cue the speculators

The chemtrails did that, too?

I expected it was going to push food prices up...and it did, and I'm sure this isn't the worst of it.

BTW, kinda scary how many people pushing the CT meme these days, isn't it? It's like it's an approved talking point.

It couldn't be detected until early in the 20th century, though.

no we can say like that ....

...right?

The numbers have risen and research shows that this is not just due to better diagnosis.

A large scale study was done involving blood samples stored for decades, followed by current samples from the same individuals. Then they went back and tested both old samples and new ones with modern tests. The tests revealed many people with old samples that tested negative, and current samples that tested positive.

And overall, there is a higher incidence than there used to be and no one knows why. But if the wheat grown today contains more gluten protein, that could be an explanation.

I'm one of the new cases, by the way. Wheat makes me bleed. It's poison.

He may have some of it right, but he really screwed up other aspects.

There's a lot of confusing information out there.

Last edited Fri Jun 21, 2013, 12:52 AM - Edit history (1)

I was really hoping the opium thing was true. There goes the street value of bread...

Carbs are not an essential nutrient, unlike fats, proteins, minerals, and certain vitamins. I find whole wheat incredibly toxic.

physiologically 'expensive' & it's not optimal, as can be seen from the fact that it's only native peoples living in very extreme climates (like the far north) who ever lived regularly on a near-zero carb regime. even then, there were some carb sources.

and they didn't live particularly long or healthy lives (though given the inherent risks of the climate & fauna it's hard to compare). osteoporosis & kidney problems are some of the hazards of near-zero carb diets.

gliadin protein content than in the past.

the TV audience. It means you have to check every single other thing he says by referring to some source that is being honest. Though you have to wonder why we should have to bother.

We had a huge thread on this last year. The basic errors in this guys claims were pointed out then.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021499384

they r saying true bt half

That is my opinion of it.

See my post immediately above yours.

Where do they find these guys?

thanks, makes me feel better.

He gives the average doomsdayer a bad name.

if you have bread that rises, it has gliadin.

this is good enough

i dnt think so.

I don't know why he's making this shit up about gliadin being new. That's pretty weird.

the thighs of women have lost their clutch. (Look it up. It's a quote.)

Nostalgia often has us thinking that the "good old days" were much better than today. Not so. Our memories are deceiving us, and we're not comparing the same things.

Homemade bread still tastes just as good as ever. Factory bread never tasted as good as grandma's bread. It's not the wheat. It's the process, the ingredients, and the freshness.

My grandmother's biscuits, for example, were to die for. It took me years to discover the reason. She made them with lard as the shortening. Lard. So, I made a batch of biscuits with lard. They tasted just like my grandmother's. She made pie crusts with lard, too. They were wonderful. I use lard now, too. I just don't tell anyone. Lard makes baked stuff taste good. So does butter.

Lard, but not shortening, as in Crisco shortening? I mean, shortening is almost lard, isn't it? I've never purchased lard at the grocery store, but it's there.

I Love to bake with butter. And another thing: a lot of items like cookies, made with real butter, cook up much better when the dough has rested in the refrigerator for a couple of hours.

Crisco is made of vegetable oil. The properties of lard makes it easy to cut flour into it without it melting. That makes baked goods flaky. Butter is also animal fat, but has a lower melting temperature, which is why the refrigeration produces better results. Finally lard can stand higher temperatures without browning or changing flavor.

Nobody uses lard much anymore. I use only for pie crusts, biscuits and to make masa for tamales.

Crisco & butter for pie crusts. I'm going to try using vodka for the 2-3 Tbsp of water used in the pie crust. I have the reworked recipe somewhere, but I don't know the exact substitutions yet.

It makes me bleed. Not fun.

"This product is manufactured on a line that also produces XXX products" is a cover for almost anything.

in what amounts.
It's taken years and many deaths to label peanut products or products made in the same facility as peanut products.
Our lives are much less important than their bottom line and executive salaries.

i agree with u .. ya this may be.

