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morningfog

(18,115 posts)
Fri Mar 29, 2013, 11:12 PM Mar 2013

New study finds no link between 'too many vaccines' and autism

A new study adds to years of research showing that childhood vaccines do not cause autism, despite worries among a growing number of parents that their young children receive “too many vaccines.”

Researchers from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention concluded that even when multiple inoculations are given on the same day, children are at no higher risk of developing autism, according to the report published in the Journal of Pediatrics Friday.

“This study looked into the concern that receiving too many vaccines at one doctor’s visit or too many vaccines during the first two years of life may be linked to the development of autism,” the report’s lead author, Dr. Frank DeStefano told NBC chief medical editor Dr. Nancy Snyderman. “We found they’re not related.”

The CDC researchers conducted the study by reviewing the vaccination histories collected between 1994 and 1999 of 256 children with autism and 752 children who did not have the disorder. They calculated the number of antigens – the substances in a vaccine that stimulate disease-fighting antibodies – that infants are exposed to either on one doctor’s visit or overall during the first two years.

“We did not find any relationship between the number of antigens and the risk of autism,” said DeStafano, Director of the Immunization Safety Office at the CDC.


http://vitals.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/03/29/17516929-new-study-finds-no-link-between-too-many-vaccines-and-autism

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New study finds no link between 'too many vaccines' and autism (Original Post) morningfog Mar 2013 OP
I love vaccines. nt ZombieHorde Mar 2013 #1
k&r uppityperson Mar 2013 #2
Hug me; I'm vaccinated! longship Mar 2013 #3
So once again money was diverted from necessary research Warpy Mar 2013 #4
Oh? proverbialwisdom Mar 2013 #7
The only difference is a specific diagnosis Warpy Mar 2013 #13
Oh? proverbialwisdom Mar 2013 #36
Oh, people without a medical background writing about a medical condition Warpy Mar 2013 #47
The majority have a child with autism and have ZERO ulterior motives to mislead or misdirect. proverbialwisdom Mar 2013 #57
So what? That certainly doesn't make them experts or qualified. morningfog Mar 2013 #62
That factor alone doesn't cut it, I agree with you. They are saying to the public there is more. proverbialwisdom Apr 2013 #63
I see you found more time. morningfog Apr 2013 #64
Please see graphics in posts #33 , #35 and #59 together in order to grasp the concerns of many @AOA. proverbialwisdom Apr 2013 #65
I have to give you props on being prepared.. snooper2 Apr 2013 #68
Age of Autism... SidDithers Mar 2013 #22
Oh? proverbialwisdom Mar 2013 #5
Poor Ed doesn't quite understand science. morningfog Mar 2013 #9
The analogy is simple and accessible. So is the information here. proverbialwisdom Mar 2013 #11
The analogy is stupid. morningfog Mar 2013 #12
So forget the analogy. Recent remarks by these four establishment researchers contradict the study. proverbialwisdom Mar 2013 #15
Did you even read what you posted? morningfog Mar 2013 #18
I'd like to recommend that you read these quotes in their full context at the linked posts. proverbialwisdom Mar 2013 #25
"Dr. Geraldine Dawson, chief science officer for the advocacy group Autism Speaks." Starry Messenger Mar 2013 #34
That 2009 publicity campaign sounds abysmal, though created by two fathers of children with autism. proverbialwisdom Mar 2013 #39
analogies are not evidence. nt Deep13 Mar 2013 #30
Agreed. This merits more than analogies or platitudes. proverbialwisdom Mar 2013 #33
So, what do YOU think is the reason? morningfog Mar 2013 #37
What I think isn't the issue. proverbialwisdom Mar 2013 #43
No reason to believe the figures. Deep13 Mar 2013 #46
He sure as hell doesn't understand the immune system! Warpy Mar 2013 #48
k&r Starry Messenger Mar 2013 #6
so how long until the woo people show up? name not needed Mar 2013 #8
They have arrived. morningfog Mar 2013 #10
it shames me that people think age of autism our adventure in autism should be Godhumor Mar 2013 #20
They're always here, posting rubbish from rubbishy websites Warpy Mar 2013 #49
Unsupportable and unsustainable given the current health trends. Wait and see. proverbialwisdom Mar 2013 #58
Du rec. Nt xchrom Mar 2013 #14
Good - hopefully the funding for all these studies can now be better directed bhikkhu Mar 2013 #16
If I could recommend an individual post, I'd recommend yours! LeftishBrit Mar 2013 #19
Well said...nt SidDithers Mar 2013 #23
some of those funds need to be directed towards transitioning adults from school to work and liberal_at_heart Mar 2013 #28
indeed La Lioness Priyanka Mar 2013 #44
The implications of the flawed control group design discussed here by AOA contributor J.Thompson. proverbialwisdom Mar 2013 #17
Do you seriously think links to ageofautism help your argument?...nt SidDithers Mar 2013 #24
Please consider the primary sources cited, NOT the news aggregator/analysis websites, per se. nt proverbialwisdom Mar 2013 #26
Then you should post the primary source without the advocacy site middleman...nt SidDithers Mar 2013 #27
No control was needed in this type of study. MAD Dave Mar 2013 #52
May I also point out Wakefield was found to have committed fraud MAD Dave Mar 2013 #54
UK CryShame press release - 9 March 2013 proverbialwisdom Mar 2013 #60
DURec. Another win for science over superstition... SidDithers Mar 2013 #21
Exactly MAD Dave Mar 2013 #55
I read about this in Well, No Shit! magazine. nt Deep13 Mar 2013 #29
Did you read this, too? proverbialwisdom Mar 2013 #32
You anti-vaxxers are letting your paranoid superstitions... Deep13 Mar 2013 #45
You non-science anti-vaxers scare the shit out of me. n-t Logical Mar 2013 #53
vaccines save lives period. bench scientist Mar 2013 #31
Ginger Taylor: Overall health outcomes matter, not merely reduction of communicable disease levels. proverbialwisdom Mar 2013 #35
Wow. "merely reduction of communicable disease levels." morningfog Mar 2013 #38
I was quoting Ginger Taylor's recent testimony before the Maine legislature re: informed consent. proverbialwisdom Mar 2013 #40
Ginger Taylor is a calloused ass, then. Some real asshole depravity there. morningfog Mar 2013 #50
I don't have more time to spend on this, however... according to research posted at AOA, proverbialwisdom Mar 2013 #59
Glad you won't be posting any more of that tripe in this thread. morningfog Mar 2013 #61
Now that you are locked out, you really won't be adding anymore tripe to this thread! morningfog Apr 2013 #75
Is phenylketonuria caused by consumption of phenylalanine? eridani Mar 2013 #41
This was obvious to everyone but gullible idiots. sagat Mar 2013 #42
Exactly. So what about the 99% of EVERYONE ELSE who's vaccinated and WITHOUT autism alp227 Apr 2013 #70
Here is the abstract of the study if anyone is interested davidpdx Mar 2013 #51
I used to HATE statistics...... MAD Dave Mar 2013 #56
Post removed Post removed Apr 2013 #66
SPAM^^^^ morningfog Apr 2013 #67
Brian Hooker criticizes a vaccine safety study; hilarity ensues SidDithers Apr 2013 #69
Try some real studies that show proof KRAD74 Apr 2013 #71
Have you links to any "real studies that show proof"? Welcome to DU. uppityperson Apr 2013 #72
That's the problem. KRAD74 Apr 2013 #73
That's because all the research supports vaccines. Those who refuse vaccines are selfish morningfog Apr 2013 #74
Some are not saying to refuse vaccines all together KRAD74 Apr 2013 #76

longship

(40,416 posts)
3. Hug me; I'm vaccinated!
Fri Mar 29, 2013, 11:27 PM
Mar 2013


on edit: However, anybody paying even cursory attention to this issue already knows that the vaccine-autism connection basically died when the former physician Andrew Wakefield was struck off the roles in the UK for fraud and conflicts of interest.

