General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWas the killing of Osama bin Ladin morally justified?
We did kill four other people in that raid; we also did it without the permission of or participation by the Pakistanis.
Of course those four other people could be seen as enemy combatants, and informing the Pakistani government might have created problems such to make the raid undoable.
Cards on table, this relates to the drone issue, obviously.
Bryant
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Totally justified | |
16 (94%) |
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More or less justified | |
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Not sure / too many variables | |
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More or less unjustified | |
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Totally unjustified | |
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It is impossible to justify this bullshit poll | |
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I like to vote! | |
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0 DU members did not wish to select any of the options provided. | |
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onehandle
(51,122 posts)I would have killed him with a corkscrew.
Over several hours.
greatauntoftriplets
(175,735 posts)The Magistrate
(95,247 posts)Autumn
(45,084 posts)and kill thousands of people to get bin Ladin. He sent in a team of highly trained Navy Seals and they got the job done. He did not send a drone and kill innocent people who just happened to be near by.
Whisp
(24,096 posts)Autumn
(45,084 posts)EastKYLiberal
(429 posts)It's better the last thing they hear is the buzzing of a drone than the screams of an American soldier getting maimed or killed in the firefight.
Autumn
(45,084 posts)He deserved to look in the eyes of his executioner and know his death was coming.
rollin74
(1,974 posts)Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)If your question is about drones, that's what you should ask about.
el_bryanto
(11,804 posts)It's helpful to consider the most recent high profile assassination the United States Government performed.
Bryant
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)international terrorist' some validation for actions that kill by remote control those whose names we are not told who are certainly not the most wanted man on Earth including American citizens? Again, what's the similarity, what is the actual connection? The targets are not similar, the pursuit not as extended nor exhaustive, the tactics and weapons (which are the central part of your actual point) are not the same in at all.
Seems you are going a long way to not ask the question you actually have in mind.
el_bryanto
(11,804 posts)I have grave reservations about this kill list.
I do question the line "pursuit not as extended nor exhaustive" - since we don't know the subjects, we can't know whether or not these targets merit assassination. It's possible they do.
Is it appropriate to use drones to kill innocent American civilians?
Is it appropriate to use drones to kill guilty as hell American terrorists?
I must admit this was sparked a bit by that list of ethical flaws someone posted - I'll go get the link in a moment (here it is)- but several of those ethical flaws could also be applied to killing Bin Ladin.
Bryant
Floyd_Gondolli
(1,277 posts)Yes, the difference is method. Special OPs vs. Drones. But the process in which they got there is exactly what those opposed to drone strikes have been talking about for several days -- a unilateral decision by one man to whack a citizen of another country.
Congress wasn't consulted. There were no committee meetings on the hill. They just did it. Like they're doing with the drones.
Full disclosure: I happen to agree with the targeting of Bin Laden (it took a Dem to get it right) and I'm also unopposed to the use of drones.
Puzzledtraveller
(5,937 posts)I had to point this out in another thread about drones and Osama Bin Laden, geesh.
el_bryanto
(11,804 posts)But I'm not sure how many here are fine with killing people with drones so long as they aren't Us Citizens.
Bryant
RC
(25,592 posts)with seemly impunity? Just because their a name on someones list. Does no one see the connection between what we are doing there and the continuing terrorism?
The very fact that WE are in their country killing them, will cause any still non-terrost to fight back any way they can. Give them time.
The blow back for the animosity we are currently generating in the Middle East will be very unpleasant.
La Lioness Priyanka
(53,866 posts)if say someone in iraq wanted to retaliate the unnecessary bloodshed from a war we waged for no reason at all towards one of our leaders, i wonder how many of us would think that is justifiable
leftstreet
(36,108 posts)Arctic Dave
(13,812 posts)use my computer to google map them.
I would probably let them borrow my car.
zappaman
(20,606 posts)Will never shed a tear for that fucker.
riqster
(13,986 posts)Many of the same issues around the drone strikes do apply here, of course.
Asymmetric warfare is neither more nor less morally complex than "traditional" combat. Moral ambiguities (to say the least) will always accompany any enterprise that is centered around killing people. For examples, look at the Blitz, Dresden, or the Albigensian Crusade.
Puzzledtraveller
(5,937 posts)without their knowledge or support.
intaglio
(8,170 posts)On the other hand there would have been little hope of transporting and putting on trial the self righteous piece of garbage that was OBL.
TheCowsCameHome
(40,168 posts)Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)whatchamacallit
(15,558 posts)If someone in the government decided to put el_bryanto on a kill list, should they be able to vaporize him, his family, and possibly his neighbors without providing due process?
el_bryanto
(11,804 posts)As I am a totally innocent guy and very likable.
Should Drones be able to be used to kill totally innocent guys like me? No.
Should Drones be able to be used to kill totally guilty guys like bin Ladin? Yes. No. Not without some review. Maybe.
Bryant
whatchamacallit
(15,558 posts)I believe in due process for everyone.
el_bryanto
(11,804 posts)super problematic by the way - seems to nod towards exigent circumstances. The Target apparently has to pose an immediate threat of violent attack against the United States.
I guess the problem is who determines when an individual meets those circumstances.
Bryant
Ohio Joe
(21,756 posts)The fucker needed to be dead.
Ed Suspicious
(8,879 posts)Vincardog
(20,234 posts)Arctic Dave
(13,812 posts)However, the US almost always kills their partners in crime. Like the mafia.
The others they imprison without the ability to expose theirs and our secrets.