aren't bishops and priests required to register as agents of a foreign government.

Why would anyone support the Catholics?

And correct me if I'm wrong but I believe "thou shalt not kill" is one of 'em.

How he was chosen is beyond my comprehension. He is not a pious man, and he couldn't shine the shoes of his predecessor.

child rape, and nothing is more important to the catholic church's hierarchy than that.

Just when you think the church couldn't get any lower, this happens. You can't stop someone from visiting the Vatican, but do you have to give them an audience? It boggles.

who started the 'hate the gays' shit.

I'd say that's a lot lower.

Yes there are good Catholics out there, but the Vatican and the people whole rule there among the riches, do more harm to the world then good.

demolish the place until nothing is left standing. Liars, thieves and perverts, the lot of them.

I guess that's debatable at this point we know child rape is being covered up from the very top
if you call yourself a Catholic that means you belong to an organization that is actively covering up child rape and defending serial rapists

Can you be a good Catholic when you knowingly belong to an organization committing these crimes ?

Like I said, that's debatable

There are those that continue trying to make a difference in the community, despite their dislike of that the church leaders have done.

Then they are giving legitimacy to an organization that covers for serial pedophile rapists.

You cannot donate and fund an organization that defends pedophiles and then call yourself a good person

I think we are going to have to agree to disagree on this.

I say this as someone who despises the church, would like to see Cardinal Law jailed at the very least and has a number of family members effected directly by what happened here. Despite all that, I know some good Catholics who try very hard to help people within their community using the well established resources affiliated/run by the Church.

and receiving a gift from them? That isn't the same as embracing their law.

I don't meet and greet or accept gifts from murderous psychopaths.

I guess I can't expect the Pope to live up to my high standards.

But I care even less about bearing false witness. That is all.

You have accused someone, although whom it is not clear, of bearing false witness.

I'd like to know who has borne this false witness, and what the falsehood was, I think you owe that to us due to the seriousness of the charge you have leveled here today.

I thank you in advance for your explanation.

who you are accusing of bearing false witness. That is a serious charge, but you have yet to answer.

Last edited Fri Dec 14, 2012, 04:32 AM - Edit history (1)

Direct quote from material published by Uganda Parliment:

Pope Benedict XVI has given blessings to Uganda Parliament Speaker Rt.Hon. Rebecca Kadaga during a mass attended by thousands of pilgrims at the Vatican Wednesday.

Kadaga who led a delegation of Ugandan legislators to the Vatican expressed delight at meeting the Pope and visiting St Peter’s Basilicca.

“I think this is a moment that cannot be repeated. We have been reading about him, hearing stories about St.Peter’s Basilica but now we are here physically. I think it is something that I will remember all my life. Its a very great moment and I thank God for this opportunity,” she said minutes after meeting the Pope.

SOURCE: http://www.parliament.go.ug/new/index.php/about-parliament/parliamentary-news/147-speaker-kadaga-receives-blessings-from-the-pope-at-vatican-mass

I've been there, and there are literally tens of thousands of people from all over the world packed into St Peters Square, and they all get blessed. Some get photo ops. You don't have to be Catholic. Nowadays you do need to get tickets in advance, which are free, but only because somebody tried to assassinate the last pope at a Wednesday meet'n'greet so now there's the usual security.

Sheesh.

I am not giving this Poop an iota of the benefit of the doubt. He has proven what side he is on.

AND if you think he didn't have a clue, I have swampland to sell you.

American fundamentalist Protestant ministers have been all over Uganda for the last decade, & it's ultimately through *their* agency that this anti-gay hysteria got ramped up in the first place.

US troops are in Uganda, & Obama recently sent more. Not to protect gays, but to protect the Ugandan government, a US comprador.

No, you don't have a clue.

I find that beyond repulsive.
This post addresses a so called man of god who professes to have some moral guidance. He may not have armaments, but contrary to what we want, there are many people who do view his words and deeds as worth imitating. This type of moral suasion is as damaging among the people as other more concrete aid.

Yes, I have a clue. So please take your supercilious bile and insults and spread them somehere else. You will break your neck getting down from that high horse. I think it would be possible not to resort to your form of response which is to declare your findings and shout 'case closed.'

where's your post about the clintons, shown making nice here with the musevenis?



or about hilary clinton, smiling pretty with museveni?




The Pope is a head of state as well as a religious figure. There is nothing significantly different between what the Pope did & what our leaders do -- except that our government is actually funding Uganda & our Protestant evangelicals are the folks who started this shit.

For three days, according to participants and audio recordings, thousands of Ugandans, including police officers, teachers and national politicians, listened raptly to the Americans, who were presented as experts on homosexuality. The visitors discussed how to make gay people straight, how gay men often sodomized teenage boys and how “the gay movement is an evil institution” whose goal is “to defeat the marriage-based society and replace it with a culture of sexual promiscuity...”

One month after the conference, a previously unknown Ugandan politician, who boasts of having evangelical friends in the American government, introduced the Anti-Homosexuality Bill of 2009, which threatens to hang homosexuals, and, as a result, has put Uganda on a collision course with Western nations...

But you for some reason choose to focus your ire on the Pope.

But I repeat myself.
My ire is directed at the Pope because of his long history of attacking gays. The Pope is what this post is about. I am not addressing the US aide IN THIS POST. You seem determined to drag that in as some way to absolve the Pope or diminish his actions. They are both wrong IMHO.

