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Recursion

(56,582 posts) Wed Jan 16, 2013, 12:23 PM Jan 2013

Unintended consequences: Mali

So, here's an example of how tricky foreign policy is.

Mali is collapsing right now because there was an influx of heavily armed Tuaregs who feel their ethnic group isn't sufficiently represented in what remains of the Malian government.

The reason there was an influx of heavily armed Tuaregs was because they used to be employed by Gaddafi to keep the Libyan people in line and they aren't employed there anymore.

The reason they aren't employed there anymore is that we supported the Libyan uprising. Things are rarely as simple as they look at first.

9 replies

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Unintended consequences: Mali (Original Post) Recursion Jan 2013 OP

The Tuaregs have sought separation for years. dipsydoodle Jan 2013 #1

Dunno. Seems like a pretty complex gymnastic routine to blame Mali on the Obama administration. FSogol Jan 2013 #2

I wasn't doing that, but OK Recursion Jan 2013 #3

You might not of intended that, but the blame game will happen. FSogol Jan 2013 #8

The Touareg problem is a problem that goes beyond Mali. Mass Jan 2013 #4

Foreign Policy comes to mind Recursion Jan 2013 #5

You need '%28' and '%29' for the parentheses muriel_volestrangler Jan 2013 #6

Thanks. I'm on chrome on Linux Recursion Jan 2013 #7

The Tuareg MNLA has been sidelined by the Islamist groups including Al Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb. ellisonz Jan 2013 #9

dipsydoodle

(42,239 posts)

1. The Tuaregs have sought separation for years.

Reply to Recursion (Original post)

Wed Jan 16, 2013, 12:30 PM

Jan 2013

Now they're doing something about it - diplomacy having failed miserably. Its just that now they've got help grouped under the buzz word "Islamists". No doubt the arms they're using were ex-appropriated for Libya.

To paraphrase what you said - someone shot themselves in the foot

FSogol

(45,514 posts)

2. Dunno. Seems like a pretty complex gymnastic routine to blame Mali on the Obama administration.

Reply to Recursion (Original post)

Wed Jan 16, 2013, 12:41 PM

Jan 2013

Recursion

(56,582 posts)

3. I wasn't doing that, but OK

Reply to FSogol (Reply #2)

Wed Jan 16, 2013, 12:42 PM

Jan 2013

Are you saying the situation in Libya isn't a huge part of this?

FSogol

(45,514 posts)

8. You might not of intended that, but the blame game will happen.

Reply to Recursion (Reply #3)

Wed Jan 16, 2013, 01:09 PM

Jan 2013

Already started. Check here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022201289

As for Libya, when a nation becomes destabilized, it spills over into the region. That is the only connection I see. I see no problem with US actions in Libya.

Mass

(27,315 posts)

4. The Touareg problem is a problem that goes beyond Mali.

Reply to Recursion (Original post)

Wed Jan 16, 2013, 12:45 PM

Jan 2013

There are Touareg from Lybia to Western Africa, and traditionally, they are nomads who used to be able to travel freely throughout the continent. Borders and urbanization has reduced their ability to live this type of life and the effort by countries to make them sedentary has generally been poorly received. It is not a new problem, as I remember the problem existing in 1976 when I visited Algeria.

It is true that some of Gaddafi's people were Touareg, but it is the first time I see any link between this and the rebellion in Mali. Do you have any source?

In addition, there are reasons why France intervenes, and they are not altruism. Some of the lands the Touaregs live in in Niger are a large source of uranium that France needs for their nuclear power plants. If the rebellion extends, it could be a problem.

Recursion

(56,582 posts)

5. Foreign Policy comes to mind

Reply to Mass (Reply #4)

Wed Jan 16, 2013, 12:47 PM

Jan 2013

The Tuareg Rebellion even has its own Wiki article.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuareg_rebellion_(2012)

OK, the parantheses fail every attempt I make to get the link to work.

muriel_volestrangler

(101,347 posts)

6. You need '%28' and '%29' for the parentheses

Reply to Recursion (Reply #5)

Wed Jan 16, 2013, 12:56 PM

Jan 2013

thus: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuareg_rebellion_%282012%29

Firefox automatically converts them when you copy to your clipboard from the URL box or use 'copy link location'; I don't knwo which other browsers do.

Recursion

(56,582 posts)

7. Thanks. I'm on chrome on Linux

Reply to muriel_volestrangler (Reply #6)

Wed Jan 16, 2013, 12:56 PM

Jan 2013

And the paste buffer on Gnome 3 still has some issues. And I'm too lazy to do Unicode conversions.

ellisonz

(27,711 posts)

9. The Tuareg MNLA has been sidelined by the Islamist groups including Al Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb.

Reply to Recursion (Original post)

Wed Jan 16, 2013, 01:29 PM

Jan 2013

According to the head of MNLA:

That is one of the reasons why the secular Tuareg rebel movement - the National Movement for the Liberation of Azawad (MNLA) - rose up in January 2012 and swept the northern two-thirds of Mali, declaring an independent state called Azawad.

But the MNLA rebels were soon sidelined by al-Qaeda and its local offshoots, which pushed them from the cities and took over the region, imposing Sharia. The MNLA declined to fight al-Qaeda and beat a tactical retreat. They say their primary enemy is Mali, and until the world recognises them, they cannot lose blood and treasure opening a second front.

"We should fight al-Qaeda in exchange for what?" asks Bilal Ag Cherif, the head of the MNLA and president-in-waiting of the Tuaregs' hoped-for Azawad state.

--------

In the meantime, Timbuktu is being run by AQIM in partnership with local Islamist armed group Ansar Dine - an organisation of mostly Malian Tuaregs and Arabs which serves as an umbrella and host for the foreign fighters of al-Qaeda, much as the Taliban did in Afghanistan. The two groups work hand-in-glove managing the Islamic police and distributing charity.

http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/spotlight/2012review/2012/12/20121228102157169557.html

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