General Discussion

ProSense

(116,464 posts) Sat Jun 29, 2013, 05:54 PM Jun 2013

Am I missing something about the latest revelations regarding the EU?

It seems to me that this was already reported during the Wikileaks scandal.

Hillary Clinton ordered diplomats to spy on UN: WikiLeaks docs

<...>

The Guardian, which along with the New York Times, Germany's Der Spiegel, France's Le Monde and Spain's El Pais received the WikiLeaks materials in advance, dug up a cable signed by Clinton in June of 2009, "demanding forensic technical details about the communications systems used by top UN officials, including passwords and personal encryption keys used in private and commercial networks for official communications."

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2010/11/28/clinton-ordered-diplomats-spy-un/

U.S. bugged EU offices, computer networks - German magazine

<...>

Der Spiegel quoted from a September 2010 "top secret" U.S. National Security Agency (NSA) document that it said fugitive former NSA contractor Edward Snowden had taken with him, and the weekly's journalists had seen in part.

The document outlines how the NSA bugged offices and spied on EU internal computer networks in Washington and at the United Nations, not only listening to conversations and phone calls but also gaining access to documents and emails.

<...>

Martin Schulz, the president of the European Parliament, said that if the report was correct, it would have a "severe impact" on relations between the EU and the United States.

<...>

Without citing sources, the magazine reported that more than five years ago security officers at the EU had noticed several missed calls and traced them to NSA offices within the NATO compound in Brussels.

- more -

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/06/29/uk-usa-eu-spying-idUKBRE95S0B720130629

How is Der Spiegel communicating with Snowden?

I find fascinating is the glee that other countries are using this as an opportunity to dig the United States.

It's a one-sided affair because a disgruntled American decided to flee the country and reveal its state secrets.

There was also the report about British spying. All these countries engage in spying.

The Errors of Edward Snowden and His Global Hypocrisy Tour
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023112872

14 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

Am I missing something about the latest revelations regarding the EU? (Original Post) ProSense Jun 2013 OP

Good point. I knew someone would show us why it's OK. MannyGoldstein Jun 2013 #1

Are you shocked? n/t ProSense Jun 2013 #4

Is the President of the European Parliament shocked? adric mutelovic Jun 2013 #6

Yeah, ProSense Jun 2013 #8

The wikileaks cables were about an order by Hillary Clinton adric mutelovic Jun 2013 #9

From the OP: ProSense Jun 2013 #12

You didn't answer the question of whether wikileaks cable said bugs were placed adric mutelovic Jun 2013 #13

Wait, ProSense Jun 2013 #14

Yes, as usual. MannyGoldstein Jun 2013 #11

I'll be doing interviews out in the field flamingdem Jun 2013 #2

Spy's gonna do what a spy's gotta do. Not always a bad thing: freshwest Jun 2013 #3

Yes, a conscience whatchamacallit Jun 2013 #5

Well, I'm sure your response indicates that you have "some dignity," huh? ProSense Jun 2013 #7

I know I was thinking the same thing. Plus it's kind of a repeat of the whole spying at the G20 okaawhatever Jun 2013 #10

MannyGoldstein

(34,589 posts)

1. Good point. I knew someone would show us why it's OK.

Reply to ProSense (Original post)

Sat Jun 29, 2013, 06:00 PM

Jun 2013

Obviously, the Europeans are hiding a terrible secret!

ProSense

(116,464 posts)

4. Are you shocked? n/t

Reply to MannyGoldstein (Reply #1)

Sat Jun 29, 2013, 06:21 PM

Jun 2013

adric mutelovic

(208 posts)

6. Is the President of the European Parliament shocked?

Reply to ProSense (Reply #4)

Sat Jun 29, 2013, 06:28 PM

Jun 2013

http://www.europeanvoice.com/article/2013/june/schulz-shocked-by-alleged-us-eavesdropping-on-eu-diplomats/77718.aspx

Damn Paulite European guy.

ProSense

(116,464 posts)

8. Yeah,

Reply to adric mutelovic (Reply #6)

Sat Jun 29, 2013, 06:34 PM

Jun 2013

"Is the President of the European Parliament shocked?"

..."trust us"?

I love how every other government is genuine. I mean, where was he during Wikileaks? LOL!

adric mutelovic

(208 posts)

9. The wikileaks cables were about an order by Hillary Clinton

Reply to ProSense (Reply #8)

Sat Jun 29, 2013, 06:48 PM

Jun 2013

The Snowden leak is about spying having occurred, not just an order.

To respond to your question of whether you're missing details: Yup.