You can take the uppity out of mirt, but you can't take the mirt out of the uppity?

How much can you say about wheat? Guess we're going to find out...

One of my favorite films!

like the difference between a protein and an alkaloid and the fact that it has been present in all strains of wheat as well as in rye and other gluten containing grains.

Everything tastes different from what grandma made for a lot of reasons that have nothing to do with a different strain of wheat. It has mostly to do with the fact that you're not five years old and really, really hungry and partly to do with the general adulteration of foods with non food ingredients like fungicides, stabilizers, artificial color, artificial flavor, and a whole host of other shit they put in to improve appearance and shelf life.

If you don't believe it, treat yourself to an organically grown chicken: the meat is pale, the flavor intense, and you can't cut it with the side of a fork.

Well, at least it's not anti-vaccer bullshit today...

Does nobody remember the predictions that the Indian continent would basically starve because not enough food could be grown to feed them?

Thank you, Norman Borlaug, The Man Who Saved A Billion Lives.

Starvation is a terrible thing, but the problem is, every time there is a breakthrough in agriculture, it is followed by a growth in population.

Those billion people who were saved? They lived, and had kids.

How do we get off the merry-go-round?

Anyone who can glibly say, "starvation is a terrible thing, but.." doesn't get it.

In case you haven't noticed, the planet is rapidly running out of resources to support all 7 billion of us, much less several billion more. If you have some solution to that, I'd love to hear it. Or are you just going to sit around and watch it happen?

Does your indifference to hunger extend to the one in five children in the US who are hungry, or just the brown people?

I got rid of the wheat (modern wheat) last November. I have lost nearly 70 pounds with no severe hunger pangs and NO added exercise. The book is much more than about gliadin (hardly any, really about gliadin). The argument is a sound one and I will repeat it REALLY worked for me. My life is so much better. I eat some einkorn and hard red winter wheat breads I make myself. I eat lots of veggies with butter. Bacon, meats, even hot dogs and ham (uncured, etc.) The pounds flew off in the beginning.

The key is kicking the wheat and processed food habit. Without the wheat my appetite decreased markedly. I am satisfied with MUCH less and my blood pressure and blood sugar levels have gone down amazingly.

Those taking pot shots at this book ( and others warning about modern wheat, the super carb) are just talking out of their hat. Will it work as dramatically for you? I don't know. I learned of the book from DU and I tried it. I modified the diet, somewhat, because I need carbs for my brain to function properly. I was creative. I like to cook. You will never know until you try but, in my opinion, Dr. Davis is spot on.

I now weigh less than I did thirty years ago and am approaching my weight just out of high school. I can now wear the suit that I was married in back in 1979. I hope that any who are obese will not listen to the detractors who have not even read the book or tried the recommendations found there. It can change you life.....for the better.


It worked for me.

Part 1: I have a very good friend who is a national level body builder. Of course, every single item that goes into their mouths is calculated and examined to make sure it will help their goals. Body builders HAVE TO EAT every 4 hours... they EAT ALL DAY LONG. The body actually uses up calories digesting food... so by eating in regular patterns, the body is almost always digesting - this helps the body convert protein into muscle. Body builders eat almost all protein. Their diets consist of steak, chicken and eggs. That's about it! They can also have bananas and plain salads and rice. They also use a "rice flour" to mix with eggs - to make "egg pancakes". The diet if very plain, no sauces. Steak and boiled chicken... every day. I have seen them sometime cheat on their diets, and eat something they are not supposed to -- BUT it would NEVER be anything with wheat. Wheat is to be avoided at all costs for bodybuilders.

Now this is a special diet for bodybuilders, not for the average person. But I once went on this diet for two months... steak, chicken, eggs, salads and rice. I lost 25 pounds off my gut (4 inches!) and was in the best shape I had been in two decades. I am currently 50 years old. I was shocked at how fast I lost weight. And felt strong and healthy the entire time. But it is so HARD to stay wheat free. Everything has wheat.

