To try and compare homeopathy and guns is ridiculous, and takes away from the problem of quacks and scams in the name of "medicine", IMO.

The benefits of both are regularly espoused by those firmly rooted in neither research nor reality.

I think the comparison is better than you'd care to admit.

Guns are getting all the attention they can handle right now. There is no need to diminish the problems with homeopathy by diluting the issue with something so unrelated.

There seems to be a lot of confusion out there that "homeopathic" is another way of saying "natural" or "herbal."

So to you my question is: What is homeopathy?

Did you click on either the link or the video in the OP?

Most would call it quackery.

How do you define it?

Unless it is in pill form, then it is whatever pills are made out of, minus the active "ingredient."

Homeopathy has been around for quite some time and there are people who believe in this wholeheartedly. I am not one to digress on others beliefs. Why there those who make it their life purpose to try and make other people, those whom you do not even know, (BTW) to come around to their own personal view of how they should live their lives is beyond me. To each, their own, I say! I'm not going to change you as much as you are not going to change me. Problem is that we need each other if we are going to win against those who hate us both. Let us respect each others way; that is unless you would prefere we get at each other over some differences that will NOT make much difference.

Homeopathy is pure, 100% bullshit. It is not science. It is not medicine. To believe that it is it to deny reality in favor of delusion.

While I will always respect your right to believe whatever you want, you have no right to expect anyone to respect your beliefs.

Respect is earned. Earned through actions. How can one expect to be respected when their actions actively deny reality?

I do not respect them for that belief, though. But I certainly have respect for people that also may believe in a god, because they have earned it through actions here in reality, not because of their belief in a god, or homeopathy.

And when a person tries to defend their beliefs (in this case homeopathy) in an attempt to get others to respect it, by ignoring reality, science, mathematics, and common sense, what respect must be given that?

Many natural remedies are legit and beneficial, but you get more health benefits from drinking a glass of water and eating an apple than homeo "cures."

And, people who do give it to their kids and pets should be ashamed of themselves.

Homeopathic doesn't make any sense. But I still will seek natural or herbal remedies whenever possible.

Thanks!

in many instances.

Homeopathic treatment is not just mixtures of liquids. And has been used in countries around the world for centuries.

Have you ever had your nose run after eating something with a lot of cayenne pepper? That's a homeopathic treatment for sinus infection.

Another sinus treatment: Flushing your sinuses with salt water mixture. Very effective, esp to prevent sinus infections.

The best treatment, IMO, uses both modern medicine and alternative treatments.

My philosophy is...if it's not harmful or expensive, why not try it and see if it helps?

"salt water mixture"? Diluted 30 times? Just water.

And homeopathic "medicines" are not cheap. But at least they are not harmful. Except if you're going to visit a country where there is, say, malaria and you choose the homeopathic vaccine. This has actually happened.

It seems you may be conflating homeopathy with "natural" medicine. The OP has both the definition and a 2 minute video explanation of just what "homeopathy" is, and what you describe above is not homeopathy.

So, if water has a memory of medical substances it had contact with, what about poison?
Let's say, I pour a jar of poison into the ocean, let it stir for a few days and then extract two cups of water from that same spot.
(On a ratio of 1l vs 1km³ that's a dilution of 10^-12, which is fairly normal for homeopathy I guess.)

One cup for me, one for a believer of homeopathy.
Let's see, whether we survive.


EDIT:
Oh no, something horrible just came to my mind: If you take a piss in your shower...

"Like cures like!"

The homeopathic poison would cure you of poisoning.

What is the homeopathic agent to help you go to sleep?

Caffeine!

Like cures like.

Homeopathy. 18th century magical medicine today! It's nothing but pure quackery.

For example I am one of those people that can't take opoid medicines or I will sit in a lake (not a puddle) of my own sweat, so if my kids has a fever and is sweating I ought to give her some codeine to stop the sweats.

There was a movement to ground homeopathy on more scientific footing back in the 1870s, but it wound up splitting the homeopathy school into two distinct camps: one that welcomed further scientific investigation and progress, and one that insisted on a "back to basics" approach with regard to Hahnemann's teachings.