Read in Der Spiegel:

"According to SPIEGEL information, the US placed bugs in the EU representation in Washington and infiltrated its computer network. Cyber attacks were also perpetrated against Brussels in New York and Washington."

Did the Raw Story story say the installation of bugs took place or the computers of the European Union offices were infiltrated? http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/nsa-spied-on-european-union-offices-a-908590.html

ProSense

(116,464 posts)

12. From the OP:

Reply to adric mutelovic (Reply #9)

Sat Jun 29, 2013, 07:12 PM

Jun 2013

Without citing sources, the magazine reported that more than five years ago security officers at the EU had noticed several missed calls and traced them to NSA offices within the NATO compound in Brussels.

From Der Spiegel:

America's NSA intelligence service allegedly targeted the European Union with its spying activities. According to SPIEGEL information, the US placed bugs in the EU representation in Washington and infiltrated its computer network. Cyber attacks were also perpetrated against Brussels in New York and Washington.

<...>

The documents also indicate the US intelligence service was responsible for an electronic eavesdropping operation in Brussels. A little over five years ago, EU security experts noticed several telephone calls that were apparently targeting the remote maintenance system in the Justus Lipsius Building where the EU Council of Ministers and the European Council is located. The calls were made to numbers that were very close to the one used for the remote administration of the building's telephone system.

"The wikileaks cables were about an order by Hillary Clinton"

"A little over five years ago" would be during the Bush administration.

Still, what's different about the claim about spying in Washington?

One thing about all of this is having to go by a report on documents that no one has seen except the those reporting it.

"Martin Schulz, the president of the European Parliament, said that if the report was correct..."

More details, please.

adric mutelovic

(208 posts)

13. You didn't answer the question of whether wikileaks cable said bugs were placed

Reply to ProSense (Reply #12)

Sat Jun 29, 2013, 07:20 PM

Jun 2013

You ignored it.

This was about an order given by Hillary Clinton. Today's Der Spiegel is not. Your main point is that this is repeated news. Not true.
The funny thing that the title to your Rawstory links reads "Hillary Clinton ordered diplomats to spy on UN: WikiLeaks docs" yet you turn it into a Bush administration thing alone.

ProSense

(116,464 posts)

14. Wait,

Reply to adric mutelovic (Reply #13)

Sat Jun 29, 2013, 07:37 PM

Jun 2013

"You didn't answer the question of whether wikileaks cable said bugs were placed. You ignored it. This was about an order given by Hillary Clinton. Today's Der Spiegel is not. Your main point is that this is repeated news. Not true."

...Hillary gave an order and nothing happened? Is that what you're saying? It is repeated news to the extent that everyone knew that the U.S. had spied on the EU when Wikileaks revealed it.

MannyGoldstein

(34,589 posts)

11. Yes, as usual.

Reply to ProSense (Reply #4)

Sat Jun 29, 2013, 07:00 PM

Jun 2013

Often shocked.

Rarely surprised.

flamingdem

(39,319 posts)

2. I'll be doing interviews out in the field

Reply to ProSense (Original post)

Sat Jun 29, 2013, 06:05 PM

Jun 2013

which is also where you'll find my latest leaks, next to the manure pile!

freshwest

(53,661 posts)

3. Spy's gonna do what a spy's gotta do. Not always a bad thing:

Reply to ProSense (Original post)

Sat Jun 29, 2013, 06:06 PM

Jun 2013

My favorite whistleblower of all time. Just a working class hero who decided to answer the call to help the downtrodden. He was never given any media time for the obvious reasons. You never know what's going on until you get a good look through those sunglasses...

whatchamacallit

(15,558 posts)

5. Yes, a conscience

Reply to ProSense (Original post)

Sat Jun 29, 2013, 06:23 PM

Jun 2013

and some dignity.

ProSense

(116,464 posts)

7. Well, I'm sure your response indicates that you have "some dignity," huh?

Reply to whatchamacallit (Reply #5)

Sat Jun 29, 2013, 06:32 PM

Jun 2013

I think you're just pissed off that you can't stop me from voicing my opinions.

Deal with it. It should be easy on that pedestal you built for yourself.

okaawhatever

(9,462 posts)

10. I know I was thinking the same thing. Plus it's kind of a repeat of the whole spying at the G20

Reply to ProSense (Original post)

Sat Jun 29, 2013, 06:48 PM

Jun 2013

Conference. I'm just perplexed. Did they think it would draw the outrage of the earlier stuff? Is this something that is supposed to represent a series of more leaked info?

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