Now he pals around with Jenny McCarthy, Jim Carrey and the other vaccination denialist idiots.

But the vaccination troothers never change their song. Meanwhile, children are struck down by childhood diseases which the latter generations have never known.

I was born in the forties, so I have seen polio in my life. I remember both kids at school who suddenly disappear, and kids walking on crutches. I also remember when the Salk vaccine became available; all students got it. First, it was a jab; the second and subsequent ones were the oral vaccine on a sugar cube. All were easy-peasy compared to being crippled. We all saw enough of that already.

I worry that we may see something like a recurrence of polio to shut down these vaccination deniers. At least we no longer have to worry about Smallpox -- thanks to vaccination.

Warpy

(111,267 posts)
4. So once again money was diverted from necessary research
Sat Mar 30, 2013, 12:04 AM
Mar 2013

to answer a bunch of know nothing hysterics who mindlessly follow that fraud Wakefield.

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
7. Oh?
Sat Mar 30, 2013, 02:02 PM
Mar 2013
http://medicalxpress.com/news/2013-03-state-highest-autism-range.html

State with one of highest rates of autism turns out to be in normal range

March 26, 2013
by Mary Jo Layton in Autism spectrum disorders



When New Jersey reported one of the nation's highest rates of autism last year - doubling in six years to one in 49 children - researchers described it as "beyond an emergency." But a federal study released this past week indicated that the high rate appears to be the norm nationally. Autism spectrum disorder now affects one in every 50 children, well above the one in 88 previously reported by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.


"The good news is that the increase in autism isn't special to New Jersey," said Walter Zahorodny, an autism researcher at the University of Medicine and Dentistry of New Jersey. "The bad news is that it's a significant increase and it's registering everywhere."

The findings released this past week by the U.S. Health Resources and Services Administration and the CDC are spurring debate: While experts attribute the increase to better reporting, it also suggests that the disorder is being diagnosed more frequently in children with milder symptoms.

According to the study, 1 million children nationally are diagnosed with autism, a complex disorder that affects brain development and a person's ability to communicate, learn and form relationships.

"The feeling all along wasn't that New Jersey has more cases of autism - New Jersey was just more rigorous in ascertaining the incidence," said Dr. Joseph Holahan, medical director of the child development center at St. Joseph's Children's Hospital in Paterson. "It's still one of the most common serious developmental disorders we see."

<>

"We still think one in 50 is an underestimate," said Michael Rosanoff, associate director for public health research and scientific review for the advocacy group Autism Speaks.

The real issue is we need to meet the demands of this public health crisis," said Rosanoff said. "This should be a wake-up call."

<>


Re: last year's CDC numbers from more rigorously designed study (with the 1 in 49 NJ stat),

Eighty percent of the children with autism in the New Jersey study were identified as having the most severe form of the disorder. Boys were more than five times as likely to be diagnosed as girls, both in New Jersey and in the rest of the country.

Read more at: http://medicalxpress.com/news/2013-03-state-highest-autism-range.html#jCp


Link from: http://www.ageofautism.com/2013/03/dachel-media-update-autism-awareness-assault.html

Warpy

(111,267 posts)
13. The only difference is a specific diagnosis
Sat Mar 30, 2013, 03:38 PM
Mar 2013

instead of labeling kids along the spectrum "retarded" or "oddballs."

Autism isn't increasing. We're just getting better at spotting it.

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
36. Oh?
Sat Mar 30, 2013, 11:31 PM
Mar 2013
http://www.ageofautism.com/2013/03/johns-missing-autism-wandering-and-why-we-need-action-now.html
http://www.ageofautism.com/2013/03/alert-the-media-yes-autistic-kids-have-a-novel-bowel-disease.html
http://www.ageofautism.com/2013/03/wizard-extortion-pharmaceutical-epidemic-judge-rotenberg-school-of-shock.html
http://www.ageofautism.com/2013/03/day-19-loyola-chicago-hospital-locks-down-autistic-patient.html


http://thinkingmomsrevolution.com/media-kit/media-kit-videos/

Q&A 4: WHEN DID YOU START TO WORRY ABOUT YOUR CHILD? 3:06



■ALISON MACNEIL – CAMBRIDGE, MA 0:06 I first started to worry about my son about 16 months. He stopped playing with his toys, he stopped making eye contact, didn’t notice if you walked into a room, and had liquid rancid diarrhea all day long.

■SUGAH – HOUSTON, TX 0:38 It was between 12 months to 24 months

■0:49 He was not talking like he should be talking, he would just parrot back whatever I had to say.

■CATHY BRENNAN REILLY – ROCKPORT MA 1:31 At around 18 months he got a cold, a regular cold which turned into pneumonia which turned into ear infections which turned into pneumonia again. During that time he had a fever related seizure, 6 to 8 weeks after the illness he recovered and um, he had lost all his language, he couldn’t speak any more.





Book Review

“This Revolution ignites spirit and brilliance out of the tinder of wrenching pain, crazy contradictions, and a confused and collapsing medical system. Viva la Revolution!!”
~ Martha Herbert, MD, PhD. Pediatric Neurologist and Brain Development Researcher at Harvard Medical School and the Massachusetts General Hospital.




Autism Beyond The Spectrum: Inspiring True Stories From Parents Fighting To Rescue Their Children

Twenty-three moms and one brave dad make up The Thinking Moms’ Revolution. Their group stretches from Montana to Malaysia to Montreal. While parenting children with disabilities, they came together on Facebook to collaborate about bio-medical and dietary interventions, as well as doctors and researchers developing cutting edge treatments. In the process they became a tight-knit family dedicated to helping their children lose their diagnoses. Out of this collaboration they have created something far more substantial. Suspecting that the roots of their children’s autism, adhd, asthma, sensory processing disorder and food allergies may be found in the overuse of antibiotics, preventative medical care, environmental toxins and processed food, they began a mission to turn it around!

Here, Helen Conroy and Lisa Joyce Goes have collected TMR’s stories of healing and hope as they fight to recover their children from autism and related disorders. Each chapter is written by a different TMR member sharing how they found each other, what they have learned along their journey, and why the support of close friends, also parenting kids with special needs, is so important. In this book you will read about their individual experiences, and learn how their determination and friendships have become a daily motivation for parents worldwide.












proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
57. The majority have a child with autism and have ZERO ulterior motives to mislead or misdirect.
Sun Mar 31, 2013, 11:04 AM
Mar 2013

It's your choice to discount whomever you want though.