Part 2: I have a good vegan friend that only eats just organic foods, and also stays away from all wheat products.

Processed food is really bad for you.

So back to the OP where they mention "modern wheat" versus the older strains. Yes, there is clear evidence that the wheat has changed, and maybe they do not have the direct evidence to point to the exact genetic modifications that affect our body - yet! But it still remains that even the older strains of wheat are not good for human diet in the amounts most people consume.

want to lose weight... avoid wheat.

Because if so, I consider it to be nothing more than the latest fad diet. Hidden beneath most fad diets is a calorie diet in disguise. (...."I am satisfied with much less...&quot

I too lost 50 pounds last year. I also lost 3 dress sizes, 60 pts off my cholesterol score, 10 pts off my BP and the diagnosis "pre-diabetic." I did it by eliminating all animal protein from my diet and replacing it with fruits and vegetables of all kinds along with lots of whole grains including wheat. I eat until I'm full and eat some more, if the mood strikes. No calorie counting, nor even a concern with same.

Because there is no calorie counting at all.. you eat more than ever! You eat 5-6 times a day! As much as you want, as long as you stay with 3 things.. steak, chicken and eggs. You can have romaine lettuce with fruit... no dressing! With your steak or chicken, have some plain rice.

Eat as much as you want. You will find that you will start to eat smaller portions, because you are required to eat every 4 hours. You are forcing you body to digest things like steak and chicken. They are all protein, and it takes your body more calories to "digest" all that food, so you end up burning fat to digest the steak and chicken.

If you are working, it is hard to have plain steak or plain chicken at any restaurants, so that means you have to prepare your food and bring it with you.

It is a very boring diet, and so simple. try it for 60 days and watch how your body reacts, especially men. The first place they lose the weight is the gut.

Not to be nasty or anything, but the nutritional content of the diet you describe is heavy on fats and cholesterol and light on just about everything else. It's the Western Diet (the crux of most dietary problems to begin with) times 10. gak!


ETA: Your bodybuilding regimen reminds me of the Adkins Diet. Know what's worse than the dreaded wheat and carbs? Too much protein! http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/high-protein-diets/AN00847

they eat, then they work out, then they eat, then they work out... every day. Never "too much protein"...

for me personally, I never went to the gym and worked out while on this diet.

And personally I think my weight loss had a lot to do with me not drinking soda and other sugar items, plus no wheat.
So by eating protein heavy diet, I lost a ton of weight and looked and felt healthy -- and it was only 60 days.

I only have 15 lb to lose. I'm mainly looking to avoid heart disease, cancer, etc by the most sensible means available.

Specifically The Starch Solution! It's my favorite of his books.

That stuff is poison if you ask me. I know dozens of people who have cut wheat out of their diet like myself and the weight just melted away, no other dietary changes and no exercise. Perhaps there are those with a genetic makeup that allows them to process it, I'm not one of them evidently.

I lost 130 lbs. in 2 years. My high blood pressure went away, as well as the protein in my urine from mild kidney disease, and fibromyalgia. The chronic back pain is gone.

And the biggie, I'm no longer diabetic, my blood sugar has been between 70 and 100 since I gave up the Western diet. Actually, it was the very next day! I'm off all medication.

I've been at this weight in the past and never, ever felt this good. Not even as a child or young adult.

I once weighed the amount of food I eat every day, and it amounts to 9 pounds! I'm never hungry, obviously

for the diet is correct.

in the case of gliadin, he is markedly, astonishingly, WRONG. So wrong that it makes me wonder what kind of 'doctor' he actually is.

Davis is lying. So he (and you) should STFU until you (and he) know what you're talking about.

From wikipedia "Gliadin is a class of proteins present in wheat and several other cereals within the grass genus Triticum." There is a lot more information on the web.
Your grandma needed gluten to get bread to rise, yeast bread dates back hundreds of years. Giladin is a component of gluten.