A plague on all their houses.

led DIRECTLY to these anti-gay bills? DIRECTLY.

There is no equivalence here between what the Pope did & what our government & these government-connected evangelicals did.

"Some get photo ops."

Uh huh. The average Joe can have a photo op, huh? This was a disgusting act by a disgusting piece of shit.

to go along with his cloven hooves. On the one hand he can come off as benevolent while on the other hand giving the 'Kill the Gays' leaders a priceless photo op to use back home.

Did you get lost on your way to the revival tent or what?

And contrary to popular belief, you don't have to go to a revival or church for that matter to know what it means.

and don't give it a second thought. I think we can do better than that.

I think exactly that because of what has been done to young kids in the church. The Pope has been in the middle of it in his various positions. He has metaphorical cloven feet. I am talking about him and those involved in the perpetuation of abuse and not the members of the church as a whole.

Who is this we you speak of?
You have been here for 200 posts and already you have set yourself up as judge of 'what we can do better.'
Please start an OP and point out ALL the ways we at DU can do better and don't limit it to me. Surely in your travels you have a boatload of suggestions.

an incitement to hatred primarily against a group of persons defined in terms of race, ethnicity, national origin, gender, religion, sexual orientation, and the like." Yes, hate speech.

http://www.rnw.nl/english/article/vatican-speaks-out-against-uganda-anti-gay-laws

I'm sorry to have to explain this to you. In California we teach children what hate speech is from a very early age. I guess the rest of the country isn't like that.

who and why I dislike part of the Catholic Church. It is pointed at those who have and do protect pedophiles. I have never included the members unless they fall in that category. I also have great admiration for the nuns in general and those who have fought for justice.

You don't have to explain hate speech to me so take our lectures elsewhere. You are deliberately choosing to distort what I mean. And I do mean it. Those who have protected pedophiles can GTH!

Not only can you not speak for DU, you cannot speak for California (says this 57-year-old California Native). What we teach in our schools is not always practiced on the playground or were you asleep during Prop. H8? I also find it amusing at your little geographical elitist stereotype suggesting that California is unique in teaching about hate speech. Seems your high horse is somewhat vertically-challenged, to be kind.

not everybody pays attention in class.

It seems Joe.My.Hillbilly.God got it wrong, imagine that:

Did you calll JMG Joe.My.Hillbilly.God? JMG is a respected blogger who represents the LGBT community. He has been on the front lines of the fight for gay rights for years.

Your ill-informed insults reveal just how little you know. I suggest you find out a little more about people.

I think we can do better.

and your interpretation.
In addition, if he has made a mistake here or elsewhere, that is no excuse to make up names and dismiss him in light of his record. He would be the first to admit he isn't perfect.
We can do better than judge after one article.

to play to your personal prejudices, and your excuses for using them do not reflect well on you or any site you post them on.

I pointed out that if you consider this dishonest that doesn't mean the whole site is. The dishonesty is in your mind.

US aid through USAID, etc.

That's a bit more important than some blessing from a guy in white sheets.

Uganda is our ally; we keep the present honchos in power.

And it's US protestant missionaries pushing this gay-hating shit.

Fundamentalist a la Rick Warren.

One can detest all those who support such homicidal bigotry.

receives all comers.

To make a huge deal about a handshake in comparison with the fact that the US funds, props up & advises the present Ugandan government is ridiculous. There's no equivalence.



Clinton w/ Ugandan Pres Museveni 8/12

The SoS "chided" Museveni and praised a civil rights group fighting the anti-gay stuff -- but funding was not cut. Add it to the list of many such 'scoldings' US-funded murderers have received down through the years.

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/africa/2012/08/2012851807445585.html

I did not say one was as bad as the other. I just say I find it in my heart to detest all those who support such a thing and those who give them comfort, be they Pope, Government or regular person.

for all comers, while there's no comparable post about how the US government *funds, backs & arms* the ugandan government & offers only finger-waving on this issue.

Here's the obamas with the musevenis: happy happy happy



Obama Sends 100 US Troops to Uganda

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2011/10/obama-sends-100-us-troops-to-uganda-to-combat-lords-resistance-army/

Yes, it's either/or.

...full stop, regardless of the faith. Some are better than others, sometimes on some issues but it's like a 10,000 year old game of good cop / bad cop. They are all based on fairy tales (no more real than Santa Claus and Unicorns) and are a never ending source of hate, intolerance and violence. They may have served a purpose once but now they do nothing but hold humanity back.

When I read a news story now I've begun to substitute the names of specific faiths (Catholic, Protestant, Evangelical, Mormon, Islam, Judaism, etc) with religion.

welcome to DU!

Of course all the outspoken Catholics here in the US send a message that it is right to condemn homosexual relations while looking the other way when child molestation takes place.

I love the church when I was a child, even went to mass with my mother even though I was no longer participating in the church in anyway.

Even my sister has walked away from the church and she was devoted until they baulked at serving mass for my mother's funeral when the priest found out she had divorced and married.

And speaking of my mother, she turned to the church when my dad was drinking and beating on her and all they could offer was to submit to my father for the sake of the family.

At it's core, it has a great message. But like most other religions, when the man made rules subsumes the core, it's time to walk away...

If I wanted to live in the Apathetic, Mis-Guided Rigid, Cruel Landscape of the "Popes" idea of Catholicism--I'd join the Catholic Church.

Nazi + Catholicism = double homophobe.

Gee. WHAT a surprise.

No one saw this coming.