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
63. That factor alone doesn't cut it, I agree with you. They are saying to the public there is more.
Mon Apr 1, 2013, 12:40 PM
Apr 2013

My automatic impulse, ordinarily, would be to go no further than the information provided in the OP by "the Director of the Immunization Safety Office at the CDC." BUT PARENTS, WHO LIVE AUTISM AS A CENTRAL PART OF THEIR LIVES, SAY NO DICE. They're experts on revealing important information that should make everyone stop and demand answerers.

For example, these career paths may be problematic, or they may not be. However, it's hypocritical for DUers to vociferously condemn one and turn a blind eye to the other, or worse, attack those who expose the latter.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022582265

Fri Mar 29, 2013, 12:06 AM

Lanny Breuer Cashes in After Not Prosecuting Wall Street Execs-- Approximate Salary of 4 million $

178 RECS


http://adventuresinautism.blogspot.com/2009/12/julie-gerberding-named-head-of-merck.html

December 21, 2009

WSJ: Merck Appoints Former CDC Chief As Head Of Vaccines


DOW JONES NEWSWIRES

Merck & Co. (MRK) named former public-health authority Julie Gerberding as the head of the company's $5 billion vaccines business, starting Jan. 25.

Gerberding was the director of the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention through most of President George W. Bush's administration, from 2002 until earlier this year.

Vaccines, along with emerging markets and biologics, are an area Merck is eyeing for growth as it digests its recent acquisition of Schering-Plough Corp. The takeover was designed to help bolster Merck's research pipeline and diversify its product lineup in the face of challenges such as generic competition and setbacks in bringing new drugs to market.

<>

As president of the vaccines business, she will be responsible for the sale of the company's current portfolio of vaccines, the introduction of vaccines from the company's pipeline and the acceleration of Merck's efforts to broaden vaccinations in developing countries. Gerberding will also collaborate with Merck's manufacturing division and Merck Research Laboratories to manage links between basic research, late-stage development and manufacturing.

<>
 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
64. I see you found more time.
Mon Apr 1, 2013, 01:46 PM
Apr 2013

Have you read the study? Do you understand it? Even the best you can muster is a few who say that in a very small subset of those predisposed or just not yet showing symptoms, could possibly be triggered by reactions to vaccines. I still don't get your point or your position, because you refuse to give it. Is it worth 5 million + children dying a year to prevent a very small subset from maybe possibly having one thing trigger rather than another. later triggers may be inevitable.

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
65. Please see graphics in posts #33 , #35 and #59 together in order to grasp the concerns of many @AOA.
Mon Apr 1, 2013, 04:03 PM
Apr 2013

Also see




There are numerous links, here's the first (from an open website where exchange is encouraged and your concerns could be posted):

http://www.ageofautism.com/2013/01/iom-fails-again-to-pursue-science-on-vaccine-injury.html

IOM Fails Again to Pursue Science on Vaccine Injury

SafeMinds Response to 1/16/2013 IOM Report: http://www.safeminds.org/news/pressroom/safeminds-responds-IOM%20Report.html

The January 16, 2013 Institute of Medicine report, The Childhood Immunization Schedule and Safety: Stakeholder Concerns, Scientific Evidence, and Future Studies, repeats the IOM pattern of failing to call for the appropriate scientific research to be conducted on vaccine-induced autism. The report ignores the fact that for 6 of the 7 vaccines administered in the first year of a child’s life (HCV, DTaP, PCV, Rotavirus, IPV, and Rotavirus), there has never been a study of autism prevalence in children who received the vaccine versus children who did not receive the vaccine. These studies were not performed before each of these vaccines was approved, and have not been performed since approval. The IOM report admits that such a study is the gold standard of science, yet does not call for studies. The IOM report ignores the fact that for the 7th vaccine (Hepatitis B), there has been only one such study and that this study found a 3-fold increase in autism risk for children who received the vaccine in the first month of life. The autism epidemic dates to the 1988 birth cohort per an EPA study, the same birth cohort which was administered the Hib conjugate vaccine (an entirely new class of vaccine), and an October 2011 published paper describes a plausible mechanism by which this new type of vaccine could have caused the autism epidemic. Yet the IOM report ignores the fact that autism prevalence has never been studied for the Hib conjugate vaccine in children receiving versus not receiving this vaccine.

Why would the IOM not call for the obviously necessary research to be conducted? Safeminds believes the answer lies in an institutional bias within IOM towards protecting the vaccination program. Leaked transcripts of initial deliberations during the 2004 IOM Immunization Safety Review show that the IOM chair told the committee that they would not ever come down that autism is a true side effect of vaccines; subsequently, the IOM 2004 report had the audacity to call for a halt in further research into a vaccine-autism association. The IOM 2004 report was not based upon conclusive research, but instead appeared policy-driven based on leaked transcripts. Now in this January 2013 report, intended to lay the groundwork for future research on vaccine-safety, the IOM instead advertises the benefits of the current testing system which has failed to conduct the necessary research. While recognizing that “randomized controlled trials are the gold standard for clinical research”, the IOM committee does not call for these trials. The IOM committee also dismisses the feasibility of retrospectively comparing vaccinated vs unvaccinated children citing that population groups often containing unvaccinated children, such as religious communities, would yield sample sizes too small for valid results. This short-sightedness ignores the more obvious solution of utilizing the estimated 1-2M home-schooled population for such a study.

According to a 2009 survey in Pediatrics journal, 54% of parents are concerned about the adverse effects of vaccines and 25% think some vaccines cause autism in healthy children. Per a 2010 National Poll on Children’s Health, 89% of parents rate vaccine safety as the most important topic in children’s health research today. The IOM report is disappointing in that it does not lay out a path to the necessary research, and as such does nothing to allay the concerns of parents regarding vaccine injury. For the estimated money spent for this IOM report, the U.S. government could have instead funded a retrospective study of autism prevalence in home-schooled vaccinated versus unvaccinated children. SafeMinds calls for urgent government funding for the necessary vaccine-autism research, rather than continuing to fund organizations such as IOM which advocate for avoiding such research.

Posted by Age of Autism at January 19, 2013 at 5:42 AM


I have never read that there are "5 million + children dying a year" FEWER in the present than in 1983.
 

snooper2

(30,151 posts)
68. I have to give you props on being prepared..
Wed Apr 3, 2013, 10:15 PM
Apr 2013

It's always a good sign when people have their specific truthy organized and ready to go!

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
5. Oh?
Sat Mar 30, 2013, 01:57 PM
Mar 2013
http://www.ageofautism.com/2013/03/geraldine-dawson-says-vaccines-dont-cause-autism.html

...A reader named Ed Burke offered this analogy:

"I don't have a horse in this race, but I am surprised that no one is talking about what the study shows, which does little or nothing to inform the debate as to whether the current recommended vaccine schedule is safe.

"If you fire paint guns across a schoolyard all day and that night compare the kids with splattered clothes to the ones clean, they were all exposed to the same number of paintballs. The paintballs still caused the splattered clothes.