This sort of nonsense is invariably brought to us by the "paleo"/atkins crowd and gleefully supported by our lovely factory farm-based agriculture.

its hard and quite painful.

are ignoring tons of published articles on wheat, gluten, gliadin, WGA, and diseases such as psoriasis, cancer, depression, and more. Willfully, sounds like.

I think the reaction to label anything that isn't corporate approved "anti" or "pseudoscience" is direct evidence that the corporate brainwashing has succeeded to such a degree that people will blindly defend anything, even if it posions them. I was tested last April for food allergies, I'm allergic to corn, cow's milk, soy, tomato, peanuts, oats, cayenne, paprika, vanilla, lemon, watermelon and strawberry. I have had health issues all my life, once I made the changes in my diet my health improved drastically. I wonder what they would call that? Since I didn't use corporate approved meds to improve my health and instead made an informed decision and took initiative to change my habits.

Or to my uncle, whose skin was covered with painful lesions because of gluten sensitivity.

taught in medical school and promptly forgot about. He said that he's been wrong all these years and sprue(ciliac disease) is far more widespread than he imagined and now he, and his collegues, look to this first when presented with this constellation of symptoms.
It's very nasty and I feel sorry for your needless pain and suffering.

It gives me symptoms of Crohn's disease and affects my uncle's skin. But it also has been linked in some people to elevated liver enzymes and to neurological problems.

Classic Celiac (for which I also tested positive) turns out to be the tip of the iceberg.

should of course avoid it.

Few people these days who claim such have had a biopsy to confirm it. It's a figment of many people's imaginations.

A claim of gluten enteropathy should ALWAYS be based on factual evidence and not fear or worry or internet rumors.

They're proved this with studies testing stored blood samples from decades ago.

People who are made sick with gluten -- internal bleeding is my symptom, but there are many others -- don't appreciate those who minimize the problems.

What we need is much better labeling. Current law doesn't require gluten to be labeled even though it causes problems to more people than some of the other foods that must be labeled.

The gluten free hysteria I refer to is the fad in producing gluten free products assuming it is healthier. Which it is not. Of course, that changes if you have a gluten allergy.

There are a lot more gluten-free products out there now, thanks to the hysteria, and a lot more restaurants offer gluten free food. Traveling's a whole lot easier than it used to be.

Hence, the hysteria is not only unfounded, it is actually unhealthy.

Gluten is still present in most processed foods and the vast majority of baked goods. What product is now off the market because gluten-free products are offered as well?

Any food marketed as healthier because it is gluten free is bad. And I have witnessed the explosion in gluten free products both at restaurants and in grocery stores. This is dangerous not simply because it is a stupid marketing ploy but also because people don't the potential for nutritional deficits.

eat the same sensible diet as their Celiac relatives. In many countries, wheat is not the mainstay that it is in the typical American diet. And gluten is not a necessary food group.

The main thing gluten-free people need to be aware of is that the government requires some wheat products to be enriched with extra vitamins. So a gluten-free person might need to enrich his or her own diet with vitamin supplements. This isn't a big deal.

so it is almost as good as a biopsy. And a heck of a lot cheaper.

It doesn't pick up all the cases of serious gluten sensitivity however -- only the ones that result in the type of damage to the villi in the upper intestine that we call Celiac, and would be shown by the biopsy.

But there are other types of gluten sensitivity that are just as serious as Celiac and unfortunately they don't have good tests for all of those. Fortunately, my Crohn's symptoms turned out to also respond to the gluten-free diet that I went on for Celiac (you can have both Celiac and Crohn's) - and so did a bunch of other symptoms. It was almost like my whole body had been fighting the gluten.

Instead of fiddling around with foods.



But seriously - it works.

I know in theory that might help, but I doubt it would help with my other symptoms. It had progressed enough for me that I was starting to have hives, and I'm afraid I might have had the gluten related skin disease next (my uncle had it). So I'll skip the worms and stay away from gluten.

in the more recent samples of blood from *the same people,* not that the wheat 'changed'.

which is also the economical explanation for higher incidence as the population ages.

