that is no reason to go to a war. It was a bullshit reason to go to war in Iraq, and so yes, they are comparable.

We have had plenty of opportunities, starting with the capture of the USS pueblo in the 1960s...the last good one was three years ago.

The north is getting more and more provocative, and the most it's getting is a rise in language and sanctions.

So no, it's not comparable.

...started looking into it, I had no idea what the situation was. I really hope people do some investigation on their own. I'm not saying that I think if people do, they'll magically see things the same way I do...But I think there's a lot of ignorance (not meant as a pejorative) about what's going on over there and why.

PB

Situations like this don't fester for as long as this one has because they're simple and straightforward. Korea wasn't as simple as "China owns Pyongyang and Washington owns Seoul" even during the war itself, and it bugs me that so much discussion of the situation is based on the assumption that that was ever the case, much less still is.

Everyone throwing around "this is only happening because of X" or "all X needs to do is Y" or similar talking points is more or less operating on those assumptions, or equally ignorant ones. Drives me up the wall.

If there were rallies in the us some here would attend.

of indulging himself and hanging out with celebrities. I think a lot of the rhetoric is for domestic consumption and about saving face.

...commentary here on DU in the past when the North Koreans have spoken so fondly of unleashing hell on earth.

As my girlfriend says, "You can trust people to do what they do."

But this is a little different, Cali. It really is. And qualitatively different.

Shutting off the hotline between the two countries, the various stages of removing all checks and declaring war footing, the strangely-worded threat to shut down the joint factory between North and South Korea.

Those and other things are significant and measurable deviations from previous behavior. Unlike the river of vitriol which has flowed out of North Korea from the last, what, five decades (?), these are new and different developments.

If North Korea decides to shell Yeonpyeong Island or another North Korean navy ship sinks, the interpretation of the events (while already grave in most circumstances) may genuinely start a series of retaliations which can't easily be stopped.

PB

Read The Twelve Caesars by Suetonius. Roman emperors were absolute rulers, and even the best ones committed their share of torture and murders. A couple of them may have been psychotic (Caligula comes to mind), but most were just rich guys who realized that they could get whatever they wanted and no one could stop them short of killing them, so they did a lot of pre-emptive killing of their opponents.

I'm old enough to remember when China was blustering in the way that North Korea is now. They had nukes as of 1962, and throughout the Vietnam War, they were issuing "serious warnings" to the U.S. This was during the Cultural Revolution era, too, when China looked almost as extreme as North Korea does now.

"Oh well, he's just nuts," that sort of thing. Even the vilest leaders these days aren't their entire government, and even a basketcase like North Korea will have plenty of people governing it who know what they're doing for the most part. Those people might be as frankly evil by any standards we recognize as they are competent, but I definitely don't think it's ever a good idea to just assume insert-country-here is intrinsically loony-bin material. There's usually some method to even the most ridiculous behaviors, and blowing them off as generically insane usually shapes the way they're reacted to in unhelpful ways.

(That said, Suetonius probably wasn't the most reliable source, and a few of them like Caligula aside was probably exaggerating things quite a bit..)

PB

Some will show at lay off Pyongyang rallies...I predict young and ignorant, but some will. A few will on principle, opposed to all wars, those I have respect for.

...feel just about every which way about every which topic.

The North Korean dictatorial dynasty is so openly odious though.

PB

By miscalculation most likely, otherwise known as the sneeze incident.

Somebody fires by mistake, a sniper on the other side shoots, and off to the races.

We have had incidents close to that on the DMZ, I wish I were kidding.

"Panting for disaster".

Not many, thank goodness, but when you're talking about North Korea even one is astonishing.

"It says everyone's free in their constitution! They're so much better than the United States!"

Blerkghtbpppt.

In your rights to eat grass and bugs, long live dear leader.

The dark humor writes itself

That is unless Kim goes completely off the rails. Our actions, namely sending over the B-2's only ratchet up the tension and increase that probability that Kim does go completely off the rails. Sometimes the best thing you can do is ignore the little guy acting big and bad, just walk away. Antagonizing him with your own chest thumping display can only lead to him actually going nuts and trying to take you on.

Just ignore the idiot, he's thumping his chest because he's young and has to prove he's as crazy as his father and grandfather. Walk away, let him bluster, and he will calm down. He doesn't have China's backing right now, and without that he knows he's screwed.

...but this one I applaud.