"If you expose a population of kids to a slew of vaccines and then compare those who develop autism to those who don't, and say, well, the autistic kids were not exposed to any more vaccines than the non-autistic kids, that does not prove the vaccines do not cause autism any more than our hypothetical proved paintballs do not cause splattered clothes.

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
11. The analogy is simple and accessible. So is the information here.
Sat Mar 30, 2013, 03:16 PM
Mar 2013
http://adventuresinautism.blogspot.com/2012/04/dr-walter-zahorodny-believes-vaccines.html

APRIL 3, 2012

Dr. Walter Zahorodny Believes Vaccines Cause Autism. And Geri Dawson???

By Ginger Taylor



From a Radio Listener in NYC:

I was listening this AM to WNYC – Kurt Andersen, of all hostile people, did a segment on the ADDM numbers with Walter Zahorodny, assistant professor of pediatrics at the University of Medicine and Dentistry of New Jersey in Newark. Zahorodny was the lead researcher on the New Jersey portion of the study.

Kurt Andersen (Seth Mnookin's friend): “I guess we know what they (the causes of autism) aren’t, for instance childhood vaccines. Right?

Dr. Zahorodny: “Vaccines don’t play a significant role in autism increasing. Some small number of children probably do have autism because of an adverse vaccine reaction, but they don’t make for the overall rise.”

D'oh!

What's that you say Dr. Z? Vaccines don't cause most autism, but they do cause some autism?? You don't say?!

When the brainwashed "science media" can't even get those involved in the research to hold the "vaccines do not cause autism" line any more... we can be assured that the Hungry Lie is falling apart in earnest and the end of the vaccine age is near.

If anyone can confirm or has audio, would love to hear it.

UPDATE: Confirmation. Starts at 13:20 (AUDIO LINK): http://www.wnyc.org/shows/bl/2012/apr/02/autism-rates-rise-new-jersey/

More at link.


 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
12. The analogy is stupid.
Sat Mar 30, 2013, 03:33 PM
Mar 2013

For it to e on point, it would have to be that children were sprayed with paintballs, and for those hit with the same amount of paint, there was no correlation between the the amount of paint on them and when they later got a cold.

The analogy is just stupid.

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
15. So forget the analogy. Recent remarks by these four establishment researchers contradict the study.
Sat Mar 30, 2013, 04:03 PM
Mar 2013

Drs. Zahorodny, Dawson, Amaral, Gerberding.
Also see Healy and Poling.


http://www.ageofautism.com/2012/06/autism-and-what-the-experts-are-saying-part-two-.html

Autism and What the Experts are Saying, Part Two: Dawson, Zahorodny, and Amaral

June 04, 2012 at 5:45 AM
By Anne Dachel


If you’re like me, you’re sick to death of reporters telling you that all the science shows no link between vaccines and autism. Members of the press don’t hesitate to remind the public on a daily basis that only misguided parents believe vaccinations can cause autism. It’s usually a one sentence dismissal in a news report...

There are some huge chinks in the armor of the no link claim, however. I’m referring to the public acknowledgement by some top medical experts that yes, vaccinations do sometimes cause children to become autistic.

There are more and more independent doctors out there saying there is a link, but I’m talking about doctors who are often cited in news stories denying any causal relationship, yet who will also admit that, yes, sometimes vaccines are responsible.

<...>

In April, 2011, Dr. David Amaral, Director of Research in the Department of Psychiatry and Behavioral Sciences, UC Davis MIND Institute, was interviewed for PBS by Robert MacNeil.

He was asked if vaccines can cause autism and he said this:

“I think it's pretty clear that, in general, vaccines are not the culprit. There has been enough epidemiological evidence showing that if you look at children that receive the standard childhood vaccines that, if anything, those children are at slightly less risk of having autism than children that aren't immunized.

“And so, you know, I think it probably is a waste of effort at this time to try and understand vaccines as a major culprit for, or a major cause of, autism. It's not to say, however, that there isn't a small subset of children who may be particularly vulnerable to vaccines.

“And in their case, having the vaccines, or particular vaccines, particularly in certain kinds of situations -- if the child was ill, if the child had a precondition, like a mitochondrial defect. Vaccinations for those children actually may be the environmental factor that tipped them over the edge of autism. And I think it is incredibly important, still, to try and figure out what, if any, vulnerabilities, in a small subset of children, might make them at risk for having certain vaccinations."


It’s shocking to listen to well-credentialed experts deny any link at the same time they also casually talk about the possibility vaccines are a factors in autism. That was never supposed to happen. Dawson’s “very small minority of individuals," Zahorondny’s “some small number of children,” and Amaral’s “small subset of children” might include my child. And how big is “small”? And where is the proof that the vulnerable group of children is “small”? There isn’t a single study that has looked at the children who regressed into autism following routine vaccinations.

It was the late Dr. Bernadine Healy, former head of the National Institutes of Health, who was on CBS News in 2008 calling for such a study. She said,

“This is the time when we do have the opportunity to understand whether or not there are susceptible children … that makes them more susceptible to vaccines plural, to one particular vaccine, or to components of a vaccine, like mercury. …We have to take another look at that hypothesis, not deny it….”

CBS reporter, Sharyl Attkisson:

“Do you think the government was too quick to dismiss out of hand that there was this possibility of a link between vaccines and autism?”


Healy:

“I think the government or certain health officials in the government have been too quick to dismiss the concerns of these families without studying the population that got sick. I haven’t seen major studies that focus on 300 kids who got autistic symptoms within a period of a few weeks of a vaccine. I think that public health officials have been too quick to dismiss the hypothesis as irrational without sufficient studies of causation.”

<...>


See audio of interviews with Dr. Zahorodny and Dr. Dawson in adventuresofautism.blogspot.com link above.
See Dr. Poling letter in post #29: http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014148376
See Dr. Gerberding video here: http://adventuresinautism.blogspot.com/2008/03/julie-gerberding-admits-on-cnn-that.html

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
25. I'd like to recommend that you read these quotes in their full context at the linked posts.
Sat Mar 30, 2013, 07:57 PM
Mar 2013
In April, 2011, Dr. David Amaral, Director of Research in the Department of Psychiatry and Behavioral Sciences, UC Davis MIND Institute, was interviewed for PBS by Robert MacNeil.


"... It's not to say, however, that there isn't a small subset of children who may be particularly vulnerable to vaccines. And in their case, having the vaccines, or particular vaccines, particularly in certain kinds of situations -- if the child was ill, if the child had a precondition, like a mitochondrial defect. Vaccinations for those children actually may be the environmental factor that tipped them over the edge of autism. And I think it is incredibly important, still, to try and figure out what, if any, vulnerabilities, in a small subset of children, might make them at risk for having certain vaccinations."


http://www.ageofautism.com/2012/06/autism-and-what-the-experts-are-saying-part-two-.html



On April 2, 2012 on WNYC, interviewer Kurt Andersen... did a segment on the ADDM numbers with Dr. Walter Zahorodny, assistant professor of pediatrics at the University of Medicine and Dentistry of New Jersey in Newark. Zahorodny was the lead researcher on the New Jersey portion of the CDC study.


