up).

the evolved among us talk about the military, corporate excesses, the 1% not sharing the burden, etc.

The knuckledraggers always want to take from poor people and children first. It really is very telling.

you do not measure up to the standards then you are scum. Been scum all my life. I do not expect it to change. It is the way the rich make themselves feel superior.

You got it right about the 1980's rhetoric. Gingrich imagines himself clever with words and crafting subtext (he's into NLP) - but he's really an idiot living in the past and gets surprised when his "subtle messaging" is backfiring on him.

He's clearly trying to run with the bullshit meme that worked for Reagan with "welfare queen" - where ignorant voters are led to believe that their tax dollars are being taken from them and given to "lazy black people". A complete fabrication but that doesn't matter for his purpose. He's trying to put this image and concept in voters minds and then pin it on Obama by calling him the "food stamp president"

Except for a shrinking pool of ignorant dumbfucks, this kind of racist bullshit doesn't work anymore and poor Newt is simply dumbfounded that he's being called out for the racist pos he is.

One day on another board there were 8 people in one thread all claiming to know somebody who was cheating with SNAP.

I suggested that they get off their well-fed asses and go drop a dime on these welfare cheats.

I question somebody who would denigrate someone buying a decent piece of meat. What, they should be buying that $2.99/pound ground shit in the tube that's 60% fat which gets poured in the trash?

I think the real scandal is that the "Richest Nation in The World" has millions of people who can't afford enough to eat. My local pantry moved 6 MILLION pounds of food last year. 6 MILLION!

I remember food stamps and "Gubbmint Cheez". Every day, I thank the FSM that I can afford to help others as wel as feed myself.

And if they want to buy a fucking bag of shrimp, allright then.

If this is so, I'm more worried about the person noticing what is being purchased, than the purchaser. I cannot remember one time that I have taken an accounting of what someone ahead of me is purchasing, whether with or without assistance.