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nolabear

(41,986 posts)
Mon Mar 25, 2013, 03:23 PM Mar 2013

If YOU were making an argument for same sex marriage before the SCOTUS, what would you say?

I'm serious. Mine would go something like:

The most important job that this court has is to ensure that, as the Constitution repeatedly says, all American citizens are treated equally under the law. The fact that this argument is being heard by the court at all indicates that it sees same sex marriage as a legal, and not a moral or religious issue. All arguments against two people of the same sex having the right to marry come from a supposedly moral or religious standpoint, and attempt to create a concept of "reverse bias", wherein they state that their own freedom is being impinged upon by the granting of the right of marriage to same sex couples. If the court can find a single incidence wherein a person has been denied their Constitutionally guaranteed rights by the union of two men or two women, then let the court present it now or do the right, the just, the responsible thing and find that marriage equality should be not state-by-state, for that is a hardship unimposed on any heterosexual couple, but nationwide, so that we can get on with the business of creating stable and loving families in a country that desperately needs them.

What say y'all? How would you make a good and convincing argument that the Court would listen to?

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elleng

(130,972 posts)
3. Loving:
Mon Mar 25, 2013, 03:40 PM
Mar 2013

'The court ruled that Virginia's anti-miscegenation statute violated both the Due Process Clause and the Equal Protection Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment.

Chief Justice Earl Warren's opinion for the unanimous court held that:

“ Marriage is one of the "basic civil rights of man," fundamental to our very existence and survival.... To deny this fundamental freedom on so unsupportable a basis as the racial classifications embodied in these statutes, classifications so directly subversive of the principle of equality at the heart of the Fourteenth Amendment, is surely to deprive all the State's citizens of liberty without due process of law. The Fourteenth Amendment requires that the freedom of choice to marry not be restricted by invidious racial discrimination. Under our Constitution, the freedom to marry, or not marry, a person of another race resides with the individual and cannot be infringed by the State.'

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loving_v._Virginia

patrice

(47,992 posts)
4. Yours is the better, more positive, form of mine. Mine would be about how damaging oppression
Mon Mar 25, 2013, 03:44 PM
Mar 2013

is and I, as an American, do not want to be responsible for that damage to our LGBT brothers and sisters.

I don't want to be part of a thing that hurts those individuals, not only in violation of their own rights to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness, but also for the incalculable losses to us as a whole. Even if those who are oppressed learn to cope, their oppression results in all kinds of losses, everything from teeny tiny to enormous losses that result from legally instituting a permanent under-class. I know SCOTUS doesn't care, but I'm thinking here about how oppressed persons are way less likely to engage in random acts of kindness. That smile given to a stranger IS valuable in ways that money will never be able to buy.

ALL of us need that considerate word, that road peace, a new home for the abandoned puppy, that light touch in a tense situation, a completely gratuitous good-hearted laugh . . . and if we act to prevent anyone from discovering love itself, I guess I have to say that there is no hope for the freedom that all of us need to learn how to be happy and as good as possible to ourselves and others.

 

cbrer

(1,831 posts)
5. No Nation has a right to call itself free
Mon Mar 25, 2013, 03:52 PM
Mar 2013

When its government concerns itself with the personal decisions of its citizens within the scope of their individual lives.

PERIOD!

 

Marr

(20,317 posts)
6. I think I'd argue that refusal to acknowledge same-sex marriage is government mixing with religion.
Mon Mar 25, 2013, 03:53 PM
Mar 2013

Religious groups can define marriage any way they choose, but the government cannot refuse certain citizens the same rights as others based on those religious decrees.

Demoiselle

(6,787 posts)
7. All these arguments are excellent.
Mon Mar 25, 2013, 04:00 PM
Mar 2013

I would add that all stable human and humane societies are built on our sense of commitment to each other, and that commitment starts at a very basic one-to-one level. We need as many "couples" in our world as possible. To disallow the commitment of two people just because they're the same sex seems to me to be a dreadful waste.

Tikki

(14,557 posts)
10. My husband and I have been married since we were kids..and over the years we have been warned not...
Mon Mar 25, 2013, 04:19 PM
Mar 2013

to talk to middle school-aged and high school aged girls about our teen marriage being a success because
it might make these girls think they can get married as teenagers.

Now here is the truth: A marriage is either going to work or not work. A relationship is formed on many levels
and maturity to handle each level as it happens comes along with a person, not an age or a sex..

If the goal of 'marriage' is to be successful then there is NO reason to think that many same-sex relationships
won't perform successfully into a marriage.

On a legal issue...I get protection for my present and future legally from my husband's years of hard work because
I am part of team Tikki.

I have met same-sex couples who are teamed up and well represented. They would like to feel secure whatever
might befall their futures, also.

The Mister and I have zero religious identity so I can not talk to that, but seems religious couples succeed and struggle in
relationships pretty much like every one else.

Maybe that is it: Same-sex couples are like everyone else..except biologically,... and should be afforded the same privileges.


The Tikkis

MineralMan

(146,317 posts)
12. I would simply say,
Mon Mar 25, 2013, 04:34 PM
Mar 2013

We either have equal protection under the law or we do not. We either have no state church or we have a state church. I can marry the person I love without any assistance from any religion. Why cannot my wife's cousin?

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