Kurt Andersen (Seth Mnookin's friend): “I guess we know what they (the causes of autism) aren’t, for instance childhood vaccines. Right?
Dr. Zahorodny: “Vaccines don’t play a significant role in autism increasing. Some small number of children probably do have autism because of an adverse vaccine reaction, but they don’t make for the overall rise.”

Starts at 13:20 (AUDIO LINK): http://www.wnyc.org/shows/bl/2012/apr/02/autism-rates-rise-new-jersey/

http://adventuresinautism.blogspot.com/2012/04/dr-walter-zahorodny-believes-vaccines.html


AUDIO (starts at 40:57): http://onpoint.wbur.org/2012/04/02/autism-numbers-skyrocket/player

Monday, April 2, 2012 at 10:00 AM
Autism Numbers Skyrocket

GUEST: Dr. Geraldine Dawson, chief science officer for the advocacy group Autism Speaks.

Ashbrook: "Dr. Dawson, here's a question online from Melrose, has the link between MMR vaccine and autism been completely discredited. I notice that the word 'vaccine' has not even come up so far in this hour. Is that...for some years that had a lot of attention, is that off the table now, Dr. Dawson?"

Dr. Dawson: "There is no evidence that the increase in prevalence that we're seeing in Autism Spectrum Disorder is linked to the MMR vaccine. You know, if vaccines play a role, and there has not been any evidence thus far to show that it has, it would be a very small minority of individuals who have an underlying medical condition where the vaccine may have triggered an onset of symptoms for an already existing condition or vulnerability. So we do not believe that vaccines are an explanation of the increase and we strongly encourage parents to get their children vaccinated."


http://adventuresinautism.blogspot.com/2012/04/dr-walter-zahorodny-believes-vaccines.html
http://onpoint.wbur.org/2012/04/02/autism-numbers-skyrocket


http://adventuresinautism.blogspot.com/2012/04/dr-walter-zahorodny-believes-vaccines.html

April 3, 2012
by Ginger Taylor

...Ashbrook, like Andersen, took the initiative of bringing the vaccine question into the interview, and in both cases it was merely an invitation to declare the vaccine hypothesis DOA. And neither Zahorodny or Dawson took the opportunity to do so!

They BOTH could have said, "Correct." And just moved on. But they didn't!

They both contradicted their interviewers presumptive statements, and said a version of, "Incorrect, vaccines do cause autism in some children, and it is a smaller number of cases than people think, but I don't see that vaccine induced autism could be playing a major factor in the increase."

IMHO... no way in h-e-double hockey sticks that these two didn't know exactly what they were doing. They had every chance to run from vaccine causation and they didn't. They confirmed it. Then they minimized it.

We have just witnessed the very quiet pushing of the envelope. Dr. Geri Dawson and Dr. Walter Zahorodny have just joined you and me and all our friends in taking our position that vaccines cause some cases of autism, just not all the cases of autism. Now we are only separated by the degree in which we believe the vaccine induced autism is a factor in the skyrocketing autism numbers.

<...>


See Dr. Julie Gerberding video here: http://adventuresinautism.blogspot.com/2008/03/julie-gerberding-admits-on-cnn-that.html

-----------------

Please also read the letter sent from Dr. Jon Poling to Dr. Steven Novella, a neurologist at Yale University, in post #29 here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014148376

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
39. That 2009 publicity campaign sounds abysmal, though created by two fathers of children with autism.
Sun Mar 31, 2013, 12:12 AM
Mar 2013

OTOH, I read this the other day, which raises some good points. (And guess what? Author Valerie Foley wrote a comment in your article's link! WHAT ARE THE ODDS?)

http://thinkingmomsrevolution.com/featured-guest-blog-april-is-a-comin/

Posted on March 23, 2013 by Valerie Foley

...Moreover, in autism there are people who can talk and people who can’t. People who can live independently and people who can’t. People who need regular hospital care and people who don’t. It’s a spectrum disorder.

So the idea that those who need less, actively campaign against those who need more, is not just insane, it’s got a really ugly feel to it.

In other social movements, the stay in the same placers tend to stay in the same place, and the move forwarders tend to move forwards. Makes sense. In autism, the stay in the same placers seem to need to slow down the forward momentum, and I’m buggered if I understand why. Because if you are happy with the status quo, wouldn’t you just um, live it?

<>

But here’s the important thing.

Your personal experience contributes to the massive growing pool of autism experience. It is not indicative of everyone who shares the experience of autism. The reality of your experience does not negate the integrity or validity of anyone else’s experience.

<>




proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
43. What I think isn't the issue.
Sun Mar 31, 2013, 12:46 AM
Mar 2013
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-31727_162-20049118-10391695.html

March 31, 2011 11:32 AM
By Sharyl Attkisson

...The article in the Journal of Immunotoxicology is entitled "Theoretical aspects of autism: Causes--A review." The author is Helen Ratajczak, surprisingly herself a former senior scientist at a pharmaceutical firm. Ratajczak did what nobody else apparently has bothered to do: she reviewed the body of published science since autism was first described in 1943. Not just one theory suggested by research such as the role of MMR shots, or the mercury preservative thimerosal; but all of them.

Ratajczak's article states, in part, that "Documented causes of autism include genetic mutations and/or deletions, viral infections, and encephalitis [brain damage] following vaccination. Therefore, autism is the result of genetic defects and/or inflammation of the brain."



And for those individuals happy with the condition, it's simply neurodiversity.

Deep13

(39,154 posts)
46. No reason to believe the figures.
Sun Mar 31, 2013, 01:10 AM
Mar 2013

If I did, I have no reason to doubt the that it is better diagnosis or that a lot more things are at the ends of the spectrum than previously.

And even if autism is some kind of epidemic, why blame vaccines?

Warpy

(111,267 posts)
48. He sure as hell doesn't understand the immune system!
Sun Mar 31, 2013, 02:46 AM
Mar 2013

Kids make a bigger "assault" on their immune systems every time they eat dirt!

Godhumor

(6,437 posts)
20. it shames me that people think age of autism our adventure in autism should be
Sat Mar 30, 2013, 06:21 PM
Mar 2013

Taken seriously. The amount of damage the anti-vaccine movement has done is off the charts.

Warpy

(111,267 posts)
49. They're always here, posting rubbish from rubbishy websites
Sun Mar 31, 2013, 02:48 AM
Mar 2013

and expecting people with actual, you know, educations to take any of it seriously and moving the goalposts every time they get shot down.

It's tiresomely predictable.

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
58. Unsupportable and unsustainable given the current health trends. Wait and see.
Sun Mar 31, 2013, 11:19 AM
Mar 2013

Last edited Wed Apr 3, 2013, 02:16 PM - Edit history (2)

Please read the full letter at the link provided. Here is an excerpt of 4 paragraphs. My apologies for any inadvertent copyright infringement.

http://www.ageofautism.com/2008/07/dear-dr-novella.html

Dr. Jon Poling to Dr. Steven Novella: Don't Attack the Moms

Managing Editor's Note: The following is a letter sent to Dr. Steven Novella, a neurologist at Yale University, from Dr. Jon Poling. (We've printed the letter with permission.) Dr. Novella is the founder of The New England Skeptical Society (meetings, 1st Tuesday of the month, on the lawn of the House of the Seven Gables, Salem, MA. BYOB (bring your own blinders.) and is a contributing editor to Quackwatch. Dr. Poling is a neurologist/PhD and the father of Miss Hannah Poling.

