You don't get your child back. You just get your child on drugs knowing that you've given up on him or her and think that he or she is basically flawed.

Also, experience and studies have shown that many SSRIs and psychotropes cause or exacerbate violent and suicidal tendencies.

SSRIs have done a lot of good. Ask a few DUers - they can share their stories.

Suffered from depression and anxiety. Was hesitant to go on anti-depressants, particularly Prozac (must have been all that $cientology propaganda). But I've been taking the medication under supervision and it has been working well for me. It really helped to even me out.

But SSRIs are not for everyone. And health professionals know this.

I had a home invasion robbery at my house. 27 shots fired, almost dead, the whole deal. And after that I started having serious panic attacks. Serious, like my heart would jump out of my chest, like I was scared to death. So, at my (now ex) wife's urging, I went to my doctor .After a 2 minute diagnosis ("Do you think about death, are you sad for no reason&quot I was prescribed Zoloft. Followed instructions like crazy. Hardly smoked weed, but drank a bit, then a lot. Made it worse. 6 weeks in when I felt worse, not better, I went back and told the doc I didn't like it, he doubled the dose and within that 6 week period my life was OVER.

I drank more, my sex drive non existent etc. More suicide thoughts, more panic about everything. Seriously out of it. I couldn't hold on to anything. It was like a side of me was missing. Some days I would be in a movie, one only I saw, with me being the lead character. really hard to describe the feeling.... I got more violent (slamming door breaking things purposely) as well and had an incident with my wife that led to our breakup. (Which was not violent, a spirited argument yes, but she was never touched)....

Also I had a therapist, a psychologist, but he was of not much help there at all. Probably me at fault for that but at the time I had a LOT going on and hated both my wife and her kid for the shootout. Mostly because exactly what I sad was going to happen did, with her kid being "Homeschooled".... (drug sales, tons of kids in the house all day long playing video games "Idle hands are the devils workshop&quot


Now that does not mean that my life was all roses and kisses, I had a lot going on then. The shootout, the lawsuit, the collapse of my biz,health, heart issues, my Dad's rapid descent into craziness, etc. so things were pretty shitty.

I lost everything. 40 bucks and a car that ran exactly eight miles. of course eventually I lost my healthcare so being able to afford pills was out of the question and keeping a therapist as well. But I also knew the pills were not helping at all. I just could not get clear in my head. I made some horrific business decisions for which I am paying for to this day and I just never felt well until I stopped taking them.

Yeah my life was pretty tough then, getting divorced, still being sued by the guy that tried to kill me, near homeless, ripoff in business, parent's crazy and violent, etc.. But I did it. And I started to get better. More focused. I would still get panic'y but when things weren't like that I could handle it, not be mentally impaired the entire day long.


Went back to smoking weed (For most of the time on Prozac I did not smoke due to it raising the chance of panic) and guess what, still get depressed but it is nothing like it was back then. My panic attacks are a lot less and a lot more manageable. I have learned to maintain things better now and not think that I am dying all the time. Of course my life is upended once again (my Mom is in the hospital right now in ICU) and that will cause enormous upheaval in my life once again, and I may get depressed again but never will I take another pill to treat it.


But,If I saw that doctor walking down the street I would beat his ass.

Mine is a similar story, but would prefer not to get into the details. I will say though, that it happened to me about 8 years ago, and I am still picking up the pieces of my life to this day.

SSRI(s) are helpful for some people; I have personally seen, and know it to be true. However, let me just say that there is a very good reason why the FDA requires that suicide warnings be issued for the young and old in their advertisements. I think these warning should include everyone.

Brain chemistry differs greatly from one person to the next. What may work wonders for some people, can seriously f*** up others. This is why I personally feel that doctors should not be prescribing these pills as if they were candy. And if a qualified mental health professional thinks SSRIs would be beneficial for their patients, they should monitor them far more carefully, and not be so fast to up dosages when people report problems with the medication.

-just my 2 cents fwiw.

Xanax is for panic attacks and you had an extremely traumatic event. Some health practitioners aren't very good, and apparently you had two of them.

Hope things go the best they can for your mother.