Homeopaths were also the first to create a national medical society in America, beating the AMA to the punch by about two years.

That I'm more sympathetic to.

The "pro-science" wing eventually got absorbed into the AMA and dispensed with homeopathy altogether. The last historic medical college to teach homeopathy stopped offering the classes in 1949.

prayer.

Humorism (The Four Humors) corresponds to one of the traditional four temperaments of Hippocratic medicine black bile, yellow bile, phlegm, and blood.

It was amazing how much they could do (successful brain and eye surgery, for instance) while being so completely wrong. Also some weird changes of perspective: they considered the liver, rather than the heart, the seat of emotion. It sounds stupid to my ears, but then again the heart being the seat of emotion is kind of stupid too.

"In 2000, two men from Cedar City, Utah were prosecuted for practicing medicine without a license after they performed a trepanation on an English woman to treat her chronic fatigue syndrome and depression."

My oral surgeon recommended I use it and is convinced that it works. Apparently this is considered a homeopathic medicine. I am sceptical about this whole concept but took it anyway.

While "natural" medicine certainly has its failings, some plants DO have evidence to support their efficacy. While I am unsure about the efficacy of Arnica Montana, a quick look at the Wiki on it seems to suggest that it is not homeopathy. YMMV.

I wouldn't use them, but they exist.

http://abchomeopathy.com/r.php/Arn

Again, only because a homeopathic version would contain no AM at all.

Good morning, cleanhippie.

I'd be surprised they could be allowed to sell it if I didn't know it gets diluted so much there's nothing left of the original substance.

I don't do homeopathy, and find no science-based evidence to support it but -- like religion -- if it makes people feel better and doesn't hurt them or the rest of us, it's none of my business. (At the same time, though, I suspect a lot of people turn to homeopathy out of desperation and there are plenty of analogies of other methods of self-medication applied out of desperation, rather than true choice or science-based evidence. I won't judge.)

Many people turn to homeopathy after all else does not work. And if it works it works. But all this anti-homeopathy, I don't understand. I'd like to see statistics on how many people die from homeopathy as compared to prescribed drugs.

Under the homeopathic theory that like cures like, if someone is so full of shit their eyes are brown...

Sid

I don't know how she did it...all that pain, but she refused to take the morphine

and used only aspirin as opoids make me sweat like a pig. Refused anymore pain killers after the first night in the hospital.

and it worked extremely well with swelling and bruising after surgery. I also bruise very easily, so I buy Arnica Gel, and use that on my bruises, well they definitely heal much quicker..

that your bruises heal quicker.

All I have is my eyes... Is that not good enough?

It's double blind for a reason. You see what you want to see. Confirmation bias.

to make you feel better in your position. I don't.. Isn't it a wonderful thing when people have free will to do what they want with their bodies??

and the complete lack of it in our Society. I want our children to become smarter and better educated. People who wish to push Big WooWoo are in fact a huge road block to achieving that goal. If you feel you don't need Science just do me a favor and promise me you will not get involved in Society at large.

People pushing CAM and Creationism are dumbing down our Society.

by "promise you to not get involved in society at large"? Are you saying to drop dead? That is what it sounds like.. I'm not pushing homeopathy on anyone, unlike you, I don't try to pressure others into agreeing with me..

I mean like the creationist pushing for the bible in school. I want supporters of Homeopathy to promise they will keep that junk out of our schools and not get upset if science programs inform kids that water does not have memory and ultra dilutions of compounds don't do anything and that like cure like is a logical fallacy.

I think schools should teach critical reasoning and teach kids about scams. Will CAM zealots get pissed at such programs?

The podiatrist recommended it for my severe plantar fasciitis. It's an OTC ointment, and given the ingredients (various waxes. mostly) I think the mild massaging after the exercises prescribed worked about as well as the arnica. It did smell nice, though.

Don't underestimate the placebo effect, though: your body is going to try to heal itself if it can, and, according to an article I read in Science a few years ago, placebos are getting a lot more effective these days!