Dear Dr. Novella,

<>

With regard to the science of Autism, I have no argument with the assertion that a single case does not prove causation of a generalized autism-vaccine link. What the case does illustrate though is a more subtle point that many physicians cannot or do not want to comprehend (ostensibly because vaccines are too important to even question). Autism is a heterogeneous disorder defined by behavioral criteria and having multiple causes. Epidemiological studies which have not found a link between autism and aspects of vaccination do not consider the concept of autism subgroups. Indeed, in a heterogeneous disorder like Autism, subgroups may indeed be ‘vaccine-injured’ but the effect is diluted out in the larger population (improperly powered study due to inability to calculate effect size with unknown susceptible subpopulation). I think former NIH Director, Dr. Bernadine Healey explained it best in that population epidemiology studies are not “granular” enough to rule-out a susceptible subgroup.

Furthermore, ‘science’ has not systematically studied the children who fell ill following vaccination to determine what the cause(s) for their adverse reaction was. It would follow that if you never tried to understand why a single child developed encephalopathy following vaccination—you wouldn’t have the first clue as to what aspects of vaccination you could alter which could increase the relative risk of that adverse event (whether it be thimerosal, live virus, or ‘too many’). Could the susceptibility be a mitochondrial genetic haplogroup similar to Chloramphenicol toxicity—sure it could! Why did a few Alzheimer’s patients die of fatal encephalitis following administration of the failed AN-1792 vaccine, but the majority had no ill effects (vaccine didn’t work though)?

Definition: Autism is a heterogeneous systemic disorder with primary neuropsychiatric manifestations due to complex genetic and gene-environmental interactions likely affecting synaptic plasticity early in childhood development. This new theory of Autism is rapidly replacing the ‘old guard’ dictum that Autism is a genetically predetermined developmental brain disorder of synaptic formation/pruning that is set in motion prenatally. By the ‘10 year rule of science,’ your time is about up!

Until the biological basis of ASD subgroups are better understood, further epidemiological and genetic studies regarding “Autism” causation will be relatively meaningless. We need good science to be able to address these complex issues which parallel nicely the emerging story of genetic and environmental influences in Parkinson’s disease. Perhaps some Parkinson’s researchers want to take a crack at Autism?

<>

Thank-you Dr. Novella and his band of skeptics for continuing the debate.

Dr. Jon Poling

Jon S. Poling MD PhD
Managing Partner, Athens Neurological Associates
Clinical Assistant Professor, Department of Neurology, Medical College of Georgia
Diplomate, American Association of Neuromuscular and Electrodiagnostic Medicine
ASN Certified in MRI and CT Neuroimaging

Posted by Age of Autism at July 22, 2008

bhikkhu

(10,718 posts)
16. Good - hopefully the funding for all these studies can now be better directed
Sat Mar 30, 2013, 04:07 PM
Mar 2013

...towards finding the causes and better treatments for autism, perhaps.

liberal_at_heart

(12,081 posts)
28. some of those funds need to be directed towards transitioning adults from school to work and
Sat Mar 30, 2013, 08:04 PM
Mar 2013

independent living. Almost all research funds go towards early detection and intervention. I'm all for early detection and intervention, but after the age of 3 autistic people just get dropped off the radar. It's like they disappear off the face of the Earth and no one asks the question how do we help these kids and adults after the age of 3.

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
17. The implications of the flawed control group design discussed here by AOA contributor J.Thompson.
Sat Mar 30, 2013, 04:38 PM
Mar 2013
http://www.ageofautism.com/2013/03/geraldine-dawson-says-vaccines-dont-cause-autism.html

COMMENTS EXCERPT:

Here, the industrial scientists misuse the definition of the word “control children.” Normally a “control” group is the group not exposed to the potential cause of an effect under investigation. In this case the “control children” are the children reported with no effects by the industrial scientists after exposure to the potential cause(s).

See http://www.jpeds.com/webfiles/images/journals/ympd/JPEDSDeStefano.pdf

So the study compared exposure groups of children to exposure groups of children. But it did not compare zero exposure groups of children to exposure groups of children.

Thalidomide was defended by industrial scientists with this approach using an absence of real control children. This is what Sjostrom and Nilsson wrote over 40 years ago about the deceit in that approach:

“Every biologist knows that within a group of living organisms there is always an individual variation in the sensitivity towards, for example, a poison or a drug. Because of natural biological variation some individuals are affected more than others and some are perhaps not affected at all. If about 0.5 milligrams of strychnine is given by intraperitoneal injection to a certain strain of rats, approximately 50 per cent of the animals will die. The fact that the other 50 per cent survive cannot, of course, be taken as evidence against a causal relation between the intake of strychnine and death in rats.” Sjostrom and Nilsson, “Thalidomide and the Power of the Drug Companies,” (1972) p.162.


As Sarah quoted below the CDC acknowledges that not biological systems are alike. So where is the study with real control children? Autism Speaks, where are the millions of dollars in research being spent?

Posted March 30, 2013 at 11:54 AM

MAD Dave

(204 posts)
52. No control was needed in this type of study.
Sun Mar 31, 2013, 09:34 AM
Mar 2013

What the CDC study was looking for was not binary (ie. received vaccine and got autism score 1; did not receive vaccine and did not get autism score 0) but rather if increasing antigen dose showed a higher prevalence of autism diagnosis. The study was pretty clear in its findings - that increasing antigen dose doesn't show an increase in the prevalence in autism.

Autism, like most diseases is a complex mixture of genetics and environment. In other words, as has been posted before some kids receiving vaccines may get autism and the vaccine may have pushed the child's body to begin the disease process called autism, but in addition to the vaccines a multitude of factors led to autism. Extrapolating slightly, I doubt vaccines are a major contributor to the development of autism. More likely a coincidence!

MAD Dave

(204 posts)
54. May I also point out Wakefield was found to have committed fraud
Sun Mar 31, 2013, 09:45 AM
Mar 2013

From Wikipedia

On 28 January 2010, a five-member statutory tribunal of the GMC found three dozen charges proved, including four counts of dishonesty and 12 counts involving the abuse of developmentally challenged children.[9] The panel ruled that Wakefield had "failed in his duties as a responsible consultant", acted both against the interests of his patients, and "dishonestly and irresponsibly" in his published research.[10][11][12] The Lancet immediately and fully retracted his 1998 publication on the basis of the GMC’s findings, noting that elements of the manuscript had been falsified.[13] Wakefield was struck off the Medical Register in May 2010, with a statement identifying dishonest falsification in The Lancet research,[14] and is barred from practising medicine in the UK.[15]

IMHO, by lying and deliberately manipulating his findings his actions led to the death and disability of many children he is guilty of a serious crime (possibly crimes against humanity) and should be tried in a criminal court. IMHO, his behaviour was reckless and negligent and deserves to be punished to the fullest extent of the law. Not simply because his behaviour harmed children but because his actions led to a whole movement against well established public health measures - highly shameful!