Sounds like the problem was the drug, not the med

I take Welbutrin and Effexor and it works wonders with my ADHD

But I am not willing to experiment with a bunch of drugs to find out what is right for me. the last one went so far haywire that I am not willing to trust anything. Not to mention I ahve NO health insurance, no SSI no nothing so taking a drug is not i the deal for me. NAd I ahve way more presing health issues than that right now.

Including many DUers

assuming you are now off antidepressants, who would you blame for beating this doctor while he was walking down the street?

Alcohol is a depressant. Antidepressants are antidepressants. Taking them together is a big no no. I cannot say whether that contributed to the Zoloft not working in your case, but I know I quit drinking entirely once I went on Zoloft and would not start back because I know it can interfere with the drug working to help me. And, in my case, it has helped me greatly.

I'm sorry to hear you received no relief from Zoloft. Zoloft may not be right for you. It really is worth it, though, to try until you find something that can help, so you can get some relief from the pain. I hope you can find something that will work for you.

I am one of those DUers who has a much better quality of life because of the SSRI medication I take. I was never a danger to myself or others, but deeply depressed and suffering from debilitating panic attacks and anxiety associated with PTSD. Now, not only can I function, but I function well AND do not have to live with the horrible physical effects of depression. I hate to quote a commercial, but depression really does hurt many sufferers physically. I still have a healthy wariness of people in public spaces, but at least I can go pick up my prescription now without a panic attack. That, alone, has helped continue my progress toward healthier mental health.

colleagues I have worked with were helped with the right medicines. They could not function before.

Doesn't it depend on the circumstances?

not "not valid"

needs examination

if every school shooter in the last 20 years was on bath salts would you be interested in examining the link?

NIH.GOV: Antidepressants and Violence-Problems at the Interface of Medicine & Law
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1564177/

"Recent regulatory warnings about adverse behavioural effects of antidepressants in susceptible individuals have raised the profile of these issues with clinicians, patients, and the public. We review available clinical trial data on paroxetine and sertraline and pharmacovigilance studies of paroxetine and fluoxetine, and outline a series of medico-legal cases involving antidepressants and violence.

Both clinical trial and pharmacovigilance data point to possible links between these drugs and violent behaviours. The legal cases outlined returned a variety of verdicts that may in part have stemmed from different judicial processes. Many jurisdictions appear not to have considered the possibility that a prescription drug may induce violence.

Emotional blunting

Another mechanism that may contribute to hostile events is treatment-induced emotional blunting. Several reports published since 1990 have linked SSRI intake with the production of emotional blunting, detachment, or an amotivational syndrome, described in one report as the equivalent to a

“chemical lobotomy”

Conclusion

The new issues highlighted by these cases need urgent examination jointly by jurists and psychiatrists in all countries where antidepressants are widely used. The problem is international, and it would make sense to organise an international effort now.

Annex: The Illustrative Medico-Legal Cases (at link)
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1564177/

******

This is NOT "NRA Talking points".
This is NOT An attack on those with issues.

This is a call to look at WTF is causing kids to shoot up their schools.

Michael Moore wants to know too:

Members helped

I have been taking the mood stabilizer Lamictal generic equivalent since August for my recently diagnosed bipolar II syndrome. It has helped me tremendously, much easier to concentrate, much less depressed, well, except for the last few days when the ignorant and fearful on DU have told me I am public enemy number 1, sleeping much better, generally happier. Costs me $16.69 a month, a great bargain if you ask me.

people. I don't get how or why they are allowed to make those kinds of allegations. Oh, wait, I forgot. The public's perception of "the mentally ill" is that we are ALL violent, so anything goes when it comes to what they want to say about us. It is beyond depressing.

... On a client's 2011 1040, so we can resolve her IRS issue. She's a really nice lady, and none of this is her fault, the accountant made kindergarten level errors, what a jerk.

Of course, being bipolar, I may have to bludgeon her to death with a stapler or something when she comes into the office to review the corrected return prior to the January audit, because, you know, that's just how all of us bipolar paralegals/certified tax preparers roll. Do I really need the "SARCASM: emoticon here? Well I guess I better before someone sends the cops after me. So, here goes:

Not that I'm bitter about all of the abuse I've taken right here on DU from supposedly fellow Dems, mind you, no, not bitter at all.

and they are speaking from fear and years of propaganda, especially from the "natural cure" industry which refuses all scientific scrutiny and pretends to be some beneficent, altruistic force "fighting the power" all the while raking in billions for selling people false hope and snake oil.

