At length.

I so hope they get him alive without any further harm done to anyone.

Enough.

that he surrenders peacefully and that no one takes 'justice' into their own hands. May there be no more loss of life.

...no vows to bomb somebody to make the pain stop. Let's hope no billionaires decide to start a war on innocents, and that we don't spend a decade or two pampering ourselves in fake wars.

what incentive would he have to surrender? He has to know he will go to prison for the rest of his life, or maybe even executed. He's screwed no matter what.

It incentivizes criminals/terrorists to not surrender peacefully. Instead, he'll probably commit suicide rather than face waterboarding for extended periods of time.

If we treated prisoners like human beings (even if they don't act like human beings), then they may trust our justice system.

It would be immeasurably valuable to be able to find out how and why he got radicalized.

God, I hope so!

As much as part of me wants to say - "FUCK YOU AND YOUR STUPID-ASS FUCKING 'GRIEVANCES' - that you've just forfeited ANY right to have ANYBODY give half a rat's ass about," we still do need to know what makes them do this.

I remember watching the coverage of the World Trade Center bombings and the first thing that crossed my mind after the sheer confusion and dismay was - what would make them do this? Why would they want to do this to us? What would fuel that sheer hatred to motivate them to do this?

It may be some petty stupid personal reason that they did this. But at least we'll know.

that permitted him to be radicalized? The superficial answers he may give as to why he did this won't provide the information we need to prevent the many people who are not Islamic from doing similar things.

This is a case of Islamic terrorism from what we now know. But just identifying the excuse for the violence does not get to the fundamental cause in the human being for giving up other means to change the world and resort to violence.

Was it the backgrounds of these two boys in wrestling and fighting that caused this? Were they indoctrinated not just in a fanatical religion but also in faith in violence?

Because the other killers in recent years, those involved in Sandy Hook and Aurora and Tucson and all the other killings were not Islamic. What is central in these kids? Why do we have Islamic terrorists? Or right-wing terrorists? Or the kool-aid poisonings in an extremist Christian sect many years ago?

Let's try to find out so that we can make our world safer for everyone.

Killed innocent people.

Anything beyond that is inconsequential.

doesn't help us prevent the next kids from doing the same thing.

We just go through this over and over. When will it end?

Each time, we attribute it to something: mental illness, religious fanaticism, a particular religious or ethnic background. But not all mentally ill kill innocent people, not all religious fanatics kill innocent people and not all people of this or that religious or ethnic background kill innocent people.

What is is that is different about people that makes or causes them to kill? I want to know.

I have heard that the military trains people to be able to kill because actually it is not always natural to a person. If it is possible to train a person to kill, would it be possible to train people not to kill?

That's ridiculous.

there are killers. And it has been going on for a long time. The commonality approach is the basis for ALL wars and racism.

As we've all seen, there are some pretty demented individuals in this country who may want to enact revenge.

the relatives are drawing attention to themselves, so quickly. Even ones in other countries.
Not a normal pattern.

This person probably still has a few weapons and from his behavior last night, he intends to use them. I just hope he doesn't succeed in injuring or killing anyone else before this is over.

and ended up on Big Bear and all the similar cases and these two brothers really have in common -- in terms of how their brains and bodies worked in these situations.

How did they separate themselves from humanity in their feelings to the point that they could do these heinous acts?

It isn't for me just a question of these guys.

A fanatic entered a Unitarian church some years ago and began shooting. Why? What is the real trigger for all these crazy people.

I think that the religion or the cause is just an excuse, not the real reason they do these killings.

What do you think?

Psychology often seems mostly a categorization of behaviors with a lot of educated guesses about causes. Dorner's behavior seems very similar in a lot of ways to what we see today with these two.

Whether the underlying cause, meaning something chemical or developmental, is similar will never be known. At least not with the tools we have today.

he may be rethinking it right now, even though its too late.

Check out the Boston Marathon Bomber's YouTube Page:
http://www.youtube.com/user/muazseyfullah/videos?flow=grid&view=15

Based on the Islamic videos, we may be tempted to infer a certain mindset.
Perhaps, these guys thought they were Islamic Jihadists.

Will the last one, blow himself up rather than surrender? The fact that he hasn't means he's weighing his options.
He could be a great source of information, to learn their true motives and where they got their military-style training.

Now he doesn't have that leadership steering this anymore. He's alone. Alone and likely scared. Never good conditions under which to operate. Either for him OR for all the police in the area.

What a day. What a week. Sheesh.

Right?

They walked around with their backpacks and then without them in plain daylight when they should have known that there would be cameras everywhere.

They were not very well trained if they were trained. Or perhaps I should say, they were not trained for urban warfare in our society.

They were fools. Most people who kill or rob or commit burglaries -- those kinds of crimes that involve physically doing something illegal -- are not very bright -- are really fools.

Someone once said to me, "The stupidest people on earth are those bank robbers." That is certainly true of those who walk into banks and rob them. Of course, if they get into the management of a bank, that's another story.

And people who commit acts that could be considered "terrorism" in the US are really, really stupid because they will get caught. They will not survive. They will be convicted. I don't care what your cause is, you do not want to commit a federal crime of that sort. It is a stupid, stupid thing to do. No one anywhere will have sympathy for you or your cause if you kill an innocent person -- not in America. That's just not how you get sympathy here.

And we are not intimidated. Never. What's more, we are smarter than you think. So forget it. Go dig a hole if you feel angry.

who have nothing to do with this.

Maybe they do have something to do with this. We don't know.

in the minds of these little shitbirds.

Hopefully we will be able to get some information from him.

I want to know who he worked with, who he knew, who owed him money, etc


And then I want to see him spend the rest of his life at Angola

Unless he's a robot.

time to do something right, Dzhokhar.

But I don't think he's going to allow that.

but give some sign like I don't have a gun on the back please. because local police officer in Waterloo IA gets away with murder for killing a black kid who he didn't know didn't have a gun on him. The thumbs down here is the kid was shot in the leg. second shot was the kill/murder shot. We don't need some nut out there pretending hey lets kill Rambo.. when it would be nice to save someone who might have been just following.. how should I know if the kids brother had his life threatened.

Unfortunately I have a bad feeling about this.

Bring in his religious leader and let him talk this boy down off the ledge.

...this guy surrenders the sooner the idiots being interviewed on all the cable-news networks that keep 'making shit up' about their motivations...like the bastard claiming that because they were ready to die that they must be al-Qaeda...and the pluperfect prick Tom Ridge, smugly offering up his 'wisdom' - and the bitch Andrea Mitchell not challenging any of their speculations - wil have to STFU. I mean, surely the guy they 'released' after they grabbed his SUV and withdrew money from his ATM, could have confirmed whether or not the remaining 'kid' had a suicide bomb wrapped around his body, but did Ridge even think of that?...hell know. So all this speculation is just a reminder of the ineptitude of Ridge and his color-codes. Yeah these guys were influenced by somebody, but Cheznean (sp?) independence and terror has always been local and not known to be associated with Bin Laden, so why bring it up now without some facts?