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
60. UK CryShame press release - 9 March 2013
Sun Mar 31, 2013, 11:31 AM
Mar 2013
http://www.jabs.org.uk/

CryShame press release - 9 March 2013

http://www.cryshame.co.uk

Important new research ( http://www.plosone.org/article/info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0058058 ) reports similar findings to the work of Dr Andrew Wakefield in the 1998 Lancet and in subsequent paper in the early 2000s

Groundbreaking new research examines the molecular structure of inflammatory material taken from the bowels of autistic children. It compares the structure of diseased biopsies in the autistic children with biopsies from three groups of non-autistic children with Crohn’s disease, ulcerative colitis, and histologically normal (the controls).

Previous research confirmed the pathological and immunological make-up of biopsies of autistic children, but had not to date identified its specific molecular structure. Children with the four different conditions have been found to have similar findings of inflammation. But it was not clear if this was the same condition shared by all four groups; or if a distinct condition was specific to autistic children alone; or if indeed there was no disease in the autistic group. A molecular analysis of the genetic structure found in the inflamed bowel tissue of children in each group would provide initial answers to these questions.

To date government and medical scientists continue to deny an association between autism and bowel disease. In the UK there is currently no research into the association between autism and chronic bowel disease. This has been the predicament since the government and medical profession waged a campaign to discredit research from the Royal Free Hospital led by Dr Andrew Wakefield in 1998 and the early 2000s that first identified the presence of bowel disease in autistic children.

Following years of denial from government and the medical profession, new research published in the leading online journal PLOS ONE confirms the presence of intestinal disease in autistic children and supports reports from many parents of ongoing painful gastric problems in their autistic children.

The research studied bowel samples from 25 autistic, 8 Crohn's, 5 ulcerative colitis and 15 normal control children and found that inflammatory material obtained from the biopsies of autistic children had a distinct molecular structure that was different from the other three groups.

This is an important finding of the distinct genetic expression that has now been identified in autistic children as distinct from non-autistic children with Crohns, ulcerative colitis and normal bowels. It paves the way for future research into the specific molecular structure of the inflammation affecting autistic children and hopefully will lead to new interventions and treatment.

Background Notes

1. The first paper to bring to public attention the presence of bowel disease in autistic children was Wakefield AJ, (1998) 'Ileal-lymphoid-nodular hyperplasia, non-specific colitis, and pervasive developmental disorder in children'.The Lancet published this paper in 1998 but subsequently retracted it in 2010 after the GMC found Dr Wakefield and Professor Walker-Smith guilty of serious professional misconduct.

2. Several former colleagues went on in the early 2000s to study the nature of the bowel disease in autistic children, focusing on the pathology of gut tissue and the presence of autoimmune features in the bowel (eg Furlano et al (2001) 'Colonic CD8 and ?? T-cell infiltration with epithelial damage in children with autism', Journal of Pediatrics, Vol. 138, 3).

3. The senior research leader of the Lancet and subsequent papers was Professor John Walker-Smith who in March 2012 had all the charges of professional misconduct made by the GMC quashed on appeal by Justice Mitting in the High Court.

4. Government Minister admits more needs to be done to research autism and bowel disease. Read letter here.


I added underline in critical note #3. FYI, Professor/Dr. John Walker-Smith is regarded as the co-founder of the field of pediatric gastroenterology (with Harvard Professor/Dr. Allan Walker).

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
32. Did you read this, too?
Sat Mar 30, 2013, 10:47 PM
Mar 2013
http://thinkingmomsrevolution.com/media-kit/

Did You Know?

1. As of 2007, 54% of American children had a chronic disease including obesity.
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1876285910002500

2. 1 in 6 children have a developmental disability.
http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/developmentaldisabilities/index.html

3. In 1983, only 10 vaccines were given and the Autism rate was 1 in 10,000. In 2008, the vaccine schedule was increased to 36 vaccines and the autism rate was 1 in 150. Today in 2013 there are 46 vaccines and the autism rate in 1 in 88.
http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/schedules/past.html

4. ADHD affects an estimated 3-7% of children in the U.S.
http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/adhd/data.html

5. There have been no studies testing the safety of the Flu Vaccine on pregnant women.
https://www.vaccineshoppe.com/image.cfm?doc_id=12651&image_type=product_pdf

More.


http://thinkingmomsrevolution.com/media-kit/media-kit-videos/



■ALISON MACNEIL – CAMBRIDGE, MA - 0:06 The problems we were experiencing with our children are not rare, in fact incredibly common.

■LISA JOYCE GOES – NEW LENNOX, IL - 1:05 Over 50% of the population have children with special needs or chronic illness and that is a staggering statistic. Our goal is to help people know that they are not alone.

■HELEN CONROY – NAPLES, FL - 2:32 People don’t know what your going through and it’s hard to do it by yourself. One of the things that inspired us to really write the book to share that type of support and to hope inspire it in othe people. We share our stories in the book and we hope that people identify with at least one of us.


Deep13

(39,154 posts)
45. You anti-vaxxers are letting your paranoid superstitions...
Sun Mar 31, 2013, 01:00 AM
Mar 2013

...jeopardize public health. Pick an insult that means selfish and reprehensible.

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
35. Ginger Taylor: Overall health outcomes matter, not merely reduction of communicable disease levels.
Sat Mar 30, 2013, 11:11 PM
Mar 2013
http://adventuresinautism.blogspot.com/2013/03/testimony-on-maine-ld-672-act-relating.html

By Ginger Taylor
March 11, 2013

...Vaccine policy should not be based merely on the reduction of communicable disease levels, but on overall health outcomes for children, including the true increased risk of autoimmune and neurological disorders that may be caused by an overaggressive and inappropriate vaccine schedule.

 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
38. Wow. "merely reduction of communicable disease levels."
Sat Mar 30, 2013, 11:49 PM
Mar 2013

You said that in response to the post showing some 5 million CHILDREN'S LIVES SAVED annually.

That is over the top and beyond the pale.

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
40. I was quoting Ginger Taylor's recent testimony before the Maine legislature re: informed consent.
Sun Mar 31, 2013, 12:22 AM
Mar 2013

Didn't YOU catch that?

 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
50. Ginger Taylor is a calloused ass, then. Some real asshole depravity there.
Sun Mar 31, 2013, 07:38 AM
Mar 2013

5 million children's lives saved is "merely a reduction in communicable levels."

This is why these nuts are dangerous. They muddy the waters with their anti-science bullshit.

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
59. I don't have more time to spend on this, however... according to research posted at AOA,
Sun Mar 31, 2013, 11:27 AM
Mar 2013

The US ranks 34th on overall childhood health among developed countries, although has the most aggressive efforts to prevent communicable disease in the world.

Additionally, for graphic image see slide http://www.rescuepost.com/.a/6a00d8357f3f2969e2017c342a8a37970b-400wi

from http://www.ageofautism.com/2012/12/safeminds-mark-blaxill-testimony-at-autism-hearing.html#


eridani

(51,907 posts)
41. Is phenylketonuria caused by consumption of phenylalanine?
Sun Mar 31, 2013, 12:38 AM
Mar 2013

Yes, but only in a small minority of the population lacking one of the enzymes necessary to metabolize it.