I eat a lot of wheat bread.

A new protein... The stupid, it burns.

Mister Evil-Genetic-Engineer is poisoning our food supply. Unrec.

My doc pulled me off wheat some months ago to see if it would help with inflammation and vertigo. By the 4th day, I literally felt half my age and the muscle/joint pains went away - and they haven't come back. I still get vertigo every so often, but now is way shorter in duration and severity.

Doc said to give it a month and check back in - but I knew in just that 4 days. He was astonished when I went back for the followup - called it "drastic". I also had dropped that 15 pounds I was looking to lose for the last, er, decade - without even trying. I just wasn't hungry any more (wheat can cause cravings in some people). For the first time in my adult life, I can differentiate between cravings and hungry, and they are definitely 2 different sensations.

I am not celiac, but "wheat sensitive".

Where I think this is going sideways is assuming it will help EVERYONE. A family friend tried the gluten-free route and felt like crap. It all depends on your body, I guess, but it worked wonders for me.

can actually find products now -- and restaurants so we can travel. It used to be a huge pain eating out but in my city it's getting easier all the time.

My grocery store now has 2 full aisles dedicated to organic and gluten free foods - including a full 3/4 wall of frozen foods. That wasn't there a year ago.

Because celiac can be dangerous (and deadly), a lot of restaurants are starting to teach their employees about cross contamination. That has come up a few times when I asked about wheat free options on the menu.

Might not be too good for business.

It was also discovered that I was allergic to corn and that also was causing joint pain, random pain, depressed mood and irritability.

nothing like what I cooked all those years before.

Microwaves had something to do with making the "baked goods" perform better in Microwave for "instant cook" ...so there's that and the GMO. When cookbooks I've used for years turn out wheat foods that are substandard to what I'm used to in my "hands on" then I know there's something wrong. BTW...my 80's MIL agrees that the quality of wheat is not what it was and that when ever she prepares cookies for the Great Grand Kids...she's almost embarrassed to send them...because the quality is not what she was used to.

Something is very wrong. And the Cook at Home Folks who have Years/Decades of Experience from their Mothers and GrandMa's and GGrandma's KNOW... THERE IS A CHANGE.

Remember how spinach was a real acquired taste?--that was when it actually contained iron. Now, after 50+ years of commercial agriculture, the soil is depleted and the flavor just isn't there....I've thought for years that the rise in spicy or flavorful sauces in restaurant cuisine was driven by this.

Don't know if the same is true for grains but I wouldn't be surprised.

I remember how strong it used to taste. I'd wondered if it was a different variety they were growing, but what you say makes sense about soil depletion changing the flavor.

It is--primarily--the lack of iron in the soil.

Which is why I always laugh about agribusiness' commercials saying X is an excellent source of Y! (fill in the blanks). If it isn't in the soil, it isn't going to be in the crop.

Huge difference. It wasn't a weight issue, it was malaise.

I get hazy and nonproductive after eating it. Went off it for two weeks and went back on. Joint pain flared up.

I have eaten lots of wheat my whole life with no weight gain until recently. I also had no physical pain at all until recently. That last 2 years in my 50's has had a correlation with eating wheat and pain and inflammation.

*

My reaction to wheat was so bad that I finally got tested and found out I was also allergic to cow's milk, corn, tomato, peanuts, soy, oats, cayenne, paprika, vanilla, lemon, watermelon and strawberry. Not sensitivities, but actuall allergies, producing histamines. After modifying my diet to limit or remove these foods my health and mood improved greatly.

my eating out choices are going to be REALLY limited. After a get used to avoiding wheat better, I may get tested as well.

I went gluten-free about 4 months ago, and stopped most dairy (no milk, just cheeses) at the same time. I still can't believe what a change this has been in my life. No more chronic GERD, I dropped 35 lbs in 2 months without even trying, the chronic edema in my feet and legs vanished, and I don't have the massive mood crashes that used to follow eating wheat products. (I thought I might be bipolar, who knew?) Quitting milk got rid of the throatful of mucous I used to cough up for an hour after breakfast.