I am not against beneficial natural substances backed by rigorous scientific evidence.

Denninmi, your voice is so important. Do not let it be drowned out, and when you hear people speaking from ignorance, please realize that they have a problem, not you. You can try to help them by teaching them and educating them, if you want, when you feel like it - but ultimately it's their responsibility to own their backwards ignorance, not yours.

I, for one, have had a major improvement on the quality of my life since going on SSRIs back in 1998. I was never violent before and have not been violent since I started taking my SSRIs either. Your statement is categorically false.

I was WAY nastier before Prozac.

but stamping out the rumor is like trying to kill the hydra.

Sid

the more I look the more it seems confirmed, but since it was debunked here that must be true. So we have now hit the trifecta. It couldn't possibly be bad meds, so many think guns aren't the problem, and violence in media must not be looked at. I guess his socks were just too tight that day.

The NY Daily News, which was the original source of the uncle / Fanapt story, the source cited by everyone else reporting the story, has scrubbed any mention of the uncle or Fanapt from their article.

So your article at businessinsider links to this article at the NY Daily news as their source:

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/nancy-lanza-feared-son-adam-worse-article-1.1221505

Notice anything missing? (Hint: it's the uncle and Fanapt)

You can check out the comments to confirm that it was scrubbed.

and believe that will keep us from noticing that they are bat-shit-crazy NRA gun-humpers.

I have no link. I am speculating.

Many have benefited and are benefiting from the wonders of modern medicine. We have also noted over the years that not all drug regimens are effective and some, unfortunately, have led to psychotic reactions. My reading of the young man's behavior indicates a condition that unless the mother was a Christian Scientist, was probably being treated with medicines. You may be the expert that could guess which ones, I'm not.

Come back to this post in a couple of weeks after the media gets a hold of all the results of the law enforcement investigation and see what you think.

One missing reporter in this story so far is the brother. Have we any report that gives him a chance to speak out? Odd.

...who did the shooting didn't have the means to get help.

NRA = GOP & vise versa

and loved ones cant get help for people who need it either. Involuntary commitment can't happen until a person commits a crime. Thank you Raygun..

Thus the murder / suicide.

Whether he was on meds, not on meds, in treatment, an Aspie... the bottom line is that he had easy access to guns.

THAT'S what needs to be addressed first.

The stigmatizing of the mentally ill saying these mass shootings are being done by people who "must be" mentally ill is terrible. Most mentally ill folks are the recipients of violence rather than the perpetrators.

While I welcome attention to the woeful mental health care provisions in this country, its just not fair to smear them this way.

Have you read this Wapo article? The Five myths about mass shootings:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/five-myths-about-mass-shootings/2012/07/27/gJQAcpB8DX_story.html

You need a preceding criminal event for incarceration.

For an IC you just need to have a court that concurs that a person can be reasonably considered a danger to themself or others.

now in most states you can get an IC, the first thing the judge asks is if the petitioner has the means to pay for the commitment. If not there is no public money available for the commitment and the person has to be in custody to get funding for mental health. Raygun defunded mental health services which closed 3 state hospitals in my state. The only state hospital beds are for people charged with or convicted of a crime. I live 1 mile from a private mental health facility, this is the facility used if a petitioner has the means to pay and the court orders IC.

Where did that notion come from. Private and public resources are available for those that want it. I had to make one phone call this past summer and was in to see a psychiatrist two days later.

As far as commitment, yes, it's sad in a way that crimes often have to happen first, but I feel that our current system is preferable to locking up people who haven't done anything wrong, but because of who they are.

Nazi Germany got in the habit of first discriminating against, and then imprisoning people based on who they were, not what they had done. Look how well that worked out. Endless human suffering at the hands of pure evil.

There is no funding for inpatient services unless one is in state custody. There used to be before Raygun took away the federal funding.