Does spme environmental factor increase the odds of developing autism? Possibly in a small vulnerable subset of people. Note that "some environmental factor" in no way asserts that this factor has to be vaccination.

alp227

(32,025 posts)
70. Exactly. So what about the 99% of EVERYONE ELSE who's vaccinated and WITHOUT autism
Thu Apr 4, 2013, 01:20 PM
Apr 2013

or other conditions? If vaccines really cause autism, wouldn't the nation be something like...I don't know...

davidpdx

(22,000 posts)
51. Here is the abstract of the study if anyone is interested
Sun Mar 31, 2013, 08:06 AM
Mar 2013

Increasing Exposure to Antibody-Stimulating Proteins and Polysaccharides in Vaccines Is Not Associated with Risk of Autism
Frank DeStefano, MD, Cristofer S. Price, and Eric S. Weintraub

Objective To evaluate the association between autism and the level of immunologic stimulation received from
vaccines administered during the first 2 years of life.

Study design We analyzed data from a case-control study conducted in 3 managed care organizations (MCOs) of
256 children with autism spectrum disorder (ASD) and 752 control children matched on birth year, sex, and MCO. In
addition to the broader category of ASD, we also evaluated autistic disorder and ASD with regression. ASD diagnoses
were validated through standardized in-person evaluations. Exposure to total antibody-stimulating proteins
and polysaccharides from vaccines was determined by summing the antigen content of each vaccine received, as
obtained from immunization registries and medical records. Potential confounding factors were ascertained from
parent interviews and medical charts. Conditional logistic regression was used to assess associations between
ASD outcomes and exposure to antigens in selected time periods.

Results The aOR (95% CI) of ASD associated with each 25-unit increase in total antigen exposure was 0.999
(0.994-1.003) for cumulative exposure to age 3 months, 0.999 (0.997-1.001) for cumulative exposure to age 7
months, and 0.999 (0.998-1.001) for cumulative exposure to age 2 years. Similarly, no increased risk was found
for autistic disorder or ASD with regression.

Conclusion In this study of MCO members, increasing exposure to antibody-stimulating proteins and polysaccharides
in vaccines during the first 2 years of life was not related to the risk of developing an ASD.

Edit: My bad, I didn't know the article was available publicly at the link posted above. I was just trying to help by posting part of the actual study so people could read it.

MAD Dave

(204 posts)
56. I used to HATE statistics......
Sun Mar 31, 2013, 10:15 AM
Mar 2013

but as I've grown older I've learned to better appreciate its finer points.

It is perfectly possible to find a statistically significant link between two completely unrelated things. As an example, the number of hairs in a drain cleaned by Joe the Plumber and the number of votes received by John McCain.

Just because a link exists, does not imply a causal effect. If this were not the case, the Republicans would have had Joe the Plumber clean all of the drains at every single one of McCain's campaign stops, just to doubly ensure McCain's victory.

Our F$&king society is crumbling partially for lack of good science education

Response to morningfog (Original post)

SidDithers

(44,228 posts)
69. Brian Hooker criticizes a vaccine safety study; hilarity ensues
Wed Apr 3, 2013, 10:16 PM
Apr 2013

Hooker? Really?

http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2013/04/03/brian-hooker-criticizes-a-vaccine-safety-study-hilarity-ensues/

Last week, the Journal of Pediatrics published a study that did a pretty good job of demolishing a favorite antivaccine trope used to frighten parents. In fact, it’s one of the most effective of antivaccine tropes, as evidenced by a large number of parents who are generally pro-vaccine expressing doubts when asked about this particular antivaccine slogan. I’m referring, of course, to the “too many too soon” slogan, in which antivaccinationists try to imply that the current vaccine schedule somehow “overwhelms” an infant’s immune system and leads to autism by some unknown and undemonstrated mechanism. There is no compelling science behind this particular idea, but that doesn’t stop it from being used as an argument against the current vaccine schedule by antivaccinationists and antivaccine-sympathetic doctors like “Dr. Bob” Sears (who created an “alternate” vaccine schedule based on the idea that the current schedule gives babies too many shots too soon) and Dr. Jay Gordon. “Too many too soon” even became the rallying cry of a march on Washington, DC led by the queen of the antivaccine movement herself (at least at the time, anyway), Jenny McCarthy.

So it was that when I wrote about this particular study and what it showed the first time, I couldn’t resist mentioning a few of the antivaccinationists who, predictably, attacked the study, including the aforementioned “Dr. Bob” Sears, whose tantrum on Facebook over the study was burning stupid distilled down to the most powerful stupid known, much as 16 Million Reserve distills down pepper extract to a mixture so hot that it’s painful. “Dr. Bob’s” screed has the same effect on the brain of anyone who has a science-based understanding of vaccines as 16 Million Reserve has on the tongue. So, for that matter, did homeopath Heidi Stevenson’s “scientific critique” of the study.

And so does Brian Hooker’s critique of the study.

The things I do for you! After reading Hooker’s “debunking” of DeStefano et al, I feel the need for many, many gallons of reason and science to wash the pain from my brain, much as a hapless person who ingests 16 Million Reserve will crave gallons and gallons of water to wash the pain from his mouth. Before I get into his “scientific critique,” let’s just remind everyone of who Brian Hooker is. Brian Hooker is a biochemical engineer who works as a consultant in the biotech industry who also, unfortunately, has turned to antivaccine quackery. Specifically, he belongs to the wing of the antivaccine movement that believes against all evidence that the mercury-containing preservative thimerosal that used to be in childhood vaccines until around 2001 to 2002 is a major cause of autism. He’s also somehow managed to beguile a certain budding antivaccine crank by the name of Jake Crosby to the point that Jake turned on his former allies and dished dirt in the form of their private e-mails, publishing them on the even crankier Patrick “Tim” Bolen’s website. Hooker’s claim, channeled through Crosby’s “reporting,” was that he actually had arranged the Congressional hearing on autism in November and that the antivaccine crank group SafeMinds had, through its lobbyist Beth Clay, stepped in and taken it over by misrepresenting themselves as representing Hooker.


 

KRAD74

(6 posts)
71. Try some real studies that show proof
Fri Apr 26, 2013, 12:49 PM
Apr 2013

It seems to me that they need to revert back to an older schedule of vaccinations. A set group of children for those parents who decide to go with a 1974 or 1983 schedule versus children that are getting the schedule now. There should be equal amount of children and also male and female being equal on both sides.

 

KRAD74

(6 posts)
73. That's the problem.
Fri Apr 26, 2013, 01:39 PM
Apr 2013

I really don't see a whole lot of research out there denouncing vaccines and the only way is to find out what is causing the problem.

 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
74. That's because all the research supports vaccines. Those who refuse vaccines are selfish
Sat Apr 27, 2013, 08:54 PM
Apr 2013

and put their kids at unnecessary risk.

 

KRAD74

(6 posts)
76. Some are not saying to refuse vaccines all together
Mon Apr 29, 2013, 12:40 AM
Apr 2013

I don't see why people have to get so defensive. There should not be a problem with slowing the rate at which we give them and what age also some have been added that may be optional. I was born in 1974 and there was not near this amount.

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