We'd been trying to figure out what was causing the spectrum of symptoms, and my wife found a youtube with Davis. I watched it until the first time he mentioned gliadin, and decided right there that it was something I had to try - even though I don't have celiac or any other acute gastric issues. It worked.

Y'all can bitch about pseudoscience all you want. This is one time when you have to try it for yourself and see what the results are. My wife and I went G-F at the same time, but it did nothing for her, so she went back to eating her standard breads.

So now I'm a poster child for new-age food fads. Gluten-free, low dairy, mostly vegetarian, mostly organic vegetables, no alcohol and no GMO. I've never felt better in my life.

Now that I'm off wheat, I feel better and crave healthy foods.

I'm not allergic ,and I have no internal head game about food, I just like how I feel off of wheat and sugar.

I have weekends where I occasionally go out and eat all the bad stuff. My gut feels terrible for a few days afterward, and I instantly lose 3 pounds, just getting it out of my system.

Maybe it's middle age, too. But this seems to be where I should be, too.

Last edited Fri Jun 21, 2013, 12:34 AM - Edit history (1)

"new protein".

ya this vry sad ...

Pasta is central to the Italian diet, and bread is a big part of the French diet. That's mostly wheat pasta, wheat bread, even bread made from (ooooh nooooes!) refined wheat flour. (Crusty baguette is about as high on the glycemic index as bread goes.)

There's got to be more to this than "wheat = bad" or "modern wheat = bad". Maybe there are more people who individually have problems with wheat than we were aware, and that could lead to some of the popular anecdotal stories of "Wow! I stopped eating wheat and lost 130 pounds in four days!", but as a big-picture explanation for obesity it doesn't make much sense when taking into account a bigger perspective than US obesity.

Since wheat is so common in so many foods, I'd guess that many people lose weight by swearing off of wheat for no other reason than in causes them to have to be so much more careful and selective about what they eat.

For people who go so far as swearing off all grains, not just wheat, you've got to explain the low rates of obesity in Japan and China where rice is a big part of their diet.

or, maybe their food is better regulated in that they contain less chemical additives. I would say that more people their make their own food from fresh ingredients.

Does it make eliminating wheat a strategy that works only because of side effects of that choice, and not something inherently wrong with wheat itself?

I don't know. I can see that it may cause problems for individuals but that can be for reasons other than a problem with wheat itself, allergies etc. It may be that commercially produced wheat and products and not wheat growing unadulterated have structural differences that may effect human consumption differently. For examples, Canola. It is "man-made". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canola. I wonder what modifications are made to wheat that is grown and processed commercially in the US?

I haven't purchased bread in years, I limit wheat in other parts of my diet. Better mood, lost weight, reduction in allergy symptoms.

digestion, and energy levels. All, apparently, just from eliminating wheat from my diet.

I'd noticed years ago that I often felt groggy after a lunch that included bread or crackers, even the "healthy" whole-wheat variety, while I felt fine, wide awake, after a high-protein lunch with some veggies and/or fruit but no grains. I'd also noticed that wheat germ, which I'd first started buying back in the 1960s before they changed to the dwarf variety of wheat that Dr. Davis explains causes so many health problems, no longer made me feel more energetic. Didn't understand why till I read Wheat Belly.

I totally agree. It worked for me.

above. Congrats on all the weight loss! Like you, I've been able to get back to the weight I was at in my 20s, and without having to starve myself or exercise nonstop.

As you said, Dr. Davis's book is about much more than gliadin.

I hope that even those people who aren't willing to read Wheat Belly will at least check out his blog, including the success stories there:

http://www.wheatbellyblog.com/success-stories/

Its called don't eat a damn thing cause someone somewhere believes its poison and will kill you. Instead just don't eat and starve than at least you'll die but it won't be from food that's bad for you.