If a loved one, or an authority figure is concerned a person is a danger to self or others there should be a way to get that person involuntarily committed. Part of the problem with many mental health conditions is refusal to believe on the part of the person who is effected. Nobody is saying this is a fix-all, but this is a major difference between the time prior to the 1980's and the time since. Equating the captivity of people who are deemed a danger to self or others to "Nazi Germany" is complete Godwinism.

However, our political priority seems to be war, profitable war, not needs of our own people.

As far as your other point, I completely disagree with you.

The argument of the gun lobby/gun supporters goes like this: most gun owners are responsible citizens who would never commit a crime with their guns. Therefore, it would be an egregious violation of their civil rights to take their guns away based on the actions of the few even though they have committed no crimes. And, gun crimes will happen, it's "just the price of a free society".

The double standard/hypocritical argument about people with mental health issues goes like this: although most people with mental health issues aren't violent or dangerous, the few are or have the potential to be. Therefore, for the good of society, we should lock them all up, make them register with law enforcement, or otherwise monitor them as a preventative measure even though they have committed no crimes, and even though that is an egregious violation of their civil rights. Because taking away the civil rights of the mentally ill is "just the price of a free society."

state all people with mental disorders should be institutionalized. Those who are deemed, through due process, to be a danger to self or (more importantly) others should be institutionalized until they are no longer a threat, IMO. This process of involuntary commitment would result in disqualification from NICS, as NICS is supposed to work now. The fact that involuntary commitment isn't an option without commission of a crime, or in cases where the petitioner can afford to pay the astronomical inpatient costs, is counter to interest of the public, again IMO.

I have 2 family members who benefit a lot.

It's guns. It's the glorification of violence. It's drugs. It's the lack of real treatment for the mentally ill.

Everyone wants to blame everyone else so their own precious turf can be unchanged. It takes a village to raise a child but it also takes a village to screw one up.

You're welcome...

no place in the general population.

...

The problem lies entirely within a the small set of Americas who feel like they need to own arsenals. Most gun owners don't have a bunch of guns, only 10% of Americans account for the majority of guns in America. Anytime we take our eyes off figuring out where the problem is within that 10% and start looking at society as a whole we are taking our eye off the ball.

Yes it's too many and too powerful guns in the hands of people who shouldn't have them.

But something is also making people snap more frequently than in other countries. We have deadlier incidents (guns) but we also have more frequent incidents overall (caused by???).

Other countries have more violent traditional cultures, play more video games, watch more violent movies, play more death metal, etc. but no other country drugs such a significant portion of its population to the extent that the US does. So to me, this is a theory that is worth exploring.

Also worth exploring is the role of our 24-hour tragedy porn media industry which doesn't exist in other countries to the extent it does in the US.

is that what pierced the skulls and bodies of all those children?

You can see the tragedy one of two ways:

1. Person + Gun = 28 dead.

2. Person + Gun + violent video game obsession/mental illness/pharmceutical side effect = 28 dead.

There's a common factor here that some people don't want to talk about.

Guns, glorified violence, meds, lack of adequate mental health resources -all these things deserve introspection on our part. We can't just continue to point fingers at 'those other guys'.

Although I disagree slightly - I think our over-eagerness to make children 'manageable' by doping them up with Adderal, Ritalin, anti-depressants and other shit has possibly led to long-term chemical changes in their still growing brains that was un-studied/un-expected and we're now un-prepared for a generation of Manchurians.

That's not the real fucking problem and you gun humpers know it.

this past week than over at freeperville it's totally disgusting

Thanks for the well thought out points for discussion.

I never humped a gun. Please restrict your personal attacks.

not the least of which is the total lack of consideration and disrespect we exhibit for one another as individuals and the diminished sense of community brought on by greed in this nation. Guns, pharmaceuticals, poor mental health care access, inadequate funding and staffing for schools, worship of the almighty gun and dollars, constant bombarding of images of violence in the media and the message that some are more worthy than others... it's all in there. Events do not exist as disconnected from all other factors in the world. They just don't.

it will be made to seem like it was related to pharmaceuticals. Let's face it, if this kid turns out to have been on some psychotropic, any psychotropic, that will be made the issue by the anti-med crowd. No proof required.

dunno

I blame Reaganomics and his policies in the end