A nurse friend turned us on to it about twenty years ago and since then i keep the pills & ointment in my purse at all times. For physical trauma, swelling &/or bruising is is a godsend. I have shared this with many and they are always astonished and thankful.

a topical gel on bruises. It's an actual herbal medication (at least the one I use).

Similasin. The "active" ingredient is Bella Donna, an opiate. Obviously it must be pretty diluted because it is sold over the counter. And it seems to work. Besides, I'd rather use it that dropping chemical drops in my eyes.

It would appear that saline is all that is in Similasin, so if a bottle of saline is available at the store cheaper than your Homeopathic "remedy", would you choose that instead? Why or why not?


The fact that the "opiate" is diluted so low as to be available OTC, should raise flags with the consumer that he/she is not really getting what they think they are. Agree?

I'm not into homeopathy, and the stuff is crazy expensive ($9 for a little bottle), but it feels good a relieves my dry eyes. I did notice that they've changed the name of it since I started using it...it used to be called Redness Relief, now it's just Dry Eyes. There's probably nothing in it to actually relieve redness, although that is still listed as a benefit on the label. I still prefer it to products like Visine full of chemical preservatives.

I urge you to try some plain saline, available in any store with the other OTC meds. It will save you a ton of cash!

Good luck.

Cut it out. The poster you are responding to stated they like the product. Your "opinion" is just as full of crap as the people you are making fun of, unless you have some sort of medical credentials specifically specializing in eyes.

the beginning, my wife and I have met many longstanding DUers and the admin in person in DU meetups.

I doubt anyone here would call me a "troll."

However, you are trolling for a little ego boost today. I hope you get it.

I never called you a troll, but you are trolling me. Does that make you a troll? maybe, maybe not. I guess that is up to you and your actions.

thereby implying I am a "troll." I care. Many people care. However, this thread is just an ego boost to you. It has zero to do with your faux concern for "public health," and a strong desire to be "right."

And that's all this whole thread is: one circle jerk for "skeptics."

Anyway, you are being ridiculous, so I'm done with you.

Have a nice day.

I am not a user, or believer in homeopathic remedies, NOR do I believe in telling adults how to spend their money, or how to live when it doesn't affect me in the least.

"giving medical advice". It in no way constitutes the practice of medicine.

Trolling.

that you denied using earlier.

I also never called you a troll.
Project elsewhere.

it fast enough for me to miss it.

Or deleted it after you were called on it. Personally, I think you are cowardly....which is why you start these passive aggresive threads that border on bullying. Typical...take it right to the line...and then stop before your threads get deleted...and make use of your silly "waving emoticons" to "show that you are just a really really nice person."

You found my comment to be implying that I called you a troll. I deleted it. What more do you want?

You behavior, OTOH, fits the definition of the word "trolling."

is a grey area as defined by law, correct? The OP wasn't discussing "merits," s/he was implying knowledge of OTC eye drops. Perhaps you should be more concerned with their degrees, or area of expertise.

I AM aware of how you FEEL about homeopathy where animal husbandry is concerned; however there are veterinarians with the same degree that you have, the same science undergrad who feel differently. We choose to not use these products, however, if others do....unless it is one of your feline patients, it is frankly none of your business.

It is duly noted.

I am confused.

Saline solution relieves my dry eyes. The nasty stuff in Visine is totally different.

From their own website http://similasanusa.com/ingredients.

Again you are dropping chemicals into your eyes because you don't want to drop chemicals into your eyes.

Their "active" ingredients are diluted to the level described by Dawkins in the video above. Do you understand just how diluted that is? If you watched his demonstration, and accept the principles of basic mathematics, then there are no chemicals in those eye drops. None at all.

It is so diluted as to be virtually non-existent. Unlike Visine. I have dry eyes, and these drops feel good. I make no assumption that the homeopathy does anything, but they relieve the dryness and they're not Visine. I don't otherwise "subscribe" to the theory of homeopathy. I just happen to like this particular product.